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[TheGreatDave]

Can anyone really think of a good reason why we haven't rebanned them except for "a lot of GAFers use them"? When was the last time they really broke a news story or did anything insightful outside of the Home info that got them blackballed?

If we don't ban them, can we at least have an official "Great Job, Kotaku!" thread now that GJK no longer updates?

Seriously, the site is beyond awful now. I have no idea why it's allowed to exist online, let alone on GAF.

 

[bernardobri]

Tim Rogers would like to dispute that claim. Kotaku does post a lot of shoddy pieces, but they've posted some nuggets every once in a while too.

You can't overlook a poor editorial by pointing out some good leftovers.

 

[J-Rzez]

Yeah, might as well tell the company who develops one of the most successful and respect franchises in this industry to get out. One in which major auto makers come to for them to make videos, aero-design, and in-car electronic data UIs. Kaz gets invited to check out prototypes of vehicles and drive them before the motoring press even. Prologue may have sold enough to fund GT5 all around, maybe even break a profit.

I agree that GT5 is taking FAR too long, but this has to be possibly one of the most retarded articles I've read in a long time. Then again, Kotaku just wants to retain their title as worst "major" gaming sites out there, feeling threatened by IGN's recent onslaught on that title.

 

[Y2Kev]

I can't help but thing PD gets unfairly maligned for its development cycle here. .

I just really fucking want to play GT5!

 

[riceandbeans]

I read that article earlier today and called bullshit on it as well. I'm really glad someone here brought it up because Kotaku has been so full of shit lately, especially after their Nintendo-Zelda release date quotation niptuck.

What Halo is to FPS's, GT is to the racing genre. Sure, 60 million may sound like a lot, but considering the amount of content and exclusivity of the series, not only is it out going to sell millions of copies as evident by GT5, it's going to sell consoles and show what the PS3 is made of. Yes, let's axe the team that makes one of our flagship titles.

One week sales could and should easily swallow up the development cost and go on to still push out an impressive profit. I think any hardcore gamer with a decent round of common sense could see that.

I'm all for the Kotaku ban. They're articles are almost always negative, full of opinions that chastise people for taking a side (what happened to unopinionated journalism? Shut the fuck up and give me the facts, not your opinion.), and the constant ripping of Sankaku Complex is getting annoying.

 

[DarkJC]

Seriously, the site is beyond awful now. I have no idea why it's allowed to exist online, let alone on GAF.

Agreed, and frankly I can't believe a lot of GAFers go there. I can't remember the last time I visited that shithole of a site, don't want to give them any traffic.

As for the argument of them being fast, who cares? Instead of rewarding the sites that take their time to fact check, edit their stories, and not spew shit, let's reward the ones that bypass everything and just post it to get it up first! Visiting them just because they're the fastest means you're part of the problem.

 

[blindrocket]

We need the Kotaku monkey picture.

 

[Micromegas]

I tried Kotaku when I became disgusted with Joystiq. Didn't last long at Kotaku.

Yes, if I ever wanted to read an exploitative blurb about some vaguely "video game" related crime, I'd go to Kotaku first.

But I don't.

 

[megalowho]

Can't blame anyone for getting sour about GT5's perpetual upcoming release at this point. You can't just lovingly tweak and tinker forever in this industry - at some point you have to stick to a schedule and ship a product. Polyphony has a good situation going and I can't help but feel they've taken advantage of that, possibly to the detriment of Sony's overall plans for the PS3 and certainly to all the fans that are now waiting on 4+ years to play this thing for real.

So I get that sentiment. But yeah, cutting Polyphony lose? Play hardball? Get the fuck outta here. They make Gran Turismo, for fuck's sakes. As much as the delays hurt, and there may be a story in there somewhere, GT5 is as close as it gets to a guaranteed AAA hit no matter when it lands. They've done it before, they'll do it again. It just may take way, way longer than anyone wants it to.

 

[DCharlie]

GT5 is as close as it gets to a guaranteed AAA hit no matter when it lands

unless they brainfart and produce a GT PSP style barflette - which i can't see.

GT5 has to be an exercise in bad planning. Scope creep is one thing but scope creep after 4+ years? Managerial failure.

