The mistake here is thinking the decline will be permanent. There's a bigger chance of a re emergence than a never ending decline.
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PS3 appears to have finally outsold the 360?
- Thread starter Psycho_Mantis
- Start date
The mistake here is thinking the decline will be permanent. There's a bigger chance of a re emergence than a never ending decline.
Sony will only be able to do that if they offer a SKU with 8-16GB flash in NA.
I'm not sure why they haven't already or if they plan to at all, I'm sure they would offered one earlier.
No, but it would need a hefty price drop and past-gen casual game releases to appeal to the same younger audiences the PS2 appealed to. We don't know if that will happen and how long third party publishers will keep releasing their crossgen games.
I'm not so sure about that. Ultimately they made their money in a much shorter period of time, and spent less investing in it in the first place. When you consider that the Wii sold 90m consoles at a profit but was only heavily promoted for five or so years, it doesn't look too bad at all.
The big problem was in not having a successor system waiting in the wings to take over much earlier, but having a console that can sell that much in half the time it will take the competition isn't really a bad thing.
WiiU is obviously another whole bag of problems, but the Wii did pretty well.
BibiMaghoo
Member
Yeah, amazon also have the 12Gb for £150. I agree the 12Gb model is pretty gash, my brother got one for christmas and I ended up having to give him an HDD, as he couldn't download a single plus game due to the PS3 needing twice the space of the game to install. £100 for it would be fine though.
However, look at the price of a 250Gb 360. Amazon has them at £189.00, so for £11 more you double your storage space and have a Bluray player over buying a 360. I would imagine this has something to do with the cost. I don't think at the moment £200 is alot for 500Gb model, but it would sell better at £150 I am sure.
McValdemar
Member
Man, I really damn hope so.
A console only drove by western games... ....well is no longer a console for me.
But Japan studios have been huge disappointment this gen.
And they really need to stop mimicking western studios and get back evolving their way of doing games.
Well, if western third party games are all you care about, it is pretty important.
That said... both systems get basically the same games. I understand the fanboy shit, I really do, but the common enemy is Apple and Nintendo. I am personally terrified at the specter of both the PS4 and Xbox 4(hours away from announcement, hah) coming out and just flopping on their ass, while the new iPad sells out the asshole, and the 3DS is the top selling console this fall.
I really hope Microsoft has some truly amazing shit to show off today. Because what I saw from Sony at the PS4 unveil was profound ignorance as to the current state the of the gaming market.
something fishy
Member
I've got a feeling this is just the incorrect January forecast reused. MS would have to have sold minus numbers and sony somehow made up a couple of minimum whilst selling very few during the quiet time of year to manage this.
it'll be late this year they finally do it.
it'll be late this year they finally do it.
Krisprolls
Banned
I disagree completely. I still don't understand how Ipad games are supposed to take over the world when there's no controller on an Ipad. How are you supposed to play deep games ? I still don't understand.
PS4 meeting focused on core gaming, that's what they had to do and it was successful because of that. Ipad is not a competitor for PS4 and Xbox since there's no controller on it.
Cornbread78
Member
It's a matter of time, true or not.
Yup.... time for all the "Those numbers are complete $hit posters" Sony defense force, and 360 Defense force, time to assemble to up-play or down-play any numbers presented.....
Embarassing and funny as hell is what it is.....
something fishy
Member
they halved their market share, lost their market dominance and were hugely outsold by the market leading Wii.
Not really great.
In truth they were the biggest losers, all others had big increases in market share. That's all you'd see as an investor.
The face of gaming has changed, being a playstation no longer ensures dominance and I suspect this is why they look to have planned a new box that will do better for next gen. This new more even market has made them compete and it's great for customers.
FalsettoVibe
Member
I knew this was coming sooner or later. PS3 will continue to sell even after PS4 is out. I can't see 360 doing that.
Krisprolls
Banned
Yeah. I think MS decided to finish last place on purpose. It made investors happy.
But they did get Blu-ray out there, and it did win the format war because of it. No idea how lucrative that's been for Sony though. I'd also say that their loss has been core gamers gain, since it's forced them to up the out put from their first party considerably, and we've had some amazing gems as a result, and continue to do so.
dragonfart28
Banned
So how many PS3s does Sony have to sell to recover the $4 Billion they lost last gen?
something fishy
Member
well, they tripled their sales volume not halved it. is that supposed to be a negative then? Position seems fairly irrelevant when numbers are so close. Market share growth or otherwise matters far more.
just being realistic about the businesses.
Take away the fangoggles and folk talking of wins is just silly.
PC is the big winner billion sold and still growing.
and very good point above on Blu Ray. As a Trojan for the format it has to have been a calculated risk and be considered a success.
Krisprolls
Banned
And how many nextbox to sell to recover losses from the original Xbox ?
Duxxy3
Member
They aren't even close.
Bluekaveli
Member
The war is over guys. Pack your bags.
We're going for The Wii sales next.
