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[jstevenson]

That's what I meant. Some sets don't properly display HDR10 content. On the sets that do display it properly the difference between HDR10 and DV is not a "killer" difference.

Like someone posted on AVS today, there is no format war. Neither format is going anywhere. HDR10 is required on every UHD Blu Ray and is supported by Microsoft and Sony's consoles. As of right now you have 2 manufactures that make DV capable sets. The LG sets are expensive. The Vizio sets can display DV content good enough, but reportedly have trouble displaying HDR10 content as well as other HDR10 sets which means alot for gamers. With this in mind, I don't think not supporting Dolby Vision should be a deal breaker for anyone looking at getting a HDR set right now.

well it's not just the TVs though, it's the mastering done on the HDR10 side that is causing some of the issues, some of the discs and content are mastered badly.

The further challenge is since all the capabilities of the displays are different, the HDR10 content needs to be more standardized.

This is why DV is the better experience right now, beyond the additional picture information it's providing.

And I agree, neither format is going away. I think DV just will likely end up being the premium format of the two, and it already is, basically.

As you note, I wouldn't say DV is a dealbreaker on a TV choice, but it sure is damn nice

 

[dreamcastfan]

This doesn't even bring up the fact that dynamic HDR10 is coming and will be a firmware upgrade for existing HDR10 sets.

Where did you read it would be a firmware update? I've been looking for info everywhere, and they only thing I have found is talk about it using HDMI 2.1

 

[tmdorsey]

Where did you read it would be a firmware update? I've been looking for info everywhere, and they only thing I have found is talk about it using HDMI 2.1

Well it's not 100% confirmed, but based on this article at least Samsung might be pushing it out as a firmware update.

http://www.flatpanelshd.com/news.php?subaction=showfull&id=1463138030

 

[vort3x]

I bet the HDMI cable they bought was less than $10!
Fools!

99 cents!

 

[ericksakti]

oled55b6p for 2110
oled 65b6p for 2923
oled 65e6p for 3461

which one should i take guys im so confused

 

[NYR]

oled55b6p for 2110
oled 65b6p for 2923
oled 65e6p for 3461

which one should i take guys im so confused

Do you care about 3D and don't mind paying a bit extra for an amazing innovative design? E6.

Do you not care about 3D and don't care about the set design? B6.

Get a 65 inch, always get as big as you can afford, no one ever second guesses going too big, unless your TV is in a closet or your couch is 2 feet away from the TV.

Personally, the looks of the E6 are worth $500 to me, people will be in awe of it for a long time. If you don't plan on hooking it up to a receiver and speakers, the E6 has way better sound as well.

Generally speaking, the picture quality is the same, but I really would not consider a 55 inch.

 

[ericksakti]

Do you care about 3D and don't mind paying a bit extra for an amazing innovative design? E6.

Do you not care about 3D and don't care about the set design? B6.

Get a 65 inch, always get as big as you can afford, no one ever second guesses going too big, unless your TV is in a closet or your couch is 2 feet away from the TV.

Personally, the looks of the E6 are worth $500 to me, people will be in awe of it for a long time. If you don't plan on hooking it up to a receiver and speakers, the E6 has way better sound as well.

Generally speaking, the picture quality is the same, but I really would not consider a 55 inch.

Hmm, I like the 65e6 for the design and the sound bar.
However, this tv set is for my bedroom, so I'm wondering if the 65 inch is too big for a bedroom? I live in Indonesia and these are the only 3 models available here to purchase.

I dont care for 3d, however my viewing distance from my bed and sofa is about 3.1 meters, which size is better for this distance?

 

[Kyoufu]

Hmm, I like the 65e6 for the design and the sound bar.
However, this tv set is for my bedroom, so I'm wondering if the 65 inch is too big for a bedroom? I live in Indonesia and these are the only 3 models available here to purchase.

I dont care for 3d, however my viewing distance from my bed and sofa is about 3.1 meters, which size is better for this distance?

Whichever model you choose, you should get the 65".

 

[NYR]

Hmm, I like the 65e6 for the design and the sound bar.
However, this tv set is for my bedroom, so I'm wondering if the 65 inch is too big for a bedroom? I live in Indonesia and these are the only 3 models available here to purchase.

I dont care for 3d, however my viewing distance from my bed and sofa is about 3.1 meters, which size is better for this distance?