 

[Replicant]

As for the argument of them being fast, who cares?

Oh, they're fast okay. Fast when it comes to copying info from GAF into their site.

 

[chubigans]

Oh, they're fast okay. Fast when it comes to copying info from GAF into their site.

Bwahaha :lol

 

[Scythesurge]

Oh, they're fast okay. Fast when it comes to copying info from GAF into their site.

But doesn't everyone do that? Though they may be the fastest.

 

[wackojackosnose]

I'd normally expect a company to be more discreet if they're gonna rip off other sites or forums.

http://kotaku.com/5449844/a-first-look-at-nba-jam-for-the-wii

Here, they (1) photocopy an image of a new magazine exclusive (or even worse, right click save image as) and (2) sourced details from GAF.

Not very impressive for journalism or blogging.

 

[faceless007]

Not really, that'll only mean stuff that was supposed to be in the game wouldn't make it. Leave the guy and his team alone and the game will eventually get complete. Hell they let Ueda do whatever he wants and his games aren't anywhere near as popular as GT.

Your avatar, it mesmerizes me.

 

[Terrordactyl]

Plunkett took the entirely wrong angle with the article, but I'd definitely agree Polyphony need to be kept on a tighter leash after this constant delaying of GT5. I'm sure it will sell well, but as I said, from a business standpoint it could have already sold well and they'd be developing GT6 by now.

Why? What do you care it doesn't hurt your pocket, and we are just getting a more polished game out of it, I'll gladly wait another few months because I know for fact the game will be better as a result

 

[Son of Godzilla]

I can't read posts about people calling GT a flagship when it's launching 4 years afterwards without dying from irony.

 

[Clear]

Great OP by Chubigans, kudos for such a clinical dissection of an ill thought out opinion piece.

The main thing for me is that PD are using the extra time to add additional features/content to the game. They aren't sitting on the title, they are trying to make it better.

How is this a bad thing?

I mean consider the alternative: Release early then spend the next months/year(s) iteratively patching in stuff, possibly at a premium to the user. Is that really preferable?

 

[Wellscha]

Well, they rushed out GT2 out of the door and we all know how that turned out. Some developers just need more time than others. Problem is that these same developers like to announce stuff way before it's ready to be announced.

Exactly!

 

[watership]

Kotaku hasnt published a good article on 5 years, time to cut them off?

Stephen Totilo writes for Kotaku. He's a one of the best game journalists around.

 

[ChackanKun]

So...making the definitive racing car game is a bad thing?

Yes, I hate delays, but the fact that those exist so that the game comes out with the largest number of features possible, greatly tweaked and with minor bugs (hypothetically), by all means let there be delays.

 

[Teddman]

It's 2010 and this game has been delayed again. I think you should let Kotaku have this one.

QFT

At this point, any article that puts pressure on Polyphony and draws attention to the effect their delays have had on the PS3's success is fair game.

 

[Busty]

They should try to stop cancelling all of their projects. They must have lost quite a lot money on Eight Days, The Getaway, The Protector, The Fixer, and so on.

.. by 'The Protector' are you referring to the internal name for Sony Liverpool's 'action' project? If so.

?

 

[Relaxed Muscle]

QFT

At this point, any article that puts pressure on Polyphony and draws attention to the effect their delays have had on the PS3's success is fair game.

Yeah, I'm sure Kaz and his team is already feeling the pressure of some unknow self nominated "Game journalist" and his unfounded claims based on wrong facts.

 

[gofreak]

QFT

At this point, any article that puts pressure on Polyphony and draws attention to the effect their delays have had on the PS3's success is fair game.

I think a delay to Q3/Q4 actually is better for 'PS3's success'.

Q1/Q2 is already jam packed. Q3/Q4 is by far the busier shopping period of the year.

If I were Sony I'd be putting out GT5 in Sept/Oct. That's when people start going out en masse to buy hardware, when you want to have your shiny new big guns to help people choose your system. And that's when I'd want my biggest franchise (at least in Europe) riding high at retail and in market consciousness. Put it out in March...yeah, the software will do big numbers, but the 'normal' pool of hardware buyers is much lower. By the time you get to the holiday it'll be an 'old' game.

