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Ps5 explainable SSD costs
- Thread starter Xplainin
- Start date
TheCrimsnFuckr
Member
Yeah, I am honestly really curious about how exactly the whole M.2 SSD thing is going to work with the PS5. Mark Cerny stated that the fit would be tight so SSD's would have to be small (and likely not have a heatsink or anything) and will need to be able to reach a certain maximum speed (7GB/ps) but there is no statement about whether that means sequential or anything else. Will Sony have a list of supported SSDs on their site? Will Sony just trust the average consumer (who is usually very technologically illiterate) to buy the right kind of SSD? Will there be any way for Sony to control the price early in the generation? How long will it be until there are supported SSDs on the market?
Meanwhile, Microsoft has their proprietary SSD card that is stated to match the exact specs of the internal SSD and has a proper cooling solution to maintain the stated speeds (as is intended for the internal SSD) and will be selling SSD cards on day 1 of the system's release. They will likely cost at least a couple hundred dollars, but at least I know that I will get something that works day one, is idiot proof, and has prices that can be controlled by MS if so desired.
I mean personally, I am just going to use an external SSD (or an SSD put into an enclosure, not sure yet) that can take advantage of USB 3.2 and have my many games on there and just transfer them over to the main system when I want to play them, as well as have all my back compat games on there as well.
Sony's plan definitely seems more focused on the eventual long term when SSD technology gets a lot cheaper and more efficient heat wise, whereas Microsoft's solution seems more focused for how the situation is at launch as well as delivering a consistent speed target. Whoever made the right call about this is dependent on how long it takes for high speed SSDs that meet Sony's threshold for the PS5 to become readily available and affordable, as well as how well Sony provides support for people trying to expand their storage.
Meanwhile, Microsoft has their proprietary SSD card that is stated to match the exact specs of the internal SSD and has a proper cooling solution to maintain the stated speeds (as is intended for the internal SSD) and will be selling SSD cards on day 1 of the system's release. They will likely cost at least a couple hundred dollars, but at least I know that I will get something that works day one, is idiot proof, and has prices that can be controlled by MS if so desired.
I mean personally, I am just going to use an external SSD (or an SSD put into an enclosure, not sure yet) that can take advantage of USB 3.2 and have my many games on there and just transfer them over to the main system when I want to play them, as well as have all my back compat games on there as well.
Sony's plan definitely seems more focused on the eventual long term when SSD technology gets a lot cheaper and more efficient heat wise, whereas Microsoft's solution seems more focused for how the situation is at launch as well as delivering a consistent speed target. Whoever made the right call about this is dependent on how long it takes for high speed SSDs that meet Sony's threshold for the PS5 to become readily available and affordable, as well as how well Sony provides support for people trying to expand their storage.
igivehugs2nakedwomen
Banned
Get an external SSD. It's 10 times faster than an external HDD.
MastaKiiLA
Member
Similar to the Optimize for Series X badge, there will probably be a PS5 Compatible badge of sorts, that will be allowed on the packaging and promotion of drives that meet Sony's certification process. That seems like the simplest approach to it. Ratification should involve sending a sample of candidate drives to be QA'd by Sony, and the SKUs that get approved get authorized for the badge. There'll no doubt be scammers, but that probably exists for anything. There are already bootleg name-brand NVME drives out there.
Drive prices scale with the manufacturing costs of the manufacturing process, so both Sony and MS will see long-term drive price reductions. The only benefit Sony sees is having a higher-performance drive in their architecture. I don't think we'll see them winning the cost war on external storage, as the process the XSX drives will be built on will be cheaper than what the PS5's drive is built on. They should reach price parity at some point, as the tech each is built on is phased out over the life of the console, and they get replaced by newer, but still very cheap SSD tech. At that point, PS5 users might be able to get storage cheaper, as MS external storage might still carry the 1st party premium pricing, whereas PS5 compatible drives might be available in a fire sale somewhere online.
Panajev2001a
GAF's Pleasant Genius
Again, I get why you need higher speed to compensate for the lack of priority levels granularity, but you are pulling an extra 1.5 GB/s out of nowhere...
igivehugs2nakedwomen
Banned
NVMe M.2 PCIe 4.0
It's just like the 2.5 in SATA standard for PS4. If it isn't the right size it won't fit. If it isn't the right speed, it won't work.
Panajev2001a
GAF's Pleasant Genius
Never stated, that is your personal interpretation by fusing different statements together... lightweight concern trolling or misunderstanding... not sure.
GHG
Member
Yes, my motherboard manufacturer sends companies an invoice every time they release a bios update to support some new hardware.
Good grief. If your intentions when creating this thread weren't obvious before, they're clear as day now.
Xplainin
Banned
But I would assume there would be some kind of authentication of the drive from the PS5 itself.
Im pretty sure Sony wouldn't want some cheap Chinese Wish.com SSD out in there.
I expect that companies would submit their drives to Sony for evaluation, Sony would test them against the needs of the system, and if it passes Sony would certify it as compatible. Then the list of certified drives would be in the PS5s firmware and it would recognize the drive and allow it to work. If the drive someone puts in isnt one of the certified drives it would say that the drive isnt compatible with the PS5 and it wouldn't work.
I would also the expect Sony would charge for them to certify your drive.
igivehugs2nakedwomen
Banned
If the SSD isn't fast enough you'll know as soon as you actually try to use it. It won't work. Also, your claim of Sony charging companies for certifying individual drives is ridiculous. They didn't do with PS4 why would they do it now?