3 meters/9 feet is really far. Definitely 65 inch. THX recommends at least 60 inches for that far, CNET says no bigger than 72, and SMPTE recommends 68 and above!

https://www.cnet.com/how-to/how-big-a-tv-should-i-buy/

 

[Insane Metal]

As I said earlier: I have a 60" Sammy Plasma but I hate how dim it is and how reflective the screen is. If I were to get an LED TV, which model you guys recommend? Budget: <1000... screen size >40 is ok. Thanks.

Edit: according to Rtings, the Samsung KU6300 is the best option. I'll see if I find it somewhere to take a look.

 

[axb2013]

3 meters/9 feet is really far. Definitely 65 inch. THX recommends at least 60 inches for that far, CNET says no bigger than 72, and SMPTE recommends 68 and above!

https://www.cnet.com/how-to/how-big-a-tv-should-i-buy/

Can confirm. I went from a ~109 ppi 1440p 27" monitor to a ~67 ppi 65" 4K TV. 67 ppi sounds bad but it's not an issue because the distance compensates for low ppi.

With a 65" TV as a monitor, my ideal view distance range is 4-9 feet. If there is no PC involved, 65" could go up to 12ft. I have some flexibility, 7-12ft range by moving couch and TV placement, tempted to move in closer.

 

[Chao]

Received my new Lg C6 yesterday.
Coming from a 9100, it really didn't look that much better.

Even HDR didn't wow me as much as watching the previous oled screen for the first time.

So yeah, I think oled > 4K > HDR in terms of "wowness" for me, at least for the time being. to be honest I could only spend like 40 minutes testing it yesterday and I'm out of home all day, so I may change my opinion tomorrow after some more tests

 

[DJ Lushious]

Received my new Lg C6 yesterday.
Coming from a 9100, it really didn't look that much better.

Even HDR didn't wow me as much as watching the previous oled screen for the first time.

So yeah, I think oled > 4K > HDR in terms of "wowness" for me, at least for the time being. to be honest I could only spend like 40 minutes testing it yesterday and I'm out of home all day, so I may change my opinion tomorrow after some more tests

The thing about HDR is it seems there's a big focus on NITS. However, the effect is much more varied across the luminosity spectrum and can really be appreciated when comparing the same picture across the two formats. As it stands, though, OLED just can't sear the eyes like LCD does, so I see your sentiment raised time and time again. For me, knowing what to look for and what to expect, HDR beats 4K every time. I can just barely tell the difference between 4k and 1080p (it's there, but not the huge leap that 1080p was), but with HDR it's immediate.

Just my two cents, though.

 

[finalflame]

Took the plunge and bought Pacific Rim in UHD BR yesterday and holy fuck. This movie has been by far the best demo of 4K/HDR for me. Some scenes literally had me squinting from the brightness on my KS8000, and the movie is just beautiful overall. Highly recommend it for people wanting to see the full potential of HDR.

 

[dedhead54]

I want to pick up a KS8000 this week but can't decide on which size to get. I currently have a 50" 2014 Samsung and it fits the large dresser that I have it on perfectly (TV and consoes are in my bedroom, I have roommates and their stuff is in the living room). Like the width of the 50" I have now is almost the exact same as the dresser. I feel like 50" is the perfect size but wonder if I could notice any difference between the 50" have now and the 49", which is what the KS8000 comes in. I also feel like if I am spending the money and upgrading maybe I should just go bigger anyways.

 

[Syrus]

I want to pick up a KS8000 this week but can't decide on which size to get. I currently have a 50" 2014 Samsung and it fits the large dresser that I have it on perfectly (TV and consoes are in my bedroom, I have roommates and their stuff is in the living room). Like the width of the 50" I have now is almost the exact same as the dresser. I feel like 50" is the perfect size but wonder if I could notice any difference between the 50" have now and the 49", which is what the KS8000 comes in. I also feel like if I am spending the money and upgrading maybe I should just go bigger anyways.

65 or nothing

 

[Chao]

The thing about HDR is it seems there's a big focus on NITS. However, the effect is much more varied across the luminosity spectrum and can really be appreciated when comparing the same picture across the two formats. As it stands, though, OLED just can't sear the eyes like LCD does, so I see your sentiment raised time and time again. For me, knowing what to look for and what to expect, HDR beats 4K every time. I can just barely tell the difference between 4k and 1080p (it's there, but not the huge leap that 1080p was), but with HDR it's immediate.

