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[Jackpot]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-23779561

Fukushima leak is 'much worse than we were led to believe'

A nuclear expert has told the BBC that he believes the current water leaks at Fukushima are much worse than the authorities have stated.

Mycle Schneider is an independent consultant who has previously advised the French and German governments.

He says water is leaking out all over the site and there are no accurate figures for radiation levels.

Meanwhile the chairman of Japan's nuclear authority said that he feared there would be further leaks.

But some nuclear experts are concerned that the problem is a good deal worse than either Tepco or the Japanese government are willing to admit.

They are worried about the enormous quantities of water, used to cool the reactor cores, which are now being stored on site.

Some 1,000 tanks have been built to hold the water. But these are believed to be at around 85% of their capacity and every day an extra 400 tonnes of water are being added.

"The quantities of water they are dealing with are absolutely gigantic," said Mycle Schneider, who has consulted widely for a variety of organisations and countries on nuclear issues.

"What is the worse is the water leakage everywhere else - not just from the tanks. It is leaking out from the basements, it is leaking out from the cracks all over the place. Nobody can measure that.

The "worsening situation" at Fukushima has prompted a former Japanese ambassador to Switzerland to call for the withdrawal of Tokyo's Olympic bid.

In a letter to the UN secretary general, Mitsuhei Murata says the official radiation figures published by Tepco cannot be trusted. He says he is extremely worried about the lack of a sense of crisis in Japan and abroad.

This view is shared by Mycle Schneider, who is calling for an international taskforce for Fukushima.

"The Japanese have a problem asking for help. It is a big mistake; they badly need it."

More at the link.

 

[ComputerMKII]

'Please understand'

 

[CyclopsRock]

Seems like everyone's having problems with leaks these days.

 

[OminoMichelin]

So glad we decided against nuclear in Italy.
Mafia+nuclear energy = NOPE.jpg

 

[Tworak]

it's that stupid-ass pride shit again. yah let's not ask for help and instead wait for another earthquake which will level the water storage tanks and bathe everyone with glorious contaminated water.

 

[Kinyou]

The way the government handles this is more than shameful

 

[iamaustrian]

I read that kids cancer cases doubled in the last month.

I also remember when dozens of hardcore nuclear-pros tried to explain me that a nuclear plant exploding fucking 4 times in a row is nothing to worry about.
radiation will be minimal and gone in like 30 days.

I beg to differ

 

[Azulsky]

Sounds like Tepco is being extremely cheap about cleaning this thing up, and then trying to cover it up.

 

[maquiladora]

Time for a Fukushima Direct to clear this up.

 

[V_Arnold]

Earth Radiation Council needs to be formed. Total transparceny, globally enforced, no one can handle any nuclear plants without them seeing/accessing to everything.

When is this going to happen?

 

[OminoMichelin]

Earth Radiation Council needs to be formed. Total transparceny, globally enforced, no one can handle any nuclear plants without them seeing/accessing to everything.

When is this going to happen?

Never: nuclear lobbies are too powerful.
This fukushima affair is catastrophic, but I don't see media outlets giving it much attention.

 

[Log4Girlz]

Earth Radiation Council needs to be formed. Total transparceny, globally enforced, no one can handle any nuclear plants without them seeing/accessing to everything.

When is this going to happen?

Tonight in your dreams.

 

[Tworak]

Never: nuclear lobbies are too powerful.

I think you confuse nuclear lobbies with 'sanity'. there is no alternative to nuclear power. oh wait, there's two. crude oil and natural gas, oh and coal. fuck yeah, let's use those.

 

[Lagspike_exe]

This sounds like a beginning of some cheap action horror movie.

 

[xenist]

What? You mean problems don't go away by not talking about them? I thought that was the honorable way to deal with failure.

 

[Lagspike_exe]

I think you confuse nuclear lobbies with 'sanity'. there is no alternative to nuclear power. oh wait, there's two. crude oil and natural gas, oh and coal. fuck yeah, let's use those.

Or hydro energy for example. Cheap and perfectly clean.

 

[Nikodemos]

And that's just because of Tepco's greed. This entire time they have been hoping to one day repair and restart (at least part of) that shitheap. Had they gone "Fuck it, let's entomb this turd; bring out the dancing clomes concrete nozzles", things would've calmed down a bit by now.

 

[CassSept]

Earth Radiation Council needs to be formed. Total transparceny, globally enforced, no one can handle any nuclear plants without them seeing/accessing to everything.

When is this going to happen?

Ahahaha. Haha.

Hahahahahaha. Good one.

Total transparency, maaan, that's great.

