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|OT| Next-Gen PS5 & XSX |OT| Console tEch threaD

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Too many variables getting in the way of concrete conclusions from these head to heads but it's fun investigating and speculating. It's been far from one sided so far. Will be interesting to see Alex compare PC to SX this time as we have those areas dropping.

With both consoles capped at 60FPS, we don't know how far north they are of that number on each platform, only that the developer decided, at that point, on those resolutions to ensure a solid frame rate. (Solid FPS seems a sensible choice for parity)

For all we know, they could be employing VRS to lower resolution in parts of the frame, enough to warrant keeping that resolution on SX. It could be lots of things. It's fun to speculate either way.

There is more innovation than ever around methods designed around feeing up performance from MS, AMD and NVidia. Sony is not resting here either if recent whispers of new scaling/reconstruction techniques being explored and developed are anything to go by.

There will always be problems with multi platform that gets in the way of fully realising every machines potential.

Once the last gen consoles are put to bed, helpfully we see a little more time and effort going into multi platform titles.
 
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JonkyDonk

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I definitely felt the frame rate drop under 60 in that big room when playing. Hopefully that will be fixed in the final version. This video says it's native 4k in the demo, but I think the final game will be dynamic. It makes sense for a visual demo to be at the highest res but for the real game with combat you would want the smoothest performance.
 

Snowdonhoffen

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I definitely felt the frame rate drop under 60 in that big room when playing. Hopefully that will be fixed in the final version. This video says it's native 4k in the demo, but I think the final game will be dynamic. It makes sense for a visual demo to be at the highest res but for the real game with combat you would want the smoothest performance.
Yup, if they can't optimize the game more then make it dynamic res and the drops are gone.
 

Panajev2001a

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Yup, if they can't optimize the game more then make it dynamic res and the drops are gone.
I think with 4 months to go (despite the old generation ports they are doing, I think the fact that the new consoles have such low volumes due to Covid is forcing some studios to try to back port titles that were meant to focus on a single console generation) and some post launch patches they can and will get to where they need to go. Demo is just something to keep PS5 salivating and thanks to some Sony incentive to Capcom: it sounds like a nice effort, but not their biggest focus (will not be available for previous generation consoles for a good while).
 
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ksdixon

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Please allow me a little vent.
Man... The PS5 OS is ROUGH!

No folders/themes, Games Library won't remember to stay sorted as A-Z, PStore redesign is baad. The settings are split-up all over the place, some up-top on dashboard, some on the pop-up control centre (euw!) quick access menu down the bottom, underneath cards I never use. Trimming captured footage in media gallery seems less intuitive and more awkward. And I simply can't get rid of my muscle memory when it comes to the press/hold inputs of backing-out to the dashboard/launching the quick menu, because Sony flipped them from the PS4 inputs, so of course I always choose the wrong one.

There are some genuine quality of life improvements I've found though. You can send 4 images in a message at once. You can play a previously recorded video, and capture screenshots from it, whereas on PS4 the button combination would exit the playing video. The load times for game loading, PSNow game loading, game downloading and installing, general dashboard navigation are all blazing fast too.

I'm honestly starting to feel something like survivor's guilt because I'm essentially using my PS5 as a load time enhancer for my fave PS4 games. And I wish the PS5 menu system was the PS4 one in like 99% of instances. I wonder if whacking an SSD into a PS4, or buying a PS4 Pro and whacking an SSD into that, would be a good idea.

... It's a good thing Sony usually have the games to back them up, because sometimes their business/OS design decisions are ass backwards.

Has anything at all been said about OS level feature improvement timeframes?
 
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assurdum

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People stop to use ElAnalist del bit this channel is completely unreliable anyway using VGtech as source:
4k CBR but the drops are terrible when happen. Keep in mind is a very scripted area and dark, when area is more open and illuminated FPS starts to suffer. Knowing capcom hardly performance improve significantly compared the demo. This game will run unstable in the more open environment, and all the videos seen until now show it . Hope to be wrong.
 
