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Playstation Move Thread: It Only Does Everything
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The Fight Review... I guess because of the way TTP reads it, you can hardly gauge if he's excited or not. Even if he isn't? You can gauge it. 
stil, I think the transparency comments are pretty spot on. I'm not sure now if I should pick it up. TTP doesn't really mention if the game is FUN. It was largely a technical implementation video. Hardly reviewish.
More gaffers should get this and start an OT with impressions.
* just noticed the IGN review. echoes my comments from watching the gamespot guy way earlier in this thread where I thought, it didn't look fun. okay. skimmed to the breakdown and I think the reviewer is angling to hate it. You want to fault a game's mechanics? sure. But I've seen videos of this and theres no way
3 for presentation for what they've done? It looks like a 6-7/10
graphics is a 7/8/10
even the sound is under 5/10? Please....
The poor developers got their ass handed to them
found this:
http://www.videogamer.com/ps3/motion_fighter/review.html
stil, I think the transparency comments are pretty spot on. I'm not sure now if I should pick it up. TTP doesn't really mention if the game is FUN. It was largely a technical implementation video. Hardly reviewish.
More gaffers should get this and start an OT with impressions.
* just noticed the IGN review. echoes my comments from watching the gamespot guy way earlier in this thread where I thought, it didn't look fun. okay. skimmed to the breakdown and I think the reviewer is angling to hate it. You want to fault a game's mechanics? sure. But I've seen videos of this and theres no way
3 for presentation for what they've done? It looks like a 6-7/10
graphics is a 7/8/10
even the sound is under 5/10? Please....
The poor developers got their ass handed to them
found this:
http://www.videogamer.com/ps3/motion_fighter/review.html
Jax said:
It's not just the transparency. It's a combination of factors. Distance issues and IK collision are the other two. The reviews I've read till now all mention "unresponsiveness" and stuff like that, but there is no such a thing in the game. The Move technology is actually working pretty fine. All you need to do is go to the gym and throw punches around. It always detects them, immediately and accurately. It's how the game was built around the Move tech that leads to the "unresponsiveness" impression. It sucks to see the Move tech being put under a bad light despite not being at fault.
Great video TTP, spot on as always. Keep up a good work.
I think the fixed distance solution you suggest would be a bit too simplifying, there should be a possibility to create distance between you and opponent like in real boxing. What I think would be better solution is to set a minimal distance you can get to the opponent, this way you still need to chase the thug, but will not run into him, creating all those funny collisions.
I think the fixed distance solution you suggest would be a bit too simplifying, there should be a possibility to create distance between you and opponent like in real boxing. What I think would be better solution is to set a minimal distance you can get to the opponent, this way you still need to chase the thug, but will not run into him, creating all those funny collisions.
I'm an expert
Formerly worldrevolution. The only reason I am nice to anyone else is to avoid being banned.
Cracked and got the starter pack they have over here in Japan with Beat Sketch. Will wait on the navigation controller since I wanna see how MAG and Heavy Rain play without it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XjBmkur7Lt0
Non-glitchy headtracking in a dim-- almost candle-lit-- environment.
So I don't know what The Fight's excuse could be.
Non-glitchy headtracking in a dim-- almost candle-lit-- environment.
So I don't know what The Fight's excuse could be.
Stumpokapow
listen to the mad man
Updated review scores in OP (The Fight debuts with 40 average, 2 reviews) and added "Get Fit with Mel B" and "EA Sports Active 2". If there are any Move required games not listed in the OP let me know and I'll add them.
BruceLeeRoy
Banned
If Zoukka praised any of the other Motion control techs I could see it being slight trolling but being that he has always spoken out about the overall ridiculousness of all 3 I think like most people he just thinks they are lame. However, due to my need to feel like I am 8 again I almost to easily find myself adopting them.
SolidusDave
Member
Stumpokapow said:
But there are already games in your list that do not require Move
Jax said:
At times, it really is. When you menage to chain your moves correctly ("planet align"..) it's immensely satisfying. Left uppercut followed by right jab feels soo good with the Move. But that's not really the kind of question I want to answer with my videos in general. I'm more interested in how things work. And if they don't, why.
