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[husomc]

Gameplay for starters. And I dont mean gameplay for the sake of gameplay like they showed with some indie games like Kena and Little Devils. I mean next gen AAA gameplay. That was one of the biggest complaints of Microsoft's event in May, where they showed lame indie games and little to no gameplay, and Sony pretty much came out and did the same thing. It's really hard to get a good understanding of gameplay systems from just a trailer. Right now I am looking at all these trailers and I dont see whats next gen about it. They look prettier, sure but are the CPU and SSD being used for?

Ratchet is a great example of how to cut a trailer. They showed exactly what Cerny was talking about, and while it might be gimmicky it's something that sets the PS5 apart from next gen. I look at Horizon, Demon Souls and Spiderman and I am struggling to see what next gen gameplay systems are being used. Lets not even get into GT7 which looks cross gen as fuck because PD is basically a shell of themselves now. The less expected of them the better.

Graphically speaking, nothing blew me away like the KZSF demo. The moment people saw that, everyone knew next gen was here. What was that moment here? I cant think of one. What did blow me away was the UE5 demo. the flying sequence showcased the SSD in a way Sony's first party games that have been in development for 2-3.5 years couldnt. EA showed literally 15 seconds of footage that was more next gen than anything. People straight up refused to believe it. That's what you want, you want people to be so blown away they call BS. Hellblade 2 is another great example. The Australia realtime demo recently released by one ex-DICE dev is a great example.

It's pretty crazy to me that third party devs, Ninja fucking theory and Epic of all people have outclassed Sony studios at their own game. That simply shouldnt have happened seeing as how GG had 3.5 years to get a badass demo going. Bluepoint had 2.5 years. PD had almost 3 years. And while Insomniac did show up with the most impressive game of the show, there is only so much you can do with games like ratchet. this isnt the PS1, mascot games simply arent going to define next gen anymore. People look to spiderman or Horizon or AAA games like TLOU2 to see what games can achieve.

And then there is the fact that they went with native 4k. it makes zero sense seeing as how much GPU resources are used to get to native 4k. Anyone with a PC knows this. Literally 4x going from 1080p to native 4k. Sony devs better hope MS also goes with native 4k, because if they do go with 1440p or 4kcb then that 18% difference that is so minuscule right now is going to get much much bigger when paired with the savings they get from going down to 4kcb. There is a reason why UE5 looks so much better, it's only outputting half of the pixels of the PS5 games. They didnt waste their GPU chasing DF wars. They put it to good use making games look next gen.

Lastly, this idea that these are just gen first gen games and shouldnt be expected to look amazing is ridiculous. This is exactly the rhetoric used by MS fans who defend their cross gen stance. Oh the "real" games will come later. Wrong. Next gen games should look and play next gen. Period. We finally have a CPU that allows devs to do amazing destruction, massive world simulations like weather, NPC behavior, and interaction and we got none of that. Is there destruction in Horizon? Do trees catch fire when you use fire arrows on dinobots? Do other NPCs help you out? What are the SSD upgrades? That thing was sold to us as this secret sauce to justify a smaller 10 tflops GPU. Is it only good for level switching and loading?

Yes, I wholeheartedly agree with you that nothing in Sony's show wowed me. Everything looked shinier and newer but nothing revolutionary. It's probably going to be the next COD, Battlefield or similar big budget FPS game that showcases what next gen is all about specially because they will utilize life like photogrammetry scans, which in itself is nothing revolutionary. And now Sony have lost the studio which made the most visually stunning game on the PS4, to facebook. Ready at dawn could have come up with something amazing for the PS5.

I'm hoping that Sony will come up with some outstanding new IP to amaze us once again, 'the Horizon Zero Dawn' of next gen !

Also what we saw was just a glimpse. Sony 'might' have a lot more new gameplay mechanics to show us somewhere down the line.