That's my opinion anyway...GT5 and the holidays will make for a more impactful sales result overall than, say, The Last Guardian and the holidays. If there was a drought in the first half of the year I might think otherwise, but there's really not, there's probably too high a concentration of games going on there vs the back-end of the year (at least as it appears right now).

As for the article...boring click-bait.

 

[pseudocaesar]

But hasn't it only had one delay? Officially speaking of course. We never had a release date, just Japan. Its pretty clear they dont need it for Financial Year 09 targets, so they might as well push it to 10/11 to enlarge those balance sheets.

 

[NemesisPrime]

I think a delay to Q3/Q4 actually is better for 'PS3's success'.

Q1/Q2 is already jam packed. Q3/Q4 is by far the busier shopping period of the year.

If I were Sony I'd be putting out GT5 in Sept/Oct. That's when people start going out en masse to buy hardware,

I think the era were driving games sell hardware are over TBH. FPSes now seem to be the King of the Hill for that*



*Wii doesn't count

 

[Jonnyram]

Neither is Totilo, really. His stuff seems like a concerted effort towards 'new games journalism' which seems to just mean being twee. Leigh Alexander is slightly like that too.

Yeah, maybe all games journalists should write about how fantastically awesome every fucking game is. How every single vehicle in Gran Turismo was painstakingly recreated by a team of 1000 studs over the space of months. I wish games journalists would fellate the developers some more, because the assclowns on games forums clearly don't do it enough. How many of your 500+ threads rate above "twee", dearest obonicus? Do you even care if people hold you in the same regard as you hold others?

 

[linsivvi]

Exactly!

Not really. It's Sony who announced the game, not the developer. And do you think they have a choice? Sony not saying a new GT is being in development during console launch would be like Nintendo saying they are not developing a new Mario or Zelda.

 

[Eccocid]

If i was Sony i would really give a GTFO to Kotaku this time. As long as company can support GT5 development why whine about the delays like that!!
Kotaku is acting up like a spoiled brat

 

[ConradCervantes]

"HAI GUYZ PD IZ SLOW MAKING CAR GAME. GIVE EM BANHAMMER SONY LULZ"

 

[RavenFox]

easy answer:

Upon release of GT5, tell PD to GTFO

Then Stringer should kick Kaz to the curb and hire Luke Plunkett to run SCE because in his years as a 2-bit blogger for the worst gaming blog on the interwebs, that gives him the experience necessary to run SCE, as this fine article shows.

Luke/Kotaku, do us a favor and leave this ridiculous speculative assanine hypothosysing for GAF (because we do it better) and go back to your factually inaccurate click-getting poorly written ramblings that you call articles (because you do that better)

lol great post

 

[LALILULELO]

Thank you Kotaku! my life is enriched again!

 

[Eccocid]

lol Can we start a small website like kotaku where we rant about games. Oh and comments secitons should be all from Gaf too. everything should be a mock up and a perfect presentation of todays game journalism. Like we can make articles about Blah blah game on 3d on every 10 minutes!

 

[obonicus]

Yeah, maybe all games journalists should write about how fantastically awesome every fucking game is.

A bit more directness and padding out of articles would be good. But hey, they can write about how games suck, too. I don't see enough of that, to be honest. Are you a big fan of new games journalism? Kieron Gillen, is that you?

I wish games journalists would fellate the developers some more, because the assclowns on games forums clearly don't do it enough.

Forum-goers being morons excuses bad writers? How does that work?

How many of your 500+ threads rate above "twee", dearest obonicus?

Are you a joke character? Are you completely lacking perspective? Who the fuck cares about me? I'm just a poster, I don't do this for a living, I don't have (and don't want) forum fantards going 'well, obonicus is slightly less terrible than everyone else, I think he's great'.

Do you even care if people hold you in the same regard as you hold others?

I don't know if I understand. Is this because Totilo posts here so I shouldn't express my opinions on his writing? Or I shouldn't have opinions on games writers? Does this apply to videogames too?

 

[mbmonk]

What is so funny is this article is just like a forum post. It's lazy, no fact checking, and shooting from the hip. Maybe I should write for Kotaku because that is right up my alley :lol

I wish games journalists would fellate the developers some more, because the assclowns on games forums clearly don't do it enough.

