The quicker Alberta diversifies their economy, the better.
They are slowly getting there...
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OPEC to America: Please don't pump so much oil!
- Thread starter wildfire
- Start date
The quicker Alberta diversifies their economy, the better.
They are slowly getting there...
poppabk
Cheeks Spread for Digital Only Future
Rising gas prices may have helped precipitate the collapse, but it was always coming. The wave of foreclosures happened because people were given loans they could never hope to repay, poorly regulated ARM's they didn't fully understand, based on unverified information, with payments in the first couple of years that were affordable after which they rose rapidly. Then those loans were packaged and sold as great investments with the rotten core hidden.
Zeus Molecules
illegal immigrants are stealing our air
Fuck you OPEC though I am sure if they give Trump a few patents, licenses, and copyrights he'll get right on that.
Nope. Get fucked. Every barrel you stop producing to control and speculate prices means one extra barrel Canada and US and Russia produces.
Saudi Arabia deserves jackshit. As does Kuwait. As does every other member of OPEC. Flood the market with oil, let Tesla dominate with the model 3 etc. Do you know how many people in Alberta struggling because of OPEC. How people struggled in the 70's with their boycotts etc.
Saudi Arabia deserves jackshit. As does Kuwait. As does every other member of OPEC. Flood the market with oil, let Tesla dominate with the model 3 etc. Do you know how many people in Alberta struggling because of OPEC. How people struggled in the 70's with their boycotts etc.
Ether_Snake
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Oil prices most definitively contributed, but it wasn't the cause. It's also why the idea of peak oil astronomic prices was always laughable as long as oil is in such high demand; high oil prices will always crash the economy if it's in high demand.
So they will magically diversify their economies, as much or more than countries that aren't major oil exporters? How exactly? Unless they once again use a resource particular to their respective countries, they won't be advantaged compared to other countries doing the same, some of which have natural sources of renewable energy which they don't have. They have to be able to replace oil with something else, and those that won't will see a massive exodus of the educated, and the country's GDP to go down significantly until they become irrelevant. I don't see anything they could replace oil with to be able to generate even a single-digit fraction of what they used to export.
With no exports, you have to put in place some sort of Juche system, and without free energy that is unlikely to work.
So they will magically diversify their economies, as much or more than countries that aren't major oil exporters? How exactly? Unless they once again use a resource particular to their respective countries, they won't be advantaged compared to other countries doing the same, some of which have natural sources of renewable energy which they don't have. They have to be able to replace oil with something else, and those that won't will see a massive exodus of the educated, and the country's GDP to go down significantly until they become irrelevant. I don't see anything they could replace oil with to be able to generate even a single-digit fraction of what they used to export.
With no exports, you have to put in place some sort of Juche system, and without free energy that is unlikely to work.
Eeeeh.
Oil spiked hard two times: in 73, and 2007.
Correlation is damn strong.
Oil prices provided the shock. The economy was a house of cards, and folded down due to that shock - but the original shock came from oil prices.
Nostremitus
Member
This is worth a read. Especially telling is when you look at the areas hardest hit by the housing market collapse. They were the areas outside city centers that had the most commuters.
http://freakonomics.com/2012/03/08/how-high-gas-prices-triggered-the-housing-crisis/
About the author
https://econ.duke.edu/people/steven-e-sexton
gutter_trash
Banned
I agree, fuck OPEC and fuck the Sauds
CadetMahoney
Member
perfectchaos007
Member
Based on their member countries, Trump is more likely to tell US oil rigs to drill 10 feet deeper!!
Who exactly is "the rest of the world"? Every country on earth relies on oil to some degree.
I don't believe the evidence is that great for oil price fixing leading to the financial collapse, but let's not pretend that G-S repeal was the reason for the financial collapse. Any finance class in college is grossly oversimplifying the situation if it implies that G-S was the reason for the collapse. Among economists, there is no singular reason for the 2008
financial crisis, and the effect of the repeal of Glass-Steagall is still heavily debated to this day. At best, it is a gross oversimplification on the issue.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glass–Steagall:_aftermath_of_repeal
You do know city centers also have high percentages of commuters right? The reason the places you are talking about was hit hard was because of how less diverse their economy is compared to cities. Rural living is still in decline even now because they have not/can not adapt to changes in technology and industry.
It didn't trigger it, it likely just put salt in the wound and made it worse.
