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[Tuck]

Nintendo doesn't believe in narrative video games. They rarely dabble in it and usually fail. Even their best stories, like Thousand Year Door and Majora's Mask, are very simple. Very entertaining, but not art like BioShock Last of Us.

They've had successes though. Kid Icarus Uprising had a really enjoyable story.

 

[Toxi]

I don't think you know what story-driven means. None of the games you mention in the OP are story-driven except for the Operation Rainfall trio. A game being story-driven isn't the same as a game just having a story.

Other M has two hours of high-production value cutscenes in a seven hour game, forced walking segments, and a narrow marketing focus on its storyline. If it's not a story-driven game, few things are.

Think Other M. Nintendo knew that game was pretty much a disaster to the point where it was obtainable for like $5-$10 new. Nintendo never lets their games depreciate in value like that unless there's something wrong with them.

No, that was just stores lowering the price because nobody was buying the game and they had too many copies in stock.

 

[Etnos]

Very entertaining, but not art like BioShock Last of Us.

ohh wow, the lulz I guess.

If you think BioShock or TLOU story are meaninfull worthwhile stories perhaps you should look at reading more books, or watching good cinema. I say this with pain not trying to be a snob here, but yeah good story in video games still really hard to pull of, specially big budget titles. Predictable hero journey shit in every single game.

 

[BeatResetsTheWorld]

Except for Mother, none of those are really narrative driven in the same way as Bioshock or The Last of Us.

I don't even understand Metroid unless you're using Other M for the entire series. Metroid as a whole is known for lacking a narrative pushing the player forward.

Which is a good thing.

Metroid, I would probably remove, but the rest of definitely narrative driven. Just because they allow the gamer more freedom, and aren't as tightly constrained as the 2 games mentioned doesn't change that. It really comes down to how spaced out the passive story agents (cutscenes, set piece triggers, etc) are, but that doesn't change the underlying motivation for moving through successive levels or areas

 

[Vena]

Nintendo doesn't believe in narrative video games. They rarely dabble in it and usually fail. Even their best stories, like Thousand Year Door and Majora's Mask, are very simple. Very entertaining, but not art like BioShock Last of Us.

I'd recommend you open up some (good) books and read them if you think either of those titles are art or if you think Majora's Mask is "simple".

 

[tronic307]

I don't mind story-driven games as long as you can play the story. If the controller is idle whenever the story is being told, what good is it?

 

[Hexagonal]

Well, I played Eternal Darkness after playing both The Last of Us and Bioshock Infinite and I felt more engaged to ED's story than Bioshock's or TLoU's, even though I loved these 2 too.

So Nintendo

Spoiler

also early 2000's Silicon Knights

has proven that they can deliver high-quality storylines, with simple yet effective gameplay. However, Nintendo might feel it's better to deliver amazing gameplay than an amazing storyline, because everyone can see the main plot of any game by just watching some YouTube videos (and that's why Super Smash Bros 4 doesn't have any plot-based mode, as I recall from memory), but gameplay has to be experienced by hand.

That said, Nintendo has the potential to give us a well variety of stories, perhaps more mature and/or risky than other games on the market.

The ironic part, after all, is that Miyamoto and Iwata produced Eternal Darkness, with the former giving advice to the team regarding how "alive" the characters felt.

 

[jimi_dini]

Nintendo doesn't believe in narrative video games. They rarely dabble in it and usually fail. Even their best stories, like Thousand Year Door and Majora's Mask, are very simple. Very entertaining, but not art like BioShock Last of Us.

Just because you don't shoot and kill lots and lots of people in Majora's Mask doesn't make it very simple from a story telling perspective.

 

[abstract alien]

They've had successes though. Kid Icarus Uprising had a really enjoyable story.

This game made me eat so much crow. I was positive the story, narrative, and VA were going to be terrible. Good thing I'm not a betting man, or I'd have lost my home.

 

[Heroman]

Nintendo doesn't believe in narrative video games. They rarely dabble in it and usually fail. Even their best stories, like Thousand Year Door and Majora's Mask, are very simple. Very entertaining, but not art like BioShock Last of Us.

MM is simple but Tlou isnt?

