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[CJY]

Now that would be freaking awesome but a couple bad decisions in there anyway. For instance why would they release so many new games in such a short span of time and when third parties will be taking up so many sales? Space those out one month at a time and have some hype and don't eat each others' sales.

Also I really don't think anyone needs to run 4 games at once

The thing about revealing so many games at the same time... most of those [2021] games will probably be revealed by a simple logo only at the PS5 reveal and then trailers/teasers will dropped throughout it's promotion phase leading up to launch of those games. Sony won't be at E3 so therefore won't have that massive stage presence to reveal most of these games and most of those games may even still be in planning phase. They'll probably rely on State of Play and other online channels this year and a simple logo reveal won't work in those channels.

If Sony really want the "quickest adoption of a PlayStation console ever", they will reveal a very wide breadth of what their WWS are working, along with some killer games available at launch. This is what this "leak" implies to me, and represents the most solid strategy taking all of Sony's moves into consideration thus far.

 

[Roronoa Zoro]

The thing about revealing so many games at the same time... most of those [2021] games will probably be revealed by a simple logo only at the PS5 reveal and then trailers/teasers will dropped throughout it's promotion phase leading up to launch of those games. Sony won't be at E3 so therefore won't have that massive stage presence to reveal most of these games. They'll probably rely on State of Play and other online channels this year and a simple logo reveal won't work in those channels.

If Sony really want the "quickest adoption of a PlayStation console ever", they will reveal a very wide breadth of what their WWS are working, along with some killer games available at launch. This is what this "leak" implies to me, and represents to most solid strategy taking all of Sony's moves into consideration thus far.

Oh I think the amount for 2021 sounds great and by all means reveal them but I was talking specifically that it's gonna launch with 2 months left in the year and release so many first party titles that year PLUS there's gonna be COD and Madden and such. I'd be worried stuff like Ratchet would get overshadowed because people usually only buy like 2-3 games at launch. I just don't want their first party titles to eat each other

 

[joe_zazen]

Yep. They don't even have the excuse of being dumb teenagers. All this over consoles? Passion is fine but this takes the biscuit....

lots of untreated mental illness and repressed rage.

I mean we all have various degrees of illness to spend this much time on gaming and forums, but some are genuinely bent Bastards.

 

[DeepEnigma]

if ninja theory can do this.

then evolution studios can achieve motorstorm cg graphics.

Direct a music video at 24FPS?

 

[CJY]

Oh I think the amount for 2021 sounds great and by all means reveal them but I was talking specifically that it's gonna launch with 2 months left in the year and release so many first party titles that year PLUS there's gonna be COD and Madden and such. I'd be worried stuff like Ratchet would get overshadowed because people usually only buy like 2-3 games at launch. I just don't want their first party titles to eat each other

Yeah, that would be far too many to release for launch day, I think 2-3 is a good number, but I believe if there are that many being considered, it just means "launch window", which is up to 6 months after launch. Delays are almost inevitable anyway. I doubt they could have that many ready for launch day even if they tried.

 

[joe_zazen]

I like the fact that songoku has ”take the 360 vs ps3 out of this thread” in super bold on the OT, yet here we are again.

Anyone who wants to know the story can read ‘race for a games console’ by ibm lead archetect. 360 was ace because gates gave ibm a big check and ibm gave them tech sony was paying for. The real losers in the story were the shit lawyers for sony who made the contracts with ibm.

 

[CyberPanda]

You're joking I hope. No way that's going to happen, and competition drives to more advance and affordable tech, which benefits the masses.

I was being sarcastic.

 

[semicool]

wait so is the 9TF PS5 rumour made up by some users on here? or have i misunderstood..

You have people throwing baseless accusations that it was made up. Could very possibly be true that ps5 GPU is 9TF, in fact that is likely. The reasons for the accusations is because they don't want to accept or believe that the 9TF evidence is very possibly true. That's due to human psychology, nature, being in denial. I'm not saying the 9TF is true, I'm saying people making up accusations to reinforce their denial of the strong possibility.

 

[Mod of War]

 

[HeisenbergFX4]

Have been expecting you

 

[Neofire]

I can't lie, I will be disappointed by a ~9TF PS5 if the XSX is in fact ~12TF.