When a big title gets released reviewers try to one up each other at fellating the game and the developer.

Reviewer 1: "Best single player ever"
Reviewer 2: "Bestest game ever and GOTY lock"
Reviewer 3: "Bestest game ever, GOTY Lock, and system seller orgy all in a $60 bundle!!"
IGN: "Prepare to have your mind BLOWN!"


The amount of hyperbole in reviews and podcast is almost sickening at time

 

[Jonnyram]

I don't know if I understand. Is this because Totilo posts here so I shouldn't express my opinions on his writing? Or I shouldn't have opinions on games writers? Does this apply to videogames too?

I'm not a fan of the 'new games journalism' moniker, to be frank, but what it boils down to is this -- whether you agree with their opinion or not, these journalists are actually pretty good at writing, and engaging the reader. But when their opinion does not agree with yours, it is disgustingly easy to sling a ten word dismissive onto a forum, and it's quite defaming to the industry in general. If you don't want people to write about videogames anymore, you're going the right way about it, believe me.

 

[mbmonk]

I'm not a fan of the 'new games journalism' moniker, to be frank, but what it boils down to is this -- whether you agree with their opinion or not, these journalists are actually pretty good at writing, and engaging the reader. But when their opinion does not agree with yours, it is disgustingly easy to sling a ten word dismissive onto a forum, and it's quite defaming to the industry in general. If you don't want people to write about videogames anymore, you're going the right way about it, believe me.

I do take your larger point, but confronting the author of the article about if it's content is correct or even challenging the premise is completely fair and I would say healthy for writing and the industry.

The article has some glaring omissions, so I don't want people to write about videogames anymore in that manner. I want articles that are factually correct and well thought out. Not a half ass forum post that they got up ASAP w/o research, fact checking, or looking at the entire picture. If THAT is video games writing.. then it can go away, quickly.

But I am in general against the get it up as fast as possible news business model. But I am a dreamer and not a business man. It's obvious that the masses prefer the fast as possible model.

 

[jcm]

For all the Kotaku bashing here, aren't they really the best of a bad lot? I need a video game blog for my RSS reader that I can bang through to get the news. Seems like Kotaku and Joystiq are the only ones that really fit the bill. Am I missing a great comprehensive video game blog? I guess there's Wired, but they seem really Nintendo-centric, which doesn't work for me. Is there anyone else?

Kotaku writes some really dumb stuff, but it costs me about 3 seconds and a press of the N key to realize it's stupid and move on. And Crecente and Totilo do a pretty good job, I think.

 

[KittyKittyBangBang]

For all the Kotaku bashing here, aren't they really the best of a bad lot? I need a video game blog for my RSS reader that I can bang through to get the news. Seems like Kotaku and Joystiq are the only ones that really fit the bill. Am I missing a great comprehensive video game blog? I guess there's Wired, but they seem really Nintendo-centric, which doesn't work for me. Is there anyone else?

Kotaku writes some really dumb stuff, but it costs me about 3 seconds and a press of the N key to realize it's stupid and move on. And Crecente and Totilo do a pretty good job, I think.

I would not call them the best, all gaming blogs have a case of the "post first, research second" but I honestly think another still banned blog does a bit better follow-up than Kotaku. Kotaku is the worst of the bunch IMO

 

[KittyKittyBangBang]

For all the Kotaku bashing here, aren't they really the best of a bad lot? I need a video game blog for my RSS reader that I can bang through to get the news. Seems like Kotaku and Joystiq are the only ones that really fit the bill. Am I missing a great comprehensive video game blog? I guess there's Wired, but they seem really Nintendo-centric, which doesn't work for me. Is there anyone else?

Kotaku writes some really dumb stuff, but it costs me about 3 seconds and a press of the N key to realize it's stupid and move on. And Crecente and Totilo do a pretty good job, I think.

This is the one I was referring to in my above post, but Im pretty sure they are still banned

 

[KernelPanic]

As frustrating as GT5 delays are I'd rather Kaz make the best GT he possibly can.

I'd hate to see GT rushed to meet some internal Sony and gamers everywhere lamenting on what GT5 could've/should've been, if they only gave it more time.

