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[TJP]

Reiza batting around some ideas for the future of GSC and beyond

11-9 in favour of charging for the next big update. Given the free support from Reiza up to now, Reiza are more than deserving of a few dollars for the next car and track additions. I'd hapily join the Reiza 'associates club' too.

I wonder if being rFactor based is holding Reiza back from making paid additions given how apparently easy it is to rip and convert rFactor based content.

 

[TJP]

RFactor 2:

New UI backgrounds available: http://isiforums.net/f/showthread.php/23797-UI-backgrounds

There is one available on RD too: http://www.racedepartment.com/downloads/racedepartment-user-interface.5301/ This one is a bikini model for those who care...

 

[TechnicMOC]

Inproved to 1:16.846

Will have to watch some of the videos, I'm learning to hit the apexs later but getting a line through the dip never feels right.

 

[Big Takeover]

11-9 in favour of charging for the next big update. Given the free support from Reiza up to now, Reiza are more than deserving of a few dollars for the next car and track additions. I'd hapily join the Reiza 'associates club' too.

I wonder if being rFactor based is holding Reiza back from making paid additions given how apparently easy it is to rip and convert rFactor based content.

As long as the grand plan is a modern, sustainable sim, I'm down for whatever they want. The problem is what they really need (a licensable modern engine, with paid DLC hooks, preferably on Steam) doesn't exist.

They're at a crossroad with no obvious direction to go. It's tough. I don't envy them.



Stock Car Extreme, Metalmoro MR18 @ Johannesburg Historic

1. 1:13.619 - Betta Lines (video)
2. 1:13.906 - Tchetil (video)
3. 1.14.076 - marvelharvey (pic)
4. 1:14.093 - Big Takeover (video)
5. 1:14.398 - Arucardo (video)
6. 1:14.413 - Seanspeed (pic)
7. 1:15.487 - Dave_6
8. 1:16.191 - IceCreamKimi (pic)
9.. 1:16.228 - Atrophis (pic)
10. 1:16.846 - TechnicMOC (pic)
11. 1:18.207 - Megasoum (pic)

 

[TJP]

As long as the grand plan is a modern, sustainable sim, I'm down for whatever they want. The problem is what they really need (a licensable modern engine, with paid DLC hooks, preferably on Steam) doesn't exist.

They're at a crossroad with no obvious direction to go. It's tough. I don't envy them.

I agree.

With ISI keeping rFactor 2 for themeselves to this point in time, Reiza are almost stuck using isimotor 2. As awesome as it would be, I can't see Reiza making paid for content for rF2 or, and this is pie in the sky time, Assetto Corsa. I'd love to see Reiza copy what Sector 3 (and one other dev) have done and use the physics from isimotor 2 and their own bespoke graphics engine. Unlike Sector 3, I'd like Reiza to make it a DX 11 (with a transition to DX 12) and 64-bit program. Sector 3 have screwed up with RRE being DX 9 because there is very limited native oculus rift support and they were banking on OR being a part of RRE.

PC sim racing thread readers - if you had to suggest a sim for a person transitioning from using a console & gamepad to using a PC with a wheel and pedals, which PC sim available right now would you choose? They are after a 'hardcore experience' (his words, not mine). I'm thinking rFactor 2 because it has day-night and changable weather (he'd prefer to have both) plus great FFB and very solid physics. The downsides are small car roster, mod installation and graphics.

 

[Betta Lines]

If the priority is a 'hardcore experience', then I'd suggest rF2 as well. I'd also suggest a free trial of iRacing.

 

[Big Takeover]

Personally, I think AC is exactly what someone transitioning from a console wants (despite what they may tell you). There are trucks loads of those people everywhere you look, and they all seem to love it.

If you think this person truly wants to cut to the chase, then rF2 is the creme de la creme in several important areas. iRacing is a great suggestion too. Talk about massively past what consoles offer...

 

[Jilt]

Personally, I think AC is exactly what someone transitioning from a console wants (despite what they may tell you). There are trucks loads of those people everywhere you look, and they all seem to love it.

If you think this person truly wants to cut to the chase, then rF2 is the creme de la creme in several important areas. iRacing is a great suggestion too. Talk about massively past what consoles offer...

I agree! I am (or used to be) a consoler. It is easy to use and hold a lot of snackable content. Go to iRacing or rFactor and you need to invest time to get great pleasure. Something you get without much time in AC and R3E.
For me time is an issue, with kids and wife and busy life, so AC and R3E it is.

Hardcore experience is iRacing and rFactor, though, but as I said, very time consuming.

