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[Henkka]

I won't argue that it isn't relentlessly stupid and indulgent, but it isn't what should be an intense, emotionally-charged climax so while you're not wrong from a point of view, I'd say the truck ride thing is worse in that it was actually supposed to be important. The Quiet scene is dumb but not some major story progression sequence.

Sure, but think about the creation of the rain scene.

Think of Stephanie Joosten, rolling around on the floor of a sterile motion capture studio, while Kojima instructs her to bend over so the camera can zoom up her butt.

Think of Kiefer Sutherland, reading the script, realizing what he's gotten himself into. Think of him in the studio, recording Big Boss giggling while splashing in the rain.

The cringe is making my face implode

 

[Jangowuzhere]

I remember when I thought all the Main Missions in MGSV were going to be like GZ; a 1-2hr infiltration of a new place, bookended by important cutscenes and they would be pivotal to the story at large. The Side-Ops would also be like GZ; varied, engaging, sometimes unique but hardly repetitive.

Then MGSV came out and of the 30+ Main Missions, less than 10 were similar to the GZ mission and the rest were GZ-caliber Side-Ops in disguise...

Even though I love the gameplay I can't stand to replay it because of all the play-halting shit like the unskippable helo rides and the constant barrage of "THERE IS FOB THINGS FOR YOU TO BUY, REMEMBER? PLEASE BUY THINGS WHILE WE HOLD YOUR RESOURCES HOSTAGE!"

If you have the PC version, you can skip the helicopter rides with the Infinite Heaven mod (as well as edit a bunch of other stuff in the main game.)

 

[brandonh83]

I never replayed V. In fact I rushed through Act 2 because I was fed up with it. I knew it would be one I would never restart, unlike even 4.

I don't even know how you'd reply V, I mean from front to back more than once. It's hours upon hours of menial tasks that mean nothing. Whereas the other games are tightly focused gameplay and story experiences; even despite the cutscene quantity and length, you can still get through them relatively fast and they don't outstay their welcome. MGS4 could have used a lot of trimming but it still wasn't that bad, comparatively.

I miss pacing, tension, and conflict, even if presented in run-on cutscenes. MGS2 had absurdly long cutscenes, yet the story still moved and was super engaging.

The cringe is making my face implode

Is everything motion-captured? Because yeah that'd have to be ridiculous. Stephanie must have been a great sport.

 

[RevolverRoden]

What's really weird is that he has an accent he's never had before.

 

[Yukinari]

I think if any non-MGS fan was shown every fight with Ocelot across the series then shown a few scenes of Ocelot talking from MGS5 they wouldnt believe its the same character.

Its a shame that Quiet gets the most character development in a game thats supposed to be the "final" chapter of this long franchise.

 

[KOMANI]

I don't even know how you'd reply V, I mean from front to back more than once. It's hours upon hours of menial tasks that mean nothing. Whereas the other games are tightly focused gameplay and story experiences; even despite the cutscene quantity and length, you can still get through them relatively fast and they don't outstay their welcome. MGS4 could have used a lot of trimming but it still wasn't that bad, comparatively.

I miss pacing, tension, and conflict, even if presented in run-on cutscenes. MGS2 had absurdly long cutscenes, yet the story still moved and was super engaging.



Is everything motion-captured? Because yeah that'd have to be ridiculous. Stephanie must have been a great sport.

I've always said... You want to do a story run of the game? Just play the prologue... You're done.
Ground Zeroes was interesting, fun, and simple. You rescued hostages you cared about, and even if you didn't know who Paz or Chico were, the game spends time with them, long enough for you to build curiosity. The closest TPP cones to that, is rescuing Miller.
I could shit talk some game mechanics as well (one button to do 5 things!? God forbid you've knocked out a guard near a ladder. Good luck climbing up it... 1 button is used for standing and going prone? seriously!? That function only works with analog buttons) but all that is forgiveable. What's not is the unfocused storytelling and invoking that there's a much more interesting game happening with Big Boss than here. I don't care who I play as, but tell a story. If you're not going to tell a story, then don't butcher your set pieces and characters to the point you lose fans rather than gain them.
"I love TLOU, so sound like Joel", wtf is that!? Kojima should have stepped away from the series a long time ago if he wasn't into it, or reboot it... Don't softly reboot the series with TPP, and still use nostalgia to sell your concept. Shame.

