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Raise the flame shield: Your "controversial" gaming opinion.
- Thread starter Laughing Banana
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Rahxephon91
Banned
Yes everyone knows this. A good portion of the FF spin-offs are also not developed by Sqaure. But this wasn't the point in bringing them up. The point is that they have also received quite a number of spin-offs under Wada, which is the entire point here. That the "milking" of the franchisees has nothing to do with Nomura.
Level 5 is shit.
DQ Swords, Monster's Joker, Slime. I'm sure there's been more then a few. And successful? Are you pretending that KH's and FF's spin-offs haven't been successful?
What does have to do with being in trouble? Your entire point is that Nomura is ruining Sqaure somehow? I'm trying to figure out how, but you seem to be unable to answer this question. FF's critical and financial misses probably have nothing to do with Nomura. But you never made the distinction if you were talking about finically or fan reaction in terms of "ruining". Hell you haven't actually answered anything.
Yes and...? What does this have to do with your point? No one denied that he has a high potion in the company. What we are trying to get at is how he's ruined the company and FF. You don't seem to be unable to answer this question.
Yes and? So since X they made XIII. That's 1 FF. So they ruined Sqaure and FF with one FF since X?
This has what to do with Nomura? The polarizing elements of XIII are it's story, structure, and gameplay. Things Nomura has nothing to do with. Unless you want to claim he he provided input. Yes he did that while making his own games. Like the one game that seems to be the oppisate of XIII.
Ok? What is your point of telling us this?
This had to do with the failure of XIV, The Japanese Earthquake and a number of other issues. Do you want to blame Nomura for all of those?
He releases KH games that do well. Pretty much most of his projects do well. Not only that his designs and the like provide profitable merchandise. To claim that he is not a worthwhile asset financially would be stupid. But you seem to want to claim that. Actually don't know what your are claiming. Is it that Nomura is hurting the company financially? or creatively? Your wrong on both accounts.
But it's problems come from technical design and management.......
Speak for yourself.
So XIII-2 is now the example of the whole companies plans for FF? And this has to do with Nomura how? What does this have to do with anything actually? Your points are all over the place.
Um how the fuck do you know what 15 will do. And isn't Versus a reinvention or does that not count because it's a Nomura game. X-2 soured fans? It's a very high selling game.
This is the most idiotic statement ever.
Something tells me your wrong. Oh I know what it is, the constant cry for 3 and the decent sales of KH games.
Ok? Don't see what this has to do with what I said. Unless you just the hate the idea of Nomura introducing a new ip because it puts him in a good light.
For the rest of the Kane and Lynch 2 fans in the world. All seven of us.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VKbe2vOMJpE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VKbe2vOMJpE
Many first party developers and games (across the big three) are extremely overrated.
Level-5 is also overrated. If it wasn't for the collaboration with Studio Ghibli and the hiring of Matsuno and Jiro, I wouldn't pay attention to that company at all.
Anyone who thinks Xenoblade is the best JRPG since Chrono Trigger hasn't played enough JRPGs.
There are only a handful of console games that are all about the gameplay and are fully worth the asking price. None of them are Nintendo games.
Yoshida and Tsubasa Masao are better character artists than Amano.
Level-5 is also overrated. If it wasn't for the collaboration with Studio Ghibli and the hiring of Matsuno and Jiro, I wouldn't pay attention to that company at all.
Anyone who thinks Xenoblade is the best JRPG since Chrono Trigger hasn't played enough JRPGs.
There are only a handful of console games that are all about the gameplay and are fully worth the asking price. None of them are Nintendo games.
Yoshida and Tsubasa Masao are better character artists than Amano.
Yeah, the Chao Garden is very fun. It's a shame they don't do this anymore.
After replaying the game a few years ago, I'd say Sonic's levels are generally great, Shadow's levels were generally decent to okay and Eggman's levels were generally great too. Sadly, I couldn't find myself enjoying Tails' levels much. Same to Knuckles/Rouge's levels. I thought they were what made the game disappointing to me, especially that I've enjoyed Shooting and Emerald Hunting in Adventure 1. Also wasn't a fan of being forced to switch characters... The game aged better than Adventure 1 for sure though, even though I always prefer 1 a bit more.
Have you considered trying the SNES/GBA versions? They have saves.
yes.
yes.
Interesting how controversial opinions on GAF are really pretty normal everywhere else.
Another one:
Dungeon Keeper is grossly overrated; the only good thing was its premise. Getting a dungeon going was laborious, the GUI was too cluttered and multiplayer was a real pain, where you spend two hours solitarily building your base and tunneling before there actually was a multiplayer to speak of, and then seeing it laid to waste by the other guy in a matter of minutes without any real way to turn the tables.
Dungeon Keeper is grossly overrated; the only good thing was its premise. Getting a dungeon going was laborious, the GUI was too cluttered and multiplayer was a real pain, where you spend two hours solitarily building your base and tunneling before there actually was a multiplayer to speak of, and then seeing it laid to waste by the other guy in a matter of minutes without any real way to turn the tables.
Indeed. Also, Halo 2 online was one of the best experiences of my life. I remember I bought the strategy guide and read and reread the Xbox Live section for weeks before finally getting it.
Regardless of how you feel about Level-5, they did the series right and developed games held in a high amount of respect among fans of the series. You won't find anyone who likes Dragon Quest mentioning any serious negatives about VIII and XI like you would XIII and XIII-2. And you do realize that all of the Final Fantasy spin-offs were developed by Square Enix, right?
