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Microsoft is in talks to acquire Discord, a video-game chat community, for more than $10 billion

pasterpl

Member
Couple things;

1. This is nowhere near a done deal, just a rumour
2. if this acquisition happens, it is MS making an acquisition not Xbox division, same with Bethesd/zenimax, Xbox division profits are not relevant, lots of these companies will have patents, ips that can be used outside of gaming that’s why focusing on overall MS financial condition makes more sense.
3. id Tech + GitHub + discord can be very interesting combination
4. Discord is currently using Google Cloud, moving 100s of millions of discord users to azure would boost already expanding cloud business of ms (chasing aws)
 
Don't need a tax reduction lesson mate. I have a sibling who has worked for 2 of the big 4 you mention.
Tax reduction isn't about falsified profits it's things like this purchase but yes just having profits isn't good you need to spend the money back into the division.

The last 10 years of xbox were relatively profitable (not every year) but the previous 10 certainly were not. These weren't purchases these were costly losses on hardware, HDDs/nvidia deals and RROD which eat billions in previous gens.
Yes I believe billions in revenue can result in 0 profit. Take into account all console manufacturers. Sony make more than double the revenue of Nintendo. 25 billion just last year vs 12 billion for Nintendo but its profits are lower than Nintendos. What is the estimated Sony profit for PS4 gen 2013-2020? 11billion in 7 years. From >11 billion revenue every single year.

You sell 10 million PS5s this year? You're looking at 5 billion in revenue in that alone. How much are you looking at in profit for selling them? You're not. You're looking at a loss of ~1Billion which you hope to offset in future sales of games/services. Xbox was not profitable for a long time but spending and losing money was a necessary step to try and build the brand and invest for future profits. At the moment we don't know if they are because the data is hidden but there certainly is a new path. One where they're investing heavily (maybe even at a loss, probably ) into gamepass in the hope that they create an install base for profits in the future. I understand the idea of Capex, i understand the world famous example of Amazon but billions in revenue does not guarantee profit and this isn't just due to tax reduction it can be necessary spending to try and actually gain a foothold in the industry. That's what xbox's spending is, that's why they are less likely to post profits but they can afford not to.

I'm quite well aware of loss leading, it's not even a practice Xbox does anymore and hasn't for a number of generations. Sony on the other hand...Ninty doesn't do loss leading at all and retains premium prices/profit margins.
 

Three

Member
I'm quite well aware of loss leading, it's not even a practice Xbox does anymore and hasn't for a number of generations. Sony on the other hand...Ninty doesn't do loss leading at all and retains premium prices/profit margins.
How can you make statements like this when they are clearly rumoured to be taking a loss (at least initially like Sony) for all generations.




How do you think they would be making a profit on XSX but sony is taking a loss on PS5 when they are the same price? You are basing your statements on nothing but thin air.
 
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How can you make statements like this when they are clearly rumoured to be taking a loss (at least initially like Sony) for all generations.




How do you think they would be making a profit on XSX but sony is taking a loss on PS5 when they are the same price? You are basing your statements on nothing but thin air.

Phil Spencer in the lead up to console release stated loss leading was a thing of the past. They do not take heavy losses anymore. The BOM at the time of release was under $500 from industry pundits, that cost figure heads down the longer time and revisions of hardware go on.

EDIT: Did you actually just quote a 360 article as your own facts. I know where the thin air argument comes from.
 
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Dabaus

Banned
Funny how Sonys bid for crunchy roll gets held up by the doj but Microsoft can go on multi billion dollar spending sprees 🤔
 

Three

Member
Phil Spencer in the lead up to console release stated loss leading was a thing of the past. They do not take heavy losses anymore. The BOM at the time of release was under $500 from industry pundits, that cost figure heads down the longer time and revisions of hardware go on.

EDIT: Did you actually just quote a 360 article as your own facts. I know where the thin air argument comes from.
What? I listed articles for all generations.
 

