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Official NFL Playoffs thread - Why bother, just give the Pats the trophy edition
- Thread starter Wellington
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Big-E said:
No shit he's not running the ball to victory, now your argument is getting retarded. If you really think his stats are comparable, take away each of those guys best years and you'll see how lopsided it is.
Brady - 17715 yds - 129 TDs
Marino - 21904 yds - 156 TDs
Favre - 19769 yds - 170 TDs
Manning - 20864 yds - 152 TDs
He's 2000 yards short of the lowest yards (Favre) and 23 TDs short of the lowest TD total (Manning). Even then the guy he's closest in each beats him significantly in the other category. Favre beats him by 41 TDs and Manning has ~3000 more yards.
Done arguing with you guys, Brady is a winner, probably the greatest ever by the time all is said and done. Unless he keeps up 30+ TDs and 4000 yds for another 5-6 no way will his name come up with the all time passers though. That's probably a good thing though since these guys don't win many championships if any at all.
but yet number of super bowl rings is? Number of wins is? I mean sure passing yards isn't the end all stat, and none of us has said it was. How about seasons with a passing rating over 90? Favre has eight of those. How about years with TDs 30 or more? Eight more. Years with tards per average over 7? 8. Years with over 300 completions? Every year he's started. are any one of these stats indicative of him being one of the best out there? No, of course not.. but taken as a whole, they paint a picture of one of the best out there.J2 Cool said:
Is Brady going to get there? Maybe.... but aside from his win/loss record there is nothing indicating that it's guaranteed. That's all anyone's saying. It's real easy to get behind a Michael Vick, a Kordell Stewart, a Kurt Warner, etc as the greatest quarterback ever because they put up the numbers for a half dozen years give or take. It's another thing to see a QB go the distance. Put in 10, 12, or 15 years and have the numbers AND wins to show for it.
I stand behind what I say. It's way too early to be calling Brady one of the greats, plain and simple. Christ, the guy hasn't even finished his 7th starting year. If he keeps up this output for another 5+ years go ahead and call him one of the greats, I'll be there right with you. But on the other side of that coin we've seen QBs stay healthy and still drop or level off in productivity after 4-5 years. If he avoids that, he'll be one of the greats. If he succumbs to it, he'll still be a great QB. But at 7 years in it's WAY too early to be calling it.
Listen... I used to be a non-Brady believer myself until they were put so "gracefully" on the public stage every fucking week during MNF or FNiA... or whatever...
Basically... I've never seen ANYONE so comfortable in the pocket in my life. Watch him play. The greatest players in any sport see the game in slow motion....... you watch him fucking play the game and tell me he's not in slow-mo watching his receivers. It's remarkable how calm he is and... well... all you need to do is look at last week's stats to even further the point. Really... last week seals it for me. Ok... Jax didn't blitz... but... christ this man executes like NONE OTHER.
He's awesome. He's great. He's easily one of the best playoff quarterbacks of all time... if not ever... and time will prove this. The man eats playoff games for breakfast.
Basically... I've never seen ANYONE so comfortable in the pocket in my life. Watch him play. The greatest players in any sport see the game in slow motion....... you watch him fucking play the game and tell me he's not in slow-mo watching his receivers. It's remarkable how calm he is and... well... all you need to do is look at last week's stats to even further the point. Really... last week seals it for me. Ok... Jax didn't blitz... but... christ this man executes like NONE OTHER.
He's awesome. He's great. He's easily one of the best playoff quarterbacks of all time... if not ever... and time will prove this. The man eats playoff games for breakfast.
el Diablo said:
I don't think you understand football very much. Do you watch a lot of it? I've watched a lot of Aikman games. Tons of Montana. I even watch quite a few classic's from the 70's
Brady is in total command and his passes are many times, perfect. All I'm saying is I haven't seen a QB this good. Ever.
You can throw numbers at me all day, it won't matter
Big-E said:
No i took their 6 best years, threw out their very best and totaled it. Looking for consistancy over an extended time period not a number inflated by a huge 1 year spike. Or should i just judge a QB by his best 1 or 2 years and then talk about them as being great QBs? Cause if you do that there are alot of guys who put up some monster years over a short period of time.
What numbers should be used then? Let me guess TD's aren't important? How few INT's you throw is the most important? Completions? Incompletions? Completion %? Attempts? What? If you tell me QB rating then that shows how much of a joke this is. How else do you judge how a guy passed the football if you don't use stats? Wins certainly don't judge how a guy passed the ball, since the passing game is only part of the equation of a win.
Cooter said:
Yawn, so now i haven't seen much or know much lol. So as much football as you've seen, you've never heard an analyst refer to a QB as a pure passer? And no i won't throw numbers at you anymore, obviously you don't get it.
forgeforsaken
Member
el Diablo said:
Convenient way of doing things when Brady has only been a starter for 7 years.
Montana was better than Brady. He also played in an era where the rules were not completely written to favor the offense.
If you took that Niners team and let them play in this era that favors passing it is scary to think of what numbers they could put up. It seems every 3 or 4 years a new offensive record is set. That isn't because Randall Cunnigham is the greatest qb to ever play, but because with the new rules if you have a good offensive line and receivers it is literally impossible to defend against.
