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[Orayn]

I wish the best for the franchise, but when I hear "...treating this as a massive, massive AAA title" for something that hasn't been that, I hear the Grim Reaper's scythe dragging across the ground ready to strike.

I think I know what he's saying, though. In terms of quality and the impact it made among core gamers, Dark Souls was a massive AAA title, and easily had as much mindshare as the other blockbusters of 2011. I don't see what's wrong with increasing the marketing budget to reflect that.

Also, don't forget that the Souls series have been some of From Software's best selling games in years. I doubt they'd have any problem with a bigger push on the publicity side of things.

 

[Krusenstern]

They're trying to market my niche underground jRPG???
Pffft, Dark Casuals 2 confirmed.

JRPG? Dark Souls is not a JRPG. You were playing something else.

 

[Robot Pants]

As I've said before in other Dark Souls 2 threads, I remain cautiously optimistic for this game.
I really hope it's just as good or better than Dark Souls.

 

[DidntKnowJack]

So current Dark Souls and Demon Souls fans will skip out on the next entry? What you said makes no sense.

It's still a niche game. In the current environment where publishers are closing studios left and right, those numbers may not be enough anymore.

 

[Amir0x]

Prepare for the most epic dumbing down of a franchise ever done

no

 

[Augemitbutter]

i want a dorito helmet for my DS character.

 

[sixghost]

As I've said before in other Dark Souls 2 threads, I remain cautiously optimistic for this game.
I really hope it's just as good or better as Dark Souls.

A lot of the stuff they showed in that IGN video looked good, but everything they've been saying in interviews makes me nervous. Hopefully there will be more gameplay at E3.

 

[Phonomezer]

JRPG? Dark Souls is not a JRPG. You were playing something else.

I'd consider it a JARPG.

 

[Seance]

Elder Souls: Prepare to Casual Edition

 

[Orayn]

JRPG? Dark Souls is not a JRPG. You were playing something else.

In the interest of averting a flame war, I'll say this: Dark Souls is a JRPG in the sense that it's an (action) RPG that was made in Japan. It's not a JRPG in the sense of being similar to Dragon Quest, MegaTen, and Final Fantasy.

As I've said before in other Dark Souls 2 threads, I remain cautiously optimistic for this game.
I really hope it's just as good or better as Dark Souls.

The ten minutes of footage and the interviews surrounding it put my fears about difficulty and core mechanics to rest. I can't believe we're getting QTE and CHEST HIGH WALL posts in this thread after that. Do people really think they've been lying about every detail of the game, making fake gameplay footage, and that the real thing is a God of War clone or something? Baloney.

 

[MormaPope]

It's still a niche game. In the current environment where publishers are closing studios left and right, those numbers may not be enough anymore.

Er, Dark Souls 1 made Namco money, why would From Software get shutdown if Dark Souls 2 was financially successful? Once again, I don't understand what you're saying.

Studios get shutdown when large amounts of money go down the drain and there's no way out, studios don't go away because of cartoon villainary.

 

[antitrop]

The ten minutes of footage and the interviews surrounding it put my fears about difficulty and core mechanics to rest. I can't believe we're getting QTE and CHEST HIGH WALL posts in this thread after that. Do people really think they've been lying about every detail of the game, making fake gameplay footage, and that the real thing is a God of War clone or something? Baloney.

I was going to write a post to make this exact point.

It was just a few weeks ago with the gameplay reveal we were all "DARK SOULS 2 REDEEMED THANK GOD ITS NOT CASUAL GARBAGE!" and here we are again.

 

[Robot Pants]

The ten minutes of footage and the interviews surrounding it put my fears about difficulty and core mechanics to rest. I can't believe we're getting QTE and CHEST HIGH WALL posts in this thread after that. Do people really think they've been lying about every detail of the game, making fake gameplay footage, and that the real thing is a God of War clone or something? Baloney.

Well that's the thing, and the reason I'm optimistic only to a certain degree.
They are showing and saying very different things.
And we only saw a very small part of the game so.......Yes it was good but you never know what the rest will be like....

 

[Baraka in the White House]

Yeah... yeah go balls deep.

Yeah, now spit on me.

