Support NeoGAF

[Mesoian]

Even if we assume that everyone who plays AM2R ignores every indie Metroidvania on the market right now, we already know that those games can be successful. Guacamelee and Ori have both sold over 500k on PC alone. Whether Nintendo wants to ignore this fact or not is up to them.

EXACTLY.

And after all this time, it's pretty clear that they simply aren't interested, especially when the best titles in the genre still hit Nintendo platforms.

Which is why people thinking that they would just be cool with this is all the more crazy to me. This project doesn't push people towards existing metroid products. It doesn't push them towards other products on the eshop. It doesn't raise awareness towards the metroid projects in the pipeline. It actively distracts the public eye from what Nintendo is ACTUALLY doing with Metroid while providing 0 avenues for new revenue. OF COURSE THEY WOULD KILL THIS!

 

[Menitta]

Right now the Metroid fanbase is FURIOUS with Nintendo to the point they saw necessary to make a video explaining how they're just misunderstanding their new game lol. Surely they could have tried a new approach to fan works here but they didn't, and that's fair, but it'll only affect their relationship with fans, and that sucks. One

Link?

 

[Chezzymann]

It sucks but companies gotta protect their brand. If they allowed anyone to make alternate versions of their games or use their characters then their brand would become devalued. So they gotta shut down all the fan projects even if they aren't making any money.

At least that's what corporate old people logic is

 

[Astral/H3X]

My theory os that Nintendo knew they had to shut it down, for whatever legal reasons the bosses come up with, but decided to wait till it was already released, thus allowing it to exist anyway.

 

[collige]

But that's still naive because it's still a case of, "Hey man, we don't want people using our IP without our permission. You would want the same if this was your thing too."

It's not really naive since the bolded isn't true. As many people have pointed out, companies like Valve, Capcom, and Sega have taken far less antagonistic attitudes towards fan projects. You could argue that the dev was naive for not expecting that Nintendo would do this since Nintendo always does shit like this, but that doesn't mean that it's a beneficial stance for any of the parties involved.

 

[TheMoon]

It's alright, guys. Nintendo knows this is what Metroid fans really want, not that fan created phony baloney.

spoiler]In all seriousness, they do have the right to do this, but the way they went about it is pretty damn shitty. Get fucked, Nintendo.[/spoiler]

The way they went about this? You mean like waiting AFTER it has been released and everybody can play it so none of this actually matters? Yea, real shitty of them. Ugh, where's my torch!

 

[Decado]

Should we grab all metroid ROM hacks now, too? Or will they not be effected?

Feel bad for the guy who out so much work into this only to be shut down a day after release.

 

[LambdaTeos]

this killed me twice...

I, too, come here to say, like a lot of people, that Nintendo is in their right to do this

And actually, foolish people thinking this was not gonna happen

 

[StarStabbedMoon]

Humanity is so hopeless . Everything is politics now.


"Fuck this shit Nintendo is garbage why didnt they just let this guy release this Nintendo game for free?"

"Here's why, it makes sense, and it was always a possibility."

"Wow, corporate bootlicking shill fanboy"

There's nothing more political than being against one's own interest to benefit a more powerful entity.

 

[Nairume]

Nobody should be surprised. Everyone saying Nintendo wouldn't do anything looks damn foolish right now.

I don't feel foolish.

Myself and others stated before that, historically speaking, they ignored projects that weren't doing obvious things that would make themselves targets (re: asking for money, competing with existing products, etc). I fully admit that I may be wrong in this situation, but I don't feel at all wrong for stating what was simply the precedent going into this release.

 

[Regginator]

HOW ABOUT GIVING US A NEW FUCKING 2D METROID, NINTENDO

 

[Linkstrikesback]

Link?

The video they were talking about was part of a Nintendo direct, where they spent the time talking about FF as trying to explain why it was a thing.

I think it's this one.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m6k3SyXU97k

 

[Green Mamba]

Which is why people thinking that they would just be cool with this is all the more crazy to me. This project doesn't push people towards existing metroid products. It doesn't push them towards other products on the eshop. It doesn't raise awareness towards the metroid projects in the pipeline. It actively distracts the public eye from what Nintendo is ACTUALLY doing with Metroid while providing 0 avenues for new revenue. OF COURSE THEY WOULD KILL THIS!

Wouldn't want to call attention to their awful franchise mismanagement you mean.

 

[Opa-Pa]

Link?

You mean the video? I was talking about the Federation Force segment in the last Direct.

 

[Mesoian]

It doesn't fix it, but it throws the fans a bone.