Not so much a case of jealousy of the other platform (and certainly not wanting XSX to be a lesser machine for the sake of platform warring) but just knowing that ~12TF was a possibility and Sony either decided to go for the budget option or underestimated their CU count / die size.

If there is a ~3TF delta I will still get a PS5 for Exclusives, BC and VR, but I may very well have to get my first Xbox since the OG for the sake of multiplatform titles.

I concur with this, I will be disappointed but after investing in Playstation for 3 decades im in it til the end. It will be interesting to see where it goes under the new leadership.

 

[RasAlGhoul]

I miss that show.

 

[DESTROYA]

I bet you cant wait when these consoles are released but the cycle will start again.

 

[LED Guy?]

It's not about expectation, GCN vs Navi talk simply makes no sense.

You dont know how efficient XSX GPU architecture will be, so how Phil Spencer could ask peeople to do the math when it comes to architecture gains, when XSX or RDNA2 GPU's arnt even out yet LOL ? People should do the math based on their guesses?

Even if you want to assume first gen Navi gains (28-32% according to digital foundry article) then numbers Phil provided will not add up, therefore he obviously wasnt talking about architecture gains as you trying to assume. In order to match 2x xbox x game performance you need 10TF Navi (in fact 10TF navi not always will double 6TF polaris results), BUT you need much less than 10TF Navi in order to match 8x xbox one results (because Navi is up to 50% more efficient compared to tahiti GCN xbox one architecture), so 10TF Navi would be overkill.

Phil statement wasnt vague when you really pay attention to details. He has said GPU power, not performance. FLOPS is GPU power metric. On top of that Gamespot article mention 12TF, very detailed Windows Central leak mention 12TF, and even github leak points to 12TF. There is simply nothing that suggest XSX will be 9.7TF Navi.

And even the Xbox Series X SoC chip that was revealed by Phil Spencer's Twitter profile picture, Digital Foundry made an analysis based on that shot and concluded that it will be a 56 or 52 CUs chip, and then they'll clock it accordingly to get that 12 TF RDNA mark.

 

[Roronoa Zoro]

Yeah, that would be far too many to release for launch day, I think 2-3 is a good number, but I believe if there are that many being considered, it just means "launch window", which is up to 6 months after launch. Delays are almost inevitable anyway. I doubt they could have that many ready for launch day even if they tried.

That's a good point. I think 3 of the most different ones at launch (to hit a wide variety of gamers and maybe not overlap with other FPS that will be releasing) and then have the others go one in January, one in February, and one in March and so on. Just constant exclusives and strong sales AFTER the holidays to keep that momentum going. I also think it's smart to have the launch a couple weeks earlier than PS4. Get at least some of that launch rush outta the way BEFORE the holidays. I still think early October or September would be better but this is better than a week before BF when you would sell out regardless

 

[SlimySnake]

I like the fact that songoku has ”take the 360 vs ps3 out of this thread” in super bold on the OT, yet here we are again.

Anyone who wants to know the story can read ‘race for a games console’ by ibm lead archetect. 360 was ace because gates gave ibm a big check and ibm gave them tech sony was paying for. The real losers in the story were the shit lawyers for sony who made the contracts with ibm.

Who is to say the same thing didn't happen again? Did Sony get better lawyers all of a sudden?

The rumors of amd creating Navi for Sony have persisted. Its clear that Sony had some kind of investment in Navi beyond the simple licensing of apu tech for their next gen console. If ms does come out with the better gpu, them we will be seeing a repeat of that gen with ms directly benefiting from Sony r&d and ending up with a more powerful gpu satya nadella was willing to open his checkbook for.

I'm not saying that's whats happened this gen but if come next month Sony comes in at 9 tflops, someone somewhere fucked up once again. Just like the ps3 execs who made a console with a $850 bom and ended with up s shitty hpu and split ram.

 

[ZywyPL]

I'm not spinning anything. We have developers saying Sony was still working on the hardware during the delay and that the late addition of a GPU was the primary reason for the delay. I linked it to you earlier. You should read the article. It's actually quite interesting and shows that Sony was able to change course rather quickly, which turned out to be the right decision, as we all know.

