The Faceless Master
Member
i can the context if she just mentioned how she fucked half of Gearbox a few weeks ago
other than that ...
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Polygon/Verge writer says Naughty Dog staff said inappropriate things to her (quote)
- Thread starter Iacobellis
- Start date
i can the context if she just mentioned how she fucked half of Gearbox a few weeks ago
other than that ...
We dont know if anything was covered up here
TGO
Hype Train conductor. Works harder than it steams.
It depends on how much of shitbag that said person is.
We do know that this kind of behavior is not uncommon though.
I guess no need to cover anything if no one ever brings up anything.
"It's ok, she gave Uncharted 4 a 8.5"
Under federal law, it's illegal to terminate someone for filing a complain. He should have filed a retaliation claim against ND/Sony with OSHA, he doesn't even need to have any written evidence an oral complaint to ND/Sony would still be valid. The catch is this
"Complaints must be reported to OSHA within set timeframes following the retaliatory action, as prescribed by each law."
EDIT: https://www.whistleblowers.gov/index.html
You know what, I wonder how many employees even read up on their employee rights.
DAREALGUMMY
Member
Except a jury is presented evidence to help the jury decide on guilt or innocence. You don't have to believe the story but a lot of people are on the other side with hostility saying it was probably a "joke", not at work or something else that puts her to blame.
You don't know these people. How could you just decide to deny someone would say something like this? Is it just because you enjoy their products and don't want to believe it? Look around at what is coming out involving things like this. People can be total scum bags, especially in an industry where women are often held down and easily taken advantage of.
Fuck.
I can't.
Zoloft Sonic
Member
I've spent fifteen years working in film production and games. Some off-the-cuff observations:
-In 99% of cases, game dev environments are extremely insular sausage fests of extremely smart, focused, oblivious young men. Intense cliquing results.
-Game dev environments are stocked with men with a surplus of ego and technical skills, and a shortage of social skills. Particularly in senior/lead positions. (sorry guys.)
-The unspoken rule is *never* go to HR if you're experiencing harassment or abuse from a high-level developer. They will side with the more 'valuable' abuser every time and your on-the-job life will become hell.
-Film production has far more women in the workplace than gaming/software development, and has more of a high-pressure 'barracks sexuality' environment where coworkers tend to have casual sex and date more as a matter of course. This frequently spills over into inappropriate advances, especially when the power dynamics of positions comes into play.
-It's messy out there.
-In 99% of cases, game dev environments are extremely insular sausage fests of extremely smart, focused, oblivious young men. Intense cliquing results.
-Game dev environments are stocked with men with a surplus of ego and technical skills, and a shortage of social skills. Particularly in senior/lead positions. (sorry guys.)
-The unspoken rule is *never* go to HR if you're experiencing harassment or abuse from a high-level developer. They will side with the more 'valuable' abuser every time and your on-the-job life will become hell.
-Film production has far more women in the workplace than gaming/software development, and has more of a high-pressure 'barracks sexuality' environment where coworkers tend to have casual sex and date more as a matter of course. This frequently spills over into inappropriate advances, especially when the power dynamics of positions comes into play.
-It's messy out there.
why would someone talk to HR if they don't work there?
also what the fuck
Yes, and it's upsetting that these cases often focus on specific perpetrators, as if excising them will remove the sickness from the environment when the environment is an incubator for the sickness. No one should feel this way at work.
You can tell a lot of the "go to hr!" ppl are out of their element
TGO
Hype Train conductor. Works harder than it steams.
General Sexual harassment needs no motive
What was said was said to hurt and degrade.
That's not random, and it doesn't mean the victim is to blame.
The ND employer maybe just a piece of shit.
I meant the ND employer
Zoloft Sonic
Member
TyrantGuardian
Member
Let me put this bluntly for you:
Even if she did fuck literally every person working for Gearbox as well as Mojang in a huge gang-bang the comment from the ND employee would STILL count as sexual harrassment and be just as inappropriate.
Yes, thank you.
This is not a joke. It's just another way to demean a woman's accomplishments. When a manager made that "joke" to me, it was like all my hard work, my accomplishments meant absolutely nothing because I was still just a sex object to him. It was completely humiliating and I wanted to cry.
Instead I got him fired.
TGO
Hype Train conductor. Works harder than it steams.
Seriously?
Even if she did, that's none of his business and he should of been professional and keep that shit to himself.
Don't turn it into a console war thing. This is a fundamental humans suck thing.
Gentleman Jack
Member
I mean, i know you're just trying to make a point (that i don't disagree with), but i don't think Ms. Farokhmanesh would appreciate you defending her, while at the same time being this graphic and crude. :/
There's asking questions and then there's trying to find a hidden agenda and going out of your way to discredit or doubt a story that is simply very much believable, especially looking at all those recent revelations in various industries.
What's unfair? towards whom?
Who is claiming it's "only or mainly them"?
Nobody is making that claim. Nobody is saying "mainly Naughty Dog", what's bothering some is that it's "even Naughty Dog"
DAREALGUMMY
Member
Their point was that no matter what SHE chooses to do, it does not give someone the right to say something like that to her.
EDIT: You might get the point, but it seems obvious others need help.
I'm sorry you are going through this. I second the suggestion of keeping a log.
It makes it much harder to dismiss (even though they'll still try.)
TGO
Hype Train conductor. Works harder than it steams.