Just my two cents, though.

What's interesting about this is that I've experienced this squinting you talk about while watching content on my 9100, and that panel isn't even HDR. I remember watching the Martian and certain scenes featured bright spots in high contrast/black backgrounds that made me close my eyes because they were so bright, and that was something I had never seen before in a LCD panel.

Will need to do more tests on the new C6 set, I can definitely see the difference but as I said it already looked stellar on the 9100

 

[The_Spaniard]

The thing about HDR is it seems there's a big focus on NITS. However, the effect is much more varied across the luminosity spectrum and can really be appreciated when comparing the same picture across the two formats. As it stands, though, OLED just can't sear the eyes like LCD does, so I see your sentiment raised time and time again. For me, knowing what to look for and what to expect, HDR beats 4K every time. I can just barely tell the difference between 4k and 1080p (it's there, but not the huge leap that 1080p was), but with HDR it's immediate.

Just my two cents, though.

Brightness is my one major concern with the OLED I'm planning on buying. OLED in general lacks the brightness of LED, and it was really apparent in store side by side when I was looking recently. I've been told that seeing them side by side makes the disparity a whole lot worse than it actually is in your home when it's not being compared to a brighter set sitting right next to it. I hope this is true, because when I was in the store I literally asked the clerk if he could turn up the brightness on the OLED I was looking at and he said it was at max brightness.

It seems like such a major issue, but then when every thing you've ever read is that OLED is the most amazing thing you have ever seen and leaves the competition in the dust, it leads you to believe that in a more intimate home environment the relative dimness is not nearly as noticeable. Or else every review for OLED sets wouldn't be crowing about how they shit all over the competition.

Please allay my fears.

 

[spannicus]

Can get a 65 inch JS9000 for 1500 dollars. Is this a good tv still?

 

[Insane Metal]

Can get a 65 inch JS9000 for 1500 dollars. Is this a good tv still?

Well, according to this review it's great.

 

[Kyoufu]

Brightness is my one major concern with the OLED I'm planning on buying. OLED in general lacks the brightness of LED, and it was really apparent in store side by side when I was looking recently. I've been told that seeing them side by side makes the disparity a whole lot worse than it actually is in your home when it's not being compared to a brighter set sitting right next to it. I hope this is true, because when I was in the store I literally asked the clerk if he could turn up the brightness on the OLED I was looking at and he said it was at max brightness.

It seems like such a major issue, but then when every thing you've ever read is that OLED is the most amazing thing you have ever seen and leaves the competition in the dust, it leads you to believe that in a more intimate home environment the relative dimness is not nearly as noticeable. Or else every review for OLED sets wouldn't be crowing about how they shit all over the competition.

Please allay my fears.

It's definitely a major issue. Sometimes I can't even tell if my TV is on. It's so dark!

Spoiler

Brightness is fine. I don't see why it would be a problem for anyone.

 

[Insane Metal]

Damn @ LG's C6 review. http://www.rtings.com/tv/reviews/lg/c6

Too bad the input lag still isn't very good. 32ms @ 1080p and >67ms @4k (HDR).

 

[The_Spaniard]

Damn @ LG's C6 review. http://www.rtings.com/tv/reviews/lg/c6

Too bad the input lag still isn't very good. 32ms @ 1080p and >67ms @4k (HDR).

I keep hearing different things about the C6's input lag. Some people are saying that their tests are lower, and others are saying that it's being improved via firmware updates. As long as it's eventually half-decent via updates I'm okay with it.

Edit: Didn't someone in this thread say that LG announced an update in the next couple of months for this line that should improve input lag on 4k HDR gaming?

 

[Izuna]

Damn @ LG's C6 review. http://www.rtings.com/tv/reviews/lg/c6

Too bad the input lag still isn't very good. 32ms @ 1080p and >67ms @4k (HDR).

nvm

edit: Black : 0 cd/m2

whaaaa

 

[Insane Metal]

nvm

edit: Black : 0 cd/m2

whaaaa

That's the beauty of OLED

 

[Weevilone]

Brightness is my one major concern with the OLED I'm planning on buying. OLED in general lacks the brightness of LED, and it was really apparent in store side by side when I was looking recently. I've been told that seeing them side by side makes the disparity a whole lot worse than it actually is in your home when it's not being compared to a brighter set sitting right next to it. I hope this is true, because when I was in the store I literally asked the clerk if he could turn up the brightness on the OLED I was looking at and he said it was at max brightness.

