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[kittens]

Wait, so does the report say/imply that the controller ONLY has a touch screen? Or physical buttons AND a touch screen? A lot of people here seem to be speculating that it doesn't have real buttons, and I'm confused as to why.

 

[legend166]

No continuation of the separate controller for each hand idea and no focus on IR pointing makes me very sad.

 

[neptunes]

If it's anything like PSP-PS3 Remote Play but better,faster with less lag, I can't call it gimmick since it will actually be useful.

Do you think the majority of its consumers would find use for such a function?

Like the ability to pause your game and play it away from the TV? In the same household?

 

[thetrin]

if anyone did not understand the 2 screens the moment castelvania dawn of sorrow was shown then seriously im sorry for them

I'm talking about back when Nikkei and other sites were leaking info and we hadn't seen it yet. Basically, when we were at the same stage we are at now with Cafe.

Do you think the majority of its consumers would find use for such a function?

Like the ability to pause your game and play it away from the TV? In the same household?

Most people only have one TV, and more than one member that uses it. So...yeah.

 

[AranhaHunter]

You take "treated as a handheld" to mean a full on handheld?

Why wouldn't I? "Treated as a handheld" is an ambiguous statement.

 

[Rafa=FedKilla]

This whole concept just goes to show how ahead of its' time the Dreamcast was.

 

[Cygnus X-1]

To be fair, a lot of people didn't really understand the point of 2 screens on the DS, and things worked out fine.

Yeah, because they're in practice just one big rectangular screen, divided by a 1 cm piece of plastic. Of course than you'll even have not to switch your focus, since you're attention is already in there. Eyes are able to see a range. Not a point. Two screens in the DS are so near that makes sense and you can watch them at the same time.

But a TV screen and a screen in your hands...you'll have to refocus every single time between two different places. I can't see how this will be intuitive nor pleasant.

 

[TheGreatMightyPoo]

Wait, so does the report say/imply that the controller ONLY has a touch screen? Or physical buttons AND a touch screen? A lot of people here seem to be speculating that it doesn't have real buttons, and I'm confused as to why.

Someone from Nintendo said they are not abandoning physical buttons.

 

[richiek]

So... they're throwing motion controls under a bus?

Didn't the French rumors state that the controllers would have motion controls?

And wouldn't the built in camera serve as a sensor bar?

 

[thetrin]

Why wouldn't I? "Treated as a handheld" is an ambiguous statement.

"treated as a handheld" only means "is in your hands". It's most likely games will stream to the controller, which means it's not a full fledged handheld.

it's like calling your PC running OnLive a full fledged gaming rig.

Yeah, because they're in practice just one big rectangular screen, divided by a 1 cm piece of plastic. Of course than you'll even have not to switch your focus, since you're attention is already in there. Eyes are able to see a range. Not a point. Two screens in the DS are so near that makes sense and you can watch them at the same time.

But a TV screen and a screen in your hands...you'll have to refocus every single time between two different places. I can't see how this will be intuitive nor pleasant.

How unpleasant was 4 Swords Adventure for you? What about Crystal Chronicles?

 

[BlackNMild2k1]

The next E3 would be too close to launch.

The next E3 will be the launch. Believe.

 

[MisterHero]

I think the use of the touchscreen in RE Mercenaries shows potential that weapon changing may finally transcend real-time

I can't wait to see what games Nintendo has in store for it

 

[alphaNoid]

2012 release blows, thats too long for the Wii and much too close to the likely successors to the 360 and PS3, which will probably be much more powerful than the Cafe. If Nintendo wants the core back, they've got to have some head time and better hardware.. hardware that people don't expect will be trumped easily within a year or so.

Might be a tough gamble for Nintendo but only time will tell.

Also, does anyone else feel that the console market is forcing all these new technologies and 'change' just to stay relevant in some way? Like I feel all these companies are trying to invent things just for the sake of inventing them.

