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mgs4 scans - bosses shown

M

Merovingian

Banned
They look freaky but cool imo.

Can already imagine that there will be a much greater sense of danger when fighting these bosses, in comparison to previous ones.
 
B

Bebpo

Banned
SolidSnakex said:
It's not out, he's just not allowed to confirm that they'll be using it since Sony hasn't announced anything.
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.

But then again if rumble controller is not out until GT5 RETAIL in like Dec 2008...yeah.


Need clarification on if that famitsu was talking about GT5:p in October.
 
F

freethought

Member
Zenith said:
What a load of bollocks. As bad as that MGS2 analysis someone linked a while back.
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Nah, it was much worse than that. Although whoever wrote the MGS2 analysis obviously had way too much free time on his hands, at least he showed some basic understanding of the theories and philosophies that Kojima had been working from when he wrote the games. That guy on 1up (the first one) seemed to be drawing most of his knowledge directly from GitS and MGS. A cohesive world view that will not achieve. He threw the word 'memes' out like it was some kind of hand grenade.

I can't help but feel with the MGS2 analysis that the author might have been better served spending his time writing about the source materials rather than a videogame. It's just not that important.

Don't get me wrong, I think both MGS and GitS have deep stories and ask some important philosophical questions, but when I say that I find that what I usually mean is in comparison to Hollywood cinema, particularly the science fiction and action genres. I guess the comparison is so easy because both borrow so much from Hollywood and end up producing more mature/sophisticated content.
 
G

Green Biker Dude

Banned
Why are people acting as if Snake stands no chance against these bosses? The new Mantis, for example, doesn't seem to be much, if stronger than the old one. Maybe you people have just forgotten all the stuff Snake went through MGS1. There's no way he'll need any help to take out just those 4.

He may be older now, but IIRC Kojima at one point was talking about how he didn't want him to be portrayed as some weak old man, that instead he wanted to show him as an experienced fighter. He may even have improved since MGS2.

And besides, does anyone really want the boss battles to turn out like MGS2's? I certainly don't. They worked in the context of the game, but I'd rather have Snake beat them than have them escape and die in someone else's hands.
 
J

jett

D-Member
DSN2K said:
I took one look at these bosses and it said one thing to me....OLD MAN SNAKE WONT SURVIVE THIS GAME. :lol :'(
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If MGS was "realistic" Old Snake would simultaenously shit his pants and have a heart attack the first time he saw these things.
 
N

neojubei

Will drop pants for Sony.
JB1981 said:
Rumble is out. That sucks :(
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IF GT5: prologue will have rumble OCT of THIS YEAR, why do you think rumble won't be in MGS4 next year?


And after seeing the video on PSN, whoa war has gotten a lot harder.
 
G

Graphics Horse

Member
Me_Marcadet said:
Just for the sake of it. This is how I think the lady fit in the wolf :

wolf.PNG
Click to expand...


I made one of those but the conversation moved onto other things so I didn't bother posting
4lfgroi.jpg
 
E

Ether_Snake

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SolidSnakex said:
Something that'll play into the use of real people for modeling



http://ps3.ign.com/articles/734/734456p2.html

Yumi Kikuchi - Japan
Scarlett Chorvat - Slovakia
Lyndall Jarvis - South Africa
Mieko Rye - ?
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Like i said before, in MGS2 the
AI colonel's representation is seen becoming translucent from time to time, with a skull visible underneath the skin. You can expect AIs in MGS4, be it The Patriots or other AIs, to have this kind of "skin and bones" effect.
 
E

Ether_Snake

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Laurent said:
Great; Thanks... I would have found out about it probably way later...

He said Jayde; it's not Jayde, it's JADE... "JA DUH"
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It's Jayde, not JA-DUH, she's not French nor Quebecer.

Energetic Dolphin, out!
 
