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[painful fart]

just like mnay people perfer other os's to windows a dev has all right to have a platform or 2 they like and one they don't.

Having opinions is one thing, but is trash talking a platform over and over again and then delivering trash on that platform really perfectly OK by you? Maybe some owners of that platform would disagree. Why the hell bother to make a half-ass port if you have no intention of doing a good job.

Spoiler

Not that I take 1Up´s preview for granted, their history does not make them a very reliable source, let´s hope some of the frame rate issues have been ironed out in the final version.

 

[Ghost Leviathan]

It's not selling well because of extremely shit marketing. The cover art looks terrible and it's unclear for most what is in the box, without having to find out.

I don't really know what they were thinking by shoving loads of their games in a box anyway. Portal should have had an individual release.

L.

 

[Lefty42o]

Having opinions is one thing, but is trash talking a platform over and over again and then delivering trash on that platform really perfectly OK by you? Maybe some owners of that platform would disagree. Why the hell bother to make a half-ass port if you have no intention of doing a good job.

Spoiler

Not that I take 1Up´s preview for granted, their history does not make them a very reliable source, let´s hope some of the frame rate issues have been ironed out in the final version.

once again that was ea's decision. he wanted nothing to do with it. most likley casue he knew the outcome would be poor. maybe for other reasons. but he has no control over how good or bad the ps3 port is. and did not wnat to do a ps3 port on top of all that.

 

[rs7k]

This kind of thing will stop when the userbase goes up.

Still crazy to think HL2 runs like that on a powerful platform. Guess EA thought they had to keep spending at a minimum to turn a profit.

 

[Nizz]

I like fights!

Seriously though - you have a point, but I don't feel it's a valid excuse. Point to the 360's install base, the learning curve involved in getting familiar with the PS3's architecture, the 360 consumer base's rabid love for shooters, ease of use in porting an already PC-based engine to the 360...shit, from a strictly financial POV, cutting corners on the PS3 makes perfect sense. If that's the perspective that matters, so be it.

From a gamer's point of view - hell, developer's pride, cheesy at that may sound - wouldn't you want the best representation of your vision on any platform it's available on? As a developer, isn't it your responsibility to ensure that your game is presented in the best possible light? Absconding that because it's "difficult", or assigning blame to the platform when it's the budget that's really talking (......allegedly) does your game a disservice, does a potential new fanbase a disservice, and does your reputation a disservice.

For example, we announced a PC version of our game a few weeks ago, but for various reasons it's been farmed out to an external company. If - for some inexplicable reason - the PC port doesn't turn out well, should we blame the external developers? Point fingers at the PC as a gaming platform? Or do we take responsibility for the game's appearance at because at the end of the day, goddamit, it's OUR baby?

The buck has to stop somewhere. And when other studios like Epic, Infinity Ward, Propaganda, et al. somehow manage to get it done on a tougher platform, pissing and moaning about PS3 development publicly and shortchanging those very customers who would love to play your game seems incredibly disingenuous.

Somebody buy him a beer! In all seriousness, this is pretty f'ed up about the Orange Box. I hate it when a lot of times the message seems to be "you bought the wrong console". It was my choice, and with my money, that I bought a PS3. Look at the situation with COD 4, for example. Everyone can discuss the experience of the game together at the same time. Of course some people may notice very tiny differences in the versions, but all in all people were just talking about the experience, no matter what console you own. And that is cool as hell, though it hasn't really been that way for PS3 owners. Me as a PS3 owner, I would have loved to talk about Stranglehold or Medal of Honor: Airborne at the time they were released. But since they were delayed well after the 360 versions shipped, that couldn't happen. Hopefully, this issue with Orange Box will be one of the last times Sony fans will have to put up with this, a late port not even at least a bit optimized for PS3. I'll support devs and their games if they obviously put forth the effort for the system. I'm tired of left-over weak ports and inferior versions of games. As far as 3rd party multiplatform games, I've supported IW and COD4, I'll support Propaganda with Turok, I'll support Epic and UT3, and any other devs who at least put forth some type of effort for PS3 (and it's a game I'm interested in!). God damn I need a coffee....

