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[M1chl]

So instead of PC, they just shut it down? What, why

 

[Fuz]

98% of gamers do not want to buy games to be developers.

Well, it also depends on how easy and fast the tool is.

 

[LordOfChaos]

Seems like it had huge potential if they brought it to PC and monetized it. Shame.

 

[xrnzaaas]

Yeah if there's one PS game that deserved a PC release it would be this one. Missed opportunity.

 

[sainraja]

Fair enough, servers still up. But support being pulled because nobody cares is good enough.

Based on what I read, they are migrating to a new set of servers. There will be limits as to how much storage each player has for storing levels, etc. They are basically reducing the scope of support, due to the new project they mentioned. I am sure there were other business-based reasons they are doing this, but it is not being shut down right now.

 

[Xenon]

Good lord. Of course it did. Impressive work though convincing yourself that they hadn't and then criticizing them for their lack of business sense.

Or maybe they did a bad job of selling or communicating that fact to the public. I

 

[PianistaMacabro]

I really have to thanks media molecule for dreams......used dreams for my audiovisual postgraduation project and ended up on unreal for a full game. Amazing game!

 

[Ev1L AuRoN]

To this day, I still don't understand how this game works...

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

To this day, I still don't understand how this game works...

is a game engine.

 

[Ev1L AuRoN]

is a game engine.

So, its like installing Unity or Unreal on your console and try to make a game using poor input devices... maybe on pc...

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

So, its like installing Unity or Unreal on your console and try to make a game using poor input devices... maybe on pc...

ironically. the inputs were incredibly well implemented. sculping, making music, navigating was intuitive. but of course is not "the standard" that learning curve feels not worth learning if you want to be a serious developer.

 

[SlicedBread3]

With Little Big Planet there was a standalone game that people could buy and play which would bring a large number of players to try the user created contact. Did Dreams even do that? Seemed like it was for creators only. The game zero sense from a business standpoint.

Yeah, they made several games with it.

To this day, I still don't understand how this game works...

Basically like Mario Maker, except you weren't limited to making Mario levels.

 

[ANDS]

Basically like Mario Maker, except you weren't limited to making Mario levels.

Thank you! This is exactly it. Like I saw some RIDICULOUS MM levels (there's one that Dan from GB made that Patrick Klepek spent like a month or so on trying to beat, like it was a whole to-do to create I'm sure) that definitely had as much time put into them as some people likely put into DREAMS. I played the thing literally for no other reason than to see if I could make something. Not for show, not for someone other than myself to play it. . .just to try. Making a platform that rotated around a shape in a periodic and predictable fashion was probably one of the most rewarding things I did in "vidya games. . ." that year.

And it isn't like the darn thing was limited to just "games." I think the biggest problem with DREAMS, from a non-creatives standpoint, is that you could see IMMEDIATELY what you could actually do with the thing - and that might put people off, when all you're trying to do is animate a character to walk over a bridge when you push a button. But if you had an idea and wanted to see if come to life in a fun way, you could do it. Including movies, music and calculators.

. . .just an absolute bummer the responses here; "Oh just go learn Unity" is NOT the point of DREAMS (or any MM game).

 

[SF Kosmo]

The game isn't salvageable. It's dead. No amount of porting will fix it... especially in a world where Fortnite and Roblox exist, not to mention programs like Unity and Godot.

It should have been included with every PlayStation and allowed creator driven monetization. That was the obvious play. Multiplayer would have added a lot as well.

 

[ReBurn]

Your post is not true and a lie.

In an interview with PlayStation Asia, Sony President Shuhei Yoshida stated that Dreams is one of his ‘favourite projects ever’. He also revealed that the publisher has a massive 10-year plan in mind to oversee the evolution of of the game.

Yoshida saying there was a 10 year plan wasn't a firm guarantee that the game would be unconditionally supported for 10 years. Plans change if they don't work out. Heck, Sony didn't even support Yoshida after that interview considering they moved him out of the top spot at SIE Worldwide Studios not long after that interview to bring in Hermen Hulst.

 

[dreamstation]

Art's Dream was fantastic. Might have to give it another playthrough.

 

[OuterLimits]

It’s pretty gross how common the sentiment here is that creation has no inherent value and is a waste unless it can be converted to USD. People always knew their creations weren’t monetizable in Dreams, that’s what made it such a purely creative environment without ulterior motivations. It’s impossible to create a microtransaction hellscape within Dreams, but it’s perfect for sketching out real game ideas quickly.

Truly a sad day, Dreams is my favorite creation software, made by creatives for creatives, and I don’t think there is anything else like it nor is there likely to be again.

While I agree with you, the problem is not really with posters here and elsewhere but with Sony who is likely shutting it down because they view it as having little value since it isn't earning them cash.

 

[Chronicle]

I feel terrible for the 10 people that bought it.

 

[Draxon Gamer]

I never got why people thought this was going to work after the Microsoft version of this same idea failed. What was it called again? Project Conker?

 

[DaGwaphics]

^ Project Spark

Project Spark - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Hawking Radiation]

What a waste. Should have been released on PC.

Next game should focus on unique platformers like LBP. The studio has the talent they just need the proper direction.