Stumpokapow
listen to the mad man
SolidusDave said:But there are already games in your list that do not require Move
Which ones? I think Flight Control is pretty much the only one on the list that doesn't need Move but it basically does for proper gameplay. My point for saying "require Move" was to exclude stuff like Heavy Rain and RUSE.
Obviously TC RS supports the old GunCon, and EyePet Move Edition is just the North American retail edition of a game that doesn't otherwise require Move. Do any other not require it?
Stumpokapow said:
Have you cross checked with my list? (which might not be 100% accurate mind you)
http://www.gameslist.iwaggle3d.com/
Just sort "Move Support" and look for the "Required" games.
Edit - sorta unrelated, but is MLB 10 ever going to get a 3D patch? I thought it was announced but aside from the demo I don't recall the full game actually getting patched for 3D.
Maastricht
Member
There are two things that I'm wondering about:
1) I guess 3D support could have been a factor here for various reasons (transparancy even more expensive, if you play with 3D you get a better idea of distances so walking around and properly following your opponent is easier)
2) if your speed and such stats improve, will you be able to follow your fighter more easily?
Also, are there any settings for movement sensitivity?
1) I guess 3D support could have been a factor here for various reasons (transparancy even more expensive, if you play with 3D you get a better idea of distances so walking around and properly following your opponent is easier)
2) if your speed and such stats improve, will you be able to follow your fighter more easily?
Also, are there any settings for movement sensitivity?
Maastricht said:
No sensitivity settings.
Following the opponent is not a problem. It's fast enough. It's the fact that he moves around constantly that's sort of annoying cos one second you land a punch and a second later your punch misses cos he moved a inch backwards. If you play calm and throw punches only when you are 100% sure the distance is right it's all good. But the AI is clearly at an advantage in calculating this stuff so you end up getting raped if you play the waiting game. Beyond that, there is the issue with collision detection "canceling" your punches if they happen to collide with parts of your opponent's body before the start flying. You do still deal some damage in that case most of the time, but you get the disconnecting impression that your actions are not replicated correctly.
SolidusDave
Member
Stumpokapow said:
Yup those and High Velocity Bowling.
I just found it strange that you want to exclude games that allow both control options, but keep some that need it for "proper gameplay". Flight Control and HVB are fully playable with the DS3, hell even TC allows it if you really want to.
In theory, people who hate to play FPS with a gamepad could argue with you that you would need Move to play e.g. MAG properly.
As long as Move is not just some gimmick option for a few bonus play modes or whatever, I think a game fully playable with Move should be included. Obviously I can see the problem that reviews of older games didn't test specifically the Move controls. On the other hand those metacritic scores are not only about the controls anyway.
backbreaker65
Banned
I knew it would not review well and I knew the transparency would rear its ugly head. TTP, fixed distance in boxing is not a good thing, boxing and or fighting is based on creating distance. If you as a fighter throw a long punch and it doesn't strike with the effectiveness that you thought it should then you throw short chopping punches and if you're still too close, then you grapple. In your video I see you were throwing jabs in such close quarters things no fighter would do. A hook in those quarters should be short and choppy or in-fighting should be upper cuts or body blows making the opponent remove himself from the close quarters or you should step back.
Now if those type of punches doesn't register, then i apologize.
Things I saw in the video that make me disappointed
Head tracking, just sad.
the use of the move button ala gladiator duel to step back or side to side.
Camera angles which also doesn't allow you to measure your punches hence the bad distance in punching.
I hope they patch the game with transparency and not a fixed distance. If they do fixed distance then make it on a lower level.
Now if those type of punches doesn't register, then i apologize.
Things I saw in the video that make me disappointed
Head tracking, just sad.
the use of the move button ala gladiator duel to step back or side to side.
Camera angles which also doesn't allow you to measure your punches hence the bad distance in punching.