I don't seem to be unable to answer your question...? Tetsuya Nomura was the one in charge of the Compilation FF7 team. To say he played no part in it is just silly. And to say that X-2 did nothing to the series just because it sold well is completely disregarding how much it polarized fans. For every person who says they liked X-2, you will find 10 others who didn't like it one bit. Many of them bought it in the first place because they really enjoyed X but didn't know what they were getting into, I'm sure.
You brought XI as an example of a game that they worked on after X but before the merger when Nomura was propped up in the company. That's my point. Final Fantasy XI helped the company, even if I completely disagree with the fact they gave the game a number at the end instead of something like "Final Fantasy Online". But I digress.
Err, the Japanese earthquake happened last year. Final Fantasy XIII and XIV came out in America in 2010. I really don't think that Square Enix would have taken as big a hit by the earthquake if it wasn't for those two games - their stock price was already falling dramatically after XIII came out in Japan, after all. Nice attempt at making me fall into a guilt trip, but that's not going to work here.
I understand that he is a financial asset, there's no denying it. But at what cost? Do I think he's hurting the company creatively? Oh hell yes. As I said before, most of the content that Square-Enix has been putting out lately has been reactionary in nature. Point to XII all you want, but the fact that the two big compilations Nomura worked on and had direct creative control over, XIII and the spin-offs for FFVII (a game he originally had very little input on story but all of a sudden tried to retcon all tons of crap into) and he's doing harm to the brand that used to be able to reinvent itself with every new game.
For example, why did he change the look of Cloud from someone who looked so strong to someone that appears to have way too many weaknesses just on first glance? Because Nomura does not like masculinity. Look at any of his character designs and you see a pattern that emerges, namely just how much loves recycling his designs. Blech.
You seem to want to believe that just because he was a character designer doesn't mean he had a hell of a lot of creative control over the product. You know something is wrong when his name is the only one shown on both title screens of XIII and XIII-2, instead of say the producer or the director. Doesn't that seem kind of funny to you? I mean, what other company does that? Only Square-Enix, because they put him on this ridiculous pedestal. You say that he barely played a part in either game - then why did they put him on the main title screen? I think it's pretty clear that Square-Enix believes Final Fantasy is highly dependent on Nomura. Don't pretend that character design doesn't make up a huge part of Final Fantasy, because when has it not? It's what we remember most.
Take a look at both the Kingdom Hearts series and the Final Fantasy series as a whole. Compared to their early titles, both have been arguably tarnished beyond repair. Why else would people be saying that Versus XIII or XV may be the series last hope for relevance? I'm not saying Nomura is solely responsible for the damage done to the Final Fantasy series and Square-Enix as a company. I personally feel that it was his creative direction that the company took and ran with has hurt them significantly on the creative side. I remember this nice quote someone told me - they turned Hironobu Sakaguchi's Final Fantasy into Tetsuya Nomura's Final Fantasy. Talk about sales all you want, but you never played any of the Kingdom Hearts games and know what sort of absolutely ridiculous things he retconned into the games after the first one, sucking a lot of the games themselves. I mean, I played Birth By Sleep, and it felt like the Disney characters were put on the backburner. Why? It's so disappointing!
Let me get this focus front and center: it's not that I don't like Tetsuya Nomura as a creator, because I enjoyed Kingdom Hearts I and II. I just don't like what he has done to either series. I'm not going to sit here and be blind by all the devotion people have for Final Fantasy and Kingdom Hearts and pretend that all the games have been perfect, especially games he was the creative lead on. I would love to put Nomura, Wada, and Kitase all on a boat out to sea. In their place, put Yoji Horii on lead design, Akihiko Matsui as director, and Yoshida Naoki as producer, and I will be a very happy man. Something tells me the board will soon get rid of Wada as it is - the guy even admitted himself the Final Fantasy brand has been damaged. The fact that you are even expecting XV (Final Fantasy 15? Really?) to turn things around is very optimistic of you, when they were talking about making Final Fantasy more like Kingdom Hearts. Oh great. I wish they let GRIN finish making that western-style Final Fantasy adventure game before they screwed them over.
R_thanatos
Member
ok i see your point .. i disagree with it but at least i see what you're talking about.
Meccanical
Member
Tetsuya Nomura is the only thing keeping Square relevant right now, as he's the only good it has left.
How's that for controversial?
How's that for controversial?
Rahxephon91
Banned
The Reason DQVIII is liked has little to do with them. If so, why haven't they been able to transfer the success in and of their other console jrpgs. DQ's quality is all Yūji Horii.
You realize most of the DS games aren't done by Sqaure and are done instead by developers like Matrix, Tose, ect. It's like the situation with DQ with Armor Project and Level 5. Level 5 does the grunt work, they aren't behind everything. It's just like the other DQ game with heartbeat. And yes you will fine plenty of people who dislike IX because of it's lack of traditional SP. And yes everyone knows XIII is a polarizing game, but again what does this have to do with Nomura? It's disliked elements aren't his fault.
No you don't.
Um no....
No one said that. He directed one part of it. Advent Children. Probably the most successful part too. So how is he ruining anything?
You can't measure this. You don't actually know how people feel. Whats your source the internet? Yes the same place that gets a hard on for every Atlus game. The only way to measure anything is the games sales, which are quite good.