 

[Captain Glanton]

This game on consoles is merely a polite afterthought. The same goes for any current, past and future developed Valve, Epic and Blizzard game.

See, the shit netcoding for TF2 on 360.

 

[Fun Factor]

Did you just miss the point completely? I'll make it simple for you:

PS3 - Doesn't get every game and the ports it gets are often subpart.
GC - Doesn't get every game but the ports it gets have no problems.

If the quality of PS3 ports is addressed, sales will go up and the quantity will increase.

I say WOW.
First off you bought 3rd party games on the GC because you liked the GC controller over the PS2/Xbox repackaged pad? Less buttons, inferior analog stick & buttons configuration made almost specifically for platform games?

2nd thing is GC got shaft big time on 3rd party games, a lot of the good quality games were made on the PS2 & ported to the Xbox, but never to the GC.
Only EA, Activision & Accliam were the ones to port games to the GC constantly.
In contrast PS3 has got every 3rd party game released with a multi platform/next-gen multi platform set & then some.

3rd, GC had the shittest ports, i.e. missing buttons (NBA Street), the shittest quality ports (NFS, Splinter Cell etc) & no online play.

 

[Zombie James]

See, the shit netcoding for TF2 on 360.

What are you talking about? Valve are top-tier, premier developers. If TF2 has any problems you can rest easy knowing it's all the 360's fault.

 

[painful fart]

once again that was ea's decision. he wanted nothing to do with it. most likley casue he knew the outcome would be poor. maybe for other reasons. but he has no control over how good or bad the ps3 port is. and did not wnat to do a ps3 port on top of all that.

Then I suggest Gabe Newell to start trash talking EA next time around.

 

[zombi]

What this says to me as a consumer is they dont want my business. And its pretty obvious that EA wants everyone's business. Even more important is that I really wanted to play this on my PS3, I dont have live gold right now and renuing it is making less sense to me each month as online games on PS3 have been nothing but great experiences for me. So now what? I dont get the game. Oh well I guess, but to be honest it would have been easy money for them. But on a basic level I know that when I do something I dont like to have shit associated with my work and if the PS3 version sucks most people are going to think its Valve's fault and that they suck. So it would be best if Gabe just accepted that people own the PS3 and that if its shit, those who buy it will associate his company's name with shit, because lets be realistic there are a ton of people who havent played HL2 or many of valve's products and for this to be their experience is lame. I hope someone in that company takes control and realizes theyre reputation is at stake when something like this is released.

 

[Instigator]

Somebody buy him a beer! In all seriousness, this is pretty f'ed up about the Orange Box. I hate it when a lot of times the message seems to be "you bought the wrong console". It was my choice, and with my money, that I bought a PS3.

I'm pretty sure you bought your PS3 for other reasons, but you can't complain about the 'message' at this point. The message was also the same with Saturn and NGC and that was obvious early on.

Not buying those lousy ports is also your choice.

 

[dark10x]

This kind of thing will stop when the userbase goes up.

Still crazy to think HL2 runs like that on a powerful platform. Guess EA thought they had to keep spending at a minimum to turn a profit.

What's really sad about the whole thing is that, even when you consider that the GPU in the PS3 is weaker than that of the 360, it's still FAR more than enough for HL2. I mean, it's basically a GeForce 7900...which is MUCH faster than what was being used for HL2 in 2004. If they treated the PS3 like a PC, I don't see why it wouldn't run well. It just seems to have been very poorly coded.

 

[Kusagari]

Then I suggest Gabe Newell to start trash talking EA next time around.

Ehhh? He's been trashing PS3 long before the Orange Box port was even announced.

 

[Byakuya769]

Honestly, if you wanted this game so much you could have gotten a PC for around the same price as the PS3 that will play Orange Box.

REALLY!?!

 

[Sho Nuff]

What's really sad about the whole thing is that, even when you consider that the GPU in the PS3 is weaker than that of the 360, it's still FAR more than enough for HL2. I mean, it's basically a GeForce 7900...which is MUCH faster than what was being used for HL2 in 2004. If they treated the PS3 like a PC, I don't see why it wouldn't run well. It just seems to have been very poorly coded.