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ethomaz

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It looks good for being almost 4 months away from release, Dusk Golem exposed?
I don’t believe it native 4k.
This video claims that?

It is probably temporal retro construction from a lower native resolution.
 

assurdum

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John responded to that guy on Twitter already. That Joe guy has no idea what he is talking about.

This is what DF does for a living, do people really think they would make a silly mistake like that...
I don't think is the same guy of the video analysis. Anyway DF sometimes could be wrong even if they "live" for that, but in this case I doubt they missed something like this. Hope VGtech put his hands on hitman 3 so finally we would know if such drops are a thing or a bullshit fanboy try
 
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ethomaz

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I remember he said the developers told him it wouldn't reach 4K. I guess that hurts his credibility for Capcom leaks as well.

Edit: Nevermind I just saw that the video is basically just BS.
He said PS5 was stuffing to reach 1080p 60fps.... that was a made up lie for sure.
 
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assurdum

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He said PS5 was stuffing to reach 1080p 60fps.... that was a made up lie for sure.
It definitely struggle for 60 FPS I give to him this merit. Will see if series X will perform better but after seen DMCV SE, I don't remind incredibly improvement in FPS compared the ps5 in the same engine
 

assurdum

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98.65% at 60fps.
Pretty good.

CBR like suspected.
It's not pretty good. Look carefully the whole video. Game is stable when nothing happens, in close and dark environment. When the area start to be a bit more complex it drops too much.
 

ethomaz

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It definitely struggle for 60 FPS I give to him this merit. Will see if series X will perform better but after seen DMCV SE, I don't remind incredibly improvement in FPS compared the ps5 in the same engine
The video stats shows the opposite or maybe I’m reading wrong.

From 31273 captured frames only 422 agave non-60fps frame time.

It's not pretty good. Look carefully the whole video. Game is stable when nothing happens, in close and dark environment. When the area start to be a bit more complex it drops too much.
So VG Tech Count is wrong?
 
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icerock

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Folks egg on Phil Spencer here thinking him to be a blithering idiot, he is anything but. If you ask me, he is an absolute genius.

Over the last few years, he has successfully whipped a narrative around Microsoft being the most pro-consumer company and Xbox offering unmatched value in gaming. While ensuring, their cash cow in form of Xbox Live Gold remains untouched. It's hilarious that all these journalists/influencers who continually invite him for over to talk about future of Xbox, never ask tough questions. As to why, Xbox segregated GamePass and GamePass Ultimate, whereby Gold subscription is required to access MP on games already on the service? Especially when competition doesn't. Or, as to why, even after all these years, and so many pro-consumer moves, they haven't pulled down the online paywall to play free-to-play multiplayer games such as Fortnite, Warzone etc. When....once again competition doesn't.

He has successfully embedded the value of Xbox GamePass with eco-system as a whole, they appear to be so intricately mixed that these issues are brushed aside. Any argument on the forum is killed immediately by "but 100+ games for $10'! or 'it's free on Gamepass" thanks to an army of zealots online. Yet, for the masses whose intake over one year is limited to F2P games, or to yearly iteration of titles such as Call of Duty, FIFA, NFL etc. the cost of gaming on Xbox is rising exponentially. With the hike in price of Xbox Live Gold, and 12 month sub being killed. The cost has doubled from $60 to $120 to access online MP. MS are doing this deliberately so as to move these users onto their subscription service, well for one thing the Ultimate subscription is even costlier and set them $180 for an year. But, they'll "sweeten" this in form of an introductory price, which will be shoved in each and every thread in the near future. Only for these prices to disappear (much like 1$ deals) once the base has swollen. It won't be long, once the gaming space is also flooded with array of sub services from other publishers. But, by the time GamePass would be in position of NetFlix, biggest sub service in the market, and even with 3rd party content slowly dwindling down over time, the cost of sub itself would continually go up.