It seems like such a major issue, but then when every thing you've ever read is that OLED is the most amazing thing you have ever seen and leaves the competition in the dust, it leads you to believe that in a more intimate home environment the relative dimness is not nearly as noticeable. Or else every review for OLED sets wouldn't be crowing about how they shit all over the competition.

Please allay my fears.

The issue isn't so much the side-by-side comparison, it's the comparison in a big box store that has far more ambient lighting than you'd ever have in a home setting that lends itself to high quality cinema. People just don't realize how much light they are being displayed in. This is much of what killed plasma, and people would go home with the brighter display, then utilize it at a reasonable light output that the plasma (now OLED) could easily handle.

If you used most LED sets in a home theater setting with big box settings, you'd sear your eyes or get a headache. Of course if the set is going to be in full light setting for watching football or whatever, then maybe you need the brightness.

 

[NYR]

Brightness is my one major concern with the OLED I'm planning on buying. OLED in general lacks the brightness of LED, and it was really apparent in store side by side when I was looking recently. I've been told that seeing them side by side makes the disparity a whole lot worse than it actually is in your home when it's not being compared to a brighter set sitting right next to it. I hope this is true, because when I was in the store I literally asked the clerk if he could turn up the brightness on the OLED I was looking at and he said it was at max brightness.

It seems like such a major issue, but then when every thing you've ever read is that OLED is the most amazing thing you have ever seen and leaves the competition in the dust, it leads you to believe that in a more intimate home environment the relative dimness is not nearly as noticeable. Or else every review for OLED sets wouldn't be crowing about how they shit all over the competition.

Please allay my fears.

You simply have to get used to it. It is not as bright but it is not like you are staring at a black rectangle. It simply isn't as bright but that isn't a bad thing, LED blows up the image and over brightens it to the point your eyes hurt. Think about it like a movie theatre, your eyes don't get tired by staring at a super large and bright image.

You simply need to "Recalibrate" your brain and eyes to not expect a super bright image, here is a sample of my OLED, nothing looks wrong here from a brightness standpoint, and this is in a bright room, you can even see the reflection of my blinds.

 

[Original Man]

Question for all those with 4k tvs with the amazon prime app. Can someone please tell me why its hard for Amazon prime UHD shows/movies to display 4k? I have a ks8000. For example, I tried watching bosch in 4k, and only got to 1080p. Yet I'm watching chiraq, and it's in 4k. Wtf

 

[The_Spaniard]

You simply have to get used to it. It is not as bright but it is not like you are staring at a black rectangle. It simply isn't as bright but that isn't a bad thing, LED blows up the image and over brightens it to the point your eyes hurt. Think about it like a movie theatre, your eyes don't get tired by staring at a super large and bright image.

You simply need to "Recalibrate" your brain and eyes to not expect a super bright image, here is a sample of my OLED, nothing looks wrong here from a brightness standpoint, and this is in a bright room, you can even see the reflection of my blinds.

 

[spannicus]

Well, according to this review it's great.

Thanks!

 

[OG_Original Gamer]

well it's not just the TVs though, it's the mastering done on the HDR10 side that is causing some of the issues, some of the discs and content are mastered badly.

The further challenge is since all the capabilities of the displays are different, the HDR10 content needs to be more standardized.

This is why DV is the better experience right now, beyond the additional picture information it's providing.

And I agree, neither format is going away. I think DV just will likely end up being the premium format of the two, and it already is, basically.

As you note, I wouldn't say DV is a dealbreaker on a TV choice, but it sure is damn nice

Another aspect of DV that isn't mentioned, is the dynamic tone mapping. Which will be another problem for HDR10 dynamic metadata, and display manufacturer implementation of dynamic tone mapping. But, this is what Sony and Samsung are fighting for, going open format means they can battle over marketing Nits, color gamut coverage, and giving dynamic metadata some marketing mumbo jumbo called "Ultra Dynamic Range Display".

 

[Yappadappadu]

I keep hearing different things about the C6's input lag. Some people are saying that their tests are lower, and others are saying that it's being improved via firmware updates. As long as it's eventually half-decent via updates I'm okay with it.