Dr Bass

Member
Phil Spencer in the lead up to console release stated loss leading was a thing of the past. They do not take heavy losses anymore. The BOM at the time of release was under $500 from industry pundits, that cost figure heads down the longer time and revisions of hardware go on.

EDIT: Did you actually just quote a 360 article as your own facts. I know where the thin air argument comes from.
Phil Spencer has said a lot of things over the years. You can't really use "what Phil Spencer" says as proof of anything.
Couple things;

1. This is nowhere near a done deal, just a rumour
2. if this acquisition happens, it is MS making an acquisition not Xbox division, same with Bethesd/zenimax, Xbox division profits are not relevant, lots of these companies will have patents, ips that can be used outside of gaming that’s why focusing on overall MS financial condition makes more sense.
3. id Tech + GitHub + discord can be very interesting combination
4. Discord is currently using Google Cloud, moving 100s of millions of discord users to azure would boost already expanding cloud business of ms (chasing aws)
As someone who works in cloud computing Azure is nowhere near AWS. Also why would moving your own customers to your own cloud service boost your own product? It's like a snake eating its tail, it's not going to boost itself that way. And what about "idTech + GitHub + discord" is interesting?
 

Bryank75

Banned
Someone doesn't know corporate history. Microsoft was the proverbial punching bag of the DOJ, EU and many more for decades. Your argument carries no weight whatsoever.

Yeah, they learned how important it is to have lobbyists and generous political donations to almost every politician you could name...
 
Discord has over 100 million users per month. Discord Nitro $9,99 per month, includes Xbox Game Pass. It would be huge for Microsoft.
 
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Yeah, they learned how important it is to have lobbyists and generous political donations to almost every politician you could name...

Pretty sad how the world works. I'd love to see a political industry without all that even allowed. I wonder what a purely for the people governance would be like...
 

M16

Member
As someone who works in cloud computing Azure is nowhere near AWS.
a09t4L7.gif
 
This would actually be a huge issue for Sony more than any exclusive Bethesda games. If Xbox were able to integrate their ecosystem outside the Xbox with 100 million already active users, PSN has no chance of catching up.

Discord would become a Microsoft/Xbox platform from which MS could distribute xCloud and Game Pass PC via xCloud to a large audience that already willingly pays a $9.99 per month subscription to use more emojis.
 
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Shmunter

Member
This would actually be a huge issue for Sony more than any exclusive Bethesda games. If Xbox were able to integrate their ecosystem outside the Xbox with 100 million already active users, PSN has no chance of catching up.

Discord would become a Microsoft/Xbox platform from which MS could distribute xCloud and Game Pass PC via xCloud to a large audience that already willingly pays a $9.99 per month subscription to use more emojis.
That’s what was expected from Google and stadia. Embedding play now to searches and YouTube vids. Really expected that to be massive. Not sure what happened.
 

Kenpachii

Member
Microsoft didn't ruin Skype, they just didn't do enough to save it. Skype basically operated as it's own company for multiple year after the acquisition. The CEO of Skype at the time of the acquisition became one of the executive vice presidents of Microsoft (reports directly to CEO) and got the reigns to all Microsoft chat apps for enterprise and personal use. Mobile was already popular and getting more and more popular and Skype had some of the worst apps for mobile unstable and extremely slow. With the 20 other IM services being born (or soon to be) that were mobile ready (Messenger, Whatsapp Viber). Skype didn't get a mobile app revamp until Microsoft came in but then it was too little too late. Than there were all the security problems that existed before Microsoft even acquired them. Microsoft basically had to throw out their Windows app out at one point and so they rebuilt it using a new framework (not UWP). There was attempts at innovation but again too little too late. They started to try and replace the Skype engineers with Microsoft engineers but again too little too late. Skype may have been popular and helped make great advancements a long time ago. But Microsoft bought into a company with little innovation and problematic technology.