We're going for The Wii sales next.
So let's fast forward to fall, and you want a device that plays games, movies, media, lets you communicate with friends, all the normal shit that people want to do with these things. Are you going to drop $400 on a PS4, or $400 on an iPad?
My fear is the market that cares about jaw dropping graphics and huge budget games has shrank to the point of being irrelevant. The Wii U is either a poorly thought out aberration (our/GAF's hopeful assertion) or is simply a sign that dedicated home gaming consoles is a market in its death throes.
When Sony rolled out that PS4 which is going to cost a fortune based on the hardware inside, it became evident that they still don't understand why the PS3 flopped compared to its predecessor. What they really needed was a recognition of the changed market.
For example, my hope is that Microsoft takes a "if you can't beat 'em, join 'em" approach and lets me play Xbox games on my iPad, using a Bluetooth controller anywhere in the world. Just let me stream the games off my Xbox at home. Sony alluded to this with the Vita, but people are not going to buy a Vita to do this, as that system is an expensive piece of shit, useless for anything but playing a scant handful of games on its own.
People own iPads and smartphones and carry them everywhere. Let me use mine as a display for my Xbox, and not keep me anchored to my TV. People simply do not consume games and television like they used to, and the failure to understand this is one of the reasons the Wii U flopped, and I fear the PS4 is headed down that same path.
IIRC they split fees with other member of the Blu Ray consortium, as well as collect some patent royalties on top of it. It's been pretty good for them, but won't save the company if they keep botching the rest of their core businesses.
No, no one can provide you that proof. Anyone who claims one or the other sells more software is making things up.
yeah, I don't get the fighting in this thread..
is almost every non-first party published title released on both platforms? yes.
is the performance difference in said titles mostly a wash either way? yes.
will both of these continue for the remainder of the gen? yes.
save the console wars bullshit for next-gen. I mean really... We only have to hold off for like 3 weeks and we can get right back into it with PS4/Infinity
bickering/trashing!!!
is almost every non-first party published title released on both platforms? yes.
is the performance difference in said titles mostly a wash either way? yes.
will both of these continue for the remainder of the gen? yes.
save the console wars bullshit for next-gen. I mean really... We only have to hold off for like 3 weeks and we can get right back into it with PS4/Infinity
/WiiU
Krisprolls
Banned
I don't think core gaming market has shrunk that much. I also think those are 2 very different markets you're talking about.
- If I want small games + web + communicating, I buy an iPad
- If I want deep and beautiful games playable only with a controller, I buy a PS4 / nextbox
You didn't answer my question : how are you supposed to control your games on an Ipad ? Kinect failed in core gaming (while it mostly succeeded in casual gaming / dance games) because it couldn't provide an answer to this question either. You can't play Fifa / CoD and so on without a proper controller, that's the problem limiting tablets and phones. How are you supposed to play your "xbox games on a tablet" without a proper controller.
PS4 games will be playable on Vita, where it does make sense (unlike Xbox on tablets) since Vita has indeed a controller. So that's the answer you want. Vita is not that pricey, before you know it it'll be worth 150$ max, not even half the price of a tablet.
even MS knows that ps3 outsold x360.so why pretend that you dont know anything
MS said in an event that x360 will beat out ps3 this gen. PS3 is already ahead by a few million units right now and would continue to sell for another year or 2
agreed. It sucks also, because they are basically being drowned out of their other core markets by China and Samsung.. I saw an article saying they wanted to press into the phone market... but man... with Apple and Samsung suffocating like 90% of the revenue from that market.... is that really the best market to try and press into?
Honestly... it's not that Sony is fucking things up... It really just is that China flooded most relevant markets with equipment at like 50% the price (and 50% the quality) and Samsung took the market where these companies traditionally competed and do like semi-annual releases at like 15 price points. Not much room left in many of those markets to compete as a result
LittleJohnny
Banned
So should we still count Genesis vs Snes sales? This gen will be officially over at the end of 2013, some would even say it ended with the Wii U launch, stop moving the goal posts
Gies reminds me of very early days at the forums of Team Xbox back in the Xbox 1 generation. It was absolutely rife with self-righteous "westerners" that were fans of the Xbox and MS's foray into consoles mainly because they were racist against Asians for some reason. Granted, not the entire forum was like that, but my time there was enough to make me sick of that attitude and never return.
Not saying Gies is racist against asians, it's just the way he posts projects the same kind of attitude.
I did. You have a separate controller that communicates with the tablet via Bluetooth. Prop the iPad up on your desk in your hotel room, fire up the "Xbox app", and game away back on your system at home. It's exactly like a Wii U system not designed by idiots.
Most people already own tablets and smartphones. Why waste money on another device when you already have a perfectly serviceable screen for playing games?
Whoa there. The issue is that Japanese game development, for whatever reason (increased emphasis on mobile/portable games, probably), fell off a cliff in the past decade. It's not my opinion, the sales reflect this when you compare them to western developed games. The Souls games and Capcom's early 360 exclusives like Dead Rising are a (welcome) aberration.