The C6, E6 and G6 always had abt. 34 ms when displaying games in good old SDR.
Problem seems to be the HDR mode and while there are ppl who say that the input lag for HDR games feels low enough to them, we don't have any other measurements to support that claim.
We really need that 4K HDR Leo Bodnar input lag tester to easily measure ourselves.

Edit: Didn't someone in this thread say that LG announced an update in the next couple of months for this line that should improve input lag on 4k HDR gaming?

That was based on ONE answer that someone got from british LG customer service. The same day day someone else told him that no such update was planned.
In other words, while it is likely that LG is working on such an update considering that they're not stupid and know that the PS4 Pro is coming, we have no idea whether or when it'll be available for the 2016 OLED TVs.

Question for all those with 4k tvs with the amazon prime app. Can someone please tell me why its hard for Amazon prime UHD shows/movies to display 4k? I have a ks8000. For example, I tried watching bosch in 4k, and only got to 1080p. Yet I'm watching chiraq, and it's in 4k. Wtf

IIRC there were different listings. Check the 4K/UHD section?

 

[Insane Metal]

Lol. Appropriate response.

 

[x3sphere]

It looks like Shadow Warrior 2 is the first HDR game on PC, anyone try it out yet?

 

[Yappadappadu]

I know a guy with a LG 65B6 OLED (hooked to a GTX 1080 PC) who just tried it out and told me that it's glorious.
I saw some pics and the TV correctly goes into "HDR" mode with "16:9/2160p/HDR/BT.2020/PCM" in the info screen of the TV.
Makes it difficult for me to resist uprading my PC, but I plan to wait for Kaby Lake in January.

Mass Effect as a Dolby Vision game should be even better thanks to the dynamic nature, so another good reason for the PC version as long as the consoles only use HDR10 static.

 

[Kyoufu]

I know a guy with a LG 65B6 OLED (hooked to a GTX 1080 PC) who just tried it out and told me that it's glorious.
I saw some pics and the TV correctly goes into "HDR" mode with "16:9/2160p/HDR/BT.2020/PCM" in the info screen of the TV.
Makes it difficult for me to resist uprading my PC, but I plan to wait for Kaby Lake in January.

Mass Effect as a Dolby Vision game should be even better thanks to the dynamic nature, so another good reason for the PC version as long as the consoles only use HDR10 static.

I will most likely get ME:A on PC for that sweet Dolby Vision support.

Sad that consoles won't support the superior HDR solution.

 

[Rbk_3]

I thought Costco was supposed to have good prices?! The P75 C-1 I got for 3,600 (before tax) is over 5,000 at Costco, according to their website. Am I missing something? Have they lost their mind?

Are you looking at the Canadian site? Costco US doesn't carry the P Series

 

[shmoglish]

Would you recommend me the XD8005 from Sony (55")? Looking for a 4k hdr tv and dont want to spent more than 1200€ (can get the 8005 for 1060€). Is there a good alternative?

 

[holygeesus]

Brightness is my one major concern with the OLED I'm planning on buying. OLED in general lacks the brightness of LED, and it was really apparent in store side by side when I was looking recently. I've been told that seeing them side by side makes the disparity a whole lot worse than it actually is in your home when it's not being compared to a brighter set sitting right next to it. I hope this is true, because when I was in the store I literally asked the clerk if he could turn up the brightness on the OLED I was looking at and he said it was at max brightness.

It seems like such a major issue, but then when every thing you've ever read is that OLED is the most amazing thing you have ever seen and leaves the competition in the dust, it leads you to believe that in a more intimate home environment the relative dimness is not nearly as noticeable. Or else every review for OLED sets wouldn't be crowing about how they shit all over the competition.

Please allay my fears.

If you light your front room as extensively as your local TV store, then OLED will not be for you. Under normal lighting they are fine. In the dark they are exemplary.

 

[The_Spaniard]

If you light your front room as extensively as your local TV store, then OLED will not be for you. Under normal lighting they are fine. In the dark they are exemplary.

If that is the case, then I will become the night.

Though I will say, for the record, that this was in the Magnolia section, which is darkened as a rule to show off TVs. But yeah I can't imagine that walls of lit LEDs at max brightness around the OLEDs help.