Oh so you've measured this? People seem to like X-2 just fine from my experience. But thats just me. Again, though, what does X-2 have to do with Nomura? He didn't have much to do with that game. And if anything the game tells us the Sqaure is willing to change up the franchisee big time. So how is this a bad thing? How is X-2 showing a willingness to follow Nomura's lead or trend. Something you have to define.
The game was announced well after Nomura had made a big hit with VII and VIII. My point is that even after those Square made 9 and XI, showing willingness to change up the series. Something they constantly do. Something you haven't proven otherwise.
But you know what really happen around the merger, something you seem to want to ignore, so that you can continue to blame Nomura with some asinine reasons.
FUCKING YOCHI WADA BECAME PRESIDENT
So that helped the company, but the countless Nomura projects that have been successful haven't and instead he should be fired because his projects which are successful don't help the company?
I'm not trying to make you fall into a guilt trip. They blamed the drop of their stocks by78% or so on the earthquake after that their was a drop based on DQ10's reveal. I'm not sure what drop you are talking about, but since you haven't actually shown prof, just gone "their stocks dropped, blame nomura" there's not much to go on. And your going to blame it on XIII? Their successful game?
Um can you actually explain this. All you have done so far is spout nonsense. If anything he's one of the few creative people there. I mean he made a new IP, made anther well received new IP, and is taking FF into a unique direction? Can you explain how he lacks creativity. Even with XIII, they were attempting to do something very new with jrpg battle systems. Did it work? Well thats up to you. Then there's also oddball projects like TLR. If anything their problems come from management, which is something they have admitted to. But I guess you will ignore this because it's all Nomura's fault.
Which one?
What BS are you talking about. The man did not have control over the Comp of VII. He merely directed 1 part and provided character designs. WTF are you talking about? To say he had little to do with the characters in VII is quite wrong. He designed them obviously, but also Nomura was called upon to supervise Cloud's various lines and personality traits. And your blaming him for XIII? How? That is not his game at all. He has little input and the spin-off is all Toriyama and and Watanabe. Your not even making sense anymore.
How? Explain this. Each FF keeps on reinventing itself. None of them are like each other at this point.
Because AC is going for more realistic look and not the anime anime look of VII?
Really? Explain, Snow, Lightning, FFVII Cloud, Seifer......
This is really just your opinion, but it doesn't support your idea how he is ruining Sqaure or FF. The FF games continue to do different things and Sqaure remains pretty profitable thanks to him and he himself is introducing new things.
No, I believe he has creative control over his actual games. You seem to believe he has creative control over everything and when challenged don't actually back up anything.
Probably part of his contract. Maybe he has a big ego. Doesn't change the fact that XIII and XIII-2's faults have nothing to do with him.
Because he is an important member of SE? No one deny's this. What you are saying is he has ruined FF and Sqaure, yet it isn't true.
BECAUSE HE"S THE FUCKING CHARACTER DESIGNER. It even says that!
Yes I believe they do think he has some selling power. Doesn't change the fact that they have done several games without his designs.
Has and... This has nothing to do with your point. You say FF doesn't reinvent itself? It does. You say he's ruining the creativity at SE? He hasn't. You tried to say they should fire him because I guess he hasn't helped the company financially? Everyone laughs because this was stupid. Pick a point and actually explain it, instead of jumping to things.
9, 12, 14, various DS spin-offs.
Yes and? I see KH, a franchisee that has a lot of love thrown at it and fans desperately want a Sequel.
I look at FF. A series that needs to get back on track, because it's past to games(GAMES NOMURA HAD NOT THAT MUCH INVOLVEMENT IN) were polarizing
Thats your opinion. XIII was great, can't help that other people don't see that older titles were also dumb anime stuff.
Because they didn't like XIII(not because of Nomura) and hope that Nomura can deliver the goods because they have liked his other stuff? BUT BUT BUT I thought Nomura was hurting FF?
Now you have lost me? WTF have you been trying to say.
Here we are! I don't know how many post later, I'm still asking you to describe what his creative vision is and how Square has followed it with their FF games. You still haven't told us this.
What does this even mean? What is a Tetsuya Nomura FF? Melodramatic anime stuff? Thats FF! It was there in 6 and 4. This is nothing new and it sure isn't Tetsuya Nomura's fault. Hell, Sakaguchi was all about X and since then XIII and XII came out. Two games, Tetsuya Nomura had little input with the story. Whoever told you that is an idiot.
I never said this. I said I don't like KH, not that I haven't played them.
Ok the story sucks? What does this have to do with anything. Its his series.
TELL ME. WHAT HAS HE DONE?
What FF games was the creative lead on? Tell me. What FF games did he design the battle system and write the story? Hmm. No one's pretending that every FF has been prefect and now it seems the problem is that you don't like people enjoying games you don't deem whatever.
Whatever even dont bother replying. This argument is just really dumb.
Riposte
Member
Thematically speaking Mass Effect was a decent attempt at being a Star Trek season and Mass Effect was a good attempt at being a Star Trek TNG movie (heh). In terms of mechanics ME1 was shitty and poorly designed, ME2 was below average with weak squad mechanics. The dating sim and RPG mechanics in both are dull in comparison to something like Alpha Protocol.