Skype was massive and great until Microsoft bought it up, the redesign under microsoft was so trash that nobody wanted to use it anymore and it got nuked from orbit on ratings everywhere, where people where searching for alternatives.

Skype also had this funny thing going on called showing your IP to the point lots of people got doxed which put so much bad rap on the program that it became more of a virus then actually a useful program specifically for gamers or people that wanted to stay in the shadows.

I see no way discord will stay relevent when those fucks buy the program up. They will find a way to nuke it and all it takes is the microsoft name.
 
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.Pennywise

Banned
Why is Discord so popular? It just looks like IRC to me.

In the same boat, never used it. Ducked in once to see and it seemed just like irc.

but there must be more to it considering the popularity


You should try to use it more. It's not just an old IRC to chat/voip with other players. It's an entire platform for socials on any level. They work much like a forum but with much more speed.

You for example are in a forum to discuss, watch, get news, etc, on gaming. Well, Discord has all of that very well integrated. Any of you can "make your own forum". With really powerful moderation tools, bots, reward system, etc.

Just look up for a game/community you like, search a server for it, join and you'll see.
 
As someone who works in cloud computing Azure is nowhere near AWS. Also why would moving your own customers to your own cloud service boost your own product? It's like a snake eating its tail, it's not going to boost itself that way. And what about "idTech + GitHub + discord" is interesting?
What. AWS is a big player (approx 30%), so is Azure (approx 20%). AWS had a headstart of 7 odd years but these days Azure is in more regions with more installations for localisation too. One could argue with Azure's open support it's friendlier to privatisation or third parties in place of AWS and a closed system. Not to derail the thread I'm genuinely curious why you consider Azure is "nowhere" near AWS? Pretty strong language for very similar cloud providers.
 
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M16

Member
Microsoft basically had to throw out their Windows app out at one point and so they rebuilt it using a new framework (not UWP).
little history lesson.
first there was the UWP version. this version was awesome,so many features. (this is not the shit UWP version everyone keeps talking about....keep reading)
then they switched it to react native(facebooks cross platform app framework), as to keep a common code base for all platforms(this is why it replaced the real UWP app i talked about above). BUT this was basically a webui wrapper running as a UWP app. there was nothing native UWP about this. this is the one people shit on and call it the UWP version.
then they switched it to an electron app (another webUI wrapper in a win32 app).
so basically UWP(native,awesome)->UWP webUI(not native,shit)->Win32 webUI(not native,shit)
 

jakinov

Member
Skype was massive and great until Microsoft bought it up, the redesign under microsoft was so trash that nobody wanted to use it anymore and it got nuked from orbit on ratings everywhere, where people where searching for alternatives.

Skype also had this funny thing going on called showing your IP to the point lots of people got doxed which put so much bad rap on the program that it became more of a virus then actually a useful program specifically for gamers or people that wanted to stay in the shadows.

I see no way discord will stay relevent when those fucks buy the program up. They will find a way to nuke it and all it takes is the microsoft name.
Skype was still massive (it even grew) and was great under Microsoft, at least initially. The UI stayed mostly the same for a while, they did have a revamp at one point but it was closer to a reskin than a new UI. Then when they found out that there was a major vulnerability (existed before Microsoft) that would affect all desktop apps and require a major rewrite; they rebuilt the UI using a framework that allowed them to develop faster. At that point the new app had less features and was inherently bulkier due to the technology that lets them develop faster.

Skype is also designed differently at its core than Discord. In the same way that SameTime, Jabber, Lync (Skype for Business), etc. is designed different at its core from Slack (basically the enterprise version of Discord that Discord likely ripped off). Unless they completely redesign what people think of Skype they were bound to lose a lot of people to Discord anyways. What they should have done though, was adopt the Zoom/Hangout model (which they did doing COVID) of creating calls via links. As with Skype was originally designed as a contact based system and they didn't copy that aspect until Zoom got big.