 

[Nyoro SF]

The ten minutes of footage and the interviews surrounding it put my fears about difficulty and core mechanics to rest. I can't believe we're getting QTE and CHEST HIGH WALL posts in this thread after that. Do people really think they've been lying about every detail of the game, making fake gameplay footage, and that the real thing is a God of War clone or something? Baloney.

Well not quite that extreme, but I am worried that even something like the common enemies grouping together will not even require patience to take out any longer, for example, or that Mimic Chests would no longer one-shot you if you open them carelessly.

Little things like that can really destroy the high stakes nature of the game that's existed thus far. I'm worried that by shaving back little by little, it'll end up being a far lesser game than its predecessor.

However I am still really hype for it. The improved PvP scenarios will be fantastic.

 

[DocSeuss]

I can just see the customer reviews now:

EVERYONE SHUT UP1! i dont understand this i thought it was going to be like skyrim but ??? why i died. HOW DARE U market this at me THIS IS NOT FUN!! i died a lot and then i broke the disc in half because it was so bad but gamestop wouldnt give my money back

This game, according to [random scripture verse] is an affront to God. I looked it up on the Wikipedias and found that it is the sequels to DEMONS SOULS, and demons DON'T HAVE SOULS. Jesus will send you to hell for this game! The Bible says so!

What? This game doesn't feature powerful choice and consequence systems like MASS EFFECT™ or DRAGON AGE™, the graphics don't look Canadian enough, and, let's face it, it doesn't even give you the option to be gay, which is important. This game is just as sexist and homophobic as The Witcher 2, which was terrible, like that other review I wrote.

The internet kicks ass.

The reviews are the worst part of Polygon, by far.

I don't know.

The community started to become a huge-ass circlejerk (even some of the better ex-Kotaku commenters ffs), and the community manager has been a douchebag to me for a while now, to the point where there's a part of me that wishes I had the chance to hit him.

 

[Midou]

or that Mimic Chests would no longer one-shot you if you open them carelessly..

Have you not followed much of the game? Especially in the footage, dying in unexpected ways like that seems to be a big focus of theirs.

 

[Spring-Loaded]

They're putting guns in the game? Sweet, I might start playing this franchise then

 

[Jaleel]

The ten minutes of footage and the interviews surrounding it put my fears about difficulty and core mechanics to rest. I can't believe we're getting QTE and CHEST HIGH WALL posts in this thread after that. Do people really think they've been lying about every detail of the game, making fake gameplay footage, and that the real thing is a God of War clone or something? Baloney.

This.

The game has dwarfs throwing axes at yo ass that instagib you.

 

[Krusenstern]

In the interest of averting a flame war, I'll say this: Dark Souls is a JRPG in the sense that it's an (action) RPG that was made in Japan. It's not a JRPG in the sense of being similar to Dragon Quest, MegaTen, and Final Fantasy.

Isn't JRPG the wrong term then? Google images with the term JRPG and you will see what is actually meant by this definition. Dark Souls is a game made by a japanese studio, but it's not a JRPG in that meaning. The action and the tone of this game has a 'japanese' style, yes. But it's not a JRPG.

 

[sixghost]

Well not quite that extreme, but I am worried that even something like the common enemies grouping together will not even require patience to take out any longer, for example, or that Mimic Chests would no longer one-shot you if you open them carelessly.

Little things like that can really destroy the high stakes nature of the game that's existed thus far. I'm worried that by shaving back little by little, it'll end up being a far lesser game than its predecessor.

However I am still really hype for it. The improved PvP scenarios will be fantastic.

Mimics don't one-shot you as is. Dark Souls fucking ruined.

 

[antitrop]

Isn't JRPG the wrong term then? Google images with the term JRPG and you will see what is actually meant by this definition. Dark Souls is a game made by a japanese studio, but it's not a JRPG in that meaning. The action and the tone of this game has a 'japanese' style, yes. But it's not a JRPG.

You're both right, what's the point in arguing semantics?

 

[Mindlog]

Speaking of, Skyrim.
I like Skyrim. I like Dark Souls. Dark Souls can definitely reach a larger audience while retaining its core features. However, here's hoping that expectations remain reasonable and that very modest growth isn't considered a failure.