When capcom didn't have a megaman game to release on the anniversary, but a big fanmade game was coming out, megaman x street fighter I think it was, they actually did some promotion for it, rather than shoot it down.
Heck, they even have a webpage on capcom.com for it (though it appears to be barely functional on my machine)
http://megaman.capcom.com/sfxmm/sfxmm_dl_uk.html

That's the right sort of approach to this if you want to help build goodwill with a fanbase, not "IF WE AREN'T DOING IT, NO-ONE CAN", which just leaves nobody happy.

But that's how intellectual property works man. It has to be them because THEY OWN IT.

Wouldn't want to call attention to their awful franchise mismanagement you mean.

That's definitely part of it. Yup. This being on the market amidst people bemoaning the mere existence of federation force is not a good look.

But money is still the driving force behind this.

 

[MegaManTrigger]

What's the problem? People will use their it's in different ways even games like they've always have. High exposure games are what catch the lawyers attention and take them down, and they get the attention because of the quality. Having a cherry picked partnership would benefit both and the fan base instead of this shit show.

The situation now it's Nintendo lawyers being lawyers and cracking down on anything, instead of development Nintendo do or even executive Nintendo. And taking the side of soul eating lawyers is a no go for me.

The problem is thinking that it's completely okay to use a company's assets, ideas, game frameworks, etc. without doing the necessary homework to acquire permission to use them. You assume it's about quality, when it really has nothing to do with this. You forget that Nintendo has the original game on the VC, which the remake directly conflicts with. "Soul eating lawyers" have nothing to do with this. If you want to be biased about that, then fine, but there are legitimate reasons for the law as outlined.

 

[diaspora]

Meh, it's already been released online. I might end up hosting a GAF-only link myself.

 

[Chronus]

Boy, am I glad I downloaded it before the shit storm.

 

[timetokill]

Sounds like nobody in here has ever made something and then had their IP infringed.

 

[Sami+]

When it puts money in their pocket, yes.

Sega still fucks up a lot though.



Tee hee no.

Uh? Clarify?

The last time I recall that SEGA fucked up fan relations is the Streets of Rage 2 remake cancellation 5 years ago, under different management. One of their employees actually tweeted about that a day or two ago saying "5 years is a really long time in this industry".

I don't understand why you're trying to discredit the claim that they've been doing a good job in this regard.

 

[Shadoken]

You would think nobody would support decisions like this , yet some Nintendo fanboys will still do it.

Nintendo could do a lot of things, but they won't xd.

I don't understand how this is an argument. It's not about fanboyism (I'm consider myself a critic), it's about logic.

So lets get this straight. Nintendo continues to ignore the fangame community and act like dicks. When other companies embrace it like Sega,Valve and Capcom.

You reply with LOLOLOL Nintendo > ALL. So yes Sega HAS set a standard , especially for Japanese companies working with the fanbase. And Nintendo fails pretty heavily in this regard and dont seem to want to change anytime soon. You dont have to defend everything Nintendo does.

 

[HvySky]

The way they went about this? You mean like waiting AFTER it has been released and everybody can play it so none of this actually matters? Yea, real shitty of them. Ugh, where's my torch!

Sucks that Nintendo would obviously be aware of this remake, but wait years for the guy to finish his hard work and then shit on him a day after he releases his project. Not like he's taking money for it. Like I said, it's Nintendo's right to do whatever they desire with their property, but they could have come out of this looking better, I think.

 

[Menitta]

The video they were talking about was part of a Nintendo direct, where they spent the time talking about FF as trying to explain why it was a thing.

I think it's this one.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m6k3SyXU97k

Oh yeah, I remember that. Thank you.

I misread the post.

 

[HawthorneKitty]

Sounds like nobody in here has ever made something and then had their IP infringed.

What did you expect?

 

[Linkstrikesback]

But that's how intellectual property works man. It has to be them because THEY OWN IT.

It doesn't have to be. That's exactly why I just in that quoted post gave an example of a company dealing with it in a way that doesn't piss the fanbase off, with capcom officially endorsing the fangame Megaman x street fighter , which released on the 25th anniversary of megaman. Yes, Nintendo is 100% within it's own rights to take down the remake. That doesn't make it a good idea, unfortunately.

 

[Andrew Evenstar]

Sounds like some fanboys are just mad some amateur put out a better Metroid game than Nintendo for free. It's okay guys, no ones taking Federation Force away from you.

I agree. Too late Nintendo, game is everywhere and it is awesome.