Maybe they could have just ported the Xbox 1 version.

 

[~Kinggi~]

This doesnt surprise me, its the ps3, its EA, there you have it.

 

[CrunchinJelly]

REALLY!?!
http://www.theplugg.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/03/arigold.gif[IMG][/QUOTE]
Uhh, the Source Engine is well known for being brilliant at scaling to work on any machine.

 

[Absinthe (Permed)]

Isn't it obvious that the PS3 version was going to be rubbish from the start? Gabe was spouting hyperbolic hate months ago and it was nothing more than damage control. So now, when EA releases a shitty port Gabe can sit back and say, "Well, I told you Sony needed to start over." Prophetic or lazy? You decide.

 

[LAMBO]

It's a shame because HL2 and all it's expansions are so great, i'd hate a shitty ps3 version to damage the HL name, but i guess it really can't as it's pc series that has flourished without console assistance for years and years.

 

[Surfheart]

I cannot fathom how they can't optimize such an old engine. Even if the PS3 is a beast to program for, how the hell can't they squeeze out the power from the console to get this running at a decent shape? It's ridiculous that both the PS3 and 360 version run at 30 fps (and from what I've heard, even lower in certain places).

Yeah I agree. The 360 port wasn't all that IMO.

 

[Druz]

10 pages later and people are still confusing HARDWARE CANNOT PLAY THE GAME with HARDWARE REALLY EXPENSIVE/NOT WORTH TO PROGRAM FOR.

 

[Byakuya769]

Uhh, the Source Engine is well known for being brilliant at scaling to work on any machine.

I would reuse my image but I think it would be lost on you. My point is that who I was responding to was basically saying "if you love the game so much spend another $600 to play it"... that's stupid.

 

[Captain Glanton]

What are you talking about? Valve are top-tier, premier developers. If TF2 has any problems you can rest easy knowing it's all the 360's fault.

:lol

See: CoD4 online. 3 hours the other night, no crashes or lagouts. That beats ANY three hour period of TF2 for me, and I put a lot of hours in before basically giving up.

 

[~Devil Trigger~]

10 pages later and people are still confusing HARDWARE CANNOT PLAY THE GAME with HARDWARE REALLY EXPENSIVE/NOT WORTH TO PROGRAM FOR.

Still adds up to, TRASH PORT

 

[Edag Plata]

This is really stupid...yeah, I said it.

See, now the game's going to be complete crap and when it sells like, 5 copies Valve will just be like "Dude, see? We told you ps3 sucks, nobody will even buy great games."

Screw that, if they're going to put no effort into their game and say the system sucks, people who own the system aren't going to want it, and I wanted Orange Box before, but now I won't waste my money on it to support them.

 

[Hitler Stole My Potato]

Fuck no, episode 2 is a mediocre expansion pack of the worst sort. HL2 is an incredible classic... but it's a 2004 game. Episode 2 feels like it's been stuck in time and crafted from whatever recycled ideas they could patch with whatever odd material was cut from the original.

:lol :lol :lol lollolololol...and so on.


Go start another thread about Haze.

 

[firex]

this thread is all the more reason to lol at consoles. but the reason the PS3 port sucks is the Source engine is directx heavy and they've never ported it over to openGL, since they have no reason to. So EA's code monkeys suck balls and had to try and port this engine to OpenGL, and they failed hard.

 

[Slavik81]

This is really stupid...yeah, I said it.

See, now the game's going to be complete crap and when it sells like, 5 copies Valve will just be like "Dude, see? We told you ps3 sucks, nobody will even buy great games."

I don't think they've ever mentioned ANYTHING like that about the people buying the PS3s. Their complaints have always been about the hardware.

 

[hukasmokincaterpillar]

Even a member of the development team admitted that they were using the CELL's PPE and RSX with no SPU usage.

They're not even using them for Havok? That's had SPU optimization since the system launched I believe. Pretty nutty if true.