The diode issue caused delays in "volume production" and not an entire year worth of absolutely no consoles. Sony were able to manufacture the diodes, just not as quick as they wanted. It's not exactly a secret.

Let it go. The kid obviously knows better than Sony themselves why the PS3 was delayed.

 

[FranXico]

Have been expecting you

Something is up...

(Just to be clear, I'm wondering, I am no insider)

 

[ANIMAL1975]

Sorry guys i couldn't resist and made this compilation:

Act 1 'the calling'

Want some leaks? Here's one.

A group of members from Xbox Era got a hold of the github leak earlier than others and pieced together a 9.2 tf PS5 theory. They started to push it really hard. You have @Proelite here doing it, even making some bets at Beyond3D that it's going to happen, while his account at Era (DukeBlueBalls) have also been doing it. Great job at always saying that you have a source everywhere else but in Era because you know you'll get found out if you're forced to get verified.

Everything that even hints, or talks about the PS5 in a positive manner gets shut down. Schreier and an Era mod are hacks. Klee has been been public enemy #1, and the stuff that they said on Era pales with what they had at their discord. Colbert joined later and like @Proelite took advantage with Era's 'No off-site drama' policy to be as passive aggressive on Twitter. All the while, Speshal Ed tries to build himself up as an insider. I've lost count over how many 'insiders', or People In The Know, like Timdog, Zedox, hmqgg, Klobrille, Proelite, Speshal Ed that discord has.

So when you see someone post that they have 'sources' saying that PS5 is 9.2 TF, it comes from there. Secretly they want that to be it because they know 2Ghz is impossible so it would be 8TF. The insiders there also came up with another 'leak', that the PS5 wont have many games at launch, which I always found weird because their 9.2 tf theory has it due to the PS5 being made for 2019 but postponed to 2020.

I was glad to get out of the discord some time ago. It just didn't seem healthy. All I wanted was a place to talk about the Xbox without any dumb drama, but that's what I got. I'll be back with more info if it turns out that they were wrong and post more on other dumb stuff that has happened when I was there.

P.S: It makes me sad that even Digital Foundry uses Proelite as a source for some of their articles.

Act 2 'the gathering'

Um ...ok. Talk about rewriting history.
The github stuff was found by Komanchi and RoGame. They are not on Era or here. They arent even console people really.
And the 9.2 tflops isn't a theory put together by Xbots, its a simple calculation of the GPU that was tested under the PS5 code names.

Translation. Hoes mad.

M MonkeyPunch
Your posts here make me laugh ... thanks for the free entertainment ...

He just joined to start Drama. Cute.

Act 3 'and Hell come loose'

Wow. I can't believe both that I called out posted at nearly the same time.

What a coincidence.

You get that no one forced you into the Discord or into the channels with stuff you don’t like hearing yeah?

You understand that?

and yeah, we posted at the same time because your post was linked in there by someone else. Shocker, what a coincidence!

U mad bro.

Writing this post isn't going to change the narrative that's reality.

In for page 666

Obviously we need to get Cerny to clock the PS5 higher. It's all our fault.

Burn.

I thought, this shit is epic!... I was so wrong:

i have like 99 posts of r600 on bookmarks. lol i wouldnt be surprised if he was hanging out with this discord group. i always found it suspicious how he was a 100% sure of the 8-9 tflops ps5 gpu. after all, komachi and apisak only gave us clockspeeds. the 36 cus didnt come out until rogame in december but r600 was always sure.

when he changed his prediction of the xbox to 12 tflops and kept the ps5 at 8-9 tflops, i knew something was up. how can you call people crazy for over a year, every day of the year, multiple times a day just for predictions over 10 tflops and then throw it all away on a windowscentral and tom warren leak? i mean it was credible but why keep ps5 the same 8 tflops now that we know 12 tflops is clearly possible in a console. so lame.

... and then, sometime later, R600 comes in defense of Proelite engaging M MonkeyPunch in a final confrontation! Epic

Final Act 'a Hero comes'

I was the one who actually told Proelite where to find it and it was after _Rogame leak so you are knowingly lying here about it.

I have PMs from Proelite dating 26th of December asking where to find testing data so he this new guy is lying through his teeth.