 

[HardRojo]

I don't agree with OP calling those games story-driven, if you asked what they were about I wouldn't be able to put the story together in an understandable manner, I mean, I'd probably just say something simple like Bayonetta is a witch who does this and that because of this and that's that, but I don't think I'd come up with something more elaborate since I don't think it belongs.

A story heavy Metroid that leans towards survival horror is what I'd like to see next, in third person preferably. I know Other M wasn't a big success but I enjoyed it for what it was and I wish Nintendo had the balls to try the formula again with better writing and direction.
Regarding Zelda games, I like them the way they are and I trust Zelda U will be amazing when it drops.

Just because you don't shoot and kill lots and lots of people in Majora's Mask doesn't make it very simple from a story telling perspective.

While I agreee MM's story isn't simple by any means, I don't agree with the generalization of "guns and killing people" since that can be reduced to "killing things", which is something plenty of games do.

 

[daxgame]

Nintendo doesn't believe in narrative video games. They rarely dabble in it and usually fail. Even their best stories, like Thousand Year Door and Majora's Mask, are very simple. Very entertaining, but not art like BioShock Last of Us.

They don't believe in them so much that they published both super niche games Hotel Dusk and The Last Window both in USA and in Europe, and they were even translated in 5 languages.
Or we could like at Another Code

 

[biglittleps]

I don't mind story-driven games as long as you can play the story. If the controller is idle whenever the story is being told, what good is it?

When story is being told then we try to watch and listen with attention

Spoiler

(can do this in movies but story does not change as the player wants in some ways which is possible in games)

but not control or read

Spoiler

(its best in books but not in games)

, we control the story when its needed

Spoiler

(but some people take this too much and downplay some games that its just watching the game always instead of playing without understanding the goal of the game that developer intended there)

but not always and depends on the people who write story and develop it to provide control.

 

[HardRojo]

They don't believe in them so much that they published both super niche games Hotel Dusk and The Last Window both in USA and in Europe, and they were even translated in 5 languages.
Or we could like at Another Code

The Last Window was never released in the US and I believe it was developed by an independent team, not one of Nintendo's core teams.

 

[BeatResetsTheWorld]

When story is being told then we try to watch and listen with attention

Spoiler

(can do this in movies but story does not change as the player wants in some ways which is possible in games)

but not control or read

Spoiler

(its best in books but not in games)

, we control the story when its needed

Spoiler

(but some people take this too much and downplay some games that its just watching the game always instead of playing without understanding the goal of the game that developer intended there)

but not always and depends on the people who write story and develop it to provide control.

What was this? Some sort of metagame where we had to play an active role in figuring out what you were saying by highlighting?

 

[DizzyCrow]

I don't mind story-driven games as long as you can play the story. If the controller is idle whenever the story is being told, what good is it?

.

 

[abstract alien]

Can we get rid of walking scenes? 99% of those things are so stupid. Last of Us being a prime example. Those were easily the worst parts of the experience.

 

[HardRojo]

Can we get rid of walking scenes? 99% of those things are so stupid. Last of Us being a prime example. Those were easily the worst parts of the experience.

I actually liked those parts a lot, a little calm after the tension of going through clickers and humans was very welcome, plus it added to the story and realism of the game with subtleties like

Spoiler

Ellie learning to whistle after trying for a while.

 

[ASIS]

Well, Nintendo usually takes core ideas and messages from stories and try to integrate them in games. For instance, in the pikmin series, the stories are usually very simple with little to no plot progression. But the core theme, the cruelty of nature, is very present and very impactful. Hell, even the concept of death and responsibility is there as well. It may not resonate with everyone but on the other hand it doesn't need to. And that is what i think Miyamoto is talking about when he commented on stories.

.. Then again:

… I'll just say there is room enough for both.

 

[abstract alien]

I actually liked those parts a lot, a little calm after the tension of going through clickers and humans was very welcome, plus it added to the story and realism of the game with subtleties like

Spoiler

Ellie learning to whistle after trying for a while.

I feel stuff like this would be better if it was handled more reactively. Run away and she will comment on how she won't ever learn. Walk and stop, and she would get better. That way it's a part of you instead of just a cutscene in disguise.