HamPster PamPster
Member
Regardless of your opinions on Nomura, no way its worse than Matsuno's breakdown (or whatever happened). Final Fantasy Tactics, Vagrant Story, XII... we aren't getting something like that again. I'm exicted for Guild 01 but it just isn't the same
Jesus Christ, dude.
I don't blame nomura for ruining FF. In my totally unscientific opinion and lack of japanese game design knowledge I blame the gooch leaving. I come to that conclusion because I haven't liked any FF since he left, and I felt Lost Odyssey was the game FF13 should have been. I didn't even know who he was until LO either so it's not like I've been a lifelong fanboy of him...at least not knowingly.
I just feel like whoever was left over hasn't been as capable as he was at making a compelling FF.
I just feel like whoever was left over hasn't been as capable as he was at making a compelling FF.
this was my reaction
Rahxephon91
Banned
Jesus Christ what? Bashing Nomura based on nonsense is annoying.
This has gotta be the first time I've ever been in 100% total agreement with you on something, FF really lost "something" that I can't put my foot on when Sakaguchi left. The last FF he directed (5) also happens to be my favorite FF.... (although I'm enjoying XIII-2 a surprising amount)
Combichristoffersen
Combovers don't work when there is no hair
Nomura = serious business
I don't mind him at all, really
Sorry, I guess what I should have said, Nomura is our lord and savior. Everyone else hurt Square Enix, not him. Did not mean to leave a mark on his holy altar.
Versus XIII will be the greatest game ever even if we've only seen about 15 minutes of it and only know that there are a handful of characters and it plays like Kingdom Hearts though we can probably expect another extremely serious, melodramatic story that once again sucks all the air of the room. I shouldn't criticize Nomura when he's been stringing fans along for nearly 6 years on the development of Versus XIII, seemingly delaying the arguable inevitability of not meeting up to fan's unquenchable expectations of a game this long in production and thus soiling Nomura's name for good and costing the company millions (for their sake, they better jump off the Final Fantasy XIII name right now if they want to avoid it), because the fact that it's been this long means a lot of people have just stopped caring, or are expecting a completely, ultimately flawless release which let's face it, just isn't going to happen because none of Nomura's games have been treated as such, even if I enjoyed the first Kingdom Hearts.
When Square Enix is doing good by their brands, we should thank Nomura for being the creative genius he is. When it isn't, we should blame everyone else because "he played a small part" even if the opposite is true because the characters of Final Fantasy have always played a major part.
I apologize for saying that I think Nomura's designs seem to be a carbon copy of each other with their metrosexual designs and many belts and zippers, turning JRPG character design into one big joke. I apologize if I think that Nomura started Kingdom Hearts with a lot of promise and later turned the story into absolute trash with the advent of convoluted storylines, horrible turns in character development for Sora, ridiculous retconning of events, and other garbage, essentially doing to Kingdom Hearts what George Lucas did to Star Wars, and is seemingly bleeding the fanbase dry. I apologize when I think it's ridiculous that some said that Lightning is an original character when they told Nomura to simply draw "a female version of Cloud" (look at the name, for christ's sake), and that I also find it funny when someone says that X-2 wasn't a big problem for fans, even if it was the first sequel to a Final Fantasy game and opened up with a J-pop concert. I am sorry that I can't stop laughing when someone says Snow is a symbol of masculinity, and I shouldn't prop up companies like Atlus and Level-5 who are willing to take risks because you know, Deads Souls wasn't a big deal and both companies haven't been putting out criticially acclaimed games. I am sorry that people think Nomura is the only thing keeping Square Enix relevant because I thought the only reason Square has made money and stayed afloat was due to Western developers (oh wait, that's actually true because the CEO said that...). I apologize if someone had the impression that I immediately hated Nomura when it was something that happened over time as I realized just how much harm he has done to the reputation of Square Enix. Oh, and one final thing: I'm sorry if this image is all I can think of when I see Nomura's designs:
I guess that's about it. Sorry!
Versus XIII will be the greatest game ever even if we've only seen about 15 minutes of it and only know that there are a handful of characters and it plays like Kingdom Hearts though we can probably expect another extremely serious, melodramatic story that once again sucks all the air of the room. I shouldn't criticize Nomura when he's been stringing fans along for nearly 6 years on the development of Versus XIII, seemingly delaying the arguable inevitability of not meeting up to fan's unquenchable expectations of a game this long in production and thus soiling Nomura's name for good and costing the company millions (for their sake, they better jump off the Final Fantasy XIII name right now if they want to avoid it), because the fact that it's been this long means a lot of people have just stopped caring, or are expecting a completely, ultimately flawless release which let's face it, just isn't going to happen because none of Nomura's games have been treated as such, even if I enjoyed the first Kingdom Hearts.
When Square Enix is doing good by their brands, we should thank Nomura for being the creative genius he is. When it isn't, we should blame everyone else because "he played a small part" even if the opposite is true because the characters of Final Fantasy have always played a major part.