 

[Orayn]

Well not quite that extreme, but I am worried that even something like the common enemies grouping together will not even require patience to take out any longer, for example, or that Mimic Chests would no longer one-shot you if you open them carelessly.

Mimic Chests don't do that now if you mash L1/R1 to break free quicker.

Little things like that can really destroy the high stakes nature of the game that's existed thus far. I'm worried that by shaving back little by little, it'll end up being a far lesser game than its predecessor.

However I am still really hype for it. The improved PvP scenarios will be fantastic.

This I agree with. The level layout and world design still leave plenty of room for them to screw it up, but I'm completely incredulous at some of the comments people are making. They're too ridiculous to even be effective hyperbole if you know even a little about what's actually been revealed so far.

 

[Risible]

Yes, please ruin Dark Souls. Delicious tears from fanboys, and an equally or more enjoyable game for me, assuming I make it through the first one and still want the sequal.

Isn't it easier and more to the point for you to just type "I'm an asshole."?

 

[Tiktaalik]

I will not be surprised if due to marketing overspend, Dark Souls 2 "fails to meet expectations" and the franchise is shuttered and dev team laid off.

 

[Krusenstern]

You're both right, what's the point in arguing semantics?

You're right too. Stupid to argue about that.

To get back to the topic, I think it's good if they're trying to market the game to get more people into Dark Souls without changing the game's concept to please more people. Get people interested in the game, appreciating for what it is, not making it suit as many as possible.

 

[Arkos]

i want a dorito helmet for my DS character.

Elder Souls: Prepare to Casual Edition

Laughing way too much at this. I'm of the camp that gives them the benefit of the doubt, nothing about either Souls game really suggests they're interested in selling out. Will be an interesting case study if they do.

 

[Nyoro SF]

Mimic Chests don't do that now if you mash L1/R1 to break free quicker.

I had no idea... I was just going off my experience in Sen's...

 

[Sir Garbageman]

Did a PR Director really just use the phrase balls deep?

 

[Orayn]

I will not be surprised if due to marketing overspend, Dark Souls 2 "fails to meet expectations" and the franchise is shuttered and dev team laid off.

Different situation from EA or Activision taking the devs out behind the woodshed after a game sells poorly; Bamco doesn't have the power to do that because they don't own From. Their arrangement is more like an EA Partners situation, only not as horribly dysfunctional. (At least not yet.)

From Software has enough autonomy that they're able to publish the game in Japan, which probably means that Bamco isn't paying for the game's entire development budget. If it somehow did poorly overseas, the worst I can imagine happening is Bamco cutting the marketing budget and relegating the Souls series to Armored Core status, or maybe refusing to publish them in the future.

 

[Capital_Five]

"I'm not saying that every Skyrim player's going to be jumping on Dark Souls"

Understatement of the fucking century. I tried playing the first game, just could not get into it at all, uninstalled after 2 hours. I only mention this because I loved Skyrim and I just don't see any overlap.

 

[Tiktaalik]

Different situation from EA or Activision taking the devs out behind the woodshed after a game sells poorly; Bamco doesn't have the power to do that because they don't own From. Their arrangement is more like an EA Partners situation, only not as horribly dysfunctional. (At least not yet.)

From Software has enough autonomy that they're able to publish the game in Japan, which probably means that Bamco isn't paying for the game's entire development budget. If it somehow did poorly overseas, the worst I can imagine happening is Bamco cutting the marketing budget and relegating the Souls series to Armored Core status, or maybe refusing to publish them in the future.

Interesting! From didn't publish Dark Souls in Japan so I just assumed From didn't publish games anymore.

 

[AstroZombie]

That sounds like a phenomenally stupid idea.

 

[Kouichi]

Oh noe guys. Namco mentioned Skyrim when talking about Dark Souls 2!

The Souls franchise is ruined! Run for the hills! QTEs and waypoints incoming!!

 

[Error]

easy mode confirmed. it's over.

 

[Man]

"We're going to go balls-deep and guns-blazing with it, and hope to God that it works," he continued.

Best comment.

 

[Orayn]

Interesting! From didn't publish Dark Souls in Japan so I just assumed From didn't publish games anymore.

