It was a really bad analogy and you should just drop it. Dressing up as Catwoman doesn't mean you are Catwoman, but others may think you are? Because something about meshing fantasy and reality? And that means you should expect to be groped? None of it makes sense.
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Misogyny, sexism & why RPS isn't shutting up
- Thread starter Lime
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It was a really bad analogy and you should just drop it. Dressing up as Catwoman doesn't mean you are Catwoman, but others may think you are? Because something about meshing fantasy and reality? And that means you should expect to be groped? None of it makes sense.
The problem is that your crusade is directed at the law-abiding women instead of the criminals that grope them.
You believe that the perception of the videogames industry as a "young boys club" is due to the (supposedly poor) way women are treated?
H.Protagonist
[-_-]/
And that's why I said I wasn't necessarily against that given the current state, but that equal effort should be made at the same time to enact change for the better rather than just accepting it as 'reality'.
You'd just get fired after hundreds of rape threats.
I think it's probably the biggest thing keeping it from being taken as seriously as the other forms of art that its most vocal proponents consider its contemporaries. Little boys tend to treat girls poorly.
InfiniteNine
Rolling Girl
Why is lexi banned? Did no one even read the article because it was a joke based on it's content.
what the..? I've never said anything close to that.
Devolution
Member
It pretty much derailed the thread.
I'm sorry did I miss where you think that women should keep up the status quo and even limit what they do because assholes exist?
Count Dookkake
Member
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InfiniteNine
Rolling Girl
It was a quote from the article. A joke.
where do you guys keep getting .." you should expect to be groped" from "being cautious so not to be groped" ?
truestatic
Member
Even if you got the joke it was perhaps one made in poor taste. You can see from the first page though, almost nobody got the joke.
Actually, I think it is because one of the rules of the site is to not do that in any topic, much less this one.
Devolution
Member
How does that contradict what I said? Sarcastic or no it pretty much derailed a good part of the first page. It was unnecessary.
no my "crusade" if you will is that you can not control the criminals.. you can however take precautions for yourself.
Bobby Roberts
Banned
the caution springs from an expectation, does it not? Where else would the caution come from?
From your earlier post: "That situations is totally avoidable."
I don't have to take precautions. It is always the criminal's fault for committing a crime.
Devolution
Member
You keep using these words. What do you think cosplayers should do? Be specific.
Wickerbasket
Member
Fourth time quoting you:
Your reply:
How is that not saying that women dressed as cosplayers should expect to get groped?
Edit: I'm honestly depressed at some of the views in this thread, I hope these views are a minority of the gaming community. All people should be welcome at gaming conventions regardless of who they are of what they're wearing, without the threat of being sexually assaulted.
I'm honestly confused. Are you actually suggesting that these cosplayers should be punished for being groped?
That instead of say, kicking the pervs out, the cosplayers should give up their hobby? And for a lot of them it would be giving up their hobby, plenty of cosplayers can only afford to go to the events nearest them. It's not really their choice of "Well I'll avoid this one because bad people go to it" (which would admittedly be the best way to get the organisers to take note of the issue) because they can't afford to further events.
dont cosplay as shitty, half-naked characters
Steve Youngblood
Member
The problem with you rhetoric is that you're missing the point. There's nothing wrong with erring on the side of caution. There's nothing wrong with making fearful people informed of risks so that they can do so if they desire. But the onus shouldn't be on the individual to behave contrary to the way they want to when there's nothing wrong with doing it save for the existence of bad seeds.
You kind of acknowledge this, but in a disingenuous fashion. As is, you don't seem to think the groping is much of an issue, as you seem to think it's easily avoidable by dressing appropriately.
It shouldn't be difficult to understand why people are taking issue with what you're saying, as it's stupid and offensive.
Your position is analagous to telling black people to stop driving nice cars so they don't get pulled over by the cops.
The problem in that situation is racist cops, not rich black people.
Devolution
Member
That's not a solution, try again.
I think it is obvious what he wants, to not dress provocative. He thinks the best course of action is for all women to not take the risk of harassment, through how they dress, at all.
It is.. if you keep reading how cosplayers. booth babes are being mistreated at certain conventions ..do go there as a cosplayer or booth/babe. don't give the convention attention.
nah
How do we solve that problem, though? How do we stop people from groping? We're talking about a problem but I don't think I read any solution, other than shaming them.