F

freethought

Member
Ether_Snake said:
Like i said before, in MGS2 the
AI colonel's representation is seen becoming translucent from time to time, with a skull visible underneath the skin. You can expect AIs in MGS4, be it The Patriots or other AIs, to have this kind of "skin and bones" effect.
Click to expand...

Just not necessarily with the Beasts, at least that's my guess. As I said before Raiden seems to have translucent skin on his lower jaw so we may see the same thing with the as yet unrevealed Beauties.

On top of that the effect on the AI's in MGS2 was limited to Codec sequences, I doubt Kojima would put so much emphasis on an effect that is unlikely to appear outside of them. Mind you, a possibility at the minute is that all communication will take place via the Mk. II and there isn't a codec at all.
 
E

Ether_Snake

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freethought said:
Just not necessarily with the Beasts, at least that's my guess. As I said before Raiden seems to have translucent skin on his lower jaw so we may see the same thing with the as yet unrevealed Beauties.

On top of that the effect on the AI's in MGS2 was limited to Codec sequences, I doubt Kojima would put so much emphasis on an effect that is unlikely to appear outside of them. Mind you, a possibility at the minute is that all communication will take place via the Mk. II and there isn't a codec at all.
Click to expand...

I am pretty sure many characters, including dead ones, will be digitized in this game, since Kojima SPECIFICALLY said that this game was about how to preserve people's sense digitally, and if we could also keep their will digitally:)

Don't expect Snake to just use codec, I am sure he will communicate with them in more direct ways this time, such as by hooking up to a VR system.
 
J

J2 Cool

Member
Yeah, this is a really odd choice. I feel like Starscream, Doc Ock, Saber-Toothed Tiger Dinozord, and Slan from Berserk decided to team up and create a unit. Somehow oddly, it kind of has an appeal after awhile.

Graphics Horse said:
I made one of those but the conversation moved onto other things so I didn't bother posting
4lfgroi.jpg
Click to expand...

I like the shine, but make the ass bigger.
 
D

drohne

hyperbolically metafictive
don't know why i didn't notice before, but watching the psn trailer just now, it appears that mantis is controlling the rest of the unit, perhaps psychically -- the trailer makes a point of cutting to her hand gestures as each member retreats

and crying wolf is kind of creepy if you consider that there's a person in there. creepy in a good way. i think!
 
B

brandonh83

Banned
I think it would be cool if we could get our MGS name generator titles as our GAF tags.

...I think. I mean sometimes I'm off the mark, this could be one of those times. Just think it would be funny. Sort of, I mean in a way.
 
F

freethought

Member
Ether_Snake said:
I am pretty sure many characters, including dead ones, will be digitized in this game, since Kojima SPECIFICALLY said that this game was about how to preserve people's sense digitally, and if we could also keep their will digitally:)
Click to expand...

I've assumed for a long time that there is a technological explanation for Liquid's continued existence. This certainly seems in keeping with what Kojima has said. I'm just not sure it applies to the Beasts, outside of them being cyborgs of course.

As far as other characters being preserved/resurrected digitally. any theories? The members of Foxhound and Cell are likely suspects as they all possessed nanomachines (I'm guessing), E.E. was an A.I. whiz so she makes another good candidate. Big Boss is the most obvious choice but how would it be explained?

Ether_Snake said:
Don't expect Snake to just use codec, I am sure he will communicate with them in more direct ways this time, such as by hooking up to a VR system.
Click to expand...

Maybe, seems like it could be a little jarring really. I'm hoping the Mk. II is the standard, you could move around while having conversations, it could still use the codec so even though you can hear perfectly no-one else can and you could sneak around while communicating.
 
E

Ether_Snake

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drohne said:
don't know why i didn't notice before, but watching the psn trailer just now, it appears that mantis is controlling the rest of the unit, perhaps psychically -- the trailer makes a point of cutting to her hand gestures as each member retreats

and crying wolf is kind of creepy if you consider that there's a person in there. creepy in a good way. i think!
Click to expand...

