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Polygon: Hololens consumer release on hold following Kinect failure

Strange since this stuff just leaked:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=27&v=zaGfEd2OPps

And a clicker:

WINWORD_2016-02-22_21-07-42-1280x551.jpg
 
ThoughtsOfSpeaking said:
Pretty much this. Just like the original surface (The table, not tablet), It seems like its tech that is just far too costly to do right. Its a great proof of concept, but it cannot work as a product for a very long time.
Click to expand...

Kind of a shame it wasn't exactly presented as such thus far.

This was never going to be one of those instances where BS could have been lived up to with more work for a consumer release a little later - at times what was presented was physically impossible to live up to.
 
It sounds a nice idea but the fov was laughable.

Add in that every other company is focusing on VR Microsoft shouldnt be taking a risk on AR just yet until it's actually workable.
 
Typical Microsoft... they promote Hololens and show it E3 and other gaming-related shows in order to try and stay relevant in a world where their game industry competitors are all racing toward imminent consumer VR product releases. More smoke and mirrors by MS to try and generate unwarranted hype for the XB1, in my opinion.
 
10k said:
What does me mean "normal" people?

:p
Click to expand...

Anyone like the author of the Time infamous Palmer Lackey cover article:

Time said:
As amazing as this is–I am moving around holograms with my hand and voice– it still looks fuzzy, like something went wrong with R2-D2’s message from Princess Leia. It all has to fit on this rectangle in front of my eyes, and the small field of vision makes it seem like it’s on a screen instead of being real. It’s impressive–and the hardware and packaging are way ahead of those of Oculus and Valve–but holograms just don’t seem real yet. As I leave, Kipman asks me how much I think the HoloLens will cost.

“Assuming there are apps I want, $250,” I say.

Kipman looks at me. “You know there’s a computer in there?”

“$350?” I suggest.

“Thank you for your honesty,” he says.
Click to expand...

AKA:

icespide said:
anybody that wouldn't pay $3k for it
Click to expand...

.

harrisk954 said:
Typical Microsoft... they promote Hololens and show it E3 and other gaming-related shows in order to try and stay relevant in a world where their game industry competitors are all racing toward imminent consumer VR product releases. More smoke and mirrors by MS to try and generate unwarranted hype for the XB1, in my opinion.
Click to expand...

More like Mircrosoft went on a different horse and that horse was the wrong one to show off in regards to future VR stuff.

We'll see how badly burned they are if VR is "success"ful or not.
 
harrisk954 said:
Typical Microsoft... they promote Hololens and show it E3 and other gaming-related shows in order to try and stay relevant in a world where their game industry competitors are all racing toward imminent consumer VR product releases. More smoke and mirrors by MS to try and generate unwarranted hype for the XB1, in my opinion.
Click to expand...

That's their prerogative right. They just happen to have lost credibility because of all 'Confident' pronouncements and 'Confident' changes in direction. So their fans seem like lunatics now when they express any 'Confidence' in what they're doing.
 
sphinx said:
I mean, yeah they unbundled it from the X1 but was it really a failure?
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Ya. I have one sitting on my shelf and even the dance games don't care to acknowledge it "no camera needed, use your phone!".
 
Maybe they're finally learning that making misleading trailers that exaggerate or flat out lie about the capabilities of dream land products then releasing barely working messes is not a good long term strategy and are shelving it. Wasn't this supposed to release originally in the Windows 10 "launch window"?

MS gotta MS with their press conferences.

Edit: yep http://www.alphr.com/microsoft/micr...-2016-release-date-price-and-specs-everything

Microsoft has been rather quiet about when we can expect to see HoloLens arrive in our homes and offices. For a long time, the only clue given was that it would be available “in the same timeframe as Windows 10”.
Click to expand...
 
I'm curious to see what a consumer-oriented hololens would do. I guess it's supposed to be tethered to the console, unlike the expensive, standalone model they've been showcasing.

sphinx said:
I think I need some explanation here...

what's this story about Kinect being a Failure? didn't it made them sell a ton of 360s?

I mean, yeah they unbundled it from the X1 but was it really a failure?
Click to expand...

First kinect was definitely not a failure, and it annoys me when they consider the second one to be one when they didn't try really hard to support it (and have been actually removing some of its features lately). Throwing the baby with the bath water. The issue with the X1 wasn't kinect, it was the price.
 
Alx said:
I'm curious to see what a consumer-oriented hololens would do. I guess it's supposed to be tethered to the console, unlike the expensive, standalone model they've been showcasing.



First kinect was definitely not a failure, and it annoys me when they consider the second one to be one when they didn't try really hard to support it (and have been actually removing some of its features lately). Throwing the baby with the bath water. The issue with the X1 wasn't kinect, it was the price.
Click to expand...

The Kinect was a big part of the price.
 