 

[IceCreamKimi]

I've been playing around with the rFactor2 demo and I must say I'm seriously impressed.

I am very close to purchasing it however I have a couple of questions about the game.

1) In the past I have read how it's a nightmare to setup. Is this still the case with the latest builds?

From what I can see I need to download rFactor 2 Content Installer, then pick and choose what cars and tracks I want to add from the cars and tracks add on pages. Is that all there is to it? From the demo I have the controls dialed in pretty well so I'm comfortable there.

2) Does anyone know if this game will be coming to Steam in the near future? If so, I might wait for that, otherwise I'll just purchase it from their website.

 

[mrsmr2]

rFactor 2 bounce bug - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=isWQZTd2Yxo

More here: http://isiforums.net/f/showthread.php/23749-AI-cars-bouncing-after-930b

I was just as impressed with how good rF2 looked as I was unimpressed by the bounce bug.

rF2 has gone back to the top of my list now, relegating AC to 2nd. The latest build (and the new Skippy) drives wonderfully while the latest AC version doesn't run as smooth as it did.

AC seems locked at 58.3 fps instead of the normal 59.9999. Not saying I can tell the difference of that 1.5 fps but there is something not quite right. That lack of smoothness highlights the relative lack of feel and involvement compared to rF2 so rF2 is back in favour.

EDIT: just read the ISI thread and the new Megane (not yet released) doesn't have the same bounce behaviour.

 

[Betta Lines]

AC seems locked at 58.3 fps instead of the normal 59.9999. Not saying I can tell the difference of that 1.5 fps but there is something not quite right. That lack of smoothness highlights the relative lack of feel and involvement compared to rF2 so rF2 is back in favour.

Are you talking about v-sync? AC has a frame limiter.

 

[mrsmr2]

Yup, v-synch.

I get tearing using the limiter (have tried 59, 60, 61 fps).

 

[Betta Lines]

Yup, v-synch.

I get tearing using the limiter (have tried 59, 60, 61 fps).

I'm confused that you're talking about 'feel' and 'involvement' but using v-sync. Tearing is unavoidable unless you're using a variable-refresh display (G-Sync/FreeSync), but completely worth it for a better connection with the car.

 

[marvelharvey]

Have you tried limiting it in Nvidia Inspector* and not AC?


*or AMD equivalent.

 

[mrsmr2]

v-sync dulls the feel, I agree and running without v-sync is generally better. IMHO, it doesn't make that much of a difference with AC because AC simply doesn't have the natural plugged into the Matrix feel and response that rF2 has, for example.

With regard to tearing I don't get anywhere near the same levels when I ran rF2 without v-sync or GSC2012 which I've never run with v-sync. AC is particularly bad compared to those two.

I'll have another play with AC without (like I did for the first 6 months of owning it) to see if things have improved.

 

[mrsmr2]

Have you tried limiting it in Nvidia Inspector* and not AC?


*or AMD equivalent.

I haven't but I think I can if I use Riva, as I'm AMD.

 

[Betta Lines]

v-sync dulls the feel, I agree and running without v-sync is generally better. IMHO, it doesn't make that much of a difference with AC because AC simply doesn't have the natural plugged into the Matrix feel and response that rF2 has, for example.

With regard to tearing I don't get anywhere near the same levels when I ran rF2 without v-sync or GSC2012 which I've never run with v-sync. AC is particularly bad compared to those two.

I'll have another play with AC without (like I did for the first 6 months of owning it) to see if things have improved.

Well I can't explain rF2, as I get similar performance in that as I do in AC, but in the case of GSC, if you're running without v-sync the framerate is probably very high, perhaps well into the hundreds, which may make tearing less noticeable.

As for lacking the connected feel in AC regardless of v-sync, try changing the graphics.ini file (steamapps\common\assettocorsa\system\cfg), and change MAXIMUM_FRAME_LATENCY to 1. I also found AC to have significant input lag until I changed this.

 

[Big Takeover]

I couldn't muster another session of MR18@Johannesburg. I needed to move on.

While not officially started, I'm thinking rFactor 2, Spark F2 #22 @ Mills Metro, inner loop C.

Take some laps, see if you approve, get yourself the Delta Best plugin installed if you don't have it.

I am open to other ideas for track/car combos. I've chosen an oldie but goodie, maybe there's something newer we could focus on however. Skippy? rF2 has the best historic content, so I'd like to take advantage of it. I'm open though.

Whatever it'll be, it'll start tomorrow. GSC won't ever close though, so post laps if you've got 'em.