 

[JackelZXA]

The only cool things ocelot gets to do are in optional cutscenes on base, like when he beats up eli or teaches soldiers how to not be stupid about automatic pistols.

 

[Sheriff_Battlesnake]

What's really weird is that he has an accent he's never had before.

Adamska was born in Normandy, France in 1944, before being kidnapped and raised in America until the age of sixteen. In 1960, Adam defected to Mother Russia and, I can only assume, spoke Russian indistinguishably from a native speaker as no one seems to question his loyalty*. In 1964 during the Virtuous and Snake Eater missions Ocelot is encountered by the player for the first time chronologically, but now he speaks in a neutral TV American English accent. This could be because all the dialogue is "retroactively" being translated by our "film crew," or our Limited Third-Person Narrator. This, however, is confused further as Naked Snake spoke with his American English VO, as did the other reoccurring characters, so why would Ocelot be the only exception? That probably because he wasn't; all the random guards also spoke in generic branded American English.

As of 1964? I got no clue what Ocelot sounds like unless it's just insinuating "this is what this character would sounds like if they were speaking English." It seems like from there he just based it on whatever the last Spaghetti Western he had in his Metal Gear Blu-RAY player was. Honestly, Old Ocelot just sounds like a different brand of country western and villainy stirred together.




*I think this is right... It seems like everyone assumes he's Russian from my memory?
**Also give Troy a break! Kojima was chunkin' out songs he contracted left and right. I get the feeling if that performance wasn't what he asked for he'd milk what he wanted out of there.

 

[Alienous]

I remember when I thought all the Main Missions in MGSV were going to be like GZ; a 1-2hr infiltration of a new place, bookended by important cutscenes and they would be pivotal to the story at large. The Side-Ops would also be like GZ; varied, engaging, sometimes unique but hardly repetitive.

Then MGSV came out and of the 30+ Main Missions, less than 10 were similar to the GZ mission and the rest were GZ-caliber Side-Ops in disguise...

Even though I love the gameplay I can't stand to replay it because of all the play-halting shit like the unskippable helo rides and the constant barrage of "THERE IS FOB THINGS FOR YOU TO BUY, REMEMBER? PLEASE BUY THINGS WHILE WE HOLD YOUR RESOURCES HOSTAGE!"

Man, you're making me sad.

The mission design wasn't great. A lot of the areas in the game had potential but was just wasted; they weren't utilized like Camp Omega was.. And even then most weren't like Camp Omega, where you got the sense they refined the design like a developer would refine a multiplayer map.

For 30 missions, where 20 or so don't even have the burden of having to fit into the plot well, it's disappointing to think about.

 

[Stevey]

And to think people were excited about Kojima making a Silent Hill game.

 

[Nottle]

He's underused in the game, great in the tapes and that initial reveal, other than that he just sort of plays the angel on Boss's shoulder.

I'm fine with the way he behaves because my headcannon is that he is around the guy that he loves and respects more than anyone else ever. He has no reason to be a weirdo around Big Boss because they are close friends.

And to think people were excited about Kojima making a Silent Hill game.

We know this game had a troubled production and that's the major reason for it's shortcomings. PT and Ground Zeroes were much more tight because there was less trouble making it and those were both more focused experiences.

 

[CheDominik]

Easily the worst scene in the franchise. Struggling to think of anything that matches it.

Just MGS4 alone has 3. Naomi speech with Otacon sobbing like a baby. Wedding and Raiden in the hospital. Jeep ride felt a little awkward but at least it wasn't corny as hell.