I apologize for saying that I think Nomura's designs seem to be a carbon copy of each other with their metrosexual designs and many belts and zippers, turning JRPG character design into one big joke. I apologize if I think that Nomura started Kingdom Hearts with a lot of promise and later turned the story into absolute trash with the advent of convoluted storylines, horrible turns in character development for Sora, ridiculous retconning of events, and other garbage, essentially doing to Kingdom Hearts what George Lucas did to Star Wars, and is seemingly bleeding the fanbase dry. I apologize when I think it's ridiculous that some said that Lightning is an original character when they told Nomura to simply draw "a female version of Cloud" (look at the name, for christ's sake), and that I also find it funny when someone says that X-2 wasn't a big problem for fans, even if it was the first sequel to a Final Fantasy game and opened up with a J-pop concert. I am sorry that I can't stop laughing when someone says Snow is a symbol of masculinity, and I shouldn't prop up companies like Atlus and Level-5 who are willing to take risks because you know, Deads Souls wasn't a big deal and both companies haven't been putting out criticially acclaimed games. I am sorry that people think Nomura is the only thing keeping Square Enix relevant because I thought the only reason Square has made money and stayed afloat was due to Western developers (oh wait, that's actually true because the CEO said that...). I apologize if someone had the impression that I immediately hated Nomura when it was something that happened over time as I realized just how much harm he has done to the reputation of Square Enix. Oh, and one final thing: I'm sorry if this image is all I can think of when I see Nomura's designs:
I guess that's about it. Sorry!
I think people in general love to praise and bash individuals more than they do development teams. Often seems like straight-up namedropping.
Rahxephon91
Banned
Don't attempt this BS now. I never said anything about having to like him. I don't care if you like him. I don't even like him as a game developer. I asked you to back up your ideas on how he is ruining Sqaure and detail how they are following his lead. Yet, that still hasn't happen. Now since you can't do that, you have decided to attempt to make it seem like I made an argument into "dont hurt my lord Nomura-sama". Cut the crap, either back up your points or stop posting. I even said I dislike KH. And yes you should actually blame the people rung the company, because you know they run the company...
And yeah you should blame the people behind FF's story and gameplay, because you know.....they made those? Not Nomura?
Yeah you should. You should probably expect a lot of annoying KH related stuff. I know it's to actually read, but I never said I was looking fowrad to Versus XIII. Quite the opposite actually, I have little interests because its a Nomura game. But I did say it is a seemingly creative and unique FF game. Which you know goes against your ill-defined point that Nomura is taking all the creativity out of Square. And a melodramatic FF? Crazy talk, they never had those.
None of this has anything to do with any of the crap you brought up. Do you even understand your own argument?
Your points are this.
1.Nomura is ruining Sqaure and FF creatively.
Mentioning the very long in development Versus doesn't really prove anything, because in the mean time he has produced and helped on many games that have helped Sqaure financially. Their disasters had little to do with him. And regardless of how long Versus is been development, it's still is nowhere close to creatively bankrupt. And XIII's probables don't come from a lack of creative ability, but rather poor management and questionable storytelling. Things Nomura has nothing to do with And regardless after 9 pretty much every FF reinvented itself and the company has released various games without him. . Actually poor management is just Sqaure in general, but do you want to blame him for that to?
So really, after all this you still haven't proven your own points and I'm still waiting for what it means to follow Nomura's lead and standards?
Again, stop painting arguments I never made. I don't care if you think he is a creative genius or not. This has nothing to do with your goddamn point! I think blaming him for made up problems is stupid and have yet to see an actual solid reason giving by you.
WTF are you talking about. I'm sorry, I hate to tell you.. Nomura is not sitting there writing the dialogue of FFXIII. So no, you shouldn't blame him for the problems of the characters being terrible. Are you high? The design of the character only goes so far, the actual writing makes or breaks the character. And even if he were to give them the idea of what the character should be like, if he's not writing it then no he's not to blame. And he didn't even come up with the stories of X, XII, or XIII. Unless, you have some secret proof here that actually Nomura is behind every thing at Sqaure, your just talking out of your ass.
So I don't know am I in crazy world where I think the blame for terrible characters and story should be tossed at the director and writer?
But I mean if your entire point is now characters suck because they look bad then...
.......How did you get past the fathered girly men of Amano?
I don't know where you getting that I said you can't like his designs. Actually, talk of his designs came up very little in anything I had to say. No I asked how is he ruining Square.
I mean go back to my first post.
My post has nothing to do with you disliking his character designs. No it has to do with the pretty unproven statement of.
Which then turned into me wanting to know what..
following his lead and standard meant. Because well only 1 FF after X is like X....
Which then you claimed....
And I'm still here trying to figure this out. You haven't told me and now in I guess a desperate bid you are trying to make it seem that I'm arguing with you because you hurt dear lord nomura-sama and how dare you not like his character designs. But yet I never said anything like that. I'm merely defending him because he's hardly to blame for Sqaure's problems. I mean I keep even admitting they have problems. There's no fanboyism here. Stop trying to turn me into that.
I don't like KH. I don't care. My point is that if anything it was or is a point that he has brought some creativity to the company. And that I don't know, I'm not sure he's the one who actually calls the shots on how it's milked. I mean you haven't proven otherwise. Just said "hes so big", but yet even then the "milking" of KH is part of Wada's strategy. It makes sense for the CEO to be calling the shots here. And yes he works on all of them because well it's his damn franchisee. I mean fucking Kojima works on all the MGS games to a degree even though he's made it clear he doesn't want to. But you know, higher ups force this. I'm pretty sure Kojima has the same amount of power at Konami that Nomura has, yet even he is unable to make the final call. If anything he probably does this to allow pet projects like TWEWy and Versus to be made. Of course these are all assumptions. But they are much more logical then "Nomura just wants to milk everything and I know this because I dislike him".