 

[mrsmr2]

As for lacking the connected feel in AC regardless of v-sync, try changing the graphics.ini file (steamapps\common\assettocorsa\system\cfg), and change MAXIMUM_FRAME_LATENCY to 1. I also found AC to have significant input lag until I changed this.

Thanks, frame latency is something I check every time there is a new build, just in case it goes back to default.

 

[Atrophis]

My terribly shoddy attempt at the hotlap.

 

[TechnicMOC]

My terribly shoddy attempt at the hotlap.

The drivers here are fast, how they find seconds seems magically to me

I watched some the videos to see where I'm lossing time and they are shifting into 5th on the ext of turn 1 well before the end of sector; giving them amazing speed up the hill.
I've just tried with traction and stabiliy control to off and my first sector is alot faster.. completing the rest while staying on road is tricky tho! I've hung together a lap that involved getting slideways, hitting a barrier; speed at the apexs was down and it was still 1:16.8xx.
Not sure if it's just this car but one of those settting is really limiting how fast it accelerates.

 

[Arucardo]

I couldn't muster another session of MR18@Johannesburg. I needed to move on.

While not officially started, I'm thinking rFactor 2, Spark F2 #22 @ Mills Metro, inner loop C.

Take some laps, see if you approve, get yourself the Delta Best plugin installed if you don't have it.

I am open to other ideas for track/car combos. I've chosen an oldie but goodie, maybe there's something newer we could focus on however. Skippy? rF2 has the best historic content, so I'd like to take advance of it. I'm open though.

Whatever it'll be, it'll start tomorrow. GSC won't ever close though, so post laps if you've got 'em.

Oh yes, I've been looking for a reason to give rf2 a go , not sure if I've even tried it with my current wheel.

 

[Megasoum]

Heh, I thought I was slow in the GSCE Proto... I just tried the Spark F2... Yikes... Will take a lots of laps to get fast there... I did a 1:21 something but I felt really really slow around the track.

Anyway I need to fix my graphical issues before I can attack the trial more seriously. My game looks bad and there's a TON of pop-in for both building around the tracks and shadows. It's really annoying.

I'll wait for you guys to post videos lol

 

[Big Takeover]

Heh, I thought I was slow in the GSCE Proto... I just tried the Spark F2... Yikes... Will take a lots of laps to get fast there... I did a 1:21 something but I felt really really slow around the track.

Anyway I need to fix my graphical issues before I can attack the trial more seriously. My game looks bad and there's a TON of pop-in for both building around the tracks and shadows. It's really annoying.

I'll wait for you guys to post videos lol

I used this graphics guide a while back. The later posts say it's mostly still relevant. Give it a go.

It's a busy lap with many driftos I think a :21 will be pretty competitive.

 

[Megasoum]

Is there a way to scale the UI? I feel like everything is so frikin big.


That's it for me tonight... Still a TON to improve but that's a start.

 

[IceCreamKimi]

Well I took the plunge and finally purchased rFactor2.

Are there any essential mods that I should look into while it downloads?

Also, apart from the tracks and cars on the rFactor download pages are there other sites that have high quality content?

Sorry about the questions but I'm new to the game.

 

[marvelharvey]

Recommended Cars:

Celica GTO
ASR Formulas Full season of F1 92, two from 91 and one from 93, 94 and 95.
Endurance Racing X (paid mod, but worth it)
GP79 (rough around the edges, but good fun)
Apex GT3
Lola 280
Miata/MX5, three versions: Standard Spec, Super Charged Lv1, Super Charged Lvl2

Recommended Tracks:

Mid Ohio
Ponzan
Croft
Lester
Longford
Nordschieife
Le Mans
Thruxton (still work in progress)
Essington
Brands Hatch (not really up to the quality of the other mods, but it's too much fun to leave out)

 

[IceCreamKimi]

Recommended Cars:

Celica GTO
ASR Formulas Full season of F1 92, two from 91 and one from 93, 94 and 95.
Endurance Racing X (paid mod, but worth it)
GP79 (rough around the edges, but good fun)
Apex GT3
Lola 280
Miata/MX5, three versions: Standard Spec, Super Charged Lv1, Super Charged Lvl2

Recommended Tracks:

Mid Ohio
Ponzan
Croft
Lester
Longford
Nordschieife
Le Mans
Thruxton (still work in progress)
Essington
Brands Hatch (not really up to the quality of the other mods, but it's too much fun to leave out)

I appreciate all that. I'm particularly looking forward to driving the 90's F1 cars you've recommended.

Oh, and also the Nordschleife, hell yeah.