MGS2 had Fortune deflecting bullets by her willpower. It was such a ham-fisted metaphor.

MGS1 the entire snow-mobile ride was cringeworthy.

 

[Rellik]

I honestly had to keep reminding myself that the boring blonde guy was Ocelot.

 

[Marty-esque]

And to think people were excited about Kojima making a Silent Hill game.

He has made some incredible games. And he wouldn't have the baggage of earlier entries in the series.

 

[RandomExpletive]

Just MGS4 alone has 3. Naomi speech with Otacon sobbing like a baby. Wedding and Raiden in the hospital. Jeep ride felt a little awkward but at least it wasn't corny as hell.

Dude I'm one of the like 10 people here that still likes V, and even I can't defend that jeep scene

 

[bluethree]

He has made some incredible games. And he wouldn't have the baggage of earlier entries in the series.

This is a good point, as the best MGS stories (1 and 3) weren't tied down with series baggage to the same degree as the others.

 

[Ishida]

Just MGS4 alone has 3. Naomi speech with Otacon sobbing like a baby. Wedding and Raiden in the hospital. Jeep ride felt a little awkward but at least it wasn't corny as hell.

MGS2 had Fortune deflecting bullets by her willpower. It was such a ham-fisted metaphor.

MGS1 the entire snow-mobile ride was cringeworthy.

Non of those are even remotely close to being as bad as the jeep scene.

 

[KOMANI]

Non of those are even remotely close to being as bad as the jeep scene.

Also, those other 3 aren't essential to the "story" as the jeep rise is supposed to be.

 

[Jangowuzhere]

Non of those are even remotely close to being as bad as the jeep scene.

The Mr. and Mrs. Smith scene with Meryl and Johnny is the stupidest thing I've seen in the series.

Also, all the philosophical gibberish in MGS4 is easily the worst dialogue in the Metal Gear.

 

[Ishida]

The Mr. and Mrs. Smith scene with Meryl and Johnny is the stupidest thing I've seen in the series.

Also, all the philosophical gibberish in MGS4 is easily the worst dialogue in the series.

Not worse than the jeep ride.

 

[Jangowuzhere]

Not worse than the jeep ride.

The Meryl and Johnny scene transforms a tense climax into a silly cartoon, so yeah it's far worse.

I don't even get the hate for the jeep ride actually. It's dumb, but I still found it charming.

 

[Shivershorts]

I'm surprised by how much you guys are coming down on the jeep ride. It was pretty inappropriate for such a significant moment in the story, but saying that it's one of the worst scenes in the series is pretty hyperbolic.

I think maybe it's just due to the extreme disappointment? And how fresh it is?

 

[Ishida]

The Meryl and Johnny scene transforms a tense climax into a silly cartoon, so yeah it's far worse.

I don't even get the hate for the jeep ride actually. It's dumb, but I still found it charming.

There's nothing charming on such a boring scene where nothing happens. Skullface's speech is boring. Snake says nothing like the inanimate puppet he is, the song kicks in in a very goofy way. Nothing happens.

At least the other scenes had me rolling on the floor, laughing. The jeep scene was just... there.

 

[Jangowuzhere]

There's nothing charming on such a boring scene where nothing happens. Skullface's speech is boring. Snake says nothing like the inanimate puppet he is, the song kicks in in a very goofy way. Nothing happens.

At least the other scenes had me rolling on the floor, laughing. The jeep scene was just... there.

I thought the speech was fine. Speech and silly music were quite memorable. Snake not talking is the only odd point. Everything else about that scene felt like Metal Gear to me.

Sorry, but I just don't get the same amusement from MGS4. Tonally, that stuff is completely out of place. MGS4 takes itself quite seriously, so having dumb silly scenes like that at almost every turn is quite jarring. Not sure what I'm supposed to be feeling half the time. Is the game trying to be comedic, tense, dramatic, etc.?