Why is it that PS fans here rejected to download data themselves and check it out and instead made up stories like the one regarding Proelite sitting on data for months and being "xbot" with agenda against Playstation?

Why do I have to post our PMs here for people to see that what the new guy saying here is bold face lie and guys clinging on it are even bigger fools?

Priceless

 

[semicool]

Sorry guys i couldn't resist and made this compilation:

Act 1 'the calling'


Act 2 'the gathering'






Act 3 'and Hell come loose'








I thought, this shit is epic!... I was so wrong:



... and then, sometime later, R600 comes in defense of Proelite engaging M MonkeyPunch in a final confrontation! Epic

Final Act 'a Hero comes'







Priceless

Can you stop with this nonsense?

 

[R600]

Sorry guys i couldn't resist and made this compilation:

Act 1 'the calling'


Act 2 'the gathering'






Act 3 'and Hell come loose'








I thought, this shit is epic!... I was so wrong:



... and then, sometime later, R600 comes in defense of Proelite engaging M MonkeyPunch in a final confrontation! Epic

Final Act 'a Hero comes'







Priceless

Here.

 

[Fake]

Embarrassing.

 

[joe_zazen]

I concur with this, I will be disappointed but after investing in Playstation for 3 decades im in it til the end. It will be interesting to see where it goes under the new leadership.

It is very interesting. Personally, I am on the fence.

I grew up with their over engineered home audio products, walkmans, headphones, alarm clocks, mobile phones, VAIOs, TVs, cameras, and would always always make time for a visit to the sony store at malls. I also really loved their wide variety of playstation games.

in 2020, there are no sony stores, i dont use alarm clocks, sony TVs use korean made panels, no VAIOs, no Xperia, and I dont like their audio stuff. With regard to games, their pivot to fewer, bigger ’written by Americans for Americans’ ultra violent narrative games have left me cold. Last sony game i adored was Driveclub, and we know how that turned out.

so ps5 is an interesting release for me. I so curious to see how i feel once they start up the marketing machine.

But I am not overly optimistic at keeping my remaining affection for Sony. my most played game on ps4pro in 2019 was clickerheroes (lol) and i haven't played a console style game since the summer. AAA gaming is getting too real and too serious for all the killing to be fun anymore, :/ And Sony is mostly about big western AAA games now. Astrobot and Dreams give me hope tho.

 

[Spreewaldgurke]

I'd probably wager even RAM amount is fixed now assuming both use GDDR6 that is. AFAIK there aren't any 4GB chips coming so it will be either 8 2GB chips or 16 1GB chips or a mix like we've seen in Scarlett E3 video.

If they go with the more complex 16 chip solution they could then just switch out these for 2GB chips like what was done with PS4 but that would be very costly and probably wasteful.

PS4 RAM change was likely done in Q3-4 of 2012 as the January 2013 near final dev kit had the 8GB unified RAM. There are now rumours popping up of a new PS5 dev kit so will be interesting, if true, what changes there are.

Rumors of new Dev Kit? Can you show me pls where?

 

[THE:MILKMAN]

Rumors of new Dev Kit? Can you show me pls where?

Just a Pastebin rumour for now. Says Prototype 2 dev kit is called Verona, has different specs (than Prospero) and only FP have them right now.

 

[Mod of War]

Sorry guys i couldn't resist and made this compilation:

Act 1 'the calling'


Act 2 'the gathering'






Act 3 'and Hell come loose'








I thought, this shit is epic!... I was so wrong:



... and then, sometime later, R600 comes in defense of Proelite engaging M MonkeyPunch in a final confrontation! Epic

Final Act 'a Hero comes'







Priceless

Thanks for catching me up to speed in one post.

Now we can get back to speculation, guesses, and all that good stuff!

 

[Mr. PlayStation]

No. But here, have this for u if you want to read someone's rambling on

haha this is hilarious man!

 

[HarryKS]

eh. its in engine just like the halo e3 trailer.
we all know games look better in cutscenes. that wont change next gen. gameplay wont look as good as the hellblade 2 trailer but they arent going to downgrade the water simulation and swap out the assets for gameplay. they will change the LODs on the character models and turn down some detail in the environments during gameplay.

current gen games already look this good in cutscenes.

common sense actually dictates that hellblade 2 graphics are possible in next gen cutscenes.