 

[TJP]

Thanks for the ssim software ideas gents. I'll give him a go on all of the sims I have and he can decide for himself....I'm guessing the eye candy of Assetto Corsa will win him over despite its various shortcomings as a racing sim (e.g. the W.I.P A.I.).

I fired up rFactor 2 and discovered two older versions of tracks (Lime Rock and Silverstone) need/can be to be installed per the ISI package list. I've no knowledge how how mods work on a technical level but I find this rather stupid!

 

[Dave_6]

Is there any sim that has CART/Champ Car in it?

 

[Theorry]

I believe rFactor 1 has a great 1998 mod. iRacing has the Dallara?

 

[Big Takeover]

iRacing and rFactor2 both have first party DW12s. rFactor 2 is also getting a remake of the popular CART Factor rF1 mod.

@marvel Great lists you've made (rF2+AC). I'll add them both to the OP, which I need to do an all around update to.

 

[Dave_6]

I'm a fan of the Indy Car series but the current cars are boring compared to the screaming 900 hp CART versions. Hopefully rFactor 2 will come to Steam at some point, or is it worth getting as is?

 

[Betta Lines]

I'm a fan of the Indy Car series but the current cars are boring compared to the screaming 900 hp CART versions. Hopefully rFactor 2 will come to Steam at some point, or is it worth getting as is?

If it does, you'd hope that they'd make the transfer as painless as Reiza did. I'd say it's worth getting now - the installation process isn't that bad... and you might as well try it as a demo (it's the same process).

 

[Big Takeover]

A new crowdfunding company is starting up called SimFunding. They're looking to fund both software and hardware projects specific to sim racing. It sounds like a promising idea.

Looking at that whois info, it seems to registered by a Czech gentleman through a Danish host. I'm not turning up any info on who he may be affiliated with however.

They've got a Mak-Corp interview up on their site.

 

[marvelharvey]

It's amazing how pretty this ugly game can look sometimes.

 

[Ark]

Is that GCSE? I'm really hoping it goes on sale soon so I can pick it up.

 

[Megasoum]

Is that GCSE? I'm really hoping it goes on sale soon so I can pick it up.

That's rFactor 2

 

[Ark]

That's rFactor 2

Ah, thanks

 

[seattle6418]

A new crowdfunding company is starting up called SimFunding. They're looking to fund both software and hardware projects specific to sim racing. It sounds like a promising idea.

Looking at that whois info, it seems to registered by a Czech gentleman through a Danish host. I'm not turning up any info on who he may be affiliated with however.

They've got a Mak-Corp interview up on their site.

I actually think it´s way too many games and it´s fragmenting an already small fan base.

In a dream world, Reiza, Isi, Sector3, simraceway and Kunus would all be developing a single game with huge mod tools.

Some companies should just give up on trying to reinvent the wheel and just set themselves up selling mods for established platforms. What Reiza does is basically glorified mods of rFactor, and that´s not a bad thing, in fact i think it´s one of the reasons why they can achieve so much with so little resources.

For us Sim fans it would be nice if we could have just two or three games and a bunch of people producing content for it. Maybe in the future we can have that, in the mean time we play dozens of Nordschleife tracks, dozens of Lotus 49, 190 EvoII or others cars that are everywhere and games that have at best 50k players.

It´s a shame because a good plataform with all the content is my ultimate dream for a sim game.

 

[TJP]

I used this graphics guide a while back. The later posts say it's mostly still relevant. Give it a go.

Here is another guide - http://isiforums.net/f/showthread.p...ate-Boost-w-Practically-No-Image-Quality-Loss

I usually just set everything to max, run ISI's own AA solution at level 3 and maintain 60fps with a 20 car grid (@Silverstone in a monsoon) but I may fettle the setting a bit to up the frame rates. Tim Weatley has mentioned on several occasions there are far too many graphical options and than an on or off option would be better..perhaps he is correct.

A new crowdfunding company is starting up called SimFunding. They're looking to fund both software and hardware projects specific to sim racing. It sounds like a promising idea.

They've got a Mak-Corp interview up on their site.

Petros has very high praise for rFactor 2 in his interview. This *sounds* like a great idea - I'd like to know what percentage of the funds ends up in the developers hands as well as what structure is in place to protect those who donate/invest their funds. Last thing sim racing needs is a kickstarter style program where the developers take money and then close their projects down.

 

[Big Takeover]

I actually think it´s way too many games and it´s fragmenting an already small fan base.

In a dream world, Reiza, Isi, Sector3, simraceway and Kunus would all be developing a single game with huge mod tools.

Some companies should just give up on trying to reinvent the wheel and just set themselves up selling mods for established platforms. What Reiza does is basically glorified mods of rFactor, and that´s not a bad thing, in fact i think it´s one of the reasons why they can achieve so much with so little resources.