Writing is on the wall, yet so many choose to bury their head in the sand. It's ironic, because these gamers are able to find the most obscure of details around console hardware or a software from the smallest corners of the internet. Yet, continue to choose to be ignorant on what is shaping up to be a pretty grim and expensive future in console space.
 

assurdum

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The video stats shows the opposite or maybe I’m reading wrong.

From 31273 captured frames only 422 are not 60fps.


So VG Tech Count is wrong?
Stats mean nothing. Look to yourself. If most of the demo is in the dark and closed environment but when the area is wider and illuminated, many drops start to show, who cares if it runs stable just in the darkness of a corridor?
 
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assurdum

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Folks egg on Phil Spencer here thinking him to be a blithering idiot, he is anything but. If you ask me, he is an absolute genius.

Over the last few years, he has successfully whipped a narrative around Microsoft being the most pro-consumer company and Xbox offering unmatched value in gaming. While ensuring, their cash cow in form of Xbox Live Gold remains untouched. It's hilarious that all these journalists/influencers who continually invite him for over to talk about future of Xbox, never ask tough questions. As to why, Xbox segregated GamePass and GamePass Ultimate, whereby Gold subscription is required to access MP on games already on the service? Especially when competition doesn't. Or, as to why, even after all these years, and so many pro-consumer moves, they haven't pulled down the online paywall to play free-to-play multiplayer games such as Fortnite, Warzone etc. When....once again competition doesn't.

He has successfully embedded the value of Xbox GamePass with eco-system as a whole, they appear to be so intricately mixed that these issues are brushed aside. Any argument on the forum is killed immediately by "but 100+ games for $10'! or 'it's free on Gamepass" thanks to an army of zealots online. Yet, for the masses whose intake over one year is limited to F2P games, or to yearly iteration of titles such as Call of Duty, FIFA, NFL etc. the cost of gaming on Xbox is rising exponentially. With the hike in price of Xbox Live Gold, and 12 month sub being killed. The cost has doubled from $60 to $120 to access online MP. MS are doing this deliberately so as to move these users onto their subscription service, well for one thing the Ultimate subscription is even costlier and set them $180 for an year. But, they'll "sweeten" this in form of an introductory price, which will be shoved in each and every thread in the near future. Only for these prices to disappear (much like 1$ deals) once the base has swollen. It won't be long, once the gaming space is also flooded with array of sub services from other publishers. But, by the time GamePass would be in position of NetFlix, biggest sub service in the market, and even with 3rd party content slowly dwindling down over time, the cost of sub itself would continually go up.

Writing is on the wall, yet so many choose to bury their head in the sand. It's ironic, because these gamers are able to find the most obscure of details around console hardware or a software from the smallest corners of the internet. Yet, continue to choose to be ignorant on what is shaping up to be a pretty grim and expensive future in console space.
Phil Spencer has nothing to do with the series X hardware design. Jesus Christ people he wanted use SSD as fixed RAM, he hasn't a single clue how to build an hardware. And I will wait more multiplat release before to think it's the new "normality". Because Matt (a developer well known) in time less suspected, predicted sometimes some game could even overperform on series X compared the ps5 beyond the expected gap, because strange things happen in some engine (his words) but he said also it wouldn't been absolutely the normality and most of the times they will stay relative close to each other in most of the multiplat.
 
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ethomaz

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Stats mean nothing. Look to yourself. If most of the demo is in the dark and closed environment but when the area is wider and illuminated, many drops start to show, who cares if it runs stable just in the darkness of a corridor?
I believe we watched different videos.
Hitman 3 DF video drops lower and more frequent than what you see in that video.

The videos have very little small drops.
 
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assurdum

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I believe we watched different videos.
Hitman 3 DF video drops lower and more frequent than what you see in that video.

The videos have very little small drops.
I believe you don't give the right attention to the final part of the video. In the big saloon FPS drops even when nothing happens, take a look. When the character start to run around the bigger area, FPS is unstable. If I can say, is not a good sign for the more opened area.
 
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bender

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Fake doctored trash video. This is why you should only trust large respected channels (like DF) when it comes to technical analysis. He even had the gall to call DF liars. I've noticed how a lot of PS fans/sites will do this if Xbox wins in a comparison. No integrity at all.