The assets in those sections are never gonna show up in the game. They're just cut scenes probably made by an outsourced animation studio. You don't play cutscenes. At most the big monster person will look like something in the game. The smoke billowing, the water(why would there be water in the game unless there's naval battles and a few interspersed coastline sequences of you walking by the beach) and the super detailed ground are things that will never show up in the game. They're a waste of resources.

You should know better. It's gonna look nice but temper your expectations.

Again, cutscenes mean nothing unless they're truly representative of the game. This was purely a montage with cgi spliced in.

 

[IllegalLemon]

It's not about expectation, GCN vs Navi talk simply makes no sense.

You dont know how efficient XSX GPU architecture will be, so how Phil Spencer could ask peeople to do the math when it comes to architecture gains, when XSX or RDNA2 GPU's arnt even out yet LOL ? People should do the math based on their guesses?

Even if you want to assume first gen Navi gains (28-32% according to digital foundry article) then numbers Phil provided will not add up, therefore he obviously wasnt talking about architecture gains as you trying to assume. In order to match 2x xbox x game performance you need 10TF Navi (in fact 10TF navi not always will double 6TF polaris results), BUT you need much less than 10TF Navi in order to match 8x xbox one results (because Navi is up to 50% more efficient compared to tahiti GCN xbox one architecture), so 10TF Navi would be overkill.

Phil statement wasnt vague when you really pay attention to details. He has said GPU power, not performance. FLOPS is GPU power metric. On top of that Gamespot article mention 12TF, very detailed Windows Central leak mention 12TF, and even github leak points to 12TF. There is simply nothing that suggest XSX will be 9.7TF Navi.

Like i said, i prefer to keep my expectations leveled. The twitter profile image of Phil spencer being a die shot of the project scarlett soc is understandable, but do keep in mind that Digital Foundry also has the soc of the one x encased in a glass frame and that was the devkit's soc not the one found in the actual console. So that soc in the picture might as well be the anaconda (project scarlett) devkit soc, not the soc that'll be in the final unit.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

in 2020, there are no sony stores, i dont use alarm clocks, sony TVs use korean made panels, no VAIOs, no Xperia, and I dont like their audio stuff. With regard to games, their pivot to fewer, bigger ’written by Americans for Americans’ ultra violent narrative games have left me cold. Last sony game i adored was Driveclub, and we know how that turned out.

Violence and action is what sells in gaming.

Ya, you gets sports games, the music fad and some Nintendo games which are non-violent, but the consistent top selling games are typically shooters, Rockstar games, and anything competitive (which is usually killing the other person).

So what happens is most game studios make a game with violence. For Sony, they've made violent heavy games for decades. God of War is probably the ultimate in gratuitous blood, head ripping, and even had that sex mini game pumping broads in bed. The only difference is now they've ditched various genres (like shooters) and concentrated at SP narrative games.

MLB, GT, Dream/LBP = Non-violent

All their million shooters they ditched = Violent

Current crop of SP narrative games are slashfests or kicking ass with waves of enemies (UC, God of War, Days Gone, Bloodborne, LoU, Spiderman) = Violent (some more than others in terms of blood)

 

[TheStruggler]

Good god what did I miss are we back to ps5 is 9tf again? Anything confirmed?

 

[ethomaz]

Are there a limit for GAF bookmarks?

Good god what did I miss are we back to ps5 is 9tf again? Anything confirmed?

GitHub data is God.

You need believe... you need faith.

 

[44alltheway]

How likely do you all think we get an announcement of a Sony event this week?

 

[DaGwaphics]

Good god what did I miss are we back to ps5 is 9tf again? Anything confirmed?

I think we've moved on to the idea that Sony has finally unlocked the full potential of the "cell" and is re-releasing the PS3 as their next gen console. But no worries, they've gotten the clocks up a bit with a die shrink and have added some new control mechanisms.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

Good god what did I miss are we back to ps5 is 9tf again? Anything confirmed?

Been a quiet week or two. All the insiders seemed to clam up some reason.

It looks like the rumours from a month ago (and before that) still hold firm

Camp 1 = 9.2TF. Handful of guys keep showing and talking Oberon specs.