Um.... you do know that the point behind that is make a character like Cloud who looks to have his same disposition. I mean even the writing depicts thats what they are going for. Don't try to spin it as "make cloud and then put pink hair". Because that just makes you look like an idiot. Or just bias which it already seems you are.
Don't post the morphing thing either.
It wasn't. Can you prove otherwise? It has it's share of fans and detractors. I mean do you want to call every FF since 6 a problem? They all have equal amount of praise and dislike. Start a X-2 thread here. It will be pretty even. I know, because I hate X-2 and when I voice that people tend to disagree with me.
He looks like a pretty tough dude. I never said symbol of masculinity. I said he doesn't look like a girl, which is true. Keep trying to deflect arguments. You've done a bang up job so far.
Dead Souls is only related to Atlus because Atlus USA released it. Atlus Japan has nothing to do with it. And it wasn't a risk. They really did not have to do anything to release it here. It was already localized. It was a pretty cheap thing to do. And yes Atlus Japan takes risks, except pretty much on a small scale. But I never said anything about Atlus taking risks. I mean can you read? Do you understand why I mentioned Atlus? And Level 5 is not the most risky company. Their games are so calculated and marketed to demographics that it's not funny. And as a rpg developer I'm failing to see their critical acclaim? WKC doesn't have it. Rogue Galaxy didn't have it. Ni No Kuni doesn't actually seem to be doing too hot either. The DQ games are not actually all them either. Besides, I never said anything about that you shouldn't prop up any of these companies. Again, stop making arguments that I never made in the first place.
WTF are you talking about? No one said anything about this. THIS HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH WHAT YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT. You points were that Nomura is hurting the company both financially and creatively. Creatively is arguable. Financially, not so much. And the fact is yes he is helping in keeping them relevant. Now throwing a curve ball about western development has nothing to do with your points. Non one said anything about them. This has solely been about Nomura and Japan Sqaure. Are your points so weak that you just trying to find anything?
The answer is yes.
Again, I never was about his designs. I never said anything about you caring about his designs. My point has been solely and trying to figure out how he has harmed the company. You have yet to explain this and this entire post has just been you making up arguments for me, to discredit me. All you have done is run away and tried to make it seem like I attacked you because you have an opinion on his designs. No, I don't care. I want to know how he ruined FF and Sqaure and how the fuck they are following his lead. I mean you just brought up that they are putting a lot of effort behind western games. HOW THE FUCK IS THAT FOLLOWING NOMURA'S LEAD?
?? ok....
Vorg
Banned
Love or Hate Nomura there are somethings that people who want him fired really needtothink about.
First Nomura has created the largest IP Sqaure Japan has had aside from FF and DQ.
Second and more importantly Nomura is the person most like Gooch left. The man actively is fighting for younger blood to take more important roles. The Dissidia franchise and several other instances show that Nomura is trying to get new blood and ideas infused with the SE important positions.
Even if you want to ignore the first two, Nomura is the one designer that is activly listening to the community. We see this in how he not only wants larger worlds, but is in fact taking ques from titles like FFXII.
All of these things are very important, we don't see this alot from Japan developers, even less who are also trying to get off new IP's when the rest of the company seems plenty happy to use only the two three big ones.
First Nomura has created the largest IP Sqaure Japan has had aside from FF and DQ.
Second and more importantly Nomura is the person most like Gooch left. The man actively is fighting for younger blood to take more important roles. The Dissidia franchise and several other instances show that Nomura is trying to get new blood and ideas infused with the SE important positions.
Even if you want to ignore the first two, Nomura is the one designer that is activly listening to the community. We see this in how he not only wants larger worlds, but is in fact taking ques from titles like FFXII.
All of these things are very important, we don't see this alot from Japan developers, even less who are also trying to get off new IP's when the rest of the company seems plenty happy to use only the two three big ones.
So defensive. I am talking broadly about how much people defend Nomura as if he is this untouchable symbol worthy of so much praise. Very little of my post was directed at you, but since you want to make it out to be. For someone who pretends to have no bias and doesn't care either way, you're putting up a huge fight in support of him. lol
You keep bringing up XIII-2 when the only time I did, you took it completely out of context. If you go back and read the sentence, I said it was a problem I had with the company as a whole, releasing reactionary content. It was not aimed at Nomura specifically. As far as Versus XIII is concerned, I never said that it wasn't going to be good or that it was "creatively bankrupt" as you put it, but rather the logical conclusion that it definitely won't match up to fans' expectations because it has been this long in development and is going to be very, very difficult for the company to show as a title worthy of so much praise despite the uncertainty of what the game actually is at this point in time.
You honestly can not compare the two. Each of Amano's designs were different from each other, and were far bolder and made a stronger impact on you. While Nomura's designs seem to blend together with his fascination of Gackt and anime, Amano's illustrations are bar none absolutely incredible. Of course he drew androgynous characters that were a little effeminate, but his designs were based more on the artistic and surrealistic which made the series on a whole feel way more like you were having this amazing dream that you couldn't wake up from. He didn't have to little his characters with belts, zippers, and other accessories. Nomura's designs are bland in comparison in my opinion, easily replaced with J-pop band members, with clothes that could easily be found in some high-end clothing store. When Amano went over the top, it was with a lot of style and a lot of grace. When Nomura went over the top, it was adding belts in places where you don't wear belts, slapping a few diamond earrings for good measure. Besides, if you want to talk about manly-looking characters, we can talk about Kain, Cyan, Sabin, Amarant, Galuf.... too many to note. With Nomura, however, most of his characters had a lot of feminine characteristics about them.