Also notice how the guy being lifted in the air has strings attached to him. The idea that she has actual puppets of Mantis and Sorrow is just weird tho.

freethought said:
I've assumed for a long time that there is a technological explanation for Liquid's continued existence. This certainly seems in keeping with what Kojima has said. I'm just not sure it applies to the Beasts, outside of them being cyborgs of course.

As far as other characters being preserved/resurrected digitally. any theories? The members of Foxhound and Cell are likely suspects as they all possessed nanomachines (I'm guessing), E.E. was an A.I. whiz so she makes another good candidate. Big Boss is the most obvious choice but how would it be explained?


Maybe, seems like it could be a little jarring really. I'm hoping the Mk. II is the standard, you could move around while having conversations, it could still use the codec so even though you can hear perfectly no-one else can and you could sneak around while communicating.
Click to expand...

Yeah I had a full explanation about how Outer Heaven is useful to The Patriots, how they perpetuate Liquid's existence for their own ends, etc. Too long to post, I could find it in an old MGS thread, but basically The Patriots want to be the instigators of all conflicts, because they know that soldiers will never manage to stay away from conflict, and hence if The Patriots don't CREATE the conflicts, soldiers will create their own, which lead to unpredictability and threats to the rule of The Patriots. So they digitized Liquid, placed him in the arm of their top agent, and now even this digital Liquid thinks it's actually carrying out his own plan when in fact it's just a puppet among many, all being played like pawns, all fighting their conflicts with the "Guns of The Patriots". No beginning, no end.

In MGS2 The Patriots controlled the flow of digital information which would otherwise cause them to crumble, now in MGS4 they seek to control war (but without actually seeking to eliminate it).

Snake almost makes that perfectly clear at the beginning of the 15 min trailer when he speaks about battlefield control and how he who controls the battlefield controls history, etc. It's worth watching again.

As for the rest, I'm pretty sure that the MGMKII will have its own AI, just like in Snatcher, but that's a guess based on the fact that they hired the guy who does Invader Zim's voice as a voice actor (Richard Horvitz).

I am pretty sure that Big Boss will be there in digital form only, to have a conversation with Snake at some point. Same thing for other characters like maybe Major Zero. We'll see:)

But I really find it puzzling that Screaming Mantis has actual puppets of Psycho Mantis and The Sorrow.

BTW, IGN is so stupid. Just go here and right click/save on the Insiders Only HD link lol

http://media.ps3.ign.com/media/714/714044/vids_1.html

Just copy the URL or just go ahead and save it:)

EDIT: Same as on gametrailers?

And:

i-shiva3.jpg
 
L

Laurent

Member
F

freethought

Member
Ether_Snake said:
In MGS2 The Patriots controlled the flow of digital information which would otherwise cause them to crumble, now in MGS4 they seek to control war (but without actually seeking to eliminate it).

Snake almost makes that perfectly clear at the beginning of the 15 min trailer when he speaks about battlefield control and how he who controls the battlefield controls history, etc. It's worth watching again.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I posted something along similar lines on another forum. An interesting side-note are the parallels between Big Boss' vision of the perfect world and the permanent war the Party manufactures in '1984', more specifically Emmanuel Goldsteins book within the book. Some of the colonels dialogue in the E3 '07 trailer was so similar to the sentiment in 1984 it had to be intentional.

I think the nature of the society envisioned by Big Boss will end up playing a very large part in the story, maybe even more so than Kojima originally envisioned. The allusions to current geo-political trends just seem too strong. Casting the 'Manhattan Incident' as the MGS version of 9/11, linking the rise of the PMC's to the global War on Terror and actually giving people the choice to cast themselves as occupiers or insurgents were all master strokes as far as I'm concerned.