 

[SlimySnake]

It is surprising and disappointing how Sony propped up the event by saying that their about to show us games only possible on PS5 and the only game that really showcased that was ratchet and clank and even then it had to be gimmicky. I expected the graphical improvements, but Sony was talking like we’d see more than that but not really. Sony is fine though most people really liked the show including me and they will outsell Xbox again. I just think Microsoft bet on being cross gen for two years is viable with what Sony showed. I still think that UE5 demo is something we’re not seeing for 3-5 years at the earliest.

all they had to do was show Aloy flying on a stormbird at lightning fast speed and they wouldve matched the most impressive part of the UE5 demo. and yeah, part of the reason for my disappointment is how Jim Ryan started the show saying this is going to be the biggest leap of any gen ever. Phil has said something similar and tbh, just looking at the cpu and ssd upgrades, im inclined to agree. which is why it was so disappointing to see them just show prettier games.

 

[Wraith Phantom]

Looks like another no news days for Xbox guys & PC fallen ones. Their out here chatting shit.

Imagine complaining about the one brand that actually supplied games this gen. Imagine complaining about the one brand that has multiple critical acclaimed games the whole gen. And still providing them.

This is laughable stuff. This is like people complaining about Jordan whilst he's winning championship rings.

 

[dotnotbot]

This is the same Russian journalist who first told about the PC version of Horizon:Zero Dawn

He's completely unreliable, one of his "leaks" was Zelda BOTW coming to PC.

 

[saintjules]

Practicing to announce the price for the Series X. You got this, Phil!

 

[K.N.W.]

I no longer have 1080ti and cant make my own comparisons with RTX 2080, however I can use existing YT comparisons.

2050 MHz clock on all GPUs

Even 2070S 10 TF is almost as fast as 14 TF 1080ti.

And comparison with RTX 2080S OC

2080S has 3072 cores, while 1080ti 3584, yet 2080S still clearly wins.

But those are not old games, they are optimized for newer cards Anyway, let's try to compare same generation cards.
BRB recording Arkham Knight with my 1080TI, I've found a good exmple of 1080 at 2GHZ, wait a little and we'll descover more about the situation

 

[Great Hair]

Practicing to announce the price for the Series X. You got this, Phil!

I rewatched it on IGN many years later. They replaced the "awkawrd moment" with applause.

 

[SSfox]

And another one

 

[pawel86ck]

But those are not old games, they are optimized for newer cards Anyway, let's try to compare same generation cards.
BRB recording Arkham Knight with my 1080TI, I've found a good exmple of 1080 at 2GHZ, wait a little and we'll descover more about the situation

These games arnt using turing features, so I think it was a fair comparison. If game would use all turing features the difference would be only bigger.

-VRS (20-30% in gears tactics, but VRS tier 2 shows up to 76% in 3dmark on 2070S at 4K)
- mesh shading (I havent seen any performance comparison yet but developers say it's a massive win)
-DLSS 2.0 (35% boost)
- RT (up to 6x times better performance than pascal)

 

[Gamernyc78]

Thy have had tht, crossbuy or similar things since ps3 to Vita or ps4.

 

[raul3d]

I don't know, INT32 units are useful when used, most of the test that compare 2080 and 1080TI are a couple of years old, I'm almost sure those games didn't use them because newer games favour the 2080 by a larger margin compared to the ones in older test. If you look at those "nitpicking" "too-much-specialized" rendering tests below (probably non-INT32), you can see that the 12,5% advntage remains in favour of the 1080TI, the opposite of what you would see ingame. The tests I saw were near launch, INT32 had just been introduced, and those games were probably non to using them. This is why I think I made a valid comparison, games were already running better without taking advantage of the newer architecture.

PS: I'm really butthurt for my 1080TI perfoming worse than the weaker 2080

Usually, game developers are not optimizing specifically for Turing GPUs. In this case they are using effects / shaders with integer operations which can be executed by all GPUs. However, before Turing/Volta an ALU could either execute an integer or floating-point operations at a time. NVIDIA recognized that integer operations were gaining popularity and decided that it would justify spending silicon space to decouple the integer and floating-point operations, allowing concurrent executing.

Therefore, older games also benefit from the concurrent execution when running on Turing GPUs, even on launch day. However, newer games will benefit more, because they naturally use integer operations more extensively and because with Turing being known, there is a greater incentive for developers to use integer operations when possible.