Motion control is cool, and can even blow people away. I get things like motion, or camera support like Kinect or Move even (with proper polish mkay). But things like 6" LCDs in handhelds, motion AND cameras all in the controllers? I feel like its just forced and too much. I'm sure Nintendo will show it off and it will look cool but really.. is it needed in that regard?

Next thing you know we'll have hand warmers, built in fans and rear view mirrors all built into the controllers.. just because nobody else has done it lol. People are so alligned with their favorite company that they'll say, "LOOK! X Company put rear view mirrors on the controller!! OMFG, SO INVENTIVE! Look, I can see the bag of potato chips on the table behind me WITHOUT turning around. OMFG.. OMFG, I bet other companies will try to steal this though..."

I dunno .. I love new tech, I really do but I'm starting to feel like all of this shit is just forced for the sake of trying to stand out. I dont offer a solution, I suck. But I'm just curious if anyone else feels this way?

 

[Foffy]

The whole portable nature of it makes it sound like Nintendo could be battling with their own portables...

I hope the controller has buttons and doesn't try to compete with the 3DS. I'm reserving my opinions now because the shock and outrage for when the Wii when years after that system came out, it caused the other console manufacturers to focus on motion control too.

Considering Nintendo's having three events next week (the press conference and accoring to IGN, two events following that conference) I assume they have a lot to talk about, and I'm sure Project Cafe will be the focal point of their press conference after Skyward Sword and dates for Nintendo's major 3DS games.

I'm hyped. :3

 

[Deku]

Why wouldn't I? "Treated as a handheld" is an ambiguous statement.

If it has no cart slot for media and assumes it has a basic processor to handle wifi and a few low level tasks, it by definition cannot be taken out of range of the console as it will have no inputs nor the processing power to run content.

I can see certain exceptions, like storing demos to bring to a friend's house, VC games and maybe cached netflix video.

 

[Kaako]

Weird ass rumors. I anticipate their press conference next week. Should be fun.

 

[fabricated backlash]

Most people have two hands, or can easily move one hand several inches to the left or right without major difficulty.

The same people that complain about the touchscreen aiming on the DS and want a second analog stick because they appearantly have not enough motoric skills to move their thumb a little inward?

Still, multitouch is seriously not needed on a device that has actual buttons.

 

[The Hermit]

I'm talking about back when Nikkei and other sites were leaking info and we hadn't seen it yet. Basically, when we were at the same stage we are at now with Cafe.


Most people only have one TV, and more than one member that uses it. So...yeah.

Lol, totally. At least we are discussing something about how will it work, instead of the fruitless how it will look.

 

[Joe Shlabotnik]

Ahà. But if it's secondary, then its implementation is gimmickly and pointless. And paying for that is not very funny.

You're doing the Unfrozen Caveman act here. Unless there are literally two intense action games occurring on both the TV screen and controller screen simultaneously, it is not beyond human capability to use both of them at the "same time". The controller screen will likely be more interface/information-based, but that's hardly "pointless". It could be providing you information that other players shouldn't see. You could be doing a separate activity on the controller screen while your friend is doing something else on the main screen. That's off the top of my head.

 

[Cygnus X-1]

That, or driving a car, perhaps? Its something you get used to.

When I drive a car I just look at the road. Only on the road. Otherwise it's obviously dangerous. The rest is done without the need to shift my focus away.

 

[Kandinsky]

It better fucking be multitouch.

LOL!

 

[Deku]

Weird ass rumors. I anticipate their press conference next week. Should be fun.

How so? we've known these details for months.

Nikkie is routinely used by Nintendo and Sony to leak details to the public so it confirms the key components of the rumours are true.

 

[Graphics Horse]

I think the use of the touchscreen in RE Mercenaries shows potential that weapon changing may finally transcend real-time

I can't wait to see what games Nintendo has in store for it

I just hope that's still an option.. the text doesn't suggest anything about dual screen games, but hopefully it will be very flexible. Doesn't seem to make much sense otherwise.