Not saying what you are saying is incorrect, I will add though, that the world's economy is largely in sync. A financial power of U.S, Europe, or China would no doubt send ripples to other countries if it bad enough. U.S's economic collapse is partly the reason why the rest went was hit too.
Sorry to all the law-abiding oil producing nations (e.g. Colombia, Canada, Brazil, Mexico etc) but it's worth some degree of collateral damage if it curtails the absolute shower of shit that comes down on Russia, Iran and Saudi Arabia - as well as Venezuela.
In the latter case I feel awful because the people have done nothing wrong and are suffering through a great crisis, but the way to end those dictatorships is to starve them of their cash.
All oil producing economies are eventually going to have to figure it out anyway as we move towards renewable/gas, so perhaps it's a blessing in some ways.
In the latter case I feel awful because the people have done nothing wrong and are suffering through a great crisis, but the way to end those dictatorships is to starve them of their cash.
All oil producing economies are eventually going to have to figure it out anyway as we move towards renewable/gas, so perhaps it's a blessing in some ways.
I love the people of Russia, Iran, SA and Venezuela, stay strong guys.
Infinite Stars
Member
I'm not saying it was good that Alberta was entity focused around the oil fields, just that OPEC acted like a jackass then and is getting their just desserts.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Resource_curse
The only difference between the OPEC countries and US states like West Virginia is that the US economy is broad enough to be able to prop WV up when the Curse comes calling. Single resource based economies like the OPEC countries are always prone to crazy boom and bust cycles due to their overwhelming reliance on said resource, and their own shortsighted blindness that it will always be there to prop them up.
The only difference between the OPEC countries and US states like West Virginia is that the US economy is broad enough to be able to prop WV up when the Curse comes calling. Single resource based economies like the OPEC countries are always prone to crazy boom and bust cycles due to their overwhelming reliance on said resource, and their own shortsighted blindness that it will always be there to prop them up.
Spuck-uk
Banned
They'll still be absolutely nothing without oil money.
Spuck-uk
Banned
Soooo, same as America then.
Also, freedom of movement lets people escape WV to better lands.
That is very true, but their economy is completely different today. I don't see it as argument.
Surely, none of the poverty could be attributed to kicking out multinational companies, giving free oil to Cuba (to resell)and printing money until it's worth less than toilet paper.
MistakenMobius
Member
This is Venezuela...
Baron Doggystyle von Woof
Member
"Balance the markt"
Get the fuck outta here OPEC.
Get the fuck outta here OPEC.
poppabk
Cheeks Spread for Digital Only Future
The fact that he includes the UK and Ireland in the countries heavily hit shows that attributing this to gas prices is kinda flawed. The UK does not have the same long commuter distances that the US has, and gas is heavily taxed and so gas prices increased by 20 - 30%, not the 60% seen in the US.
There were a lot of factors involved in the colapse, but to argue that the underlying cause was high gas prices and not predatory lending and deception and excessive risk in the investment community is ridiculous.
You can dislike OPEC and GCC. But at least have a bit knowledge. This is exactly what they are doing and have been doing for quite a while. Have you been in the GCC region?
DeviantBoi
Member
Not Venezuela.
That money went to Chavez and to help set up wannabe dictators in other Latin American countries.
Venezuela may be hurting right now, but once they get rid of Maduro and set up someone with some actual knowledge of how to run a country, they can move to improve things.
If the prices of oil hadn't collapsed, Maduro would just continue what Chavez was doing.
I was diggging your arguement until you said the oil prices spiking in 2003 eventually led to the crisis. You hurt your own credibility because you showed a fundamental lack of understanding of what it means to lend out to people who ccan't afford to pay.
Financial institutions have a good way of measuring the creditworthiness of people over time. The loans given were drastically skewed to become higher risk than they should've been in the first place. They were giving out loans with full knowledge that it wasn't realistic that these people could support these loans in the first place. It doesn't matter what forced the people using these to loans to choose between surviving with food on their table or paying off their bullshit loan. Their bullshit loan was designed with a high chance of failure in the first place.
poppabk
Cheeks Spread for Digital Only Future
In a way it is likely that OPEC saved the world economy, as had these practices been allowed to continue without a correction it is likely that we could have dug ourselves into a hole so big that it would have taken a lot more with it when it burst. It's also interesting to note that there wasn't some precipitous drop in oil production by OPEC nations that caused a massive spike in gas prices, again it was likely speculation in the financial markets coupled with increased demand.