In terms of direction, I remember something someone told me: Amano would draw characters as he saw them, while Nomura draws characters as he is told to. I am not mentioning this as a huge critique of his work, but it's a line that I think represents why I thought Amano was a better artist, and made the early Final Fantasy games more profound in terms of creativity. That is not a strike against Nomura, mind you - just something that appealed me about those games.
I never said it was Tetsuya Nomura's fault they made so many games. I am saying that he ruined the story of Kingdom Hearts by convoluting it to an extremely disappointing degree. Obviously companies are in business to make money. But that doesn't give anyone the excuse to drive something into the ground.
Versus XIII was not a pet project. How can it be a pet project when it has Final Fantasy XIII in the name?
The person who wrote XIII, Watanabe, is the same person that was under Nomura's wing when he made Kingdom Hearts. He taught him everything he needed to know, and they worked closely together.
Uh, what? Don't know what you're talking about, but if it shows Cloud turning into Lightning, I guess you don't want me to prove my point on the recycled designs idea. lol
The fact this it was the first Final Fantasy sequel upset a lot of fans. If you don't like it either, why play devil's advocate? I simply hate everything X-2 stood for and thought the damage started there. I am fully aware it wasn't Nomura's decision to do that. But in my opinion, it was a horrible decision regardless.
First off, Sony themselves passed on the project because they didn't think it was going to be successful (source: http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/sony-dropping-demons-souls-a-mistake). If Sony didn't want to do it but Atlus was willing to, a much smaller publisher, that shows a lot of guts, especially because they went all in by investing a lot of money in the special editions, among other things, and the high costs associated with investing in a very online-oriented title. I know you didn't say Atlus was taking risks because, once again, not everything I was talking about was directed at you!
And I never said Level-5 was the most risky company; I only said they're a company willing to take them, far more than Square-Enix has. Rogue Galaxy was actually very well received critically, so I don't know why you brought that up. Ni No Kuni is in fact critically acclaimed and a very highly anticipated title over here. You're also forgetting their Professor Layton, Dragon Quest, and Dark Cloud games. I personally find Level-5 much more creatively apt than Square Enix especially nowadays. Their games are far more exciting and fun and light-hearted, as opposed to Square-Enix's overly broody and heavily melodramatic storylines (I am criticizing Square-Enix here, not Nomura. I want to make sure you get that before you go on another unnecessary tangent).
Man, you LOOOOOOOVE taking my words out of context, don't you? Someone else brought up their opinion that Nomura was the only reason keeping Square-Enix afloat. I was responding to THEM, not YOU!
Uh,THAT IS A BIG REASON WHY I DON'T LIKE HIM! lol! A big reason why I don't like Nomura is because I really don't like how ridiculous his character designs are in that it's like Nomura looked at a poster of Gackt and traced a couple dozen characters out of that! The fact that it's become a big joke has soured me big time. I don't think you'll find someone calling out Amano for recycling designs. You're just swimming around one of the reasons I think he's hurting the company! When the characters of Final Fantasy are a big part of the game, and I hate how they look, isn't that an acceptable reason for someone not like Nomura? I think it's only common sense. I look at Lost Odyssey and Last Story, and I get excited by the character designs! I look at Final Fantasy XIII or Kingdom Hearts lately, and I start to get tired. It's just how I feel about the whole matter.
I'm not dropping facts here, or some sort of thesis for scholars in the field to look over. I'm dropping opinions, which is what this thread is all about. In my opinion, Nomura is ruining Square Enix as a company from a design perspective.
UPDATE:
Well, I never said that Nomura hasn't been a big financial asset for the company, nor am I going to sit here and pretend that I will hate Versus or the next Kingdom Hearts game because I am not some hipster (although Nomura drained a lot of faith I had in KH and DDD doesn't seem to remedy those issues as far as story is concerned). I don't really know how Dissidia is an example of him getting young blood in the mix, seeing as how the majority of people working on those games had been with Square-Enix for years. If you mean giving a few people a chance to try a different position, then sure, I can see that. I just wish he would do the same for console games that have a better profile than games on a failing platform. Versus XIII seems to be using a lot of veterans and practically no young blood, so that's disappointing. I also don't see what new IPs Nomura is getting off the ground, with all due respect. Dissidia is just a mish mash of Final Fantasy characters, purely a gift to fans like Advent Children was. Versus XIII is something they planned out from the start with the whole Fabula Nova Crystallis series compilation. I just want to set that straight.
And you mention open worlds, but I honestly do not think that is the answer to the problem, and I don't know if fans were actually clamoring for that (aside from towns, but that's not really an open world in a real sense). The thing is, the series has taken a big hit in terms of character development and the fact that at least with XIII, the JRPG formula became far more basic and linear than it had been. I think he needs to solve those problems. I don't know what you mean by taking queues from XII, but I hope it has nothing to do with the license and gambit systems. lol! I think producers like Yoshida Naoki is a perfect example of someone dedicated to listening to fans. He's been extremely attentive to the fans and deserves far more praise than he gets.