Even if she did, that's still no excuse
Which i absolutely agree with - that point could have been made exactly the way you just made it, by putting emphasis on her sexual agency and the fact that nothing legitimizes harassment, instead of trying to one-up the graphic description of the original poster. I'd just assume that, if i were the reporter, and i were reading the thread, i'd be like ... "uhm, okay? I mean, thanks, i guess, but also ... wtf?"
DarkMage619
$MSFT
Can you accuse a person of stealing with no proof and have that person punished? I have no idea if the allegations are true but if this woman was harassed or attacked she should alert the authorities not post vague accusations online. Has a person ever lied about harassment? If so we shouldn't take every accusation as true without due process.
The Dark One
Digital-Hero
Member
I've heard things uttered in game studios that cannot be repeated. No different from any other industry unfortunately. You'd think it was High School at times.
What are the authorities going to do about it? What world do you live in where that's a thing that would get this taken care of?
phantasmic_glaive
Member
Sounds like any job if you ask me, and I've worked in a lot of fields.
And if what you say is right, which I'm pretty sure it it is, then you would hear about this more and more about other developers. But you don't.. right now, it feels like ND's head is wanted. Bunch of people saying an employee of a company is not speaking up. Plus if you're a reporter, I'm pretty sure you know a name.
But that's that person and they do what they want..
Was anything ever made of the last guy who claimed this?
To be clear I have no stake in this. Harassment is fucked up and should be dealt with immediately. This Twitter shit seems suspect.
You're attributing motives where you have no knowledge. Most likely he was asking her for sex by using house of cards to say, hey, the reporter sleeps with her sources there, so you should sleep with me.
It's pretty obvious, unless English isn't your native language, then I'd understand how you could miss the implication.
WHO TOLD Y--oh yes, yes
Because going head to head with names can be a career ending move.
Look at Terry Crews coming out with his own experience about being sexually harrassed by hollywood execs, he doesn't name anybody either because he knows he could get blacklisted over it.
People are afraid, man.
TGO
Hype Train conductor. Works harder than it steams.
Never seen House of Cards.
I'm obviously missing the reference.
CaviarMeths
Member
Imagine coming into a thread 15 pages late and think you're enlightening everyone with this "should have done" shit.
Are you surprised though? This is the same gaming community that found excuses when Alison Rapp was fired after GamerGate attacked her and her employer failed to defend her because of doing some "sexy" cosplay, this is the same community that makes excuses for CEO's that send memos to their employees saying not to talk about GamerGate publicly or privately, the same exact community that doesn't mind that parties promoted by publishers/show booths are filled with women dressed like they are doing some auditions for Baywatch or that executives/developers ask for women with bikinis in beds to do a fucking business interview.
The standard is so low that I'm not even surprised anymore. I expect this kind of thing of disgusting behaviour of always trying to "look on the other side": what has she done that warranted this comment? what was she wearing? what has she done in the past? it was just a joke! It's fucking depressing but unfortunately I don't have the memory of a fish, so this kind of behaviour is expected from the gaming community. Just pathetic.
This is facts. Ppl need to ask less about the context of dude's shitty statement and more about the context of an environment where the "proper channels" hold 0 weight and ppl involved feel overwhelming powerlessness in the day to day
DarkMage619
$MSFT
Does this person have a boss? What about the police? Who do you talk to if you accuse someone of wrong doing? Why go online with vague allegations? Give the name to the head of the organization so that there can be a proper inquiry. That will also give that person a chance to defend him/herself.
Again why is there an assumption of guilt on the naughty dog employee? What about a presumption of innocence? Can I accuse you of something based solely on my word and have you punished? Is that even fair?
There needs to be due process we are all entitled to that. ALL OF US.
The Dark One
DAREALGUMMY
Member
There is no accused. There is no due process. In a time where powerful people are being exposed, stories like these told to give others the strength to either come out with theirs to not remain silent or find comfort that they're not alone.
Not sure I've seen a better tag for a user than yours. Is it new?
Ppl are saying that due process in corporate environments favors the perpetrator; that those who hold particular power, whether it's via their position, the company's perception of their value, or unspoken social dynamics or whatever, are able to get away with disgusting behavior due to priorities of those around them. This includes bosses and police and inquiries done by ppl who dont have your best interests as a priority (lawyers, hr, bosses, coworkers, etc.)
I think it's fine to presume innocence, but i also think it's reasonable to empathize with those who have been repeatedly burned by this assumption. It is certainly not a case of "the truth will prevail in the end"; the truth is often framed by those w/ the most capital, both social and $s.
See, she didn't even name the developer. Hence we don't need to bother the "what if they get fired?" So don't bother protecting "someone" who isn't being named nor personally accused. She intentionally called out an unnamed developer. Not because she wants to ruin one career, but rather to add additional information to whether or not it's plausible that someone at ND might sexually harass others.
So how about we don't bother "defending" someone who doesn't need to be defended because they haven't even been named yet.
Holy shit. How can anyone defend this? No way this flies in any professional setting. Pretty fucked up that people are attacking her.
Fuck me, you're right. Considering all the shit that's coming out of Hollywood right now, I'm not even sure why I had that thought. Just because I'm horrified by that behavior doesn't mean a lot of people aren't.
Fuck me, you're right. Considering all the shit that's coming out of Hollywood right now, I'm not even sure why I had that thought. Just because I'm horrified by that behavior doesn't mean a lot of people aren't.
Interfectum
Member
MaximumSpider
Banned
Naughty Dog just keeps digging
mckmas8808
Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
Or it could be the cult of a male-dominated society that they aren't willing to let go of. Why narrow it down just to a company?