 

[gofreak]

I'm going to wait and see what the 'idea' is, but if the idea is remote play of games away from the TV, I foresee a lot of devs taking a very haphazard approach to what is basically two modes of play that need to be accommodated (two-screen-at-TV-play and single-screen-away-from-TV-play). I can see the need to accommodate both compromising the extent to which they explore use for the tablet's screen in TV play.

But I dunno, we'll see what the concept is.

 

[guek]

i posted this in the other cafe thread:

I think I know what's going to happen.

The one rumor that is almost certain to be wrong at this point if the nikkei info is true is the whole "ipad with handles" idea. The tablet will either be just that, a tablet, or it will have a detachable shell with grips that provide buttons. It cannot have permanent handles because portability would then be a complete bitch. It would be bulky and unmanageable. Essentially if it can't fit in a purse, it's not leaving the house.

The rumor started by stephen totilo that cafe will only hosue 8gb is going to end up being 100% true but not on the main console. The tablet is going to have 8gb embedded memory with an SD expansion slot. Developers will be able to create console games and then allow you to continue in some fashion via app-style portable games that you can take along with you on the go. Nintendo will have plans for an extensive app market that will tie your console experience directly to your portable tablet. These app games will not be the main console games on the go, just extensions to the main game. This is why there is not a considerable amount of space (8gb) on the machine. You'll be able to store and save all your tablet data onto the main console and swap out what you want when you want it.

However, there will be little to no cross platform availability of apps between the 3DS and the cafe tablet. Nintendo will continue to have 3DS focus on more expensive, deeper titles and 3D updates to classic games while the tablet taps into the app market.

The tablet will also not be too advanced as far as power goes because like I said, it'll only run condensed app games.


Because they're including a tablet with every console though (and you will only need one per console, circumventing the whole $200 controller issue), this is going to eat directly into the cost of the system itself. Because of this fact, the console is not going to be all that much more powerful than the 360/ps3. In fact, I'm willing to bet it's going to be barely more capable than the ps3 when all is said and done. Each console will come with a single tablet. You will be able to use the standard wiimote + GC controllers + classic controllers to play cafe games. The tablet will simply add a layer of depth and possibilities to both single player and multi-player games. No game will ever force you to have more than one tablet, though you can certainly bring your tablet to a friends house to unlock additional modes, trade data, etc.

Yeah, this is all just speculation, but if a 6" tablet is really going to be included with every console. this is really the only logical scenario I can envision.

 

[thetrin]

Lol, totally. At least we are discussing something about how will it work, instead of the fruitless how it will look.

True. There were still people who called DS "The Next Virtual Boy", which in retrospect, is a heaping helping of crow.

I'm curious to see what Nintendo is doing with the system, but I don't see "touch screen on the controller" being intrinsically stupid, as some others are suggesting.

 

[Bisnic]

Why wouldn't I? "Treated as a handheld" is an ambiguous statement.

You really expect to be able to play Cafe game on its controller while the console itself is turned off, or outside your house?


The controller wont have a disc slot you know, nor will it have the power of the Cafe to run games on its own...

 

[Deleted member 10571]

I've got a feeling this thing's tagline will be that it's some kind of 'communication' machine, similar to the Wii being a 'fun' machine.
I'm talking video calls, automatically layered on the controller screen (maybe 3d?) and able to be pulled over to the TV, communication with 3DS, mobile phones, something like that. Virtual keyboard on the controller screen for typing messages. You know, stuff.

Wiimote compatibility just needs a sensor bar, and boom, you can use a standard wiimote. You don't use the actual new controller for motion gaming, so Nintendo might just repackage the Wiimote, slap a "Wii compatible OMG!" sticker on it and there we go.

 

[CoffeeJanitor]

Yeah, I have no fucking clue either.

A lot is going to hinge on whatever the killer-app that demonstrates all this is. Them having it playable implies they have something like Wii Sports up their sleeves.