Personally, I am still happy with my 1080 TI

Back to the topic at hand:
I don’t think the comparison between a higher clocked Turing and a lower clocked Pascal GPU in current games will help guessing next gen GPU performance. We do not know yet to what extend RDNA2 GPUs benefit from a higher clock speed. Also, we do not know how the typical rendering workload of a next gen engine is composed. The Unreal Engine 5 demo might imply that more detail is rendered by micro polygons instead of complex pixel shaders, which could significantly change the workload.

 

[Tiago07]

Your post is just as guilty in reality. In comparing RTX 20xx discrete GPUs for the purposes of benchmarking, it assumes identical architecture (and therefore CU occupancy, which is why you don’t compare peak teraflops) and identical drivers and graphics APIs.

XSX and PS5 both have GPUs that are derived from AMD’s RNDA2 technology, but both machines will be using very different graphics APIs, and PS5’s GPU has the ability to keep its CUs loaded with work as changes to system memory pages invalidate parts of its working cache.

It’s systems and incremental changes like this between GTX 10xx and RTX20xx that improve CU occupancy and make comparing theoretically calculated peak teraflop figures irrelevant.

Games typically only achieve around 30-40% CU occupancy, with a lot of time a CU spent waiting on something else to finish, or for a memory fetch to fill its working cache so that it can do useful work.

PS5’s Coherency Engines and GPU cache scrubbers could contribute an average of mostly fuck all to CU occupancy, or something quite significant. It might vary based on game or game engine. We don’t know.

This isn’t saying PS5’s GPU is suddenly better. This isn’t even saying PS5’s GPU is equal or has even appreciably closed the gap, either.

This is saying that although both are RDNA2 based, there are hardware and architecture differences that directly affect CU occupancy.
There are graphics APIs unique to each manufacturer that also indirectly affect how efficiently those CUs will be utilised.

So it’s neither comparing a GTX 10xx to an RTX 20xx, nor comparing an RTX 20xx to an RTX 20xx using the same Windows drivers and DirectX API.

The answer to how much difference between the two GPUs in real world code there is for anyone not working on a multi-platform title with both dev-kits is:

“I don’t know”.

The rumours from such sources say it’s closer than ever. The earlier rumours seemed to say it was the opposite of what a naive reading of paper specifications would say.

I think it’s reasonable to say we don’t know but it’s likely XSX has the edge over all.

Comparisons to tightly controlled PC benchmarks where the only thing being changed in CUs and clock-speed is irrelevant. That isn’t the only difference between the two systems, or even the two GPUs.

I thought in something similar, we should see moments where PS5 could outperform Series X because of the CU's occupancy and the higher clocks. Cerny talked it is very difficult to use 48 CUs in parallel and that's why they go with 36 CUs and higher clocks to achieve the same 10.3TF. Probably PS5's API has something to use the all 36 CUs.

I was thinking too in Geometry Engine in XSX too, because it's part of RDNA2 and probably is related to Primitive Shaders too. Cerny talked about when the triangles are so small it's very difficult to fill all those CU's with it.
We saw in UE5 demo the exactly thing Cerny talked about. So it's possible to XSX cannot do the triangles like PS5, even "less" powerful. My only doubt here is the resolution, even with less CU's occupancy can XSX push more resolution and framerate ? 1440p is a standard to billion and multiple triangles games or can we see some games in 1800p and 4K?

My thoughts here.

 

[Neo Blaster]

Practicing to announce the price for the Series X. You got this, Phil!

That guy speaking in the end and laughter following was priceless, E3 2013 was epic.

 

[BlackBuzzard]

This is the same Russian journalist who first told about the PC version of Horizon:Zero Dawn

Guy with 90 posts spreading fud about Playstation

 

[Tqaulity]

I no longer have 1080ti and cant make my own comparisons with RTX 2080, however I can use existing YT comparisons.

2050 MHz clock on all GPUs

Even 2070S 10 TF is almost as fast as 14 TF 1080ti.

And comparison with RTX 2080S OC

2080S has 3072 cores, while 1080ti 3584, yet 2080S still clearly wins.

