ethomaz
Banned
I believe it is more luck.
My day one PS4 is pretty quiet.
But people says Pro is the main ofensor... I never had one so I can't talk.
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My day one PS4 is pretty quiet.
But people says Pro is the main ofensor... I never had one so I can't talk.
ethomaz
Banned
It was a GDC presentation... it is suppose to be do developers not gamersI am having a really hard time appreciating this SSD speed and I/O bottleneck removal. They showed no technical demos for me to appreciate Cernys vision, except the only thing I can visualize is that there are no loading times. At best what I can visualize in terms of graphics fidelity is that open world games or game levels are going to be massive. Although I understand and appreciate some technical aspects of computer engineering, for most part , and majority of people out there, are average laymen who just want to enjoy games with phenomenal graphics. But yet its the average laymens fault for not understanding the technical mumbo jumbo nerd talk of Cerny for not appreciating what Sony has to offer with a 'wait and see' policy. Give me a fucking break.
I expected 0 games being showed when they announced the presentation... just dev talk.
I like it but some doesn't like.
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LucidFlux
Member
Come on folks, where is the good technical discussion (some of you are open minded enough to have it). I often forget how blinded people can be when they are shackled down by brand loyalty, ah the youth these days... but alas. I'm happy where both of these systems landed. They're truly fantastic unique approaches and I'm day one for both, but if you've been paying attention the numbers on the spec sheet only tell half the story. What matters at the end of the day is the exclusives you want to play, services and maybe the performance of key 3rd party games (but here's a hint, they'll be largely indistinguishable).
I'll just leave this here because it seems most of you missed this recent comment from BG's...
Look I get that there are people of all walks of life in here with different perspectives and things that matter to them when it comes to their gaming device of choice, but let's be kind to each other while we discuss the possibilities that these machines bring without resulting to putting others down. No callouts needed, you all know who you are.
On that note, I really hope the remote play is improved with these systems. I love that I can bring the Switch with me around the house (have a 5 month old so I need to be flexible) but whenever I stream with my pro or X on the same 1GB fiber hardwired network in my house it's always a less than desirable experience with frame rate hitches and resolution drops.
Deeper Underground
Member
So basically nobody knows and you all are just guessing? Gotcha.
splattered
Member
My Pro is super loud always and my X1X can be almost as loud depending on the game i'm playing... COD MW for example makes it very loud almost constantly.
Metroiddarks
Member
Exactly all we have a pc gamig will have a problem with those new game made it for even the "slower" ssd of xbox maybe in medium future the motherboards or even some
nvme will include the neccesary hardware for not use our cpu cores and reach the level of performance.
VFXVeteran
Banned
Or maybeVFXVeteran rumor that a PlayStation 5 Pro is real but Sony didn't come out and announced it just like Microsoft didn't announce their Xbox Lockhart?
I'm leaning more on the side that the PS5 just announced was the "Pro" version of the two SKUs. I'm guessing that there will be a lower end model of the PS5 like a lower end model of Lockhart. My contacts made it clear that the XSX the top of the line followed by the PS5 followed by Lockhart. What I'm eager to see is how much of a price tag will these two beasts cost. I get the bad feeling that it may be $500-$600 ranges and hence the reason for a 2nd SKU.
We'll see hopefully soon.
Rolling_Start
Banned
The "couple of percent" drop was to give an example of a 10% saving of power. It was not a statement that clocks would never drop by more than 2%.
He definitely didn't say that.
Which devs have said the PS5 memory arrangement is better? Simpler, yes, but better for performance? I'll bet none.
Mass Shift
Member
If this was always going to be the case then seriously WTF were all the insiders doing trying to convince us that the PS5 was going to be incrementally to much more powerful than the Series X for?
These people literally made everybody crazy over these specs and now they're telling us none of it ever mattered. Geezus! What an absolutely useless mind fuck they put everyone through.
Shit! It ain't called cognitive dissonance for nothing.
splattered
Member
So does anyone have an updated general run down of all of the supposed leakers from over the last year?
I think O'dium, Heisenberg, BG's, and VFXVeteran are still posting?
*Not looking for any witch hunts - just wondering what their current status is. I think I saw some of these members explain themselves but what about Tommy, Orisiris, and others?
I think O'dium, Heisenberg, BG's, and VFXVeteran are still posting?
*Not looking for any witch hunts - just wondering what their current status is. I think I saw some of these members explain themselves but what about Tommy, Orisiris, and others?
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Kazekage1981
Member
I am sure Sony will demonstrate PS5's cheetah like qualities in upcoming months before its launch but holy fuck what a shitty way to reveal something so phenomenally important with billions in R&D. And I do not think this is Mark Cernys fault, this is totally Jim Ryans fault, he needs to get fired.
xool
Member
I'd take real world bets that Sony does not have a lower tier version .1000%. can't be clearer.
xool
Member
My theory = is that some of them knew PS4 was 10 TF or whatever, and didn't have the balls to say it, partially because of internet lynch mobs - which in fairness - they would have been lynched...