 

[DR3AM]

Was the game ever on PS+?
I can't believe Sony let MM work on it for so long. I'm hoping their next project isn't far away.

 

[Jimmyisback]

Why do people keep saying Sony should release this game on pc. It would have failed either way. Sony probably ran the numbers in everyway and it would have resulted in the same outcome. Just greater losses. The mismanagement has been spectacular.

 

[01011001]

Why do people keep saying Sony should release this game on pc. It would have failed either way. Sony probably ran the numbers in everyway and it would have resulted in the same outcome. Just greater losses. The mismanagement has been spectacular.

I mean there was a lot Sony did wrong here. the game should have been on PC day 1, it should have been free to play, and there should have been a way to monetize it (I'm thinking a tipping system for creators)

but being on PC would have been a good first step imo, as you'll get way more people that will tinker around with the creation tools than on a console

 

[CGNoire]

the problem with this game:
1) Its a tool, not a game.
2) Majority of gamers are not going to spend time creating something.
3) The only minority hardcore fans (probably 1%) creates something nice and impressive.
4) no MTX, no fees, no subscription, knew this game wont last for long as MM unable to generate profits, lets not talk about physical/digital sales.

Technically its still not going anywhere its just not getting anymore updates. You can still use it and upload online as well as play others stuff.

 

[DerivedDataCache]

Close the studio Sony.
Theyve had enough chances.

 

[DragoonWalker]

Something I haven't seen mentioned in this thread is a lack of a great campaign to go with the game maker. It had one, it just wasn't very good. It needed to be excellent, marketed upfront, to pull in all the casual people. A face to the game, Like LBP had. There are games out there that weren't built to be modded but a community grew around them because people loved the core game. This needed that badly. It needed a prime example from MM themselves to get gamers' imaginations going. Instead it came with a meandering artsy tutorial kinda thing.

 

[CGNoire]

PC has unreal engine and unity.

It does certain things better.
Like layouts is alot faster and its boolean functionality and workflow is unparralleled. Making Hard Surface stuff a Breeze. It also has a non destructive workflow and infinite built in history brush bye design.

Not to mention the gyro functionality built into the controller allows 6 axis analog control all at once via the gyro mixed with the 2 axis sticks. This means placing and aligning stuff is super fast. No way without one of those old school 3dm ball 3d modeling controllers that used to go for $1000 bucks back in the day could anyone on pc hope to layout as fast.

 

[CGNoire]

Dreams was just a cr**py Roblox.

We were all thinking it. Someone needed to say it.

Its so much better its not even funny. Like unconceivably better.

 

[CGNoire]

It’s pretty gross how common the sentiment here is that creation has no inherent value and is a waste unless it can be converted to USD. People always knew their creations weren’t monetizable in Dreams, that’s what made it such a purely creative environment without ulterior motivations. It’s impossible to create a microtransaction hellscape within Dreams, but it’s perfect for sketching out real game ideas quickly.

Truly a sad day, Dreams is my favorite creation software, made by creatives for creatives, and I don’t think there is anything else like it nor is there likely to be again.

Just so everyone knows its not being shut down this thread title is a little misleading. There just not realeasing anymore updates or doing awards shows and are still keeping the online portion going so we can still share our dreams.......for now.

 

[CGNoire]

A "Dreams Player" app (like Tableau Creator) would be fantastic that could connect to the DREAMS servers and pull down content for folks who didn't want the actual full game.

. . .that or put the fucking thing on STEAM and let people go nuts. Absolutely insane that this thing wasn't shopped for a second life there, and almost entirely has to do with SONY being gunshy about people using their shit to make - shock and horror - work out of non-SONY owned IP.

Man they've really gotten comfortable.



Good lord. Of course it did. Impressive work though convincing yourself that they hadn't and then criticizing them for their lack of business sense.



How. . .was this a vanity project? This is a pretty clear evolution of the work MM have wanted to do with LBP.

Some of the pushback on this title. Bizarre. Like here, in a gaming industry beset on all sides by folks unwilling to take chances, you have a company say "Let's make a game that lets people make games, from zero experience all the way up to professionals in the industry, and toss our own little game in there as inspiration to get people creating and sharing with one another" and the BEST some of you can come up with is: "Meh. Total ego project."

Its obvious who the people are who would rather absorb other peoples works and dreams and never manifest any themselves. Maybe I can understand that but to then try to activly discourage others from it just so they can feel better about there lack of ambition just makes them scum.

 

[CGNoire]

So instead of PC, they just shut it down? What, why

Its not shutting down title is misleading.

There just arent updating it anymore nor are they doing anymore awardshows. So it doesnt look good but its still has its online conponent.

 

[CGNoire]

So, its like installing Unity or Unreal on your console and try to make a game using poor input devices... maybe on pc...

The controller is super fast just a steep learning curve. As someone with extensive exp with unreal its alot faster at alot of things.