You laughing at that scene reminds me of people who watch bad horror movies and laugh at that kind of shit. The stories are trying to be dark and tense, but that end up being unintentionally hilarious. That's not what I want from an MGS game.

 

[tryagainlater]

I thought the speech was fine. Speech and silly music were quite memorable. Snake not talking is the only odd point. Everything else about that scene felt like Metal Gear to me.

Sorry, but I just don't get the same amusement from MGS4. Tonally, that stuff is completely out of place. MGS4 takes itself quite seriously, so having dumb silly scenes like that at almost every turn is quite jarring. Not sure what I'm supposed to be feeling half the time. Is the game trying to be comedic, tense, dramatic, etc.?

You laughing at that scene reminds me of people who watch bad horror movies and laugh at that kind of shit. The stories are trying to be dark and tense, but that end up being unintentionally hilarious. That's not what I want from an MGS game.

MGSV is the only game in the series that didn't constantly shift it's tone and it was more boring for it. MGS has constantly jumped back and forth between comedy and drama. People mightn't like it but it's 100% apart of the series.

 

[Jangowuzhere]

MGSV is the only game in the series that didn't constantly shift it's tone and it was more boring for it. MGS has constantly jumped back and forth between comedy and drama. People mightn't like it but it's 100% apart of the series.

That's not true at all. When MGS was serious, it was appropriately dramatic. When it was trying to be funny, it was intentionally silly. MGS4 and partly MGS2 were the only games that had odd shifts in tone. The final hours of MGS3 are straight faced and dramatic, it doesn't have overly silly blunders which undermine the powerful twists and emotional moments. MGSV puts most of its silly moments more into the gameplay instead of telling them through cinematics and character exchanges.

 

[Ishida]

I thought the speech was fine. Speech and silly music were quite memorable. Snake not talking is the only odd point. Everything else about that scene felt like Metal Gear to me.

Sorry, but I just don't get the same amusement from MGS4. Tonally, that stuff is completely out of place. MGS4 takes itself quite seriously, so having dumb silly scenes like that at almost every turn is quite jarring. Not sure what I'm supposed to be feeling half the time. Is the game trying to be comedic, tense, dramatic, etc.?

You laughing at that scene reminds me of people who watch bad horror movies and laugh at that kind of shit. The stories are trying to be dark and tense, but that end up being unintentionally hilarious. That's not what I want from an MGS game.

Those scenes were not unintentionally hilarious. They were completely intentional.

And Metal Gear Solid is all comedic, serious, dramatic, goofy, tense, hilarious, ridiculous. All in the same package. If that's not what you want from a Metal Gear game, then you are looking into the wrong franchise.

 

[Jangowuzhere]

Those scenes were not unintentionally hilarious. They were completely intentional.

And Metal Gear Solid is all comedic, serious, dramatic, goofy, tense, hilarious, ridiculous. All in the same package. If that's not what you want from a Metal Gear game, then you are looking into the wrong franchise.

You are missing my point. I know that MGS is all those things. I've played all these games and love them, I don't need someone to tell me that I'm looking at it wrong.

Metal Gear is at its best when it stays focused. When it tries to do too many things at once, it ends up falling flat on its face. It's hard to feel invested when the game switches to vastly different emotional beats in short amounts of time.

 

[Ishida]

You are missing my point. I know that MGS is all those things. I've played all these games and love them, I don't need someone to tell me that I'm looking at it wrong.

Metal Gear is at its best when it stays focused. When it tries to do too many things at once, it ends up falling flat on its face. It's hard to feel invested when the game switches to vastly different emotional beats in short amounts of time.

I disagree completely with the bolded. But different strokes.

 

[Trojan]

Good. You captured it alive.

I can't unhear this dialogue every time Ocelot is mentioned. It is burned into my memory.

 

[JumpCancel]

Ocelot: "Let the legend come back to life!"

Venom: "Why Should I If you're not?!?"

The real reason behinds snakes absence of character.

 

[Jangowuzhere]

I disagree completely with the bolded. But different strokes.