I've always preferred the more overtly political messages contained in MGS to the more subtle philosophical questions it raises. The strong anti-nuclear proliferation and anti-war sentiments are what have always appealed to me. It's actually one of the reasons I liked Raiden so much, his backstory is easily one of my favourites in the entire series and the scenes in which it was revealed were actually quite poignant. Nothing like the Oedipal tragedy that was Otacon's childhood.
 
E

Ether_Snake

安安安安安安安安安安安安安安安
Laurent said:
http://www.g4tv.com/electricplayground/features/51427/Jade_Raymond_QA.html

Montreal is in Quebec by the way. Okay, bye...
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Ok MAYBE she is from Montreal but she is anglophone, her name is english. It is pronounced JAYDE, as in english, not JAHDUH as in french. I know this firsthand. But who cares really.



freethought: I actually don't believe that Big Boss really wanted a world of war, not anymore than The Boss betrayed her country. If you played MPO you can see how there were two potential successors to The Boss: Big Boss, and Gene. Gene was exactly like Liquid, he believed he was her successor, and he intended on making the same kind of world that Liquid is trying to make, yet when he was defeated by Big Boss he realized that he was not The Boss' true successor. And we know The Boss wanted to unite the world; this is definitly not what The Patriots of MGS2, MGS4, and Liquid are trying to do. They are all acting exactly like how The Boss described The Philosophers at the end of MGS3: they have become war itself.

So I think that what we will find out is that Big Boss ended up living his life like The Boss. In his final mission he was to carry out his dream just like her (in her case, getting the legacy, and in his, creating a haven for soldiers who have been used to kill each other like puppets), only to have to give up on it and pass on the torch to his successors, all the while being seen by the rest of the world as a traitor/madman.

Ocelot and Liquid are basically the ones who are carrying a false legacy, the legacy of the "traitor" and of the "madman" while Snake is actually carrying the true legacy that was passed over from The Boss to Big Boss.

All in all I'm pretty sure Big Boss has never turned into an actual bad guy, not any moreso than The Boss. In MG2 he was bluffing to force Snake to reject his war-craving-madman persona, to make sure he would NEVER become like Gene or Liquid and to make sure that he would continue along the same path he tried to walk, to be against the idea of using soldiers as puppets. A sort of "I'll beat my own kid to make sure he hates me enough so that he will never become like me".

_leech_ said:
Did you guys notice that Octopus makes the same Octocam cloaking noise as Snake does right before she grabs that guy?
Click to expand...

Yes, and she has the same mask Snake can wear (identical). This I believe will factor in the fact that Otacon is probably now working for a PMC. In the 15min trailer you can definitly tell he is wearing fancy clothes, and has his own personal chopper (it is NOT Campbell's, I can somewhat prove it if necessary:). Plus he has access to the tech needed to make the Octocam suit, which bears Otacon's own motto, and build the MGMKII. This is probably something that is explained early on, how there is no longer any way for Philantropy to continue to operate, so Otacon decided to use his skills to work for the enemy. Sort of fighting the beast from the inside.

Also notice how Screaming Mantis has the PMC's "Praying Mantis" logo on her vest, which means she is definitly part of the same PMC.
 
Â

∀ Narayan

Member
This has probably been stated. But does anyone think that Sigint might be the one explaining things to Snake, regarding the Beauty & The Beast unit?

He was pretty young in Metal Gear Solid 3. So, uhm -- maybe?
 
R

RyuHayate

Member
U K Narayan said:
This has probably been stated. But does anyone think that Sigint might be the one explaining things to Snake, regarding the Beauty & The Beast unit?

He was pretty young in Metal Gear Solid 3. So, uhm -- maybe?
Click to expand...

I thought the same thing. I don't know, though it could be that one guy from Meryl's squad.
 
P

psycho_snake

I went to WAGs boutique and all I got was a sniff
Graphics Horse said:
I made one of those but the conversation moved onto other things so I didn't bother posting
4lfgroi.jpg
Click to expand...
Have I missed an announement that those bosses are human or are we just assuming they might be?
 
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