Can't find any information on a few games, but it looks like From Software has been the Japanese publisher for almost every game they've developed, and even a few they didn't. (3D Dot Heroes in Japan)

 

[Clevinger]

easy mode confirmed. it's over.

Or we could, I don't know, wait until the game comes out and see how it actually is.

 

[Tiktaalik]

Did a PR Director really just use the phrase balls deep?

I was going to post that yeah this is an insanely inappropriate comment for a PR guy to make.

 

[antitrop]

"I'm not saying that every Skyrim player's going to be jumping on Dark Souls"

Understatement of the fucking century. I tried playing the first game, just could not get into it at all, uninstalled after 2 hours. I only mention this because I loved Skyrim and I just don't see any overlap.

You just wandered your way into an interesting conversation here on NeoGAF. Where Skyrim represents everything that is wrong with modern RPG design and Dark Souls is the savior of gaming.

 

[Orayn]

easy mode confirmed. it's over.

“We do not plan on having an Easy Mode,” says Tanimura, “since we are creating this game with a thought that challenge and difficulty are core elements of the game.”

Spoiler

Even if you're joking, I feel the need to post quotes like this so people see them.

You just wandered your way into an interesting conversation here on NeoGAF. Where Skyrim represents everything that is wrong with modern RPG design and Dark Souls is the savior of gaming.

I personally don't care for Skyrim and I think there are a lot of things that developers should learn from Dark Souls, but I'll keep my mouth shut to avoid contributing to the angry internet neckbeard stereotype.

 

[Kageshinzo]

I always lol at Hyperbole-GAF. It almost always overlaps well with Oh-No-The-Sky-Is-Falling-GAF. Never change, guys.

 

[Kusagari]

I will not be surprised if due to marketing overspend, Dark Souls 2 "fails to meet expectations" and the franchise is shuttered and dev team laid off.

The Souls series is basically the biggest thing Scamco has at this point.

Only way I see this happening is if it somehow sells like a million less than Dark Souls.

 

[RoninChaos]

I eagerly await the Mountain Dew and Doritos tie-ins.


Source: http://www.oxm.co.uk/53991/namco-ta...ing-this-as-a-massive-massive-triple-a-title/

I'm willing to bet the marketing budget is more than the game's budget.

 

[Defuser]

My goodness, some of you have this mistake perception that From Software is part of Namco Bandai games :/

Even if Dark Souls bomb, they still have Demon's Souls if they can approach Sony.

 

[Tiktaalik]

The Souls series is basically the biggest thing Scamco has at this point.

Only way I see this happening is if it somehow sells like a million less than Dark Souls.

What I'm getting at is that even if Dark Souls 2 does better numbers than Dark Souls 1, if Namco gets the numbers wrong and they spend too much on marketing, then the game still won't be profitable.

It happens all the time. For example Elite Beat Agents did ok DS numbers for Nintendo, but they thought it was going to be a big success, and spent on TV commercials, and they later said that the title was a disappointment for them.

 

[Orayn]

The Souls series is basically the biggest thing Scamco has at this point.

Only way I see this happening is if it somehow sells like a million less than Dark Souls.

It's one of the bigger things. Tales sells gangbusters in Japan, their fighters still do pretty well worldwide, and licensed games are a perpetual money-maker, but Dark Souls has definitely gotten them more worldwide attention than any of those.

 

[Tiktaalik]

My goodness, some of you have this mistake perception that From Software is part of Namco Bandai games :/

Even if Dark Souls bomb, they still have Demon's Souls if they can approach Sony.

Independent developers can still lay off people if they lose projects.

It was a cheeky comment on my part though. I really doubt that From would be severely injured enough to lay off a whole team if Dark Souls 2 underperformed.

 

[Nirolak]

It's one of the bigger things. Tales sells gangbusters in Japan, their fighters still do pretty well worldwide, and licensed games are a perpetual money-maker, but Dark Souls has definitely gotten them more worldwide attention than any of those.

At 2.4 million Dark Souls pretty much blows every other franchise they make out of the water based on their latest entries.

Tales does 700K at most (usually less), TTT2 got to 1.5M, and Soul Calibur and Naruto are a bit below TTT2.

There was a time that wouldn't be true, but they've had quite the decline over the years.