DF videos don't contain free style rap though.
 

TLZ

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This is why you should only trust large respected channels (like DF) when it comes to technical analysis.
Really? Large respected channels are just born large? Do large channels never lie?

Most of the channels that I follow who are large now, were channels who were small when I started following them. Their size has nothing to do with respect and integrity.
 

Moridianae

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Not bad. I'm a massive RE fan, but I'm tired of shit like Re:Verse. Village looks good and runs great for four months until launch. I'm sure RE4Make exists but it won't be seen until after Village gets its time.

Really stoked for The Division 2 RE event, though.

A shame it isn't what it(I read) was going to be, with apparently Kenley College a full RE style zombie event. Heard it was just changed to an apparel event due to the pandemic.
 

BeardGawd

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Really? Large respected channels are just born large? Do large channels never lie?

Most of the channels that I follow who are large now, were channels who were small when I started following them. Their size has nothing to do with respect and integrity.
Touché but I did clarify by saying technical analysis. More experience/better tools does tend to equate to better results on all things technical. And with the age of fake media you can never be too careful trusting random channels.
 
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John Kodera Leaves Sony Interactive Entertainment (got promoted)
 

ethomaz

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John Kodera Leaves Sony Interactive Entertainment (got promoted)
Big promotion to be fair.
 

Stuart360

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Golem was indeed full of shit, but I'm not ok with framerate drops in those circumstances.
It was what?, 10 months ago, a year ago or somehting when he said what he said?, who knows what state the game was in back then, and the info he got may of been from even older than that. Maybe the graphics were much more advanced at that point in time, maybe the info he got was ray tracing related when they just started testing with RT, who knows. The game was annaounced as next gen only at the start remember.
All i know is he announced the game was called 'Village' literally months before the official announcement. Thats not something you can just guess and get right. He obviously does have sources within Capcom.
 

Bo_Hazem

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It was what?, 10 months ago, a year ago or somehting when he said what he said?, who knows what state the game was in back then, and the info he got may of been from even older than that. Maybe the graphics were much more advanced at that point in time, maybe the info he got was ray tracing related when they just started testing with RT, who knows. The game was annaounced as next gen only at the start remember.
All i know is he announced the game was called 'Village' literally months before the official announcement. Thats not something you can just guess and get right. He obviously does have sources within Capcom.

Golem is a knob. But put that aside, how's AC Valhalla for you?
 

Bo_Hazem

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Really liked it a lot, but i still prefer Odyssey. I prefered how Odyssey did the side missions and side content better. Both awesome games though.
You?

Yup, same here. Odyssey is still superior to me, but exploration is more enjoyable on ACV. Naval wars/battles were epic on Odyssey, also Odyssey had a much solid build/less glitches and no tearing.

Overall, I think this is a wonderful start for Ubisoft, I give 9/10 to WD:L, ACV, and Immortal Fenyx Rising. If you didn't try the other ones I highly suggest you do.
 
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Stuart360

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Yup, same here. Odyssey is still superior to me, but exploration is more enjoyable on ACV. Naval wars/battles were epic on Odyssey, also Odyssey had a much solid build/less glitches and no tearing.

Overall, I think this is a wonderful start for Ubisoft, I give 9/10 to WD:L, ACV, and Immortal Fenyx Rising. If you didn't try the other ones I highly suggest you do.
Yeah played and finishd Immortals. Liked that a lot too, but i'm not super keen on puzzles, so i still prefer AC. Good game though.
 

HeisenbergFX4

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Phil Spencer has nothing to do with the series X hardware design. Jesus Christ people he wanted use SSD as fixed RAM, he hasn't a single clue how to build an hardware. And I will wait more multiplat release before to think it's the new "normality". Because Matt (a developer well known) in time less suspected, predicted sometimes some game could even overperform on series X compared the ps5 beyond the expected gap, because strange things happen in some engine (his words) but he said also it wouldn't been absolutely the normality and most of the times they will stay relative close to each other in most of the multiplat.