DeathoftheEndless said:
From what I've read, its physics.

https://www.reddit.com/r/HoloLens/comments/3a8z56/microsoft_finally_admits_that_the_fov_will_not/
Click to expand...


Actually, it is a cost/battery thing:

https://www.petri.com/microsoft-sha...to-5-5-hour-battery-life-device-link-and-more

Harris notes that as manufacturing improves, the company intends to expand the field of view once it makes sense from a pricing perspective
Click to expand...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vXu5toPPqVE

Start on the video around 6:00 for more info.
 
Alx said:
I'm curious to see what a consumer-oriented hololens would do. I guess it's supposed to be tethered to the console, unlike the expensive, standalone model they've been showcasing.



First kinect was definitely not a failure, and it annoys me when they consider the second one to be one when they didn't try really hard to support it (and have been actually removing some of its features lately). Throwing the baby with the bath water. The issue with the X1 wasn't kinect, it was the price.
Click to expand...

Kinect 1 sold units, it wasn't a failure by that metric, but I'd argue that it reduced confidence in MS significantly and its unreliable nature poisoned motion controls irreparably. Was 10 years too early to the market IMO.
 
vcc said:
The Kinect was a big part of the price.
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Yes and unbundling it makes some sense in that regard. But it doesn't mean they should stop supporting it. As a matter of fact they should have increased its support, to give better reasons to buy it as an optional peripheral.
 
AR is a pretty neat technology. One that will probably make a big difference in our daily lives. However, Hololens isn't anywhere near ready for releasing to customers yet, and when it does, I suspect that gaming applications will only play a small role in its success. Overall, I think that Microsoft wants to draw attention away from the real world problems they have with the technology, so pointing to the failure of Kinect seems like a likely fallback excuse.

Alx said:
Yes and unbundling it makes some sense in that regard. But it doesn't mean they should stop supporting it. As a matter of fact they should have increased its support, to give better reasons to buy it as an optional peripheral.
Click to expand...
Kinect was dragging the Xbox brand down, so decoupling the products seems like a good way to reposition Xbone. It's probably the smartest decision that Microsoft made with the Xbone since release.
 
Alx said:
Yes and unbundling it makes some sense in that regard. But it doesn't mean they should stop supporting it. As a matter of fact they should have increased its support, to give better reasons to buy it as an optional peripheral.
Click to expand...

Support it with what? The thing sucks for games. It's only good use is for turning things on and even then you don't really need that to do it.

Despite all their talk about how it was a huge improvement from the kinect v1 it still felt like the exact same unresponsive, laggy, frustrating garbage the kinect v1 was.
 
As of now it's a business device with limited FoV, when the FOV is better and it becomes cheaper then they will release it publicly. The tech works and should not be shelved but it is not consumer ready yet.
 
Alx said:
Yes and unbundling it makes some sense in that regard. But it doesn't mean they should stop supporting it. As a matter of fact they should have increased its support, to give better reasons to buy it as an optional peripheral.
Click to expand...

MS is prone to scapegoating and in fighting. There is probably a political aspect and the Kinect and the people around it took the fall for the XB1. IT's probably career poison within MS now to push the idea.
 
It makes sense. Kinect kinda make the 360 explode, but I feel if it did launch first with the xbone version reception would be way better.

So it makes sense to wait until the tech is ready for consumer price, instead of going to an inferior, cheaper alternative like they did with 360's kinect.
 
fastest finger said:
What patronising bullshit is this?

"When the world is ready......."

Fuck off. How about "when your ill-conceived product is ready".
Click to expand...

Come on. What do you expect the designer of the product to say here? They said the same thing about all the xbox one stuff that they rolled back, that people just weren't ready yet. It's called PR.

And here it's even more personal. The dude is the designer, he's not going to say that he wasted years of his life working on a product that simply isn't good enough for the market in its current state. That's a pretty hard pill to get someone to swallow when they've dedicated a huge part of their life to a product. Ask any product manager ever, they are going to say their product was awesome and it was some other reason or someone else's fault it didn't succeed.
 
I do wonder how well VR+cameras+real-time photogrammetry could ape AR and if that could become an acceptable alternative to traditional AR.

None of that at all addresses portability that something like Hololens is aiming for though.

ps3ud0 8)
 
Shenmue said:
Support it with what? The thing sucks for games. It's only good use is for turning things on and even then you don't really need that to do it.

Despite all their talk about how it was a huge improvement from the kinect v1 it still felt like the exact same unresponsive, laggy, frustrating garbage the kinect v1 was.
Click to expand...

Well I disagree with your premise that it sucks for games, and I have a list of games to back it up. But even then it wouldn't be too hard to use things they have already developed to push it forwards. Like the KSR face scanning, Cortana, Hello, or even ports of their 360 games.
But MS is known to drop things too easily at the first difficulties, and years later people ask themselves "how come they completely lost that market when they had xxx before everybody else ?"

vcc said:
MS is prone to scapegoating and in fighting. There is probably a political aspect and the Kinect and the people around it took the fall for the XB1. IT's probably career poison within MS now to push the idea.
Click to expand...