This is what we've been trying to get across since the PS5 and XBSX specs first came out...TFLOPS is a meaningless number in terms of estimating in game performance. Hell the Vega 64 is a 13TFLOP card (more than the XBSX) but it performs slower than the 7+ TFLOP RX 5700. Why, because the RDNA architecture is much more efficient, meaning it has much more meaningful performance/TFLOP.

Just like knowing the horsepower of a car engine does not tell you anything about how much of that power actually gets to the road (and thus how fast the car can go), the number of TFLOPs (i.e. theoretical performance) says nothing about how fast the system can render a frame of a particular game. There are so many other factors that effect how efficient that engine will be (weight of the car, tires, road surface, transmission etc) that the same engine will have vastly different performance in different vehicles (300hp in a Ford pickup truck will feel very different than 300hp in a Porshe).

Now, I know the PS5 and XBSX actually use the same architecture so yes you can compare the TFLOPs more directly. And yes, the XBSX does have a larger GPU with more theoretical power no question. BUT, that still says nothing about how much actual performance we will see in actual game workloads. We'll find out soon enough, but many in the development community have raved about just how "efficient" and accessible the PS5's power is. Similar to Xbox360 and PS3. PS3 had much higher theoretical compute power, but most games ran better on X360 because the power was easier to harness and more accessible. In other words, getting 80% of the X360's power was better than 50% of the PS3's for example.

Same applies here. Again we won't know until we have a large selection of titles to evaluate and compare. But the message is: don't take the numbers at face value. There is way more to the equation than just TFLOPs and theoretical numbers.

BTW: people like to point to the PS4 and XB1 TFLOP difference as an example supporting the TFLOP narrative. However, most people don't realize that the biggest factor in the PS4's performance advantage was not the TFLOPs but it was the memory bandwidth and the ROPs (PS4 had 2x the ROPs). Those 2 factorshad more impact in why XB1 games ran at lower resolution that the 40% TFLOP difference.

 

[Wraith Phantom]

Guy with 90 posts spreading fud about Playstation

i don't understand why these people do this much work & not get paid for it.

 

[geordiemp]

This is the same Russian journalist who first told about the PC version of Horizon:Zero Dawn

Is this what discord FUD is down to now, quoting a Russian journalist about USA workers for a japanese company.

Is the world full of idiots, if your going to do FUD, try better. At least we get a laugh at the stupidity.

 

[geordiemp]

Marvel’s Avengers confirmed as free upgrade to PS5

See how the PS5 version of Marvel's Avengers will shine when it lands this Holiday.

blog.playstation.com

The GPU and CPU improvements on PS5 are exciting, but even more exciting is the introduction of an ultra-high speed SSD with lightning fast load speeds. This is a transformative improvement in consoles that will reduce load times down to one or two seconds and enable real-time streaming of massive worlds at ridiculously fast speeds. Without any optimization work, the loading and streaming of Marvel’s Avengers improved by an order of magnitude on PS5. When optimization is complete, loading content will be nearly instant, allowing players to seamlessly jump into missions anywhere in the game world. And as Iron Man flies through content-rich levels, higher resolution textures and mesh will stream in instantly, maintaining the highest possible quality all the way to the horizon.

 

[Deleted member 775630]

Aren't you meant to say "But...but... PS5 doesn't have dynamic 4K?"

 

[enver]

Did sony confirm that we will get the ps5 version for free for all their games, like last of us 2 and GoT? I mean in this gen we had to pay for their remasters.
thats the thing, MS confirmed it for all their first party games.

 

[RespawnX]

Did sony confirm that we will get the ps5 version for free for all their games, like last of us 2 and GoT? I mean in this gen we had to pay for their remasters.
thats the thing, MS confirmed it for all their first party games.

No, they didn't confirm. According to the rumours, they'll already have the more expensive console - even without UHD Drive. No matter how strong the brand is, they just can't afford to ignore back compatibility, cross-buy, smart delivery or however you want to call it. In some way we will get upgrades/free updates for most of the new games.

 

[Rusco Da Vino]

That's a terrible idea. They are selling the PS5 as a game console, using their first party games as a selling point, and that's the correct thing to do.
No media BS.