 

[Tworak]

Or hydro energy for example. Cheap and perfectly clean.

you need a lot of falling water and/or running water for that. not every country has easy access to that.

building of dams, etc, also have big environmental impacts.

 

[goomba]

Is it true that there are still like 20 active nuclear plants in the US that are based on the same US design as the Fukushima plant was?

 

[Nibel]

'Please understand'

First post doesn't get enough love

 

[Scoot2005]

This sounds like a beginning of some cheap action horror movie.

Soooo.... Godzilla rip-off? Less action, more mutants?

 

[OminoMichelin]

I think you confuse nuclear lobbies with 'sanity'. there is no alternative to nuclear power. oh wait, there's two. crude oil and natural gas, oh and coal. fuck yeah, let's use those.

Nobody is saying to ban nuclear power forever. the post I quoted called for a commission that would scrutinize power plants so we can avoid the shit that's happening now under the world's nose.
It's widely known that nuclear plants get away with a lot of inefficiencies and security problems. How many times are we willing to let shit hit the fan before something concrete is done?

 

[wsippel]

And that's just because of Tepco's greed. This entire time they have been hoping to one day repair and restart (at least part of) that shitheap. Had they gone "Fuck it, let's entomb this turd; bring out the dancing clomes concrete nozzles", things would've calmed down a bit by now.

You can't entomb it as long as the activity is still that high. You'd get another meltdown inside the tomb and can do fuck all about it. Also, tombs only last a few decades and are extremely complicated and expensive to maintain properly.

 

[Frank Jaeger]

So glad we decided against nuclear in Italy.
Mafia+nuclear energy = NOPE.jpg

I have an italian friend that at any possible mention of mafia gets really angry that there is still this association!

 

[revolverjgw]

Godzilla viral marketing has kicked off

 

[Scoot2005]

First post doesn't get enough love

Next Ninty will blame the radiation for the poor marketing. It messed with Nintendos brains. I feel really bad for the Japanese.

 

[NaturalHigh]

There are a lot of dolphins washing up on the east coast of the US this year.

Could this be related?

 

[OminoMichelin]

I have an italian friend that at any possible mention of mafia gets really angry that there is still this association!

Of course, nobody wants to hear the word from a foreigner, it strikes us as a negative generalization.
But when talking about large projects like multiple power plants is only natural to keep such things like fraud, corruption, mafia infiltration in mind. This stuff happens with roads, buildings, and pretty much any infrastructure in italy. Let alone multi billion euros projects like these.

Edit: LOL at ''still''. Mafia clans are stronger now than they have ever been.

 

[KHarvey16]

Is it true that there are still like 20 active nuclear plants in the US that are based on the same US design as the Fukushima plant was?

Probably. I doubt we built any of them on a beach though.

 

[Juice]

There are a lot of dolphins washing up on the east coast of the US this year.

Could this be related?

East coast?

 

[ToxicAdam]

This article only names one "nuclear expert" and he's a pretty well-known anti-nuclear activist for the past few decades.

 

[Perkel]

Sounds like Tepco is being extremely cheap about cleaning this thing up, and then trying to cover it up.

Sounds like people don't understand how serious is this situation. It is not broken pipet. They can't fix it. They can only reduce effects

Chernobyl to this day is problematic

 

[OminoMichelin]

This article only names one "nuclear expert" and he's a pretty well-known anti-nuclear activist for the past few decades.

We have data showing the level of contamination in the Pacific ocean though. What he says is actually compatible with what we know afaik.

 

[Jarmel]

Godzilla could be the mascot for the Olympics though!

 

[Jackpot]

This article only names one "nuclear expert" and he's a pretty well-known anti-nuclear activist for the past few decades.

um, it cites no less than 4 people - 3 experts in nuclear power, 1 in marine chemistry.who specialises in sutdying nuclear fallout in water.

 

[ToxicAdam]

um, it cites no less than 4 people - 3 experts in nuclear power, 1 in marine chemistry.who specialises in sutdying nuclear fallout in water.

Aside from Mycle Schneider, can you name the other two who said or inferred that 'they think Fukushima is worse than Japan is letting on' and there are '(currently) leaks everywhere'?

I'm having a failure of reading comprehension over here and could use some help.

 

[Cromat]

Time for a Fukushima Direct to clear this up.

Radiation Ambassador program

 

[linsivvi]

um, it cites no less than 4 people - 3 experts in nuclear power, 1 in marine chemistry.who specialises in sutdying nuclear fallout in water.

Here's one more expert from reuters:

"That is a huge amount of radiation. The situation is getting worse," said Michiaki Furukawa, who is professor emeritus at Nagoya University and a nuclear chemist.