100%

Phil was given the final box and said here what do you think.

It was even my good friend Mike Ybarra who picked the final form factor
 
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Bo_Hazem

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Yeah played and finishd Immortals. Liked that a lot too, but i'm not super keen on puzzles, so i still prefer AC. Good game though.

Actually I felt a nice pattern between the 3 of them, enjoyable puzzles. Even the simple chest on ACV there is some kind of a puzzle to get in and take it. Totally finished all the side missions on ACV except one mythical wizard boss glitched after the Yule update. Might jump in as I noticed an update yesterday, so maybe they fixed it.
 
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Shmunter

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It was what?, 10 months ago, a year ago or somehting when he said what he said?, who knows what state the game was in back then, and the info he got may of been from even older than that. Maybe the graphics were much more advanced at that point in time, maybe the info he got was ray tracing related when they just started testing with RT, who knows. The game was annaounced as next gen only at the start remember.
All i know is he announced the game was called 'Village' literally months before the official announcement. Thats not something you can just guess and get right. He obviously does have sources within Capcom.
Sure, anyone knows how early builds go. But he dressed it up, made a song and dance about it, to instigate fud onto the PS5.

When called out he admitted to being some kind of tech Sjw, trying to create equity in console mind share, how it’s not fair PS5 gets all the love or some shit and something had to be done to balance the equation.

Guys a errr.....douche and cannot be trusted.
 
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SlimySnake

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Folks egg on Phil Spencer here thinking him to be a blithering idiot, he is anything but. If you ask me, he is an absolute genius.

Over the last few years, he has successfully whipped a narrative around Microsoft being the most pro-consumer company and Xbox offering unmatched value in gaming. While ensuring, their cash cow in form of Xbox Live Gold remains untouched. It's hilarious that all these journalists/influencers who continually invite him for over to talk about future of Xbox, never ask tough questions. As to why, Xbox segregated GamePass and GamePass Ultimate, whereby Gold subscription is required to access MP on games already on the service? Especially when competition doesn't. Or, as to why, even after all these years, and so many pro-consumer moves, they haven't pulled down the online paywall to play free-to-play multiplayer games such as Fortnite, Warzone etc. When....once again competition doesn't.

He has successfully embedded the value of Xbox GamePass with eco-system as a whole, they appear to be so intricately mixed that these issues are brushed aside. Any argument on the forum is killed immediately by "but 100+ games for $10'! or 'it's free on Gamepass" thanks to an army of zealots online. Yet, for the masses whose intake over one year is limited to F2P games, or to yearly iteration of titles such as Call of Duty, FIFA, NFL etc. the cost of gaming on Xbox is rising exponentially. With the hike in price of Xbox Live Gold, and 12 month sub being killed. The cost has doubled from $60 to $120 to access online MP. MS are doing this deliberately so as to move these users onto their subscription service, well for one thing the Ultimate subscription is even costlier and set them $180 for an year. But, they'll "sweeten" this in form of an introductory price, which will be shoved in each and every thread in the near future. Only for these prices to disappear (much like 1$ deals) once the base has swollen. It won't be long, once the gaming space is also flooded with array of sub services from other publishers. But, by the time GamePass would be in position of NetFlix, biggest sub service in the market, and even with 3rd party content slowly dwindling down over time, the cost of sub itself would continually go up.

Writing is on the wall, yet so many choose to bury their head in the sand. It's ironic, because these gamers are able to find the most obscure of details around console hardware or a software from the smallest corners of the internet. Yet, continue to choose to be ignorant on what is shaping up to be a pretty grim and expensive future in console space.
This so much. Doubling the price of a service that is literally a LIE since MP servers are paid for by third party publishers anyway, is absolutely despicable behavior. There is a lot of talk of bipartisanship in politics, but I think we all need to set aside our differences/preferences and come together to denounce this insanely anti-consumer move. I was already pissed at the PS+ going up $10 from $50 to $60 a couple of years ago. When Sony sees this they are gonna do the same and everyone is going to lose.