 

[Shaanyboi]

Nintendo has rarely focused on narrative in games, and they've had mixed results when going for bigger more cinematic flair. Metroid Other M is the prime example of "these guys don't have a fucking clue what they're doing." However on the flipside, their Mario RPGs, or their Zelda games have generally relied on more simplistic storytelling and they've found far more success in that area. The densest stories they've told are probably Xenoblade, Eternal Darkness, and Majora's Mask. I would like to see them challenge themselves more narratively, but they internally don't seem to care much if gameplay isn't reliant on it, which is an admirable trait of its own.

But no, I don't think you'll ever see them try something like Last of Us or Uncharted where the cutscenes are more or less the central conversation. It's not what they're interested in.

Can we get rid of walking scenes? 99% of those things are so stupid. Last of Us being a prime example. Those were easily the worst parts of the experience.

if you mean games' constant reliance on characters slowing down with their fingers up to their ear because the game needs to convey information and the developer couldn't think of a better way to pace the situation to allow that? Sure.

In Last of Us' case, alot of those "walking scenes" are there to set in the atmosphere of a big empty desolate world, or to allow the characters to breathe and interact in a way that they can't if literally every scene is 'stealth sequence' 'action sequence' 'stealth sequence' 'horror sequence'. Removing those would make each of the action sequences and the whole 'journey' aspect far less poignant. So no.

 

[MisterGrey3000]

Majora's Mask's story isn't really that deep or complex; By most standards it is pretty simple, but that's probably what makes it so effective for a lot of people.
A simple story isn't a rudimentary or badly told story Majora fans, calm your butts.

 

[Scoops]

No, that was just stores lowering the price because nobody was buying the game and they had too many copies in stock.

Stores aren't going to drop it to $5-$10 if Nintendo is still charging the stores normal price. If stores did it on their own they would lose $30-$40 per transaction.

 

[protomouse]

So, do you think Nintendo is moving more towards story-driven games?

I think they're staying their course, while working with 3rd parties to expand their catalogue.

Do you think Nintendo should move towards more story driven games in general?

No. At least not in the sense that the industry in large is doing it - adopting cinematographic techniques that just slow the games down. The important aspect IMO is not to tell a story, but to trigger emotions within the player. ICO masterfully demonstrated how to do this without having much of a story, nor sacrificing gameplay in the process. Just do more of that sort, I suppose.

What story-driven genres would you like to see Nintendo get involved in?

I've always wanted to see Nintendo do a God simulator type game, like Black & White. Perhaps that might be a good fit.

 

[Orniletter]

Disregard.

 

[Scoops]

I don't mind story-driven games as long as you can play the story. If the controller is idle whenever the story is being told, what good is it?

I mostly agree. In AAA games cutscenes/story can be used to cover up for a lack of gameplay. However you have things like TWD that this is the case almost all the time, and I really like TWD.

 

[Scoops]

No. At least not in the sense that the industry in large is doing it - adopting cinematographic techniques that just slow the games down. The important aspect IMO is not to tell a story, but to trigger emotions within the player. ICO masterfully demonstrated how to do this without having much of a story, nor sacrificing gameplay in the process. Just do more of that sort, I suppose.

Seems like you don't like when the story becomes the primary motivator for a player to progress through a game, but may not mind it when it is simply one of multiple motivators to progress. I agree with that.

Seems like Metroid Prime and the story book in Galaxy are examples of what you are saying. Both added to the experience by providing some narrative, but the dexterity and puzzles involved with gameplay remained the main draw. I think Nintendo should have more of this kind of stuff in games with traditionally little to no narrative. An upcoming example of this Splatoon which has a story mode, where it could've easily of been like Mario Kart, just multiplayer.

Counter examples would be the Subspace mode in Brawl and Other M, where story and presentation became the primary motivator for progressing, and gameplay was an afterthought. I think we all agree less of this.

Then you have a perfect middle ground like Xenoblade, which had both heavy narrative/cutscenes and focus on gameplay to boot. Nintendo needs more of this as well IMO and I think they know it by picking up games like Bayo 2 and Devil's Third.