 

[erlim]

Whatever, I remember people writing that FEAR on PS3 sucked and ran at like 20 fps with terrible delay and response time, but I really had a good experience with it. I'll get orange box on PS3 and probably feel the same way.

 

[joeposh]

PS3 only gamers are third class citizens, better get used to it. If you have the money to buy a PS3, you should already have all the other consoles.

God, just reading that sentence gives me the shivers. Being a Gamecube only gamer last gen brought about it's fair share of PTSD :lol That aside, I hope TF2 holds up on the PS3, because that portion made the 360 version for me.

 

[bigswords]

It's still associated with him and it's still his game, his lack of commitment is shameful. It shows how proud he is of his own games.....

When pc gamers made him rich, consoles are just the "side dishes" to him.

 

[bigswords]

Fuck no, episode 2 is a mediocre expansion pack of the worst sort. HL2 is an incredible classic... but it's a 2004 game. Episode 2 feels like it's been stuck in time and crafted from whatever recycled ideas they could patch with whatever odd material was cut from the original.

Whaa..what? EPs 2 on HL2 by itself is better then Haze's storyline about druggies in the military.

 

[AltogetherAndrews]

Whaa..what? EPs 2 on HL2 by itself is better then Haze's storyline about druggies in the military.

Is that really the best you clowns have, references to Haze? Lazy, witless buggers.

 

[bigswords]

Is that really the best you clowns have, references to Haze? Lazy, witless buggers.

Heh I'm working I'm sure someone will have a better quote reply soon.

 

[mattiewheels]

Is that really the best you clowns have, references to Haze? Lazy, witless buggers.

i don't mind that the hl2 framework for the new episodes is showing its age when it was already so far ahead of the curve to begin with. if you must go with the 'more of the same' argument, this is one case where i'll take it!

 

[Edag Plata]

I don't think they've ever mentioned ANYTHING like that about the people buying the PS3s. Their complaints have always been about the hardware.

Yeah, but when you say the ps3 is "a waste of everybody's time" its an insult to the people who bought it too, either way you look at it, saying they spent a pretty penny on a waste of time.

It's just a bad excuse to justify a serious dislike for the ps3, you produce crap, it sells crap (except on the Wii, I'm looking at you Mario Party 8!!! ) and those numbers will make it look like a waste of time.

This whole thing is just stupid, they know what a bunch of competitive fanboys gamers are, they're just pushing people's buttons or justify their own fanboyness.

 

[vilmer_]

If the PS3 version doesn't AT LEAST graphically live up to the PC version @ 1280x1024, they can all kiss my pale white ass.

 

[Surfheart]

If the PS3 version doesn't AT LEAST graphically live up to the PC version @ 1280x1024, they can all kiss my pale white ass.

Better bend over and pucker up.

 

[Foil]

They should just delay it again into the spring and atleast try to make something decent out of the port. Shit, even Ubisoft got a better looking game in GRAW2 to run mostly well on the PS3 hardware after they delayed it for more time. What kind of team did EA and Valve ship this off to?

 

[ZeoVGM]

Is that really the best you clowns have, references to Haze? Lazy, witless buggers.

Uhm, either way what you said is stupid and wrong.

 

[Mau ®]

Good thing I bought the 360 version. Its very nice.

TBH this is the devs fault, not the PS3. Why on earth are people unable to get a 3yo engine running on the PS3 is beyond me... eh...

 

[TTP]

What kind of team did EA and Valve ship this off to?

Considering we know shit about who they are, I'd say...

 

[Slavik81]

Yeah, but when you say the ps3 is "a waste of everybody's time" its an insult to the people who bought it too, either way you look at it, saying they spent a pretty penny on a waste of time.

He said it was a waste of time because it made some development tasks that should be quick to complete take longer. Hence it's wasting his time.

The PS3 wastes developer time by being needlessly esoteric. The 360 wastes consumer time by being scandalously unreliable. Fortunately for Gabe, he doesn't have to complain about that, because it barely affects him. It's a problem for consumers more than for developers.

