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Poor Vita performance dragging down Sony's entire gaming unit
- Thread starter SmokedMeat
- Start date
butter_stick
Banned
lunchwithyuzo
Banned
If you want to talk trends, then XL tripled the previous week's 3DS sales in 2 days. If we use June's weekly 3DS average from NPD, that'd mean about 95k sales in the first 48 hours.
Bending_Unit_22
Member
Not unexpected in the least. The dedicated handheld market isn't dead but it's reverted back to its pre-DS/PSP structure where it can only support one major handheld I think (and thought). The situation certainly hasn't been helped by both players getting it in their head that it was ok to release $200+ handhelds. Sony deciding to release the more expensive handheld, later, and with a focus on the smaller share of the remaining handheld demographics doomed the Vita before it released.
That being said, I can't imagine Sony would kill it right before the PS4 launch. That would be a terrible signal to consumers and 3rd parties, well a handful at least. It would be similar to the effect on the Saturn of the 32X being killed off early. At this point I think the best route for Sony is:
That being said, I can't imagine Sony would kill it right before the PS4 launch. That would be a terrible signal to consumers and 3rd parties, well a handful at least. It would be similar to the effect on the Saturn of the 32X being killed off early. At this point I think the best route for Sony is:
- quietly shut down the Vita production line (if it hasn't been already),
- continue to string along the fanbase with promises of future promises,
- sell as many as they can at $300 with memory card,
- devote only the resources required to keep the above going at a minimum loss,
- accept the Vita venture won't be profitible but hope the future losses will be less than what would have been lost on the PS4 if the Vita were outright killed early,
- decide method of death and any future life in Suite, PSN, or whatever after the PS4 has been out for a year.
Doesn´t really matter if its 250 or 300, i seriously doubt many people are going to spend that money for a inferior version of the game they can play for 60 bucks on the system they already have. Oh and i would also like to add that the Call of Duty crowd probably gives a flying fuck about handhelds.
arguably indeed...
Loghorn150
Banned
But they can't keep taking a ton more losses on their gaming division forever. If that keeps happening, then sooner or later, investors/shareholders will force Sony to drop the division entirely.
Speedymanic
Banned
They do have Ratchet and Clank as well as Jax and Daxter and finally Sly. They don't have their own Pokemon, but then it would be pretty hard to replicate its success, the now dead Digimon is testament to this.
I do think Sony have slouched with the vita, they thought their core console games would help push the handheld and while those games are great, they aren't really what most people want from a handheld. They want games that can be played in short bursts and the only games that Sony have on that front are Luminies, Mutant Blobs and Stardust.
I also think not shipping the unit with the mem card was a huge mistake as was the decision to use proprietary mem cards instead of allowing any as is the case with the 3DS and PSP.
The lack of PS1 support, well, the less said about that, the better.
Sony have a good handheld, but they don't seem at all bothered by the lack of releases or by the lack of commitment from third parties for games beyond a few that most people won't really be interested in.
The really strange thing is that the handheld is lacking some of Sony's core franchises like GT, GoW, those platformers listed above as well as many others that were somewhat popular on the PSP.
"No really, guys, Vita Heaven any day now! Also PS1 games *snicker*"
Canis lupus
Member
No one supports the idea of Vita becoming a chain of smartphones and tablets?
BLACK AMERICAN PSYCHO
Junior Member
grand theft auto liberty city stories sold over 7 million and vice city stories sold over 4
Is every other device you own capable of running a web browser broken? That's what would have to happen before I would browse GAF on my Vita.
yellowjacket25
Member
I think it is a games machine for people who play games.
The issue is clearly price...I only managed to get it through saving loads through a bit of trading here & there, likewise the 3DS, I only got it at launch due to getting a price mistake somewhere for ~ £150 IIRC.
The Vita price was ok(ish) until 3DS dropped - then it was very expensive, but a massive nail in the coffin for Vita is the mem stick prices - outragous - and don't start me on the whole user locking thing.