For us Sim fans it would be nice if we could have just two or three games and a bunch of people producing content for it. Maybe in the future we can have that, in the mean time we play dozens of Nordschleife tracks, dozens of Lotus 49, 190 EvoII or others cars that are everywhere and games that have at best 50k players.

It´s a shame because a good plataform with all the content is my ultimate dream for a sim game.

I hear what you're saying... but Seattle, don't go all Stalin on me, bro! You're already standing in the ashes of a monolithic racing game. It's all fun and games until the ship sinks, right?

There needs to be competition. There needs to be balance. The market will take care of the unsustainable sims, but it's not going to be to the benefit of the remaining ones. The fact that my perfect sim would be made up of bits and pieces of about ten different sims just reinforces the importance of their existence.

------------

@TJP Cool, I'll look at that newer guide. It's been a while since I've looked at any of the settings actually. I should see if I'm leaving any ffb improvements on the table too.

For sure there are many questions to answer, but I think such a thing could be beneficial. If it's just a shiny coat of paint on pre-ordering Mak-Corp content, then that would be a disappointment. It'll need some credibility.

------

I'm going to set a rF2 time, and get the challenge up shortly.

 

[Megasoum]

The problem for me with rf2 is that I put everything to max, I get good fps but the game still look like crap lol.

 

[Betta Lines]

The problem for me with rf2 is that I put everything to max, I get good fps but the game still look like crap lol.

To be fair, if you're coming to that conclusion looking at BT's car and track selection, it's not all that representative of the best that rF2 can achieve visually. Both haven't been updated since 2013 so aren't taking full advantage of recent engine improvements, were always pretty ugly and could do with the kind of treatment that the Skippy and Lime Rock received recently, for example.

But if you're talking more generally, it's also true. It's a strange graphics engine that has potential to look seriously good, but conditions have to be just right. Seems to be highly dependent on time of day and weather, as well as the type of car you're driving (in terms of how the cockpit affects the HDR).

 

[Megasoum]

To be fair, if you're coming to that conclusion looking at BT's car and track selection, it's not all that representative of the best that rF2 can achieve visually. Both haven't been updated since 2013 so aren't taking full advantage of recent engine improvements, were always pretty ugly and could do with the kind of treatment that the Skippy and Lime Rock received recently, for example.

But if you're talking more generally, it's also true. It's a strange graphics engine that has potential to look seriously good, but conditions have to be just right. Seems to be highly dependent on time of day and weather, as well as the type of car you're driving (in terms of how the cockpit affects the HDR).

Well... The general level of graphics is really up and down... Haven't tried Lime Rock yet but Mills Loop (or whatever it's called) looked all right... Much better than Interlagos.

The main issue I have right now is really bad pop-in for the grandstand/buildings and with the shadows.

 

[Big Takeover]

Well... The general level of graphics is really up and down... Haven't tried Lime Rock yet but Mills Loop (or whatever it's called) looked all right... Much better than Interlagos.

The main issue I have right now is really bad pop-in for the grandstand/buildings and with the shadows.

I'm actually trying to cure my shadow problems right now too. I'm not sure if they were this bad yesterday (tbh, I just tune that sort of shit out), but it's not video worthy. Somebody will barf at the shadow pop-in.

edit, looks like it's limited to Mills. I'm going to drum up a new combo.

 

[marvelharvey]

Yeah, Interlagos seems to be the most offensive track for shadow pop in on the start/finish straight. I tend to run shadows at Max, at the expense of other settings, to minimise the problem.

By the way Megasoum, my previous post with the screenshots wasn't aimed at you, just the general opinion elsewhere on the internet that rFactor2 is ugly. It certainly can be ugly, but as stated above, get the right time of day/track/car combo and it looks great.

Could you post a couple of screenshots or video? Maybe we can help figure out what's causing your issues.

 

[Megasoum]

Yeah, Interlagos seems to be the most offensive track for shadow pop in on the start/finish straight. I tend to run shadows at Max, at the expense of other settings, to minimise the problem.

By the way Megasoum, my previous post with the screenshots wasn't aimed at you, just the general opinion elsewhere on the internet that rFactor2 is ugly. It certainly can be ugly, but as stated above, get the right time of day/track/car combo and it looks great.

Could you post a couple of screenshots or video? Maybe we can help figure out what's causing your issues.

Hah don't worry, no offense taken. I agree that rf2 can look great... I just don't know why it doesn't on my pc lol

 

[Big Takeover]

 

[Megasoum]

Yuuuuup