That security problem you mention existed before Microsoft acquired them and they knew about it before Microsoft acquired them. It's only one of the many problems with Skype. A lot of stuff people forget or didn't pay attention to. When Microsoft acquired them they had to revamp their mobile apps because they were garbage, they ate your battery, they were slow, lacked proper offline messaging, message synchronization, broken push etc. So they were at a shitty position on mobile. Desktop on the surface was fine for years apart from the security issue you mentioned but then shit got even worse when they found the other vulnerability and had to redo all their apps. However, the underlying Skype service/infra that any of the apps connect to was, outdated and needed to be completely revamped. Skype was originally designed as a peer-to-peer service and as a result both parties had to be online at the same time to do things like send messages (voice ,text, files). In the mobile and multi device world this was garbage because it caused problems with message synchronization across devices and also what lead to major push notification problems with the mobile apps. Their infra/service also heavily relied on computers being desktops and somewhat beefy and so they also had to redesign things to offload the apps. The other security issue with Slack which also existed before Microsoft was that they didn't support end-to-end encryption.

Microsoft had to address all these problems and try to be innovative. They could have done better sure. But this idea that Skype was this perfect thing that Microsoft ruined is absurd. Skype was a technological mess that seemed great on the surface.

Microsoft has the ability to build a chat service from scratch very fast, fairly reliably and full of features. They did it with MSN/WLM in the past and they did it again with Teams.

The main advantage Skype had the start was being one of the first with a decent app and having good voice tech but their codecs can be used by pretty much anybody and the problems Skype originally solved had been solved and made public. As time went by, it became easier and easier to build a better mouse trap than Skype with better open standards, more libraries and misc advancements in technology all around. Other services actually get to leverage modern technology instead of replacing or building on top of crap technology. Slack, Discord and Teams for example get to design their backend with modern standards in mind using modern technology; while building desktop and mobile apps using modern technologies that lets them basically reuse a bunch of the code used from their web version; and write less but get more results.
 
Why is Discord so popular? It just looks like IRC to me.
Back in 2010-2016 Skype was the main program my friends and I used to game with each other on PC using voice chat, being in high school none of us had money to rent a teamspeak server. Skype used an old voice codec so you had a delay for voice transfer

Freshman year of college (2016) discord goes into beta or either launches and the codec that discord uses is the same as teamspeak, etc. You can make your own private server with just friends and the rest is history, Discord is now the #1 program used for VC on PC and even console now with cross play becoming huge. All of that is free, no brainer they’re worth that much.
 

jakinov

Member
little history lesson.
first there was the UWP version. this version was awesome,so many features. (this is not the shit UWP version everyone keeps talking about....keep reading)
then they switched it to react native(facebooks cross platform app framework), as to keep a common code base for all platforms(this is why it replaced the real UWP app i talked about above). BUT this was basically a webui wrapper running as a UWP app. there was nothing native UWP about this. this is the one people shit on and call it the UWP version.
then they switched it to an electron app (another webUI wrapper in a win32 app).
so basically UWP(native,awesome)->UWP webUI(not native,shit)->Win32 webUI(not native,shit)
Haven't used Skype extensively in a while so I can't say how bad their newer apps are. But non-native apps aren't that bad unless you are low on resources and electron is very common for chat apps nowadays. Discord itself is also a non-native Electron app. Though it would be nice if they spent the time and money to make native applications for all their platform; it doesn't really align with their business goals of being able to build these apps fast, improve on them fast and not spend a lot of money doing it. I don't think they would have switched away from native if it wasn't for that vulnerability. I think at that point, they saw it as an opportunity to be able to rebuild the app fast and improve on it fast.
 

Gatox

Banned
How can you make statements like this when they are clearly rumoured to be taking a loss (at least initially like Sony) for all generations.
How can a rumour be clear exactly? You`re basing all your arguments on rumour, supposition and opinion. There simply is nothing clear about any of that.
 