It's no more of an insult to PS3 owners than calling the 360 'unreliable' is to 360 developers.

 

[p3tran]

IMHO the path Bethesda chose is ultimately the one Valve should have chosen or EA at least if Valve did not want to take it: do not worry about things, learn how to push the platform, use the extra time to give something new to players and maybe once that version is out release the extra content to the players who got the game on the other platform too just leaving a small exclusivity window maybe to make PS3 version purchasers feel a little special maybe (a thank you for waiting gift ?).

it is a romantic POV, but the truth is that there can be no "thank you for waiting" when you are talking about games that are of oblivion's caliber.
oblivion came after 12 months.
12 months without oblivion for any serious gamer cannot be seen as a "thank you" offer, no matter what.




btw,
what are the chances that the article reports on what is not the most optimized build possible?
are you guys sure this is not the case?

 

[DrXym]

He said it was a waste of time because it made some development tasks that should be quick to complete take longer. Hence it's wasting his time.

The PS3 wastes developer time by being needlessly esoteric. The 360 wastes consumer time by being scandalously unreliable. Fortunately for Gabe, he doesn't have to complain about that, because it barely affects him. It's a problem for consumers more than for developers.

It's no more of an insult to PS3 owners than calling the 360 'unreliable' is to 360 developers.

That doesn't make any sense. You either target a platform because you make more money or you don't target it. What you don't do is target a platform and then bitch about it whenever the subject arises, almost like you're ashamed of it and that you want it to fail.

The way Newell has been bitching makes it seem that the port was some kind of contractual thing with EA (e.g. EA ports the engine to the PS3 for rights to future Source based games on PS3 or similar) and he is expending as little effort as possible to help them or ensure product quality. Thus his bitching is self-fulfilled, and no doubt he'll lay into the PS3 once again if the reviews are bad. I can think of better people to blame starting with him.

 

[DrXym]

btw,
what are the chances that the article reports on what is not the most optimized build possible?
are you guys sure this is not the case?

It's entirely possible. Maybe they had a debug build or something which had all sorts of extra slowdown due to logging etc.

Even so, I have zero confidence in this game. Let's see the reviews confirm or deny these impressions. If the port is shit I want to see the reviews say it.

 

[Rolf NB]

They should just delay it again into the spring and atleast try to make something decent out of the port. Shit, even Ubisoft got a better looking game in GRAW2 to run mostly well on the PS3 hardware after they delayed it for more time. What kind of team did EA and Valve ship this off to?

Maybe the engine is just a bitch to port.
You know, Gabe Newell likes to build transferable skills, because he thinks that's a good use of his time. Source is built heavily around the idiosyncrasies of Direct3D, there's lots of stuff going on with texture atlases and batch management that are of course counter-productive on platforms that don't run Direct3D (and arguably on the XBox 360, too). Anyone remember the centroid sampling incident? That was Gabe crying to get a feature from the hardware manufacturers that would allow him to more intimately hug Direct3D's inherent performance problems on the PC.

 

[KongRudi]

I'm happy that EA brings it over to the PS3 atleast, then I get to play it.
Thankfully not all developers, thinks doing buisness with me (a PS3-consumer) is a waste of their time.
I want to play it on my TV, and surround system in my good chair in the living room.
Not infront of my computer, even if it's better on my PC. :-/

Hopefully they'll do a decent job of port most of the games in Orange Box, if they are any good, over to the PS3.
If it's only the veihicle sections of HL wich seems to suffer badly, they might be able to fix most of that before release, afterall there is many games in Orange Box, arn't there? They should have some porting practice to OpenGL now then, even if this is their first release.
How much of the game is those veihicle sections anyway?

Also I have more faith in a unproven EA studio than 1up.
1up also often do mistakes, when comparing reviews with my gaming taste, and this is a preview of a non-final version.
It's not that I expect it will be as good as if Valve did it, but they think doing buisness with me is a waste of their time, so I guess I will have to settle with what EAUK deliver.

 

[justjohn]

i hope this game is the last ever multiplatform game delayed on the ps3. this shit has to stop