 

[LambdaTeos]

Sucks that Nintendo would obviously be aware of this remake, but wait years for the guy to finish his hard work and then shit on him a day after he releases his project. Not like he's taking money for it. Like I said, it's Nintendo's right to do whatever they desire with their property, but they could have come out of this looking better, I think.

it's not like someone forced him to do the project without Nintendo's permission to use their IP...

And come out looking better? ... I don't see why a company should even care about the grade of effort a person puts to use their IP illegally...

 

[SinCityAssassin]

Within their rights: Yes.

Shitty thing to community: Yes.

Thread.

 

[timetokill]

I agree. Too late Nintendo, game is everywhere and it is awesome.

Question to the mods: Are this poster (and others) cruisin' for a bruisin' ? (Or permaban as it were).

Is this being treated as piracy or what? Sorry if I missed any official statement on it.

 

[Durante]

That Valve still makes directly money with it, this pretty much helps Valve to be okay with it.

Hmm, to make that equivalence work, Nintendo would have had to offer the developers of AM2R the opportunity to sell it on the eshop.

 

[Kierian]

Part of me thinks that AM2R had the potential to drum up some interest for Federation Force (which I still can’t believe is coming out next week) but, I can't say for sure.

One thing is for certain though, this doesn't bode well for that Mother 4 fan game.

 

[Mesoian]

Uh? Clarify?

The last time I recall that SEGA fucked up fan relations is the Streets of Rage 2 remake cancellation 5 years ago, under different management. One of their employees actually tweeted about that a day or two ago saying "5 years is a really long time in this industry".

I don't understand why you're trying to discredit the claim that they've been doing a good job in this regard.

Remember when Sega was doing DMCA takedowns on youtube videos on older titles in the "Shining" series because they wanted to generate more traffic towards the official videos of the last Shining game?

Sega still fucks up a lot when it comes to interacting with enthusiast works.

The other part of that post was about Nintendo saying they have plans for a 2d Metroid. They don't. They haven't in years.

 

[Eolz]

Question to the mods: Are this poster (and others) cruisin' for a bruisin' ? (Or permaban as it were).

Is this being treated as piracy or what? Sorry if I missed any official statement on it.

It's not piracy no. It's a fangame infringing on copyrights.

 

[SinCityAssassin]

Question to the mods: Are this poster (and others) cruisin' for a bruisin' ? (Or permaban as it were).

Is this being treated as piracy or what? Sorry if I missed any official statement on it.

It's not piracy as you're not illegally downloading a known game on the market, but a fan project heavily reminiscent towards one that uses the assets.

 

[HvySky]

it's not like someone forced him to do the project without Nintendo's permission to use their IP...

And come out looking better? ... I don't see why a company should even care about the grade of effort a person puts to use their IP illegally...

Hmm? I've already stated multiple times Nintendo can do whatever they want, as it's their property. What's done is done, one way or the other. Doesn't make it come off as less of a dick move to the community.

 

[diaspora]

Part of me thinks that AM2R had the potential to drum up some interest for Federation Force (which I still can’t believe is coming out next week) but, I can't say for sure.

One thing is for certain though, this doesn't bode well for that Mother 4 fan game.

I don't think anything can.

 

[collige]

EXACTLY.

And after all this time, it's pretty clear that they simply aren't interested, especially when the best titles in the genre still hit Nintendo platforms.

Which is why people thinking that they would just be cool with this is all the more crazy to me. This project doesn't push people towards existing metroid products. It doesn't push them towards other products on the eshop. It doesn't raise awareness towards the metroid projects in the pipeline. It actively distracts the public eye from what Nintendo is ACTUALLY doing with Metroid while providing 0 avenues for new revenue. OF COURSE THEY WOULD KILL THIS!

So let me get this straight. You admit that this project has no relation to any games that N are currently developing, but insist that its existence will somehow hurt these games that have no relation by pushing consumers towards other Metroidvanias. Metroidvanias that N will profit from due to them being on the eShop. That makes no sense whatsoever.

Someone being introduced to Metroid through this game could end up buying N hardware to play older games in the series. Someone playing this game could also be inspired to pick up other games on the eShop. There are many scenarios where this could make money for Nintendo but virtually none where the lose money. If they were really smart, they would have the dev re-release the game on Nintendo systems as a canon remake with extra polish.

 

[Nairume]

It doesn't have to be. That's exactly why I just in that quoted post gave an example of a company dealing with it in a way that doesn't piss the fanbase off, with capcom officially endorsing the fangame Megaman x street fighter , which released on the 25th anniversary of megaman. Yes, Nintendo is 100% within it's own rights to take down the remake. That doesn't make it a good idea, unfortunately.