And another one from National Geographic:

"This leak is very serious," said Dr. Janette Sherman, an Alexandria, Virginia-based physician who specializes in radioactive and toxic exposure. Dr. Sherman, who edited an in-depth study of health effects on cleanup workers in the 1986 Chernobyl nuclear disaster in the former Soviet Union, said she is concerned that the cleanup crew at Fukushima Daiichi may face long-term health risks. She also raised the prospect of the radiation's as-yet unknown effects on fish and other marine life in the Pacific.

Japan clearly needs help, and they need the best scientists available to help them come up with a solution.

 

[zma1013]

Never: nuclear lobbies are too powerful.
This fukushima affair is catastrophic, but I don't see media outlets giving it much attention.

It's just that there's nothing new to report. Every now and again news comes up like this and it's basically the same thing, "Fukushima plant still leaking waste." The headline never changes and the news media just won't show that every day. If it somehow explodes or someone catches a 5 eyed fish in the water, then it will be back in the spotlight again.

 

[iamblades]

Is it true that there are still like 20 active nuclear plants in the US that are based on the same US design as the Fukushima plant was?

The specific design is not really the issue. All light water reactors are vulnerable to large scale natural disasters like this because they need external cooling, and light water reactors are all we have because we have basically halted nuclear research in the 70s.

Pebble bed reactors or molten salt reactors or thorium fueled reactors would not be vulnerable to cooling system failure like LWRs, but because of anti nuclear nutjobs, we never did the research into safer nuclear power and are still using 60 year old technology. Classic example of unintended consequences.

 

[monome]

'Please understand'

I would laugh....if my GF was not in Japan.

from the start, TEPCO/Gov have been lying.

Problem is...people want to be lied to.

it's so huge a problem...people do their best to look elsewhere.

As a french, I feel dirty. Areva is there...because moneyz...this a major environmental threat and both the US/French are happy to make money and help the jp government hide facts.

 

[akira28]

Earth Radiation Council needs to be formed. Total transparceny, globally enforced, no one can handle any nuclear plants without them seeing/accessing to everything.

When is this going to happen?

This sounds like some made up organization created to be ignored or to reassure the public with televised bullshit, just as Godzilla rises outof the ocean behind them.

 

[MisterFalcon]

Earth Radiation Council needs to be formed. Total transparceny, globally enforced, no one can handle any nuclear plants without them seeing/accessing to everything.

When is this going to happen?

After the Earth Anti Drowning Council that will forcibly relocate all people living too close to the sea and in danger of being killed by a tsunami to safer ground. Hundreds of thousands were killed by tsunamis, this has to end.

 

[Row]

nuclear power is nuts when something goes wrong, all this time and it's getting worse

 

[iamaustrian]

Probably. I doubt we built any of them on a beach though.

well, while the Diablo Canyon plant is a newer and "safer" pressurized water reactor it never fails to amaze me that they built that thing not only in one of the most earthquake ridden areas right on the beach but also directly on a geological fault line and close to a second fault.

smh

but because of anti nuclear nutjobs, we never did the research into safer nuclear power and are still using 60 year old technology. Classic example of unintended consequences.

or maybe the atom lobby being polluted by greedy ass bastards who don't give a shit except for money?

 

[MJLord]

Nobody is saying to ban nuclear power forever. the post I quoted called for a commission that would scrutinize power plants so we can avoid the shit that's happening now under the world's nose.
It's widely known that nuclear plants get away with a lot of inefficiencies and security problems. How many times are we willing to let shit hit the fan before something concrete is done?

It's tough because as soon as you try to do something positive with Nuclear power people protest it.

well, while the Diablo Canyon plant is a newer and "safer" pressurized water reactor it never fails to amaze me that they built that thing not only in one of the most earthquake ridden areas right on the beach but also directly on a geological fault line and close to a second fault.

smh

The newer plants use Electromagnets to hold the rods in place, as soon as the power is cut they drop the cooling rods all the way into the reactor.

 

[iamaustrian]

The newer plants use Electromagnets to hold the rods in place, as soon as the power is cut they drop the cooling rods all the way into the reactor.

I'm not saying that it is a badly designed plant.
my complaint is the area they built that thing.
Will it withstand a(the?) "big one"? we'll see

 

[zma1013]

Don't worry guys, this will all go away in a couple thousand years.

 

[MJLord]

I'm not saying that it is a badly designed plant.
my complaint is the area they built that thing.
Will it withstand a(the?) "big one"? we'll see

It's a tough one, considering they used the methods developed in modern construction to help reduce the effects of quakes then I don't see why not.