I agree that video games are heading towards a very grim future. This hobby is already full of examples of greedy companies taking advantage of their own consumers launching unfinished games and forcing despicable microtransactions, but this is a really bad precedent since it comes from the very folks that are supposed to govern the kind of greed third parties so often fall susceptible to. If they are actively out there scamming their own users, there is no hope left. Cybperpunk is a great example because CD Project took advantage of the lax certification policies of Sony and MS and basically lied to them saying this stuff would be fixed come launch. Scammers like CD Project will now feel emboldened to take advantage of this userbase MS clearly gives no fucks about.

The problem is that its not even the worst thing about gamepass. Gamepass turning into Netflix will be a bad thing for everyone because the quality of netflix shows has gone down the gutter in recent years. They are supposed to release 71 movies this year and yet 99% of those movies will be utter trash made for tv crap that no one would ever pay to watch in a theater. It's all trash you watch because its on tv. Well, now unlike the over the air channels, you are actually paying $15 a month to watch this trash. I had to watch some Netflix movies this year because of the pandemic and man, I have seen Michael Bay movies with more substance. Watching Tenet after watching all this netflix trash made me realize just how vapid and cheap these movies are. tenet is like citizen fucking kane compared to the stuff i saw on Netflix this year. Gamepass will get there soon as they realize that pumping out quality titles like TLOU2, GoT and FFXV is simply not possible. The quality WILL suffer and the scope of these games will be downgraded. We are already seeing that with Halo infinite being the last Halo game for the next 7-10 years. MS knows they cant justify spending $100 million on a sequel that will take 4-5 years to make. they will launch quick and dirty expansions and call it a day.

If that's the future of gaming, i want no part of it.
 

Bo_Hazem

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This so much. Doubling the price of a service that is literally a LIE since MP servers are paid for by third party publishers anyway, is absolutely despicable behavior. There is a lot of talk of bipartisanship in politics, but I think we all need to set aside our differences/preferences and come together to denounce this insanely anti-consumer move. I was already pissed at the PS+ going up $10 from $50 to $60 a couple of years ago. When Sony sees this they are gonna do the same and everyone is going to lose.

I agree that video games are heading towards a very grim future. This hobby is already full of examples of greedy companies taking advantage of their own consumers launching unfinished games and forcing despicable microtransactions, but this is a really bad precedent since it comes from the very folks that are supposed to govern the kind of greed third parties so often fall susceptible to. If they are actively out there scamming their own users, there is no hope left. Cybperpunk is a great example because CD Project took advantage of the lax certification policies of Sony and MS and basically lied to them saying this stuff would be fixed come launch. Scammers like CD Project will now feel emboldened to take advantage of this userbase MS clearly gives no fucks about.

The problem is that its not even the worst thing about gamepass. Gamepass turning into Netflix will be a bad thing for everyone because the quality of netflix shows has gone down the gutter in recent years. They are supposed to release 71 movies this year and yet 99% of those movies will be utter trash made for tv crap that no one would ever pay to watch in a theater. It's all trash you watch because its on tv. Well, now unlike the over the air channels, you are actually paying $15 a month to watch this trash. I had to watch some Netflix movies this year because of the pandemic and man, I have seen Michael Bay movies with more substance. Watching Tenet after watching all this netflix trash made me realize just how vapid and cheap these movies are. tenet is like citizen fucking kane compared to the stuff i saw on Netflix this year. Gamepass will get there soon as they realize that pumping out quality titles like TLOU2, GoT and FFXV is simply not possible. The quality WILL suffer and the scope of these games will be downgraded. We are already seeing that with Halo infinite being the last Halo game for the next 7-10 years. MS knows they cant justify spending $100 million on a sequel that will take 4-5 years to make. they will launch quick and dirty expansions and call it a day.

If that's the future of gaming, i want no part of it.

Well said, mate. I might quit gaming if that's the future. Sony needs to push more quality just like when Xbox and EA said that single player games are irrelevant they showed them who's boss.
 
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