I hope they patch the game with transparency and not a fixed distance. If they do fixed distance then make it on a lower level.
ScrabbleBanshee
Member
After having move since launch, by biggest gripe with it is that it's really fucking hard to calibrate with some games during the day at my place.
I live in a condo with wall to wall and floor to ceiling windows in the living room and even when it's overcast and I have the curtains shut it's too bright in the room or something and it won't calibrate. It seems especially bad with sports champions, to the point where I don't even attempt to play it during the daytime any more. It works wonderfully in the evening.
Sucks pretty hard. I've seen videos of some guy testing it's ability to work in different lighting situations that look far worse than mine so I just don't get it.
I live in a condo with wall to wall and floor to ceiling windows in the living room and even when it's overcast and I have the curtains shut it's too bright in the room or something and it won't calibrate. It seems especially bad with sports champions, to the point where I don't even attempt to play it during the daytime any more. It works wonderfully in the evening.
Sucks pretty hard. I've seen videos of some guy testing it's ability to work in different lighting situations that look far worse than mine so I just don't get it.
TTP said:
nice "review" TTP...appropriate beard for the Fight review :lol ... looks good
Why couldn't they just do the distance as they did in TT in SC which works great (moving forward/backward moves your character too). Seems like if they can do a patch for the stuff that TTP points out it could be at least a 7/10 game. But unfortunately the reviews are already out and they sound terrible and most consumers would think its because of the MOVE tech being inaccurate. Its all about the perception.
Fuck I had high hopes for this game and am disappointed by the devs. Don't the devs have testers to point out shit like TTP did??? WTF :/
Sony better make the devs work harder to produce better games or else MOVE is gonna fade away despite being the best tech currently in the market.
Liberty4all
Banned
Time Crisis sounds great. I'm old enough to have remembered when the series first hit the arcades ... sounds like a great throwback for an older gamer such as myself.
get2sammyb
Member
TTP said:
I can't believe this. This negates practically every point IGN makes. I mean... This is unacceptable. The game clearly has issues, and I'm not saying it doesn't deserve 3/10 (though I had a lot of fun when I tried out an older build) -- but to be using the controls wrong and basically fucking up the tracking, then complaining it doesn't feel responsive is... It's just unbelievable.
Even for IGN, that is TERRIBLE.
I remember we had a long disscusion about The Fight when it was first shown. Basically every problem I said they might run into......happened. Every fix I listed for those problems they did not implement. That suggestion for invisble distance boxes was something I suggested.
Stumpokapow
listen to the mad man
SolidusDave said:
High Velocity Bowling MOVE EDITION is what's listed. The reviews are not pertinent to High Velocity Bowling as originally released. They are reviews that are only based on the on-disc Move Edition version. The reviews will discuss the Move Edition.
Yes, you can buy the Move Edition and for some reason play it without Move, but the entire purpose of the retail release is for people to use Move.
TC is not playable without Move. It may be theoretically possible to force the game into playing it with a DualShock 3, but it's not playable by any standard without Move (or GunCon 4, which in the case of TC is an equivalent to Move). All reviews focus on Move gameplay.
Flight Control would be closer to an edge case in that it is generally playable with DS3, just marketed as associated with Move and inarguably superior with Move. All reviews would focus on Move gameplay. I guess RUSE might fall under the same category, so if it makes sense to add RUSE, I can add it.
Right, well, I don't really think it makes sense to spend time discussing insanity. MAG was released as a Dual Shock game. It was fully playable as a Dual Shock game. At the time, no one said "God, they should have waited 6 months for Move so this game can actually be playable". It wasn't re-released in a separate retail SKU for Move. Although some outlets have done follow-up Move impressions, it hasn't been separately reviewed as a Move SKU.
I can't even believe that requires explaining.
gluv65 said:
I know all that. I intentionally got super close to the character to highlight the issue, but that's something that affects the game even at medium distance. Say I perform an uppercut, but my hand is blocked by the opponent's elbow AND the camera ain't showing me that. Result: WTF MY UPPERCUT DIDN'T REGISTER. MOVE SUCKS!