 

[holygeesus]

If that is the case, then I will become the night.

Though I will say, for the record, that this was in the Magnolia section, which is darkened as a rule to show off TVs. But yeah I can't imagine that walls of lit LEDs at max brightness around the OLEDs help.

Also consider I live in England, which doesn't actually encounter sunlight, so OLEDs are well suited to our conditions.

 

[MCD]

Is Samsung or other TV manufacturers gonna invest in OLED soon? Don't like LG tbh but if next year they gonna get that input lag down to 20ms...I won't be able to resist.

Sammy 8500 is perfect for gaming but movies can be a bit of a downer due to some clouding in my set.

 

[dreamcastfan]

Are you looking at the Canadian site? Costco US doesn't carry the P Series

Must have been..

 

[Bill Rizer]

Hello, I setup my Oled 55b6 two days ago, I'm still going through extensive testing with settings and various sources (mostly games); I have to say that the cinematic quality of this display is astounding, and the dynamic range of the display with games is stunning. Colors are unreal and if you watch in the dark it is simply mesmerizing.

Only culprit I have with the tv processing is the scaler, which is quite rubbish compared to the Panasonic dx780 which I had got earlier this year. On that tv 720p looked like 1080p, and 1080p looked like 4k, and that was even on a bigger screen (58").

 

[Chao]

Okay, since the HDR content on Netflix didn't look as impressive as I thought it would, I downloaded some HDR demo videos from lg and yeah, whole different story, crazy contrast, colors an reflections. Now I can see the difference in detail, they can afford showing a dude in a super shiny golden armor against a dark background without blowing up the image. Dude is shiny as fuck, background is super dark but detailed.

Can't wait to see more of this stuff.

And yeah, HDR vídeos on Netflix aren't too hot from what I have seen

 

[The_Spaniard]

Don't like LG tbh but if next year they gonna get that input lag down to 20ms...I won't be able to resist.

I'm still wondering just how much they could possibly fix that on this year's model via firmware updates.

 

[Ascenion]

Is Samsung or other TV manufacturers gonna invest in OLED soon? Don't like LG tbh but if next year they gonna get that input lag down to 20ms...I won't be able to resist.

Sammy 8500 is perfect for gaming but movies can be a bit of a downer due to some clouding in my set.

Others might but as it stands Samsung went with Quantum Dot instead of OLED. They think it to be better and cheaper.

 

[pswii60]

Brightness is my one major concern with the OLED I'm planning on buying. OLED in general lacks the brightness of LED, and it was really apparent in store side by side when I was looking recently. I've been told that seeing them side by side makes the disparity a whole lot worse than it actually is in your home when it's not being compared to a brighter set sitting right next to it. I hope this is true, because when I was in the store I literally asked the clerk if he could turn up the brightness on the OLED I was looking at and he said it was at max brightness.

It seems like such a major issue, but then when every thing you've ever read is that OLED is the most amazing thing you have ever seen and leaves the competition in the dust, it leads you to believe that in a more intimate home environment the relative dimness is not nearly as noticeable. Or else every review for OLED sets wouldn't be crowing about how they shit all over the competition.

Please allay my fears.

I only have my OLED at around half its maximum brightness (OLED light 52) and even that seems too bright occasionally. Tons brighter that my old VT65 plasma ever managed even at that level. It's a non issue.

 

[Rodin]

Brightness is my one major concern with the OLED I'm planning on buying. OLED in general lacks the brightness of LED, and it was really apparent in store side by side when I was looking recently. I've been told that seeing them side by side makes the disparity a whole lot worse than it actually is in your home when it's not being compared to a brighter set sitting right next to it. I hope this is true, because when I was in the store I literally asked the clerk if he could turn up the brightness on the OLED I was looking at and he said it was at max brightness.

It seems like such a major issue, but then when every thing you've ever read is that OLED is the most amazing thing you have ever seen and leaves the competition in the dust, it leads you to believe that in a more intimate home environment the relative dimness is not nearly as noticeable. Or else every review for OLED sets wouldn't be crowing about how they shit all over the competition.

Please allay my fears.

Unless you really want to be blind, OLED brightness set around 55 (100 being max) is way more than enough.

 

[Succinct Verbosity]

Any good HDR monitors in the uk? I can find 4K ones, but I can't seem to find any with HDR too.