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Panajev2001a
GAF's Pleasant Genius
Nah, I think you will see Sony going out of their way to procure SSD samples from manufacturers and they have been doing for quite a while, they are not stupid and as arrogant as some people want to believe, and are likely to create a blocklist of banned drives and do a quick drive benchmark to validate the drive as it gets connected and formatted.
Maybe if it fails the test you can still use it, but only as archive disk to expand storage?
igivehugs2nakedwomen
Banned
Jaguar Victory
Member
None knows what they'll cost because they don't exist yet. We'll see.
igivehugs2nakedwomen
Banned
The current gen of PCIe 3.0 SSD released at prices between 200 to 300 dollars. Do you really believe that the M.2 PCIe 4.0 will release at double the price? I don't think so.
ZywyPL
Banned
That's actually how much 1TB PCIE4 SSDs with read speed of ~5GB/s currently cost. So by the time the faster drives arrive the current ones should drop in price a bit, and the newer, 6-7GB/s ones should jump into the 250-300$ price point. The best indicator will be the upcoming Samsung 980 Pro.
igivehugs2nakedwomen
Banned
Actually there aren't any M.2 PCIe 3.0 SSD that have read speeds higher than 5GB/s that would even be remotely compatible with the PS5. That's why I was wondering why the creator of this topic didn't even make an attempt to compare various SSD technologies, such as PHISON 16 vs PHISON 18.
ZywyPL
Banned
Not PCIE3, but PCIE4, for example:
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07W588KMQ/?tag=neogaf0e-20
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07WH4DVWR/?tag=neogaf0e-20
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07TJWZGL9/?tag=neogaf0e-20
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07TLYWMYW/?tag=neogaf0e-20
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07SQZYW2V/?tag=neogaf0e-20
200-250$ for 5GB/s 1TB drives. So I don't think drives that will be 1-1.5GB/s faster should exceed the 300$ price tag.
igivehugs2nakedwomen
Banned
That's not what Cerny said. Cerny was saying that SSD's with speeds 7Gb/s on up would be released during the PS5's life cycle, not that they were required for the expansion slot. I'm going to watch the segment that pertains to the SSD and write it down word for word so that some of you can stop spreading misinformation.
Jaguar Victory
Member
I remember he said that. He said the new drives need to be faster than the 5.5 to make up for the fact they're not capable of the same data designation levels and that those drives are coming but not here yet and they'll have to test and certify because not all will work.
Xplainin
Banned
I live in Australia. It will cost 500 AUD here.
Do you dispute that?
Xplainin
Banned
And he literally put a image on screen showing 7.0gbs PCIE 4.
igivehugs2nakedwomen
Banned
I just finished watching "The Road to PS5" and wrote down what Cerny actually said it isn't exactly word for word, but it's close enough so that you get the point;
Beginning at 20:43 in the video
"If your purpose in adding more storage is to play PS5 titles, ideally, you would add to your PS5. We will be supporting certain M.2 drives . These are internal drives you can get on the open market and install it in a bay on the PS5. As for which ones we support and when, I'll get to that in a moment. They connect through the custom I/O unit just like our SSD does so that they can take full advantage of the decompression, I/O co-processors, and all the other features I was talking about." (Beginning at 21:17 he talks about the minimum read speed required) "Here's the catch though, that commercial drive has to be at least as fast as ours. (Minimum 5.5Gb/s) Games that rely on the speed of our SSD need to work flawlessly with any M.2 drive. When I gave the WIRED interview last year, I said that the PS5 SSD was faster than anything (commercially) available on PC. At the time, commercial M.2 drives used PCIe 3.0 x4 lanes, which capped out at 3.5Gb/s." He then discusses the process of sampling various PCIe 4.0 drives that are currently available, none of which meet the 5.5GB/s threshold. He then goes on to discuss upcoming M.2 drives for 2020, "By year's end I expect there will be M.2 drives that saturate PCIe 4.0 and support 7GB/s."
He never said that 7GB/s was the minimum requirement he said he expects to see M.2 drives with that type of performance. This post is actually for those who said GHG and myself were wrong about what Cerny said, so here is what Cerny actually said and you can see for yourself what he actually said starting at 21:17 of his video presentation.
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smbu2000
Member
Most PCs aren't able to utilize pcie 4.0 ssds. No Intel cpus (the majority of PCs) support pcie 4.0. Only AMDs latest Ryzen 3000 CPUs support pcie 4.0 and that's only if you have a motherboard with their newest chipset like X570.
PCIe 4.0 adoption will be slow and in turn cause prices to stay relatively high especially for the more niche high performance parts like the Samsung 980 Pro.
Most PC users will be perfectly fine with their lower cost pcie 3.0 nvme drives. My own system (Ryzen 3900X with Gigabyte Aorus X570 Master) can take advantage of a pcie 4.0 ssd, but I'm perfectly fine stcking with my pcie 3.0 1TB Samsung 960 Pro.
PCIe 4.0 adoption will be slow and in turn cause prices to stay relatively high especially for the more niche high performance parts like the Samsung 980 Pro.
Most PC users will be perfectly fine with their lower cost pcie 3.0 nvme drives. My own system (Ryzen 3900X with Gigabyte Aorus X570 Master) can take advantage of a pcie 4.0 ssd, but I'm perfectly fine stcking with my pcie 3.0 1TB Samsung 960 Pro.