We are talking about 2 different things:

You, about how Sony should market the PS5 as what it is, a video console, and it is what Sony is doing according to Jim Ryan: "overall value proposition in terms of the console and the games; the range of games, the quality of games, the quantity of games". No dispute here.

Me, about what you could get along with the "overall value of the console"; including the Media Controler to add extra value to your final purshase. You are getting a 4K Blu Ray player to watch UHD media in any event, with Media Remote or wihout it.

Source:

PlayStation 5: Sony games chief says PS5 offers a paradigm shift

Sony's gaming chief says fast loading times, 3D audio and a new controller will all enhance play.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[Imtjnotu]

Aren't you meant to say "But...but... PS5 doesn't have dynamic 4K?"

Do we know for sure a PS5 game is using dynamic 4k as of now?

 

[SSfox]

Did sony confirm that we will get the ps5 version for free for all their games, like last of us 2 and GoT? I mean in this gen we had to pay for their remasters.
thats the thing, MS confirmed it for all their first party games.

Microsoft are heavily marketing this thing with all their blabla because their games will all be cross gen, and they have the gamepass that they want to sell.

Sony are going all in for next gen and exclusives that will focus exclusively on PS5 specs post GOT in July. That's an absolute different strat.

Sony already confirmed PS5 will be BC, no need to use or invent some extra words to explain what BC means, since people already know what it means.

 

[Sethbacca]

Do we know for sure a PS5 game is using dynamic 4k as of now?

The Avengers free upgrade thread it's confirmed dynamic 4k 60fps.

 

[RookX22]

Do we know for sure a PS5 game is using dynamic 4k as of now?

I think he is talking about square announcing the PS5 version of Avengers. I think it will offer a 4k 30 fps and a 4k dynamic 60 fps. https://blog.playstation.com/2020/06/22/marvels-avengers-confirmed-as-free-upgrade-to-ps5/

 

[zaitsu]

I think he is talking about square announcing the PS5 version of Avengers. I think it will offer a 4k 30 fps and a 4k dynamic 60 fps. https://blog.playstation.com/2020/06/22/marvels-avengers-confirmed-as-free-upgrade-to-ps5/

my guess too

 

[enver]

Do we know for sure a PS5 game is using dynamic 4k as of now?

Marvel’s Avengers will offer a high framerate mode on PS5, which targets 60 FPS with dynamic 4K resolution.

So, locked 60 fps not yet confirmed, but the high framerate mode will be dynamic 4K confirmed.

 

[RookX22]

The Avengers free upgrade thread it's confirmed dynamic 4k 60fps.

Confirmed 4k 60fps option. The other option could be native 4k 30 fps. Who knows?

 

[Brudda26]

No, they didn't confirm. According to the rumours, they'll already have the more expensive console - even without UHD Drive. No matter how strong the brand is, they just can't afford to ignore back compatibility, cross-buy, smart delivery or however you want to call it. In some way we will get upgrades/free updates for most of the new games.

Lmao no the rumours have not put the ps5 as the more expensive console. Just that it will be more expensive than the prior generation at launch.

 

[zaitsu]

So, locked 60 fps not yet confirmed, but the high framerate mode will be dynamic 4K confirmed.

And still we don't know nothing about XSX version because MS is late for the party. It's common knowlegde that their devkits arived almost one year after PS5 one. First party studios has nothing on launch - if you calling HALO launch title, you can call GOT and TLOU2 launch tittle also

 

[RookX22]

I would be so happy if all next gen games offered 30 fps 4k or 60 fps dynamic.

 

[geordiemp]

So, locked 60 fps not yet confirmed, but the high framerate mode will be dynamic 4K confirmed.

Thats just bad english, dynamic resolution means steady frame rate, you dont ever see both dymanic.

I would be so happy if all next gen games offered 30 fps 4k or 60 fps dynamic.

Thats up to the developers, but at least we got performance mode on most ps4pro games recently from Sony, so its likely to continue.

I think the only reason we saw native 4k30 modes for each game is why bother for initial annouce youtube stream to do anything else.

 

[RespawnX]

Lmao no the rumours have not put the ps5 as the more expensive console. Just that it will be more expensive than the prior generation at launch.

And several sources claiming that XsX will undercut the price. So yes, 499 disc, 449 disc-less and 429 XsX is absolutely possible.