Unlike the Wii the concept so far from this description is impossible to get your head round, or see how all the possible downsides are dealt with.

The only thing I can think of is maybe a Wii Party like game or Wario Ware, but that's short sighted.

 

[Cygnus X-1]

What exactly is your cut off for gimmicky? The DS could be called gimmicky, because you could technically have all the info on one really wide screen, or move a lot of the info from the second screen to a hidden menu.

As long as devs make good use of it, it won't be gimmicky. Gimmick in this case has very little to do with raw function, and more to do with implementation.

A simply want something being addictive to the gameplay, not frustrating, not too expensive. That's all.

 

[Graphics Horse]

When I drive a car I just look at the road. Only on the road. Otherwise it's obviously dangerous. The rest is done without the need to shift my focus away.

You should check your mirrors now and again.

 

[CoffeeJanitor]

Wait, so does the report say/imply that the controller ONLY has a touch screen? Or physical buttons AND a touch screen? A lot of people here seem to be speculating that it doesn't have real buttons, and I'm confused as to why.

No idea. Iwata specifically said that Nintendo would always release a console with physical buttons a while back, so no worries there.

 

[thetrin]

I'm going to wait and see what the 'idea' is, but if the idea is remote play of games away from the TV, I foresee a lot of devs taking a very haphazard approach to what is basically two modes of play that need to be accommodated (two-screen-at-TV-play and single-screen-away-from-TV-play). I can see the need to accommodate both compromising the extent to which they explore use for the tablet's screen in TV play.

But I dunno, we'll see what the concept is.

There's a possibility Nintendo is provided software development support to surmount hurdles like this. They have to be, considering it's probably the major question on every potential developer's mind.

A simply want something being addictive to the gameplay, not frustrating, not too expensive. That's all.

I'm not sure what part of Nikkei's article suggests it will be frustrating. Your frustration is predicated on implementation no one has shown yet. We can talk again when Nintendo shows off games, and half of them require constantly keeping both screens in view.

 

[Effect]

Yeah, not sure if it's true or how it'd work.

My thought when I heard about it was that let's say a company makes a FPS.....then they can make it around the compatible remote and not use the new controller at all.

Of course that could lead to neglecting one or the other but I like that option open but maybe it's not at all going to be that way.

I will miss the remote dearly for games like FPSs(now they can look great) if it's not part of the new system.

Same. I was finally able to really enjoy console FPS due to the remote and if it goes away I guess I'll be stuck sticking to my computer for FPS or get used to being frustrated with dual analog controls.

 

[KrawlMan]

Ahà. But if it's secondary, then its implementation is gimmickly and pointless. And paying for that is not very funny.

Are you trolling? Not that you would outright admit it, but seriously.

Were you thinking this screen on the controller would act as your primary viewing space? Do you really want to pull console gaming onto a 6" screen, away from the wonderful 55" LED/Plasma TVs we have today?

Of course this is a secondary screen to the TV. In many games it might function as an inventory. Imagine a game where your inventory is accessed on the fly (Dead Space?). Despite what you may say, it is cumbersome to move through a menu w/ your joystick. Instead imagine that inventory is thrown onto the bottom screen at all times, and all it takes is a quick look down (as opposed to the game overlaying the inventory on the TV screen), a tap of the screen, then back to the gameplay.

In local multiplayer it could hide some details that the other people don't need to know. Imagine having your items show up on the controller in Mario Kart instead of on screen when you get them.

These are some really simple ideas, but they have the potential to add to the experience.

 

[brochiller]

There's a possibility Nintendo is provided software development support to surmount hurdles like this. They have to be, considering it's probably the major question on every potential developer's mind.

They should make it easy to develop games for both modes for. In fact, they have to if they want good third party support.

I'm thinking about a framework like Android is going to be doing with cell phones/tablets; one version to fun on any device.