All signs so far point to "It'll be worth the wait".

 

[SolidSnakex]

I think the era were driving games sell hardware are over TBH. FPSes now seem to be the King of the Hill for that*



*Wii doesn't count

What is this really based on though? Before this gen the only racing games that had the possibility of moving hardware were Gran Turismo, Mario Kart and Need for Speed. And that's still the case.

 

[tzare]

i think there are more games that take 'forever' to be released. Alan Wake for example.

As much as i wanna play both GT5 and AW, when it's done, it's done. because if it is released before quality is compromised. Oh, 'journalism' is so lame these days.

 

[obonicus]

I'm not a fan of the 'new games journalism' moniker, to be frank, but what it boils down to is this -- whether you agree with their opinion or not, these journalists are actually pretty good at writing, and engaging the reader. But when their opinion does not agree with yours, it is disgustingly easy to sling a ten word dismissive onto a forum, and it's quite defaming to the industry in general. If you don't want people to write about videogames anymore, you're going the right way about it, believe me.

But I disagree. I don't think Totilo is good at it. It's not about his opinions. Totilo's often uninformed, but his opinions are among the least offensive anywhere. I just think his stuff is usually too bland in content and too precious in presentation. But for instance, I think Tom Chick is a much better games writer, even if I happen to disagree with 99% of what he has to say. He's plays a lot of games and can contextualize them, something I usually don't see coming from Totilo.

Though, defaming to the industry in general? It's my opinion that they're bad. If the response to my opinion is to collapse and cease existing, so be it. Kotaku in particular seems to thrive on fostering negativity, when it's not acting as a PR outlet for publishers. I don't think I'd shed a tear for them.

 

[LosDaddie]

Can anyone really think of a good reason why we haven't rebanned them except for "a lot of GAFers use them"? When was the last time they really broke a news story or did anything insightful outside of the Home info that got them blackballed?

If we don't ban them, can we at least have an official "Great Job, Kotaku!" thread now that GJK no longer updates?

I haven't read a good argument yet why Kotaku should be re-banned on GAF. So what if KOtaku runs a not-so-cheery article on GT5? I bet you missed the Uncharted2 GotY wanking Kotaku did the same day.

We, as gamers, aren't going to agree with everything Kotaku does. I find some of their Features to be good reads. Their podcast is among the best (Bombcast, 4Guys1Up) in the industry. And I love how Kotaku does their game reviews.

If there is a better, more comprehensive gaming blog out there, I'd love to know what it is.

 

[Son of Godzilla]

What is this really based on though? Before this gen the only racing games that had the possibility of moving hardware were Gran Turismo, Mario Kart and Need for Speed. And that's still the case.

Wipeout, PGR, Daytona, Waverace, Moto GP, F-Zero, Jet Moto, Motorstorm... It's fairly common for racing games to be positioned as marquee titles. And still is. And always will be.

 

[SolidSnakex]

Wipeout, PGR, Daytona, Waverace, Moto GP, F-Zero, Jet Moto, Motorstorm... It's fairly common for racing games to be positioned as marquee titles. And still is. And always will be.

You can't just list random racing games as if they were system sellers.

 

[WanderingWind]

I haven't read a good argument yet why Kotaku should be re-banned on GAF. So what if KOtaku runs a not-so-cheery article on GT5? I bet you missed the Uncharted2 GotY wanking Kotaku did the same day.

We, as gamers, aren't going to agree with everything Kotaku does. I find some of their Features to be good reads. Their podcast is among the best (Bombcast, 4Guys1Up) in the industry. And I love how Kotaku does their game reviews.

If there is a better, more comprehensive gaming blog out there, I'd love to know what it is.

Yeah, I'm with you. Too much "I don't like their opinion, so let's BAN them," going on here. It's actually kind of depressing.

I mean, I think Sony would be stupid to do what the article suggested, but if I didn't revisit a site every time they posted something I didn't agree with, I'd have to start going outside

And I'll be damned to let that happen.

 

[johnnylineup]

I figured/was hoping this article was what the thread title was about. Unfortunately, kotaku is about the only games blog not blocked by work, so I still read it all the time.