MMxSF happened after Capcom had already started bailing from making Mega Man games.

There's a new Metroid game out in two weeks.

 

[Opa-Pa]

All that being said, I still think the game might still not been 'officially forbidden' by Nintendo. Some people pointed out that while Metroid Database took down their mirror after receiving the letter, they didn't delete the article about the game that had the links to MF and FD. And the actual devs have still to receive a warning.

I still think it's possible Nintendo took down those links because they were affiliated with a site that sells Metroid merchandising. Maybe if the devs re-upload it themselves it won't happen again... Or they can get a letter later today lol, who knows.

Edit: damn my other reply got buried already, oh well.

 

[Gaogaogao]

dmca is the shittiest, most futile bullshit ever.

 

[diaspora]

I don't know why it'd be bannable to share a link to the game. It's not developed by Nintendo and frankly wouldn't be much different from sharing fan art with AM2R being some fucking amazing fan art.

 

[Mudcrab]

Sounds like nobody in here has ever made something and then had their IP infringed.

Yeah I'm also not a billion dollar corporation either.

 

[Mesoian]

Sucks that Nintendo would obviously be aware of this remake, but wait years for the guy to finish his hard work and then shit on him a day after he releases his project. Not like he's taking money for it. Like I said, it's Nintendo's right to do whatever they desire with their property, but they could have come out of this looking better, I think.

Yes, THIS is why people should really be angry. I'm not saying the guy couldn't have saved himself a whole lot of trouble and effort with a phonecall to NOA letting them know what he was planning on doing, but yeah, not killing this project 6 months ago and doing it upon the day of release is just rude.

 

[Nairume]

All that being said, I still think the game might still not been 'officially forbidden' by Nintendo. Some people pointed out that while Metroid Database took down their mirror after receiving the letter, they didn't delete the article about the game that had the links to MF anf FD. And the actual devs have still to receive a warning.

I still think it's possible Nintendo took down those links because they were affiliated with a site that sells Metroid merchandising. Maybe if the devs re-upload it themselves it won't happen again... Or they can get a letter later today lol, who knows.

Edit: damn my other reply got buried already, oh well.

That is indeed a distinct possibility, considering the other host sites do generate ad revenue for people going there to download shit.

 

[Kyzer]

I wonder how long you're going to pretend that playing a fan made product of something that doesn't officially exist is piracy.

Ok sorry, is bootlegging more accurate? Lol

 

[timetokill]

It's not piracy no. It's a fangame infringing on copyrights.

It's not piracy as you're not illegally downloading a known game on the market, but a fan project heavily reminiscent towards one that uses the assets.

Wow dudes why don't you guys make your names red so it's clear to the rest of us?

Yeah I'm also not a billion dollar corporation either.

You don't have to be to understand how IP law works.

 

[TheMoon]

Should we grab all metroid ROM hacks now, too? Or will they not be effected?

Feel bad for the guy who out so much work into this only to be shut down a day after release.

ROMhacks have nothing to do with this.

 

[Coffee Dog]

Why did Nintendo wait until the project was completed? It was openly in development for years and they could have taken it down at any time.

 

[MegaManTrigger]

It doesn't have to be. That's exactly why I just in that quoted post gave an example of a company dealing with it in a way that doesn't piss the fanbase off, with capcom officially endorsing the fangame Megaman x street fighter , which released on the 25th anniversary of megaman. Yes, Nintendo is 100% within it's own rights to take down the remake. That doesn't make it a good idea, unfortunately.

MMxSF is a terrible example considering that it did nothing to quell the shitstorm of Capcom's bad PR in cancelling their Mega Man projects. In fact, people berated Capcom for going the lazy route and endorsing a fangame instead of making their own.

 

[Shadoken]

Remember when Sega was doing DMCA takedowns on youtube videos on older titles in the "Shining" series because they wanted to generate more traffic towards the official videos of the last Shining game?

Sega still fucks up a lot when it comes to interacting with enthusiast works.

Heyy guess what that also happened nearly 4 years back in 2012 , under said management. And there was some misunderstanding between Sega Japan and America in that case , and Sega apologized and got the vids back up. So no your point is wrong. They have changed and are much more embracing of the fan community.

I dont get the point in downplaying other Japanese companies' efforts in fixing their shit like Capcom and Sega just to defend Nintendo's dick moves , in regard to fan involvement. And lets not even start talking about how they were going to take down Smash from Evo.