Camp 2 = 12TF (give or take) to be similar to Series X. Nobody has given any detailed specs. Just vague claims.

 

[Moses85]

How likely do you all think we get an announcement of a Sony event this week?

LOTR Palantium

 

[ANIMAL1975]

Here.

For the record i was not doubting your word R600. You got that wrong.

Thanks for catching me up to speed in one post.

Now we can get back to speculation, guesses, and all that good stuff!

I went a bit too far i know, sorry
Now seriously, i was trying to resist it and all, but it was stronger than me... There was something with that 666 page
but we all good now... i fixed it!

 

[Aceofspades]

How likely do you all think we get an announcement of a Sony event this week?

Idk, ask Tommy Fisher

 

[Chromata]

Good god what did I miss are we back to ps5 is 9tf again? Anything confirmed?

My hopes are still pinned on 12tf. You have to believe

 

[Niked]

I would love to see OsirisBlack confirm devkit Verona and disclose If we will get: mind blown, happy or disappointed.
Come on!

 

[CyberPanda]

Here.

This looks photoshopped.

/s

 

[Mod of War]

This looks photoshopped.

/s

Let’s move on.

 

[pawel86ck]

Like i said, i prefer to keep my expectations leveled. The twitter profile image of Phil spencer being a die shot of the project scarlett soc is understandable, but do keep in mind that Digital Foundry also has the soc of the one x encased in a glass frame and that was the devkit's soc not the one found in the actual console. So that soc in the picture might as well be the anaconda (project scarlett) devkit soc, not the soc that'll be in the final unit.

I can understand people may have low expectations, but currently all informations points out to 12TF and there's literally nothing to suggest 9TF (I'm not counting misinterpretations).

And speaking about expectations. Few months from now 18-20TF monsters will launch on PC, so 12TF GPU will be nothing special and especially when RT performance will be much worse compared to Nvidia Ampere series.

 

[Disco_]

We will see big Navi this year: https://www.techradar.com/news/amd-confirms-nvidia-killer-graphics-card-will-be-out-in-2020

The timing seems very convenient for the PS5 and XsX to use this chip.

If xsx is using 7nm+, it wouldn't be a ~400mm2 chip. Neither is using 7nm+, most likely.

I can't lie, I will be disappointed by a ~9TF PS5 if the XSX is in fact ~12TF.

Same here but that's cause sony again likely chased the $399 price tag. PRO left a sour taste in my mouth. I feel like making it a $499 console, seeing that it was made to target those who would switch to PC anyway, would've made it a more lucrative upgrade.

 

[onQ123]

“This has the potential to radically increase performance."

And then it radically didn’t.

Guess you don't know the meaning of potential



Being the only console with double rate fp16 until Switch came along & being just a sub-platform of PS4 meant that not many devs was going to take a lot of time digging in to get the best out of PS4 Pro fp16 . then there is the fact that PS4 Pro is memory bandwidth limited so devs still would have to find ways to use it that didn't run into the memory bandwidth limits on top of the fact that they had to find good use for fp16.

 

[Gudji]

You guys talking about FP16? It helped a lot with some game on PS4 PRO according to Matt on era.

 

[Shin]

Guess you don't know the meaning of potential
double rate fp16

 

[StreetsofBeige]

Series X more power than PS5 = Don't worry gamers, PS5 using FP16 math = 18.4TF according to Cerny

PS5 more powerful than Series X = FP16? What's that?

 

[Shin]

Cerny

I think he goes by another name here on GAF, something something 123.

Spoiler: ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

[geordiemp]

Same here but that's cause sony again likely chased the $399 price tag. PRO left a sour taste in my mouth. I feel like making it a $499 console, seeing that it was made to target those who would switch to PC anyway, would've made it a more lucrative upgrade.

I bought 2 pro as well, but I wanted more from a top end console, they keep skimping and going cheap its annoying, I wanted a proper cooler, a bigger box that was quiet and more power and 499 for the pro.

Sony need to get their act together and stop the cheap as chips 399 nonsense - if they are going to go cheap, leave out thw SSD and let us buy our own SSD and make a well cooled powerful console FFS.