The death of

Spoiler

The Boss

didn't play out with a previous scene having a silly poop joke or a hilarious character exchange. Most of these games know how to pace themselves. They aren't all over the place all the time.

 

[The English Conquistador]

Kojima never should've went open world ;_;

I agree. MGS5 is a boring as fuck.

 

[RevolverRoden]

Who cares about the jeep scene. It was weird, but the real garbage was the rain scene. 100% trash

 

[JumpCancel]

Kaz was barely a character in PW. He was really just the radio man telling you what to do. The guy barely has any involvement in the actual story.

From the hours of Cassette tapes fleshing out his upbringing, military life, food preferences, love of recording locomotive sounds he was MUCH more of a character. I've 100% PW and that game has much more character than MSGV.

Everybody in your main team is fleshed out through cassettes. I never specified main narrative and to be honest there is more to the game than that: Post Game is where most of the fun is along with optional content that I indulged.

Are you saying he was much better in PW?

I prefer the lighthearted tone of PW for all it's characters, so In my opinion yes.

 

[themidnightsun156]

he had some moments, very few, mostly involving eli, kaz was the best character in my opinion, he had so many good lines and robin atkins downes nailed every one of them, great performance

 

[Ishida]

The death of

Spoiler

The Boss

didn't play out with a previous scene having a silly poop joke or a hilarious character exchange.

Neither did the death of

Spoiler

Liquid Ocelot

.

 

[LiK]

Shittiest Ocelot in the series. Wish they got the original VA back.

 

[Jangowuzhere]

Neither did the death of

Spoiler

Liquid Ocelot

.

Again, I feel like you're missing my point. It doesn't have to be related to character deaths.

Having Johnny and Meryl strike odd poses, take absurd amounts of damage, and exchange awkward dialogue is fine. Following that up be with arguably the most dramatic moment in the game (microwave hall) is stupid.

 

[Ishida]

Again, I feel like you're missing my point. It doesn't have to be related to character deaths.

Having Johnny and Meryl strike odd poses, take absurd amounts of damage, and exchange awkward dialogue is fine. Following that up be with arguably the most dramatic moment in the game (microwave hall) is stupid.

I don't think so. I think it was very Metal Gear.

 

[Jangowuzhere]

I don't think so. I think it was very Metal Gear.

Sure, but that doesn't make it good Metal Gear.

 

[Ishida]

Sure, but that doesn't make it good Metal Gear.

It made it a fantastic Metal Gear.

 

[Jangowuzhere]

It made it a fantastic Metal Gear.

mmmm not so sure about that

The Mount Rushmore of Snakes is the silly Metal Gear I want, not bad movie references.

 

[Ishida]

mmmm not so sure about that

The Mount Rushmore of Snakes is the silly Metal Gear I want, not bad movie references.

Oh well, to each it's own.

 

[Sir Ilpalazzo]

Yea... So stealthy, you can get an S rank Foxhound sticker for completing a mission by alerting every guard on the base. Stealth. Yeah.

Yeah, the ranking system is a little too lenient. So what?

 

[oldboss]

On top of being boring he looks like a fucking rat. Why they went with the rat face is beyond me.

 

[Edzi]

On top of being boring he looks like a fucking rat. Why they went with the rat face is beyond me.

It's because they used Troy Baker's face.

 

[oldboss]

It's because they used Troy Baker's face.

Haha. I assume that was a jab at Baker.

I don't think so, though. His face, in profile, looks nothing like Ocelot's.

 

[Edzi]

Haha. I assume that was a jab at Baker.

I don't think so, though. His face, in profile, looks nothing like Ocelot's.

I didn't mean it as a jab at Baker (how could I, he's a good looking guy), it's just that they used most of the VA's to do the facial capture as well, so that's why the characters all look kind of like their respective VA's. Ocelot definitely looks more like Baker then any past iteration of the character.

 

[Bold One]

I played over 70 hours and still had to youtube the ending twist


that is a badly designed game structure