So then you are saying cosplayers can expect to be groped.
truestatic
Member
Have you seen how most of these characters dress? You're not leaving me with a lot of options here.
Riposte
Member
But they'll be okay if they cosplay as a half-naked character you like?
This thread seems derailed beyond repair.
Devolution
Member
And then nothing will be challenged and nothing will change. The only thing that will occur is cosplayers are limited in their character selection and the rest of us are limited in what we get to see and experience.
Boring. People who advocate for this kind of stuff are the biggest party poopers around. Just throw out the inevitable idiot who can't keep his hands to himself and have strict policies across conventions so that it's noted it isn't proper behavior. This isn't difficult and most of these conventions already do this.
Kick the people out who do. Send a clear message. I don't think advocating for people to cover up will change a damn thing that's for sure. It just limits the fun because some people are perverted morons.
mullet2000
Member
Who's fault it is isn't going to stop it from happening, unfortunately. (Speaking on crime in general)
To you it isn't, however I'm quite sure you know there are a lot of people who are against sexualization in public, in general(traditional christian/religious values and ect). Hell, there used to be people on campus all the time(both men and women) lecturing everyone on how they act in collage, specially when it came to sex.
If I want to cosplay as Sean Connery in Zardoz I should be allowed to!
Wickerbasket
Member
Correct, taking actions against it and education will hopefully stop it. Lifetime bans from conventions if need be.
Count Dookkake
Member
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computers putin'
Member
I think the better solution is for perverts to keep their hand to themselves.
at a convention known for cosplayers getting groped i am saying ..use your head.
You are totally missing the point. You are indirectly victim blaming.
Women should never feel the need to "not go somewhere because you will be groped in your sexy outfit". Never.
If a woman chooses to wear a sexy outfit at a convention, she should NOT have to worry about being touched by creeps at all. She should enjoy herself and the compliments she will hopefully get. Nothing more.
So instead of trying to change the attitude there and educate people, cosplayers rather shouldn't be going to conventions.... riiiight.
mullet2000
Member
Out of curiosity, what are the conversions doing to punish it? I can't imagine they aren't doing anything.
Also, so matter what they do after the fact can't stop it from happening in the first place, unfortunately.
Devolution
Member
To anyone with an actual interest in minimizing sexual assault through logic it isn't. They might as well put women in burkas if their attitude is to keep women covered since that's the logical conclusion. And more clothes is not even a damn panacea for sexual harassment or groping. It's an attitude that needs adjusting that certainly won't be challenged if people yield to it.
Riposte
Member
Motorboarding is still harassment.
It's a complicated problem so I'll generalize a bit, but I think it's not an impossible problem to start fixing:
1. Cons need to make it clear that such behavior is not endorsed. Volunteers should be instructed on how to be vigilant about said behavior. Con goers need to make it clear that they won't attend cons where women are treated as unwelcome.
2. Communities like ours with a high density of prospective con attendees should push towards further consciousness of negative behaviors and their prevalence.
The big fix is that all of us -- that is, the people with awareness of what's going on -- need to become active in our roles as people who believe that women should be treated with basic human dignity. It's not enough to just talk about it.
Vermillion
Banned
Rails? You know full well this thread never had any.
chronos4590
Member
Yes indeed and that's why i think that's why its important to try to have more women representation and one from a more feminist or just closer female perspective of characterization and image. I think and i'm sure lots of us can agree the more exposure to that type of characterization will only make the medium grow more and hopefully make consumers and these cosplayers or anyone especially in youth that its not right to do this to women since we live in a culture where we do objectify women and barely view them as anything but sexual and value women in parts.
As for your question, i don't entirely get what you're saying because at least to me it seems like you thought i only think cosplayers get groped at conventions cause thats clearly not the case. Plenty of my friends who have and have not cosplayed at conventions like comic con have gotten handheld very inappropriately, in some cases i had to tell the people to back off and move on out of our space cause they're being creeps, because they don't know any better because they think that behavior can be excused or just don't care. Cosplayers or not, these creeps don't need to be touching up on women.
my comments is not just to you but Mostly just in general since i'd expect and hope you or anyone who reads it will get a grasp of what i'm saying and overall what is right and wrong
Right, but it does affect to whom we direct our advocacy.