And I also said all of that was technically correct. The thing is tho, when you are doing motion controls, not seeing a proper reaction on screen leads to false impression that detection is broken.
Now, since you can't add force feedback that would prevent your arms from moving, I think you need to find a way to have that 1:1 thing going on most of the time. Hence the suggestion to have a fixed distance that would allow fists to fly at least.
Stumpokapow
listen to the mad man
TTP said:
Checking on that list, I've got everything marked Required that's released, and the only game on the "Compatible" list where I have reason to believe that the game was reviewed primarily as a Move game (as opposed to primarily as a game with some token mention of Move support) would be John Daly's ProStroke Golf (60 metascore, 13 reviews)
TTP said:I'm sure the devs are petty aware of the issues the game has. I hope they get a chance to do a The Fight 2.
Speaking of which, my The Fight vid is missing from the OP list
and for some reason they still ignored it? I understand there are deadlines but how could you miss simple stuff like this during testing which can only enhance user experience and make it a better game to get better reviews which in turn will bring in the revenues to make the sequels. And this is in general for a lot of the dev studios and just baffles me.
I guess a patch could work for now to fix these problems instead for us to wait for a sequel which I doubt will happen now with the poor review scores leading to poor sales.
get2sammyb
Member
A.R.K said:
Yeah, I agree, but it's probably down to an early design flaw.
I'm still looking forward to playing this game for myself. What TTP showed of the tracking and some of the punching still looked genuinely fun, even if it's bogged down by problems. Like I said earlier, I had a lot of fun with an old build of this while everyone was bashing it, so I'm determined to have some fun with it.
It's frustrating because it seems like they were almost onto something here. I'm curious how it would have reviewed with the changes suggested implemented. If you've got IGN pressing the WRONG FUCKING BUTTONS and still giving it a 3/10, it seems like you're doomed from the start.
TheBrain76
Member
spwolf said:
They're games I already owned, I just can't get them to work with Move. :lol
get2sammyb said:
IGN is pretty terrible. But that's par for the course in gaming critique. They're all just swamped with so many games that few actually get a good feel for it. I remember either IGN, or Gamespot reviewed NHL 2K11 for Wii and criticized the game's total lack of control options. The thing is, the game has a fairly robust control scheme that's easily changable if you open up a menu. Dude never pressed "+" and went to the Options menu...
get2sammyb said:
Takao said:
Yes and I usually ignore media reviews but I can't ignore TTP because he is a regular gamer like us and not some media outlet who are incompetent, biased or money hated (well at least so far TTP is not
) ... they should have found these flaws during testing and fixed them. Or they should fire the guy who designed it this way, if thats how it was designed to be played.dragonflys545
Member
lawblob said:
Sorcery!
backbreaker65
Banned
TTP said:
OK, understood, so too many shortcomings to recommend? or you can deal with the shortcomings and get a good fight in.
LiquidMetal14
hide your water-based mammals
I'm thinking about picking up Time Crisis or the Shoot. I need to buy a retail game.
Agent X
Member
TTP said:
Great video! Keep up the good work!
TTP said:
I don't know for sure, but back here in the good ol' USA, baseball season is practically finished. With that in mind, I highly doubt that they're going to add 3D support to MLB 10: The Show at this late stage. Unless the patch is already very far along in development, it would probably be better off that they forget about patching this game, and just concentrate on getting quality 3D support into next year's game instead.
distantmantra
Member
What's up with Pain? I tried accessing the Move mode, but it said there was an error downloading it...
distantmantra
Member
jayb said:
Yeah, I thought of that, but it's not enticing since Pain has like a gazllion updates it would have to re-download.
PistolGrip
sex vacation in Guam
They messed up the most basic part of the game. I find this amazing.TTP said:
* fix length.
* transparency.
* head tracking (not basic but one of the selling points for this game)
The problems are so obvious they deserve a 3/10. IGN may be clueless but these faults are unacceptable.
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