Yeah I guess so. Sad really.
 
ps3ud0 said:
I do wonder how well VR+cameras+real-time photogrammetry could ape AR and if that could become an acceptable alternative to traditional AR.

None of that at all addresses portability that something like Hololens is aiming for though.

ps3ud0 8)
Click to expand...

Not until the cameras are in the same space as your eyes as that's all it takes to throw your vision off.

ps3ud0 8)
 
Shenmue said:
Come on. What do you expect the developer of the product to say here? They said the same thing about all the xbox one stuff that they rolled back, that people just weren't ready yet. It's called PR.
Click to expand...

I expect him to say "We believe in the future of our product and will be working hard to create a device the public will love"

Not make out that we are the problem.
 
LukasTaves said:
It makes sense. Kinect kinda make the 360 explode, but I feel if it did launch first with the xbone version reception would be way better.

So it makes sense to wait until the tech is ready for consumer price, instead of going to an inferior, cheaper alternative like they did with 360's kinect.
Click to expand...

I think the cause and effect is backwards. Kinect sold well because the 360 was everywhere and it was positioned well. It was at the price point of serious gifts for family. So non gamer got it for gamers. Gamers got it for their SO to give a casual introduction to gaming. Gamers got it themselves to try something new. It didn't expand the 360 market that much but the big 360 base enabled it to sell well.

With the XB1, the early adopters weren't super interested. It was bundled so you either gifted the whole expensive set or didn't so many scenarios where the Kinect was bought for people didn't happen. The casual game fans aren't going to drop $500 on any system. It was just poorly thought out. They missed why the original kinect sold and invented imaginary scenarios where they would dominate and convinced themselves it would happen.

PS. During the same time frame the PS4 eye sold out everywhere as did controllers because it tapped the same market segment of 'family' of gamers buying gifts for gamers. Despite the PS4 eye having next to 0 utility outside being a webcam for streaming.
 
I'll be ready for hololens when the FOV is better. The world will be ready when it basically fits into the size profile of sunglasses. This is tech for being out in the world.

I hope MS works with Oculus or someone on VR in the mean time as well. VR is entertainment technology. AR is enterprise / lifestyle.
 
Kinect failure? MS killed it themselves by un-bundling it and releasing no software worthy of it.

If this is how they support all their peripherals, then yes, do yourself a favor and shelf them.
 
harrisk954 said:
Typical Microsoft... they promote Hololens and show it E3 and other gaming-related shows in order to try and stay relevant in a world where their game industry competitors are all racing toward imminent consumer VR product releases. More smoke and mirrors by MS to try and generate unwarranted hype for the XB1, in my opinion.
Click to expand...

Maybe it's just me but hololens at E3 didn't sound like a sales pitch. It was a bunch of closed door events and they showed it off with minecraft without announcing any price or date. It seemed to me like they were testing the waters and with the feedback they got (potential cost + low FOV) they decided not to mass produce it to consumers.

Its not a weird conspiracy to generate hype, its just simple business sense as a potential reaction to VR and a gaming device.
 
Neuromancer said:
Remember when they said that Hololens would be available for the launch of Windows 10?
Click to expand...

They said it would be in the same "timeframe" which means "before Windows 11". Though a while after that, they announced that there wouldn't really be a "Windows 11" so still a bit misleading. I've always interpreted it as within 2 to 5 years since that was more or less the average time between major versions of Windows.
 
cakefoo said:
The Kinect excuse seems like a coverup, considering what happened just a week ago at TED:

Scoble said the Meta 2 field of view is “much bigger” than HoloLens
Click to expand...

Interesting, one thing I like in the picture of the guy wearing the headset is that the visor seems to be very transparent. Beeing able to see the user's face and eyes is in my opinion a very important point for AR, nobody likes to interact with people hiding their face. The Hololens visor is already too dark for my tastes.
 
ps3ud0 said:
I do wonder how well VR+cameras+real-time photogrammetry could ape AR and if that could become an acceptable alternative to traditional AR.

None of that at all addresses portability that something like Hololens is aiming for though.

ps3ud0 8)
Click to expand...

Mobile VR showing no signs of slowing down and things like inside out tracking being a focus and solutions like trackable arm-bands to 'mold' camera footage to correct aspects and 360 VR cameras also developing at a rapid pace... by the time real AR arrives VR will already have plenty of its aspects incorporated.

My mantra all along has been VR integrates AR far quicker than AR can ever integrate VR. VR is another technological goldrush that Microsoft are set to miss out on like total lemons hence the past year of pretending HoloLens was an actual thing hoping to quell Oculus/HTC/Sony buzz.
 
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