Also, back in the time period you're speaking of, there was some excitement because Microsoft published a lot of (half finished?) Dreamcast games like the JSR sequel. So it's not like the early days of Xbox were 100% western games, 100% of the time.
dragonfart28
Banned
If you're going to argue beyond that generation, then MS has enough money to cover any losses.
Sony doesn't.
From a business perspective, last gen was a failure for Sony.
BenjaminBirdie
Banned
I'm pretty sure the people who don't give a shit, didn't give a shit. It's the "most important topic on the gaming planet," let's be real, to Sony fans who have been waiting years for this to happen. I'd say the number of Sony fans waiting for a win outnumber Xbox fans holding onto the "crown" by about 60:1 in the hardcore gaming fanbase. And the "gaming planet" would of course be made up of hardcore gamers.
In the long run this really doesn't matter at all in terms of any one system winning or losing. The 360 established the Xbox as a top tier gaming brand. The PS3 has come back from a slow start. I don't see how you could describe either console as a loser in this cycle unless you're looking at just number sold, which is completely arbitrary at this point and considering the other aspects of the ecosystem.
Fonz72
Member
I think the PS3 will have legs for years to come. Sony has said they will support the console through 2015. I know several people who have purchased PS3's in the last year including a few Xbox guys. In my group of friends the PS3 is the ONLY console that people have multiples of.
Sony's track record with the PS2 should show that they will make the PS3 a viable option in the future. Microsoft dropped the Xbox like a bad habit and will most likely do the same with the 360.
Someday we will look back and smile fondly as we load a game on our Sotendosoft Evoulution™.
Sony's track record with the PS2 should show that they will make the PS3 a viable option in the future. Microsoft dropped the Xbox like a bad habit and will most likely do the same with the 360.
Someday we will look back and smile fondly as we load a game on our Sotendosoft Evoulution™.
The last three threads have been based on IDC estimates too. I'm surprised Microsoft and Sony haven't given us offical numbers lately. Perhaps we'll hear one today at the XB reveal.
flyinpiranha
Member
i hope ps won, m$ is jus so stupid they dun even deserv last place lol!!!!!!!!!!.
Red Chocobo
Banned
Didn't MS call the 360 the "best selling home console" of this gen, at one of their E3's? (I think it was either last year or the one before)
That was amusing.
That was amusing.
Ashler
Member
yurinka
Member
Same here. I also said this and still think the same. Unlike the others PS3 still has several great games and price cuts to come, in addition to the PS+ content and that it's reaching now emerging markets like Brazil which means that will be selling during few years more.
We'll need to wait at least 2 or 3 years more to see the end of the current gen, because PS3 still has legs.
Wii was not the clear winner. Their lack of third party support killed the system off early and made developers care that much less for the Wii U. Sure they sold more hardware, but to what point?
The industry as a whole remained successful because of the PS360. You can't say that about GC/Xbox.
yep. It will still sell easily for another 2/3 years
MS gave us their hardware number in the last earnings report. It's 77.2M. Only Sony hides their hardware numbers. MS, on the other hand, hides their software numbers.
Scraping out of last place after 7 years, losing an inordinate amount of money in doing so, can hardly be labelled a triumph considering the success of the PS1 and the PS2.
Last Gen:
PS2 - 100 million
Xbox - 20 million
This gen:
PS3 = 75 million
Xbox 360 = 75 million
It's pretty clear that this has been a pretty detrimental generation for the playstation brand. They did a good job at damage limitation after the disastrous first couple of years, but lets not get ahead of ourselves.
Remember, this is how most people saw this generation playing out as late as 2008:
Most people? lolz.
But to be fair to IDC, they were absolutely spot on with the Wii and PS3+360. They just didn't expect the 360 to steal so much of Sony's market share.
The 360 has been dead for the past few years with the exception of Kinect... this isn't really a surprise. As someone else said, the MS support for the original XBox was crap at the end of its life, and I expect the same with the 360.
I already gave my 360 to my teenage son, who has both consoles since he actually fixed my original PS3. The only way I stop playing the PS3 anytime soon is if it burns up from all of the use - lately the extra fans have been kicking in quite a bit.
I already gave my 360 to my teenage son, who has both consoles since he actually fixed my original PS3. The only way I stop playing the PS3 anytime soon is if it burns up from all of the use - lately the extra fans have been kicking in quite a bit.
yurinka
Member
Physical dual analogs, dpad and buttons + wifi n + bluetooth + cross controller + OS level tweaks = better remote play in Vita than in any other device
As opposed to the "Sony fans" who gloat over a make.believe "victory" by joke analysts that affects none of our lives in any real way shape or form?
Duxxy3
Member
That game alone will sell millions of consoles.
BenjaminBirdie
Banned
Damn, that was such a more succinct response than I managed. I should have just waited.