Felessan
Member
To give an idea - https://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-medi...gressive,q_80,w_800/ucoln8kedwfglsrlxvm5.webm
You angular and linear velocity are both capped in-game. This means developers knows exactly just how much you can see in the next moments, no matter what you try to do "unpredictably". And tweak engine so you have never have a problem with assets on the next step.
It's quite simple task to adjust amount of assets used in visible scene given that you know a) max velocities, linear and angular, b) asset load speed. And you can tweak percentage of "asset used in frame / total asset loaded into memory" so load speed will be just enough to cover character movements. And visible assets size will be much higher than in design used in hdd era.
Kazekage1981
Member
I guess all this time was invested in getting rid of bottlenecks and utilizing other aspects of the consoles hardware which were never utilized, which is wonderful to a certain degree but perhaps the PS5Pro will get back on track with brute force with further perfection to the SSD and I/O.
Jtibh
Banned
Why is the ps5 the most revolutionary hardware in the last 20 years and do i think correctly if i say the ps5 is handling a lot of tasks outside the gpu cpu like the audio and ssd transfer etc and the xbox is using its gpucpu for some of those tasks as well maybe using more ram for certain tasks then the ps5?
Honest questions as i have zero clue about tech and like to learn something new.
Insane Metal
Gold Member
Holy shit that AMD RDNA2 Ray Tracing demo is absolute trash.
VFXVeteran
Banned
The PS5 is not the most revolutionary hardware to date. That's a very subjective statement whoever said that. Last night, I only saw a great case for extremely fast SSD chipset. It's what bothered the developers the most. They've fixed that and I think it should be top priority for design, so I agree with Sony on that front. But "revolutionary"? No.
Insane Metal
Gold Member
HeisenbergFX4
stayed like 90% of the time in the ~10TF range for PS5. Only recently he started to say he heard it could go higher than that, closer to 11-12TF (probably a bad source).He's been the closest to the truth.
Kazekage1981
Member
Saw that demo, I dont even know how that is ray tracing. Its mostly metallic like reflections and mirrors ?!
xool
Member
Yeah it can work .. but in a typical action game you can turn on the spot, press L3 (or whatever) to center the camera and the camera should (and really has to because gameplay) turn 180 in very few frames. I really don't enjoy the slow animation priority type games, and hope this new tech won't drive devs to actually slow movement down, when the intention of the tech is to speed things up ...
Jtibh
Banned
Jason smurf shreier was tweeting that not my words.
Insane Metal
Gold Member
Reflections from parts that are not shown on screen.
ethomaz
Banned
IMO if they can remove loading times from games it will be the most impressive change in games since PS1.
Kazekage1981
Member
He's been the closest to the truth.
ARIGATO GODAIMAZU
HeisenbergFX4
pasterpl
Member
where is this 25gb/s coming from?
Insane Metal
Gold Member
In the presentation Cerny said that if the conditions are "just right" the read speed could be as high as 22GB/s. Not 25. But that's what he said which is bollocks imo.
Anyone have any knowledge about downscaling? I have a panasonic 1080p plasma and will upgrade to a 4k unit. I'm very happy with the plasma though
I got 10-10,5TF number from a good source. Actually sent a PM to OsirisBlack the day before the reveal and asked him if he had heard of such a dev.kit. He said that he had not but it was right. Feels good to have people I can trust in my life.
He's been the closest to the truth.
Agnostic2020
Member
The upcoming Playstation 5 will only play 2.5% of the Playstation 4's library. Microsoft's new console will play the vast majority of your current Xbox library.
With the PlayStation 5, many of the games you purchased on the PlayStation 4 won't move forward, Sony announced on Wednesday.
Sony is messing up massively right now.
travisktl
Member
Atmos can do up to 35 audio sources, while the Tempest engine goal is to do around 100.
pasterpl
Member
my ps4 pro and xbx are both quiet and barely noticeable
Self High Five
Member
Oh ok. It was just the last 24 hours. The part where he literally used the term 'Playstation fanboys' to call out all the mouth breathers for giving him shit about HZD coming to PC didn't bother you. Gee, I wonder why?
And the best of example of him being a Sony shill was reporting their dangerous crunch practices from their premiere first party studio, shortly before their biggest release in years. Despite the fact that unpaid overtime/crunch is rampant across the game industry, particularly the AAA space.
Fact is the SSD is likely what devs across the industry are most exited about & both MS & Sony delivered. But it's a fact that Sony went above and beyond and produced an SSD that is over +100% faster than an already super fast Series X SSD. That's what devs are excited about.