If this was £150 and had the same type of openess off the PS3 and had remote play it would be perfect IMHO.
The Vita price was ok(ish) until 3DS dropped - then it was very expensive, but a massive nail in the coffin for Vita is the mem stick prices - outragous - and don't start me on the whole user locking thing.
If this was £150 and had the same type of openess off the PS3 and had remote play it would be perfect IMHO.
Nice try, Kaz.
Bending_Unit_22
Member
You said it was the biggest franchise in media though. I wouldn't be surprised if it has the largest launches but Star Wars at least has to be bigger as a franchise (I'm sure there are others that's just what first came to mind).
BLACK AMERICAN PSYCHO
Junior Member
lol if I was a third party developer I wouldn't even touch ps4 if they shut down vita. Sony is about to loose a hell of alot of money on ps4 then they ever Will on vita
Robert at Zeboyd Games
Banned
If support for the Vita completely dried up next year, I would still be happy with my purchase. I like several games that are already out and Persona 4 is one of my favorite games of all time so I can't wait for the enhanced portable version to be released. And a big advantage for me is that it's a noticeably better PSP since I don't own any UMD (Vita has a better screen, option to stick controls on the right stick, lower load times, and on a few PSP games it even has better frame rates from what I've heard).
Even if Sony manages to turn things around for the Vita, it's not going to exceed the 3DS or iPhone/Android in sales. It's not going to "win" this generation of portable consoles. But you know what? It doesn't have to. There have been examples of consoles in the past like the Gamecube that were not the most popular console of their generation but still managed to both A) make the console owner a profit and B) entertain gamers with quality games.
But yeah, as a developer, the only way I'm touching the Vita is if Sony offers us a nice deal to port our stuff over. I love owning and playing games on the system, but making a living is nice too.
Even if Sony manages to turn things around for the Vita, it's not going to exceed the 3DS or iPhone/Android in sales. It's not going to "win" this generation of portable consoles. But you know what? It doesn't have to. There have been examples of consoles in the past like the Gamecube that were not the most popular console of their generation but still managed to both A) make the console owner a profit and B) entertain gamers with quality games.
But yeah, as a developer, the only way I'm touching the Vita is if Sony offers us a nice deal to port our stuff over. I love owning and playing games on the system, but making a living is nice too.
Metallix87
Member
Again, that was a MUCH healthier system ecosystem, though, and it still didn't reach the full sales potential that said franchise was known for at that time.
I'm not saying Black Ops Vita bombs. I think it'll hit a million, maybe two million worldwide in the long run. It just won't be the system seller that Vita needs.
BLACK AMERICAN PSYCHO
Junior Member
people who want to play games on the go without gimped controls or shitty hardware
The problem with this tactic is that the Third Party support is already down the gutter. Sony alone can´t even provide enough software to keep the Vita alive the first half of 2013. Without miracle the Vita is going to be a completely dead platform in early 2013.
lol, I think Sony made the Vita for me...I hate the controls of iTouch etc, I liked 3DS but the lack of 2nd stick and that odd thumbstick meant it's control was only ok (for me) however the tumbs on Vita are great and the OLED is stunning.
No... really, no....
Metallix87
Member
Now THIS is a truly absurd post. What makes the 3DS's controls gimped and/or the hardware shitty, exactly?
BLACK AMERICAN PSYCHO
Junior Member
this will happen. they've already basically admitted it
They can't since it would compete with Sony Mobile and you can't have two divisions in a bloated company compete.
butter_stick
Banned
That's a pretty tiny market. I guess there's little wonder why Sony have ended up in this situation.
Both were also released on the PS2 .
Metallix87
Member
They have? This is news to me!
Canis lupus
Member
Pokemon is bigger than Star Wars.
Bending_Unit_22
Member
I could see it as an option in the future, but as I noted I think any attempt to shift the Vita base over to a tablet would be counterproductive right now. After the PS4 is out I would think it might work to release a more gaming friendlly tablet and try to get the Vita fanbase to pick it up since all their games will move right over. Maybe do something like if you have a registered Vita you get a $50 off coupon as well to further mollify what will likely be not terribly thrilled Vita owners. Would also give the tablet a little kickstart.