 

[geordiemp]

And several sources claiming that XsX will undercut the price. So yes, 499 disc, 449 disc-less and 429 XsX is absolutely possible.

Yes the XSX will be $400 and lockart $200, may as well go with the flow, when MS announce the price come back and tell us how you really feel

I dont get the mine will be cheaper stuff, its setting up for disappointment.

 

[Deleted member 775630]

Do we know for sure a PS5 game is using dynamic 4k as of now?

Yeah the Marvel game. It's not that much of an issue though, since this isn't a first party game with the best development team behind it. I think only their biggest studios will be able to deliver native 4K and fixed 60fps on PS5. Just like not every studio was able to deliver this on the Xbox One X, except for the Coalition for example, which is a big first party studio with more money and thus more talent.

 

[Brudda26]

Yeah the Marvel game. It's not that much of an issue though, since this isn't a first party game with the best development team behind it. I think only their biggest studios will be able to deliver native 4K and fixed 60fps on PS5. Just like not every studio was able to deliver this on the Xbox One X, except for the Coalition for example, which is a big first party studio with more money and thus more talent.

I think it's more to do with a game engine that's not tooled to take advantage of next gen as effective as it could. I expect we will see this for a few third party games on xsx and ps5.

 

[K.N.W.]

These games arnt using turing features, so I think it was a fair comparison. If game would use all turing features the difference would be only bigger.

-VRS (20-30% in gears tactics, but VRS tier 2 shows up to 76% in 3dmark on 2070S at 4K)
- mesh shading (I havent seen any performance comparison yet but developers say it's a massive win)
-DLSS 2.0 (35% boost)
- RT (up to 6x times better performance than pascal)

"These games arnt using turing features". How could you know?? And TBH, they are definitevily optimized for Turing (at least a little bit), otherwise newer games wouldn't have a wider performance gap with GTX compared to the games that came around/before RTX launch. Drivers, APIs and Developers always try to stay up to date with new tech. Those features you list are good and nice, but beyond my comparison

 

[Imtjnotu]

The Avengers free upgrade thread it's confirmed dynamic 4k 60fps.

That is a ps4 game that will be used for bc unless square announced a strictly PS5 version?

 

[Imtjnotu]

Yeah the Marvel game. It's not that much of an issue though, since this isn't a first party game with the best development team behind it. I think only their biggest studios will be able to deliver native 4K and fixed 60fps on PS5. Just like not every studio was able to deliver this on the Xbox One X, except for the Coalition for example, which is a big first party studio with more money and thus more talent.

It's a ps4 game tho. It was not built for the ps5 correct? Or did square announce a version that's ps5 only?

 

[Neo Blaster]

Aren't you meant to say "But...but... PS5 doesn't have dynamic 4K?"

Aren't you meant to say "But...but...XSX doesn't have games below 60fps?"

 

[Sethbacca]

That is a ps4 game that will be used for bc unless square announced a strictly PS5 version?

I'll be honest and say I haven't read through the thread but it seems like there will be an updated PS5 version that takes advantage of new features rather than plain old BC from what I'm getting out of the synopsis. All the discussion is over here : https://www.neogaf.com/threads/marv...ital-ps5-ver-has-dynamic-4k-at-60fps.1550289/

 

[Brudda26]

It's a ps4 game tho. It was not built for the ps5 correct? Or did square announce a version that's ps5 only?

It's basically a pimped up ps4 version. Load times, no lods, high res textures and some fancy SSR etc

 

[Imtjnotu]

I'll be honest and say I haven't read through the thread but it seems like there will be an updated PS5 version that takes advantage of new features rather than plain old BC from what I'm getting out of the synopsis. All the discussion is over here : https://www.neogaf.com/threads/marvel’s-avengers-confirmed-as-free-upgrade-to-ps5-disc-or-digital-ps5-ver-has-dynamic-4k-at-60fps.1550289/

AH gotcha so it's just an add on to the original the way cyber punk is going about it.