 

[Cryxok]

I agree with that, but for me it's when story takes precedence over gameplay where I have a problem. MGS is a decent example of how to do it well (MGS4 notwithstanding, that game was a failure). It has loads of story and cutscenes, but the game would absolutely not work if the gameplay part wasn't so well thought out. For me story in MGS is just a nice little bonus, but it's the last thing I pay attention to, it's just a nice reward for playing the game up until certain points.

This comment makes me want to start the MGS series even more. I feel the complete opposite with many Atlus games; absolutely love the story and setting but I feel the gameplay is just an "obstacle" of sorts to keep the story moving foward. Not hard or anything, simply I think they get repetitive. If MGS has a good story as a bonus of a good game, then I'll be sure to buy them sooner rather than later

 

[abstract alien]

if you mean games' constant reliance on characters slowing down with their fingers up to their ear because the game needs to convey information and the developer couldn't think of a better way to pace the situation to allow that? Sure.

In Last of Us' case, alot of those "walking scenes" are there to set in the atmosphere of a big empty desolate world, or to allow the characters to breathe and interact in a way that they can't if literally every scene is 'stealth sequence' 'action sequence' 'stealth sequence' 'horror sequence'. Removing those would make each of the action sequences and the whole 'journey' aspect far less poignant. So no.

No, you don't need to literally take away control from me and make me walk (the character can do nothing else). That is just bad design in my opinion. The times they interact while you are traversing areas of desolation don't take away control, and are better for it because the conversations are more organic. There are literally better examples in the game itself.

Not one single walking section in Last of Us tells the story better than the times you have full control and they are still talking to each other.

 

[abstract alien]

This comment makes me want to start the MGS series even more. I feel the complete opposite with many Atlus games; absolutely love the story and setting but I feel the gameplay is just an "obstacle" of sorts to keep the story moving foward. Not hard or anything, simply I think they get repetitive. If MGS has a good story as a bonus of a good game, then I'll be sure to buy them sooner rather than later

That series is amazing. Part of the reason it's story tends to be special to fans is because it's attached to the gameplay, and sometimes the player themselves.

 

[petran79]

So, do you think Nintendo is moving more towards story-driven games, and if so is it because they're trying to fill a gap in their lineup that third parties no longer fill? Do you think Nintendo should move towards more story driven games in general? What story-driven genres would you like to see Nintendo get involved in? Do you think Nintendo could pull off a game where writing takes the spotlight like say in Bioshock or The Last of Us?

Now that Wii U supports disc data up to 25 GB, it can easily support those types of games.
But this is better left to third party developers, eg like in the Fatal Frame games that also utilise the console's gimmicks.

 

[squidyj]

i cant think of any popular nintendo property as 'story driven' i think claiming that moniker for them is honestly completely ridiculous, when you think about what they tend to offer on that front using the term Honestly really only does a disservice to games that really do try to excel on that front.

 

[Toxi]

No, you don't need to literally take away control from me and make me walk (the character can do nothing else). That is just bad design in my opinion. The times they interact while you are traversing areas of desolation don't take away control, and are better for it because the conversations are more organic. There are literally better examples in the game itself.

Not one single walking section in Last of Us tells the story better than the times you have full control and they are still talking to each other.

Methinks you made a mistake quoting me.

 

[Katzenjammer]

No, you don't need to literally take away control from me and make me walk (the character can do nothing else). That is just bad design in my opinion. The times they interact while you are traversing areas of desolation don't take away control, and are better for it because the conversations are more organic. There are literally better examples in the game itself.

Not one single walking section in Last of Us tells the story better than the times you have full control and they are still talking to each other.

I'm currently playing through TLoU for the first time, and I quite enjoy the forced walking sequences. Not only are they nice since you can soak in the environments and dialogue, but it also feels natural that the characters shouldn't be running all the time. I'm playing with my non-gamer dad spectating, and he has even remarked that "wow these guys run a lot, shouldn't they rest sometime too?".

 

[Oersted]

I've always wanted to see Nintendo do a God simulator type game, like Black & White. Perhaps that might be a good fit.

Doshin the Giant?

 

[abstract alien]

Methinks you made a mistake quoting me.

Aw shit lol