Horse Armour
Member
Single analog, 240p resolution, worse graphics than an ipod touch from 2010?
lunchwithyuzo
Banned
So where's Vita hiding L2/R2/L3/R3?
Man-is-Obsolete
Member
They really need to build in at least 1-2 gigs of usable storage and drop the price to $200. If the building in storage isn't possible without an expensive redesign then just throw a 4 GB card in with every purchase.if they do this soon there is still potential in turning this thing around and at the very least carving out a respectable market that has an active user base. Hopefully at Gamescom they lay out a clear plan for this thing.
Jaded Alyx
Member
The bulk of those were on the PS2.
GeorgioCostanzaX
Gold Member
If they aren't willing to commit to Vita I at least hope they have something in the works with GAIKAI for all their mobile devices: I'd be perfectly fine if the Vita morphed into just another screen to consume streaming PS1 - PS4 content at this point if the alternative is Dreamcast like abandonment.
lunchwithyuzo
Banned
The best games ever made are ~240p and use 1 or less analogs. <3
3DS hardware is very clearly behind Vita's. It's a shame Vita is tanking so bad because I do feel like it sets a better precedent for gamers and the industry than 3DS or ios does, at least as far as hardware goes. That's why it hurts to see it bomb so horribly.
Maybe LBP will? People go on about price of this and that - but imagine a £180 Vita with mem stick & LBP - that alone would give you endless gaming.
Metallix87
Member
This is a handheld, not a console. I'm not saying it's ideal, because it's not, but 240p resolution gets the job done well enough. Single analog is debatable, but really, the only game on 3DS that would've really benefited from dual analog is Kid Icarus, and they didn't even bother to have it properly support the CPP.
Wouldn't every 3DS game have to be designed with dual analogue controls in mind for the controls to be considered "gimped" though? Because as of right now most of them don't need dual analogue.
Jaded Alyx
Member
What makes you think LBP is a big franchise in gaming, let alone a system seller?
back touch can be mapped - apparently
Bending_Unit_22
Member
I wouldn't think they'd be that pissed since they aren't touching the Vita as it is for the most part, but yeah killing the Vita before the PS4 launches wouldn't help the PS4 in any way.
True, I didn't say it would work just that given their options right now I think it's the best one. As I noted if you ask me the best option for Sony was to not release the Vita as is so an early market forced death wouldn't shock me.
I don't know the exact numbers but that would surprise me since Star Wars has been a phenomena for 35 years now and Pokemon is less than 15 years old. Either way, that would make them both bigger than Call of Duty which was my point.
Metallix87
Member
That's the thing, though: Vita's superior hardware is basically what's put Sony into such a dire situation, since they can't afford to price cut. Nintendo was smart with the design of the 3DS in that respect.
How did the PSP game do? Anyone have numbers on that sucker? Mind you, that was a much healthier ecosystem, but it's still something to consider.
Honestly, though, I doubt it. The system seller the Vita needs would likely have to be a new, unique IP that screams "buy this system, because you can only get this game here!" I'm not sure what that title would be.
BLACK AMERICAN PSYCHO
Junior Member
I was talking about smartphones when I said gimped controls ( though I do wish my 3ds had a second slide pad.) And 3ds hardware is absolutely horrible even for Nintendo. They didn't have to put a quad core CPU/GPU in 3ds but that doesn't mean it had to suck. And iPod touch which is running on almost 3 year old technology has better hardware than vita.(build quality,CPU,GPU, everything). Even low end android phones are better than 3ds.(400x240 screen? how the hell did they even find someone to make that?,shitty cheap plastic, scratches screen by itself, ect.) The 3ds was rushed IMO.
?? and any other FPS/3rd person/ released
i think it's because someone at planet Sony thought there was millions upon millions in the hardcore demographics itching and scratching to get a handheld console that doesn't cater to casuals.