 

[geordiemp]

Yeah the Marvel game. It's not that much of an issue though, since this isn't a first party game with the best development team behind it. I think only their biggest studios will be able to deliver native 4K and fixed 60fps on PS5. Just like not every studio was able to deliver this on the Xbox One X, except for the Coalition for example, which is a big first party studio with more money and thus more talent.

Its not just the studio, its what they are trying to do with animations, graphics, density of scene. You cannot compare games.

AC Valhala probably wont be native 4k60 on XSX, nor on Ps5, nor on 2080ti, and thats a big team.

 

[Bo_Hazem]

That statement lacks nuance. For certain people it's illogical to buy PS4 Pro/Xbox One X late in the gen. Those are mostly the people already have PS4/Xbox One and enjoyed a lot of the games this gen.
If you either haven't played a lot of games this past gen, then PS4 Pro/Xbox One X are very good options to play games with a good IQ at a good entry point.
Additionally, publishers will stretch out cross-gen games as much as possible because of PS4 and Xbox One market share, with regards to the corona situation.
It all comes down to the price of Series X, Series S (TBA), PS5 Lump and PS5 Digital. If the price difference between a One X and PS4 Pro is small, then investing in a Series X or PS5 is the better choise in the long term.

TLDR: It depends.

Not sure, man. I'm sorry but $500 is kinda cheap already, buying current gen for your kids would make sense though, but next gen is already supporting current gen either it's XSX or PS5. For me it doesn't make sense, for some parts around the world that it's hard to buy any kind of console I bet they would just buy used ones instead of full price. Microsoft has pumped the prices up, as it seems here as well, $480 for X1X no games after it was $350 with games:

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B074WPGYRF/?tag=neogaf0e-20

PS4 Slim with 3 games bundle at $440:

Amazon.com: Newest Sony Playstation 4 PS4 1TB HDD Gaming Console Bundle with Three Games: The Last of Us, God of War, Horizon Zero Dawn, Included Dualshock 4 Wireless Controller : Video Games

Buy Newest Sony Playstation 4 PS4 1TB HDD Gaming Console Bundle with Three Games: The Last of Us, God of War, Horizon Zero Dawn, Included Dualshock 4 Wireless Controller: Consoles - Amazon.com ✓ FREE DELIVERY possible on eligible purchases

www.amazon.com

PS4 Pro with COD at $570:

Amazon.com: Call Of Duty: Modern Warfare PS4 Pro Bundle (PS4) : Video Games

Amazon.com: Call Of Duty: Modern Warfare PS4 Pro Bundle (PS4) : Video Games

www.amazon.com

PS4 Pro with Spider-man has just been discounted form $547 to $488:

Amazon.com: Sony PlayStation 4 Pro 1TB Console Bundle W / Marvel's Spider-Man: Game of The Year Edition | Blu-ray Disc Player | Wi-Fi | AMD Processor | HDMI Cable : Video Games

Buy Sony PlayStation 4 Pro 1TB Console Bundle W / Marvel's Spider-Man: Game of The Year Edition | Blu-ray Disc Player | Wi-Fi | AMD Processor | HDMI Cable: Consoles - Amazon.com ✓ FREE DELIVERY possible on eligible purchases

www.amazon.com

And PS4 Pro Death Stranding edition here in my country at 189.900 Omani Rials ($479.73 USD), photographed yesterday:

So, does it still make sense to you? PS4 is still selling strong though, same with the Switch.

EDIT: Those amazon links are Amazon USA.

 

[Lordani66]

Not sure, man. I'm sorry but $500 is kinda cheap already, buying current gen for your kids would make sense though, but next gen is already supporting current gen either it's XSX or PS5. For me it doesn't make sense, for some parts around the world that it's hard to buy any kind of console I bet they would just buy used ones instead of full price. Microsoft has pumped the prices up, as it seems here as well, $480 for X1X no games after it was $350 with games:

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B074WPGYRF/?tag=neogaf0e-20

PS4 Slim with 3 games bundle at $440:

Amazon.com: Newest Sony Playstation 4 PS4 1TB HDD Gaming Console Bundle with Three Games: The Last of Us, God of War, Horizon Zero Dawn, Included Dualshock 4 Wireless Controller : Video Games