And it isn't 'magic sauce', it's right there on paper. Don't confuse Jason with an actual corprate shill like Arthur Gies who imfamously used the exact words 'secret sauce' to spread bullshit about Xbox One before launch and then quickly denied using the term and was subsequently banned from GAF for doing so.
splattered
Member
You are honestly excited about loading in lower quality graphics and lower performance faster?
These SSDs have to provide something other than fast load times for them to be worth the increase in cost... if people are so impatient they can't wait 10-30 seconds for a level to load then I don't know what to tell them.
A decrease in loading times is welcome, but I don't want to pay an extra $50 - $100 for it.
Jtibh
Banned
I wonder if the ssd as somewhat of a replacement of memory can be used to stream in 4k assets on the fly without any performance hit on the gpu?
I guess i wonder to what extent will the ssd help in graphics the normally would fall under the gpu?
If i ask dumb questions just ignore
Insane Metal
Gold Member
Wait, I don't think that's even confirmed, is it? It doesn't make sense.The upcoming Playstation 5 will only play 2.5% of the Playstation 4's library. Microsoft's new console will play the vast majority of your current Xbox library.
With the PlayStation 5, many of the games you purchased on the PlayStation 4 won't move forward, Sony announced on Wednesday.www.yahoo.com
Sony is messing up massively right now.
Kazekage1981
Member
Can you please give some sort of description of what this SSD and removal of I/O bottlenecks can do? I am having a hard time understanding this in terms of graphics fidelity or graphics processing in laymen terms.
S
SLoWMoTIoN
Unconfirmed Member
So it was announced the Ps5 is gonna be weaker than the xboxsex. So now we have threads saying how it doesn't matter because it has some sort of hidden power that nobody knows off.
So it was announced the Ps5 is gonna have limited Ps4 BC and now we have threads saying how BC doesn't matter. Since it doesn't affect sales or that nobody cares about said feature.
So it was announced "different" kinds of SSDs are gonna be used and they can make games look better because fuck you.
Yes.
So it was announced the Ps5 is gonna have limited Ps4 BC and now we have threads saying how BC doesn't matter. Since it doesn't affect sales or that nobody cares about said feature.
So it was announced "different" kinds of SSDs are gonna be used and they can make games look better because fuck you.
Yes.
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splattered
Member
You just joined Tuesday morning and name dropped Osiris... are you Osiris' new account? haha
Bladed Thesis
Member
Yeah, its an awful article, horribly written, but it shows the loss of control of the message.
Sony needs to start talking. There's no getting ahead of the message, its already out. Poorly worded, poorly informed.
Kazekage1981
Member
OMG IM LAUGHING SO HARD AT THIS!!!
MisterXDTV
Member
This is just a clickbait based on the fact that Cerny said they prioritized the TOP 100 games by playing time
He never said that no other title will be supported
Awful article
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M-V2
Member
All these discussions, because Sony dropped the ball, it's not the PS5 is not great, it's not anyone's fault that some Xbox fans trash the ps5 for the lack of tech understanding. The problem is Sony dropped the ball in showing their console, after long silence they should direct their event toward the fans and show them the real deal but they did a huge mistake by breaking their silence in a tech talk that directed to devs.
Insane Metal
Gold Member
This just goes to show how AWFUL their messaging has been. Jesus F Christ.
vdopey
Member
I personally think next generation will be won by price.
If Sonys intention has been to keep to the $399 budget then I think this will put some strain on Microsoft.
1. MS could price the xsx at $450, but I think they will suffer a pretty heavy loss per console sold, Sony would be bleeding them as there will be a fixed budget / operating cost and the other departments will be looking at just how much loss the xbox produces.
2. MS could price the xsx at $500 or $600 in both cases the loss will be far less or it may even make profit on each unit sold, but the sales will be far weaker and its almost guaranteed Sony will outsell them at $100 or $200 price difference.
If the ps5 had been 12tf or 13tf then no doubt both would be at a very similar price point, as it stands I think the xbox costs more to produce, I could be wrong all that custom silicon may have significantly increased the cost of ps5 production, but for certain they don't have to pay royalties to AMD for it as it is their custom design, so I expect the R&D costs would have been fairly hefty, however in mass production it would cost them next to nothing.
I think Sony will end up coming out on top again this generation, by how much I don't know, but I also expect that by the end of this gen for the ps5 to be struggling.
They just need 1 game to showcase the hardware design to show case just what this SSD can do, that no other console or PC to date has been able to do and I think Horizon Zero Dawn 2, almost guaranteed will be it, as I believe this design was specifically targeted at expansive open world games. I also think Naughty Dog will produce something far more open and less linear, probably an Uncharted with Nates daughter that will end up making many a pc and xbox gamer envious.