 

[Cygnus X-1]

How unpleasant was 4 Swords Adventure for you? What about Crystal Chronicles?

I played Crystal Chronicles. And I hated it. It was really difficult to both focus on the GBA and the main action on TV. Especially during battles with bosses when you had to pay attention to what you're were doing. And since it wasn't used anymore, I bet even Nintendo realized that.

 

[KrawlMan]

When I drive a car I just look at the road. Only on the road. Otherwise it's obviously dangerous. The rest is done without the need to shift my focus away.

Then you've never driven (at least not around other cars). You can't say you haven't used your rear view or side mirrors, or possibly glanced briefly to check your blind spot while merging / changing lanes.

 

[kittens]

No idea. Iwata specifically said that Nintendo would always release a console with physical buttons a while back, so no worries there.

Good. I'm down with throwing in a touch screen, but dear god, keep physical buttons. And as others have said, I really hope the screen is multitouch. It'll be cool either way, but multitouch makes it a hell of a lot cooler.

 

[wrowa]

Can't we just wait for 3 1/2 more days before we start praising or dooming it?

 

[gofreak]

There's a possibility Nintendo is provided software development support to surmount hurdles like this. They have to be, considering it's probably the major question on every potential developer's mind.

I haven't thought a lot about it, but I don't see any easy 'automatic' answers. Unless they lowest-common-denominator things, and like I say, make the tablet use fairly unimportant, non-fundamental stuff while doing TV play. But also, like I say, I simply don't know, we'll see what the model is when Nintendo presents it, I guess.

 

[Cygnus X-1]

You should check your mirrors now and again.

Sure, but I don't think you keep your attention to the mirrors for more than 1-2 seconds usually, right?

And you have not to move your head up and down for that fortunately.

 

[richiek]

Of course this is a secondary screen to the TV. In many games it might function as an inventory. Imagine a game where your inventory is accessed on the fly (Dead Space?). Despite what you may say, it is cumbersome to move through a menu w/ your joystick. Instead imagine that inventory is thrown onto the bottom screen at all times, and all it takes is a quick look down (as opposed to the game overlaying the inventory on the TV screen), a tap of the screen, then back to the gameplay.

My hope is that Cafe games will completely do away with HUDs and inventory screens, allowing item and weapon management on the fly without needing to pause the game.

 

[StarEye]

Anyone posed the idea that having a touchscreen on your controller could open up the possibility of a 3DS Player on your "Wii2"? Where your TV acts as the upper screen, and the touchscreen as the lower screen (obviously).

 

[Tim the Wiz]

Ah, I love the glorious smell of a pre-reveal Nintendo thread. Frenzied baseless speculation and lazy assumptions wrought from vague, decontextualized buzz. I'll just wait for the conference.

 

[mj1108]

I predict a lot of 'WTF is this shit Nintendo?! You best turn 3rd party while you still can!' turning into 'Oh, I get it now' come E3.

This is what I predict happening along with a lot of "why didn't I think of that?".

Can't we just wait for 3 1/2 more days before we start praising or dooming it?

Nah, this is a Nintendo thread so it's much more fun to jump to conclusions and doom it now. /sarcasm

 

[Graphics Horse]

Sure, but I don't think you keep your attention to the mirrors for more than 1-2 seconds usually, right?

I hope not.

I'd still like this to offer some kind of touch feedback to let you know what you're touching without looking, but I'm not too hopeful on that.

 

[TheGreatMightyPoo]

Can't we just wait for 3 1/2 more days before we start praising or dooming it?

You know it will be both and often from the same people.

More questions than answers!!!!!

 

[Buckethead]

I wonder if NOA will try to strong-arm NOJ getting achievements into Cafe games.

 

[DXB-KNIGHT]

Can't we just wait for 3 1/2 more days before we start praising or dooming it?

To put it simply, Price:
Reasonable: WIN
Expensive: DOOOOOMED*

END

*see PS3