 

[semiconscious]

Something I haven't seen mentioned in this thread is a lack of a great campaign to go with the game maker. It had one, it just wasn't very good. It needed to be excellent, marketed upfront, to pull in all the casual people. A face to the game, Like LBP had. There are games out there that weren't built to be modded but a community grew around them because people loved the core game. This needed that badly. It needed a prime example from MM themselves to get gamers' imaginations going. Instead it came with a meandering artsy tutorial kinda thing.

yep. strange but true: media molecule released their last actual 'game' 10 years ago (tearaway)...

 

[CGNoire]

I feel terrible for the 10 people that bought it.

In times like this I wish there was a middle finger emogi.

 

[Unknown?]

All they had to do was release a “dreams viewer” that let people play stuff made in the game for free. Like imagine if you needed to buy a compiler to play PC games lol.


it’s not ridiculous. This thing went absolutely nowhere and it was clearly just MM, as they say, having a wank. I think tear away is actually an extraordinary game but it’s a decade old at this point. It’s weird that they shut down perfectly functional studios like Zipper and Japan Studio (!) and spent billions on Bungie while keeping this place open.

Japan Studio was not functional, far from it. Zipper on the other hand, I don't get. Even Socom 4, while disappointing, still sold decently.

 

[OuterLimits]

Just so everyone knows its not being shut down this thread title is a little misleading. There just not realeasing anymore updates or doing awards shows and are still keeping the online portion going so we can still share our dreams.......for now.

This is true. However, once official support on a game ends, the remaining player base tends to drop off dramatically. The fact it will never get a PS5 or PSVR2 update will accelerate the demise sadly.

 

[CGNoire]

This is true. However, once official support on a game ends, the remaining player base tends to drop off dramatically. The fact it will never get a PS5 or PSVR2 update will accelerate the demise sadly.

I see what your saying but since the remaining base are creatives I think the drop off will be alot slower. We creatives get obsessives even with a limited audience.

 

[Oddvintagechap]

really odd.

really should have added some mobile support. Would have been really popular on iphone.

PC support would be pointless.

 

[01011001]

really odd.

really should have added some mobile support. Would have been really popular on iphone.

PC support would be pointless.

the game barely runs at 30fps on PS4 with some of the more complex games people made.

how do you expect this to run on a phone?

 

[TheDreadBaron]

Just so everyone knows its not being shut down this thread title is a little misleading. There just not realeasing anymore updates or doing awards shows and are still keeping the online portion going so we can still share our dreams.......for now.

Yes thank you for the clarification. I think for me it’s just sad because it signals the beginning of the end, but as long as I can still use the software it’s all good. I don’t even need community aspects which will probably go away some years in the future. I’m surprised it took this long to sunset support, and still amazed that this wonderful and beautiful thing exists at all.

(Oh boy, can’t wait for Media Molecule to get back to making platformers lol. That’s what we need, more fucking platformers, not accessible and ethical game development tools that inspire the next generation)

 

[CGNoire]

Yes thank you for the clarification. I think for me it’s just sad because it signals the beginning of the end, but as long as I can still use the software it’s all good. I don’t even need community aspects which will probably go away some years in the future. I’m surprised it took this long to sunset support, and still amazed that this wonderful and beautiful thing exists at all.

Yep they cant erase it from my harddrive which means I can keep creating to my hearts content......but if/when they shut down the servers and kill dreamerverse (our artist commune)....yah that is going be gut wrenching.

In the mean time there new server will support 5gb per user which is 5x what your hard drive file can hold so it should be good enough for as many projects as yah can muster thd motivation to complete. What im more concerned with is how there gonna handle the new version limit. It makes sense but can we delete all the inbetween versions and still keep the latest? I thought they self dependent? Seriously important to know that.

 

[StealthGoblin]

They spent more than 10 years developing and supporting it - I think that’s fair enough.
Why it didn’t ever get ported to PC is beyond me though.

 

[ozz ex machina]

I'm disappointed for people who enjoyed dreams but do feel somewhat vindicated. Hyperbolic spew and hype around this game was rather annoying. It was never going to revolutionise anything.

 

[Rubik8]

Dreams… such an incredible concept and amazing engine that never produced anything I wanted to play more than 2 minutes. There is a talented group of people at MM. Now make something totally different than fancy Lego sets.

 

[mckmas8808]

Never even gave it a chance for a second life on PC and mobile? Still no monetisation?

Waste of an amazing tool

Or PS5. Sony sent Dreams to die.

 

[Varteras]

Or PS5. Sony sent Dreams to die.

Jim Ryan killed our Dreams!

 

[TheDreadBaron]

Or PS5. Sony sent Dreams to die.

I don’t really understand, what would ps5 support look like beyond what already exists? Better make use of ssd and haptics?

 

[StreetsofBeige]

Dreams… such an incredible concept and amazing engine that never produced anything I wanted to play more than 2 minutes. There is a talented group of people at MM. Now make something totally different than fancy Lego sets.

The concept was basically Minecraft or Roblox but for older console gamers who want to make games that look better and are more complex.

I dont think the typical console gamer wants to go through the hassle building and downloading people's demo level that last 5 minutes.

 

[mckmas8808]

I don’t really understand, what would ps5 support look like beyond what already exists? Better make use of ssd and haptics?

Yes! And Native 4K\60fps too. Yeah Jim Ryan obviously hates Media Molecule.