I also believe FPS' on the xsx will be better, probably standard 120FPS 4K, (Halo & Gears is their bread ) I also believe Racing games will be better on the xsx again probably native 4K 120FPS, I think Forza Horizon( their butter)? Will look jaw dropping and run beautifully probably at 60, possibly 120 FPS, the standard forza guaranteed 120FPS - this is where the raw power comes in.
Me personally I was hoping maybe Bungie would make a Destiny 3 that was actually fun and looked great and tbh I think both consoles would run it well.
Its the gaming genres you need to think about, some genres will greatly benefit from Sonys Design, Others will benefit from the Xbox design, its obvious both have followed paths that would benefit the games studios they have and the sort of games they make. The thing is and I know this is probably not to the liking of the Xbox fans - the truth is if the ssd does as Cerny says its something the Xbox just cannot do, however the PS5 performance is not far off of the xbox performance so Sony can do what the Xbox does albeit with a very small performance parity.
I don't think the Sony implementation of Raytracing will be as good, I think it maybe worse by a good margin and I don't think they have all of the RDNA2 extensions, unlike MS - He was too quiet about some of the things MS announced at a Games Developer Conference. For example VRS, Machine learning and 4 bit / 8 bit / 16 bit integer support
If Sonys intention has been to keep to the $399 budget then I think this will put some strain on Microsoft.
1. MS could price the xsx at $450, but I think they will suffer a pretty heavy loss per console sold, Sony would be bleeding them as there will be a fixed budget / operating cost and the other departments will be looking at just how much loss the xbox produces.
2. MS could price the xsx at $500 or $600 in both cases the loss will be far less or it may even make profit on each unit sold, but the sales will be far weaker and its almost guaranteed Sony will outsell them at $100 or $200 price difference.
If the ps5 had been 12tf or 13tf then no doubt both would be at a very similar price point, as it stands I think the xbox costs more to produce, I could be wrong all that custom silicon may have significantly increased the cost of ps5 production, but for certain they don't have to pay royalties to AMD for it as it is their custom design, so I expect the R&D costs would have been fairly hefty, however in mass production it would cost them next to nothing.
I think Sony will end up coming out on top again this generation, by how much I don't know, but I also expect that by the end of this gen for the ps5 to be struggling.
They just need 1 game to showcase the hardware design to show case just what this SSD can do, that no other console or PC to date has been able to do and I think Horizon Zero Dawn 2, almost guaranteed will be it, as I believe this design was specifically targeted at expansive open world games. I also think Naughty Dog will produce something far more open and less linear, probably an Uncharted with Nates daughter that will end up making many a pc and xbox gamer envious.
I also believe FPS' on the xsx will be better, probably standard 120FPS 4K, (Halo & Gears is their bread ) I also believe Racing games will be better on the xsx again probably native 4K 120FPS, I think Forza Horizon( their butter)? Will look jaw dropping and run beautifully probably at 60, possibly 120 FPS, the standard forza guaranteed 120FPS - this is where the raw power comes in.
Me personally I was hoping maybe Bungie would make a Destiny 3 that was actually fun and looked great and tbh I think both consoles would run it well.
Its the gaming genres you need to think about, some genres will greatly benefit from Sonys Design, Others will benefit from the Xbox design, its obvious both have followed paths that would benefit the games studios they have and the sort of games they make. The thing is and I know this is probably not to the liking of the Xbox fans - the truth is if the ssd does as Cerny says its something the Xbox just cannot do, however the PS5 performance is not far off of the xbox performance so Sony can do what the Xbox does albeit with a very small performance parity.
I don't think the Sony implementation of Raytracing will be as good, I think it maybe worse by a good margin and I don't think they have all of the RDNA2 extensions, unlike MS - He was too quiet about some of the things MS announced at a Games Developer Conference. For example VRS, Machine learning and 4 bit / 8 bit / 16 bit integer support
VanSiriusGabriel
Member
I would absolutely take less details for faster loadings, at the point we have reached with graphics. This is me, mind you, but yeah waiting while playing bothers me, even if it's just 10 secs. I hate the fucking waitings to send a message on PS4 or wathever, and games like Prey are incredibly designed but for fucks sake it drive me crazy to have a door with 30 sec loading minimum every fucking area in an exploration game. There are better cases but still, I just feel the urge to not waste anymore time with this.
If I could also have 12 tf in PS5 it would be even better, but it's clear it's necessary to choose and everyone will choose want he wants.
One thing for sure, better be more than very fast loadings to deliver next gen.
Sony has let this go on for 24 hours now and many sites are reporting on it... It's either true and it's a massive technical blunder by Sony or it's false and it's a big PR blunder by them. Either way it's bizarre.
No. I just joined because I was wondering about the numbers. I got 10-10,5 and every insider here was higher. I posted a guess the day before the reveal of 10-10,5 and I trust my buddy so I stucked with it.
I´m very happy with both xbox and ps5 and can't wait to get a ps5. Sadly I don't have time to own two consoles and ps have always been my main.- Status