Buy Newest Sony Playstation 4 PS4 1TB HDD Gaming Console Bundle with Three Games: The Last of Us, God of War, Horizon Zero Dawn, Included Dualshock 4 Wireless Controller: Consoles - Amazon.com ✓ FREE DELIVERY possible on eligible purchases

www.amazon.com

PS4 Pro with COD at $570:

Amazon.com: Call Of Duty: Modern Warfare PS4 Pro Bundle (PS4) : Video Games

Amazon.com: Call Of Duty: Modern Warfare PS4 Pro Bundle (PS4) : Video Games

www.amazon.com

PS4 Pro with Spider-man has just been discounted form $547 to $488:

Amazon.com: Sony PlayStation 4 Pro 1TB Console Bundle W / Marvel's Spider-Man: Game of The Year Edition | Blu-ray Disc Player | Wi-Fi | AMD Processor | HDMI Cable : Video Games

Buy Sony PlayStation 4 Pro 1TB Console Bundle W / Marvel's Spider-Man: Game of The Year Edition | Blu-ray Disc Player | Wi-Fi | AMD Processor | HDMI Cable: Consoles - Amazon.com ✓ FREE DELIVERY possible on eligible purchases

www.amazon.com

And PS4 Pro Death Stranding edition here in my country at 189.900 Omani Rials ($479.73 USD), photographed yesterday:

So, does it still make sense to you? PS4 is still selling strong though, same with the Switch.

Do you realize that this was Sony's strategy from early on? They released PS4 Pro for 399 and even PS4 at 399 knowing they will be losing money at first on the hardware but later it became cheaper to make them but they didn't change the price even though the hardware is cheaper but they are making up the profits now from their previous losses this way. Don't think that There won't be a massive price reduction when PS5 releases, which will NOT be accpetable to be priced higher than 500 dollars at most. Sony still remembers their PS3 release at 599.
What's also important you are giving us prices frm your country which I can tell you for sure has higher prices than the western market, especially american, so the price to value is not the same as in America. Look at Europe and our higher taxes, we pais 399 Euro which is about 450 dollars at the release of PS4, which in America was at 399 USD. You don't converst price-to-value ratio and compare it from one market to the other.

 

[ThaMonkeyClaw]

Curious to see those sources myself, and why this is the cheapest UHD Blu-ray at $268 if it's only a $20 to make:

Amazon.com: Sony 4K Ultra HD Blu Ray Player with 4K HDR and Dolby Vision + 6FT HDMI Cable - (UBP-X700): Electronics

Buy Sony 4K Ultra HD Blu Ray Player with 4K HDR and Dolby Vision + 6FT HDMI Cable - (UBP-X700): Blu-ray Players - Amazon.com ✓ FREE DELIVERY possible on eligible purchases

www.amazon.com

They do like to rake consumers over the coals on blu-ray player prices though, the BOM for the Xbox One S which has a UHD Blu-ray drive shows a cost of $88.50 for both the 2TB hard drive and UHD Blu-ray drive, so the $20 cost seems pretty plausible.

 

[Bo_Hazem]

Correction unless its an 8 series or a new six series I dont know about tcl six series does not have hdmi 2.1. Hdmi. I am a proud owner of a six series 65 inch I just bought a month ago for only 750. It's a fucking steal and local dimming, Input lag, colors, etc are great but it does not have hdmi 2.1 I know 2020 8 series will.

Searched about it and seems to be foggy, as many said that 6-series would as well support HDMI 2.1 after CES 2020. Seems like HDMI 2.0 but would support VRR instead.

Still a wonderful TV! We only get crappy TCL models here, not the premium ones. So that lefts me with Sony, LG, Samsung.

 

[Killer Sakoman]

Is this what discord FUD is down to now, quoting a Russian journalist about USA workers for a japanese company.

Is the world full of idiots, if your going to do FUD, try better. At least we get a laugh at the stupidity.

Don't be ignorant. There are some signs. Having people leaving all at once is always a sgin for change wither for the best or worst.

Corporates stay competitive because of customer demand that puts them under pressure to succeed. You need to keep your favorite brand under pressure and threat to lose your money if you want them to deliver. Otherwise, you will be waiting for E3 like xbox fans.