Edit: Why is that all Cowboy fans also seem to be riding Brady's jock?
If you took that Niners team and let them play in this era that favors passing it is scary to think of what numbers they could put up. It seems every 3 or 4 years a new offensive record is set. That isn't because Randall Cunnigham is the greatest qb to ever play, but because with the new rules if you have a good offensive line and receivers it is literally impossible to defend against.
Edit: Why is that all Cowboy fans also seem to be riding Brady's jock?
Wellington
BAAAALLLINNN'
Hey Bezz...Bezz said:
How does it feel? Lost to the Giants, lost to the worst QB in the league Eli Manning... must really suck.
Brady is just a flat out great QB. Since stats matter so much to some, by the end of his career he'll most likely be top 10 in every major QB passing category and that's damn good. Not to mention he'll probably add 2 or 3 more super bowl rings under his belt.
I like watching the guy play, just like I watch Peyton Manning play. Just great QB's all around. I'd consider the two some of the best of all time already. My favorite QB of all time is Dan Marino, he was my idol for a major portion of my life. I regard him as the best QB ever through tremendously high bias. But Brady, when its all said and done, will probably un-seat Marino for that spot to many people, and deservedly so.
I like watching the guy play, just like I watch Peyton Manning play. Just great QB's all around. I'd consider the two some of the best of all time already. My favorite QB of all time is Dan Marino, he was my idol for a major portion of my life. I regard him as the best QB ever through tremendously high bias. But Brady, when its all said and done, will probably un-seat Marino for that spot to many people, and deservedly so.
Wellington
BAAAALLLINNN'
Hey man Favre gifted my boy the season sack record.Artie said:
Dr. Strangelove
I'M COOCOO FOR COCO CRISP!
Just dropping in to make sure that Tom Brady is mentioned in yet another post on this page.
Tom Brady. He's great, yeah?
Tom Brady. He's great, yeah?
I agree that Joe Montana is still a better "winner" QB than Brady, but that's pretty much unfair. Brady is still really good, but I can't think of a single bad playoff game Montana ever had, while Brady has actually had a few bad playoff games. That said, Brady/Peyton are probably going to be 1a and 1b of their generation of QBs, honestly a lot like the Montana/Marino comparison, but not quite on that level.
A lot of you guys are jokes. I hate NE but Brady is top 3 in the history of the game easy. When you need him the guy is money. Manning has better stats in the regular season, but Brady's playoff stats and leadership abilities are head and shoulders above Manning, Favre, Marino, Moon, and who ever else you want to name. Shit, I would take Simms and Troy over the guys I listed and the guys people have compared Brady to.
Firex I hope someone steps up and keeps Manning from being the second greatest qb of this generation. The guy has yet to have a great playoff game and was carried to last years sb win.
Firex I hope someone steps up and keeps Manning from being the second greatest qb of this generation. The guy has yet to have a great playoff game and was carried to last years sb win.
BudokaiMR2
Member
I just heard what happened to the Cowboys.
Stupid manning family.
Stupid manning family.
Hunter D said:
Manning 27/33 457 4td 1int
Peyton Manning's Career Post-Season Stats
He had a good game against the Patriots last year, especially second half. His stats aren't that bad. He's had some really good playoff games and some bad ones. I don't think he's nearing all-time though.
Hunter D said:
Jeff Hostetler say, "Hey, remember me?"
It's hard to argue for Simms when his backup won the last five games, including the Super Bowl, of the 1990 season. Simms is a damn good quarterback, but he really shouldn't be brought up along with the great QBs of the last twenty years.
Wellington
BAAAALLLINNN'
Dammit, if only the NFC Championship game was on NBC. Could have played a drinking game... every time Madden says how good Favre is, you take a shot!
You'd be dead by halftime.
You'd be dead by halftime.
AlternativeUlster
Absolutely pathetic part deux
Apple Jax said:
You fucking nailed it dude. I was really fucking worried the first season that Brady was put to play because I was like "Drew Bledsoe has the best fucking arm in the NFL, it is fucking powerful, it is like Tecmo Super Bowl throwing it 100 yards shit" but then when he it just fucking fit. Brady was calm and precise. It was like watching a samurai version of a football player. It was fucking bizarre. When you watch a highlights reel and they had to show the 2 times that Tom Brady didn't make a completion and in a playoffs game against the Jaguars' defense, you know you are watching one of the motherfucking greatest. And those incompletes weren't even his fault, they just lost it. It is unreal.
Simms, who missed the important games of his lone Super Bowl and only played 4 full 16 game seasons is tougher than Brett Favre, who has played 16 straight full seasons (well, his first year was only 15 games).
I think that officially ends the intelligent debate.
Bart Starr's 7 NFL championships win the day.
EDIT: That should say many, not "the" in reference to the games Simms missed in 86, since he obviously played (and played excellently) in the playoffs.
Wellington
BAAAALLLINNN'
eznark said:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Super_Bowl_XXI
That record was just broken by Tom Brady on Saturday, by the way.
Just a *little* bit of fact checking goes a long way towards credibility. The second super bowl by the Giants was the one with Hostetler.
That said, I don't disagree that Favre is the toughest QB ever.
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