Gamezone

Gold Member
Why are so many concerned by the fact that Microsoft might be buying Discord? This is honestly something companies like Valve or Epic should have considered long ago in order to get their community boost going. Microsoft is doing a lot of good things for gaming.
 

onesvenus

Member
Haven't used Skype extensively in a while so I can't say how bad their newer apps are. But non-native apps aren't that bad unless you are low on resources and electron is very common for chat apps nowadays. Discord itself is also a non-native Electron app. Though it would be nice if they spent the time and money to make native applications for all their platform; it doesn't really align with their business goals of being able to build these apps fast, improve on them fast and not spend a lot of money doing it. I don't think they would have switched away from native if it wasn't for that vulnerability. I think at that point, they saw it as an opportunity to be able to rebuild the app fast and improve on it fast.
I'd say the only reason why non-native apps aren't bad and electron everywhere is because our PCs are crazy powerful.
If you compare an electron app vs a native one there's an incredible performance gap. The thing is that a lot of time makes a lot of sense to create a single electron app instead of multiple native ones
 
If they do get bought by MS, it would be interesting to see if Twitch (Amazon) looks to ban their content creators from either linking to their discord or mentioning their discord on streams.

I wouldn't put it beyond the realm of possiblity.
 

The Alien

Banned
Mad Come On GIF by UEFA


Should have bought Sega with that cash!!!!!!!!!!!!!

But since all Xbox players are part of a secret society on Discord, maybe it fits.
Im sure there's some money left on their man-purse to squeeze together enough for Sega...AND whoever else they want.
 

Thirty7ven

Banned
Would be cool if we didn’t have to constantly forget about these mega-corps paying top dollar to buy and own our data. Hard to normalize it when talking about a company that has governmental and military contracts.
 
Don't forgot Mixxer
Mixer was fine. His death has nothing to do with MS, but due to the fact it failed to get the community due to Twitch being too popular.
In fact the technologies, used in Mixer found its own in other stuff like Teams as far as I recall.

So they have better lawyers and actually plan everything out to avoid big holdups. Why isn't Sony doing this?
More likely because with Sony's purchase they would gain almost 70-80% market of anime. If anime were considered a separate market it would be akin merging Amazon and Microsoft in cloud.
 
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Metnut

Member
Would be hysterically funny for Microsoft gaming divison to spend upwards of $20B and all they have to show for it (gaming wise) is pulling a few Bethesda games off of PS5.
 
Discord would become a Microsoft/Xbox platform from which MS could distribute xCloud and Game Pass PC via xCloud to a large audience that already willingly pays a $9.99 per month subscription to use more emojis.
That is actually hilarious to be honest.

One could argue with Azure's open support it's friendlier to privatisation or third parties in place of AWS and a closed system.
Yeah, I recall some quote or something that automakers for example prefer Azure over AWS voice recognition because they can build their own solutions using Azure, while with AWS you have to deal with Alexa or something.
 
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Dane

Member
Skype still being heavily used by companies, the thing is that the personal user moved on to facebook chat as it was mostly seen as a successor to MSN. Gaming was divided between it and TeamSpeak, then Discord came in and took the crown.
 
A lot of big streamers have a discord.
I have a group of friends that we started out using slack to coordinate and keep in touch with. We moved to discord in the middle of last year due to it being more functional (party chat and stream our screens from discord). If MS was to integrate that into Xbox, it would help to solve our issues in party chat where some are on PC and some are on Xbox.

If they were allowed to put it onto other platforms like PS and Switch, it would bring about a unified party chat without having to be on Xbox Live.
 

DaGwaphics

Member
Would be hysterically funny for Microsoft gaming divison to spend upwards of $20B and all they have to show for it (gaming wise) is pulling a few Bethesda games off of PS5.

The Discord purchase probably doesn't have much to do with the gaming division at all. This acquisition would pay for itself just due to them moving the platform to Azure. Azure gains a major cloud client, while they simultaneously take said client from a competitor in the cloud space. Two birds, one stone, and all of that. Any synergies with Xbox would be icing.
 
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