I think what bothers me about Square-Enix these past few years is that they even said themselves that they are only going to focus on mainstream games. What they essentially did was leave this huge gaping hole of people who aren't buying their games that used to, whose tastes are not being met. Sure, each Final Fantasy game lately has a few million under their belt. But in my opinion, it's because there are people out there that want to believe that Final Fantasy can return to its former glory, to have that solid story and that solid cast of characters and amazing world that we grew up enjoying. I guess my tastes are different because I grew up in the 90's playing and loving the original Final Fantasy games, and to me, a lot of the spirit that were in those games are completely missing from the modern games. Instead of characters like Cloud who used to have amazing lines like "you look like a big bear dressed up as a marshmellow" something like that), you instead have these overly serious and overly dramatic characters with uninspired designs and poorly created worlds and convoluted stories... it's heartbreaking for me as a fan. I hold out hope that with Final Fantasy XV, things will really turn around, though.
You keep bringing up XIII-2 when the only time I did, you took it completely out of context. If you go back and read the sentence, I said it was a problem I had with the company as a whole, releasing reactionary content. It was not aimed at Nomura specifically. As far as Versus XIII is concerned, I never said that it wasn't going to be good or that it was "creatively bankrupt" as you put it, but rather the logical conclusion that it definitely won't match up to fans' expectations because it has been this long in development and is going to be very, very difficult for the company to show as a title worthy of so much praise despite the uncertainty of what the game actually is at this point in time.
You honestly can not compare the two. Each of Amano's designs were different from each other, and were far bolder and made a stronger impact on you. While Nomura's designs seem to blend together with his fascination of Gackt and anime, Amano's illustrations are bar none absolutely incredible. Of course he drew androgynous characters that were a little effeminate, but his designs were based more on the artistic and surrealistic which made the series on a whole feel way more like you were having this amazing dream that you couldn't wake up from. He didn't have to little his characters with belts, zippers, and other accessories. Nomura's designs are bland in comparison in my opinion, easily replaced with J-pop band members, with clothes that could easily be found in some high-end clothing store. When Amano went over the top, it was with a lot of style and a lot of grace. When Nomura went over the top, it was adding belts in places where you don't wear belts, slapping a few diamond earrings for good measure. Besides, if you want to talk about manly-looking characters, we can talk about Kain, Cyan, Sabin, Amarant, Galuf.... too many to note. With Nomura, however, most of his characters had a lot of feminine characteristics about them.
In terms of direction, I remember something someone told me: Amano would draw characters as he saw them, while Nomura draws characters as he is told to. I am not mentioning this as a huge critique of his work, but it's a line that I think represents why I thought Amano was a better artist, and made the early Final Fantasy games more profound in terms of creativity. That is not a strike against Nomura, mind you - just something that appealed me about those games.
I never said it was Tetsuya Nomura's fault they made so many games. I am saying that he ruined the story of Kingdom Hearts by convoluting it to an extremely disappointing degree. Obviously companies are in business to make money. But that doesn't give anyone the excuse to drive something into the ground.
Versus XIII was not a pet project. How can it be a pet project when it has Final Fantasy XIII in the name?
The person who wrote XIII, Watanabe, is the same person that was under Nomura's wing when he made Kingdom Hearts. He taught him everything he needed to know, and they worked closely together.
Uh, what? Don't know what you're talking about, but if it shows Cloud turning into Lightning, I guess you don't want me to prove my point on the recycled designs idea. lol
The fact this it was the first Final Fantasy sequel upset a lot of fans. If you don't like it either, why play devil's advocate? I simply hate everything X-2 stood for and thought the damage started there. I am fully aware it wasn't Nomura's decision to do that. But in my opinion, it was a horrible decision regardless.
First off, Sony themselves passed on the project because they didn't think it was going to be successful (source: http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/sony-dropping-demons-souls-a-mistake). If Sony didn't want to do it but Atlus was willing to, a much smaller publisher, that shows a lot of guts, especially because they went all in by investing a lot of money in the special editions, among other things, and the high costs associated with investing in a very online-oriented title. I know you didn't say Atlus was taking risks because, once again, not everything I was talking about was directed at you!
And I never said Level-5 was the most risky company; I only said they're a company willing to take them, far more than Square-Enix has. Rogue Galaxy was actually very well received critically, so I don't know why you brought that up. Ni No Kuni is in fact critically acclaimed and a very highly anticipated title over here. You're also forgetting their Professor Layton, Dragon Quest, and Dark Cloud games. I personally find Level-5 much more creatively apt than Square Enix especially nowadays. Their games are far more exciting and fun and light-hearted, as opposed to Square-Enix's overly broody and heavily melodramatic storylines (I am criticizing Square-Enix here, not Nomura. I want to make sure you get that before you go on another unnecessary tangent).
Man, you LOOOOOOOVE taking my words out of context, don't you? Someone else brought up their opinion that Nomura was the only reason keeping Square-Enix afloat. I was responding to THEM, not YOU!
Uh,THAT IS A BIG REASON WHY I DON'T LIKE HIM! lol! A big reason why I don't like Nomura is because I really don't like how ridiculous his character designs are in that it's like Nomura looked at a poster of Gackt and traced a couple dozen characters out of that! The fact that it's become a big joke has soured me big time. I don't think you'll find someone calling out Amano for recycling designs. You're just swimming around one of the reasons I think he's hurting the company! When the characters of Final Fantasy are a big part of the game, and I hate how they look, isn't that an acceptable reason for someone not like Nomura? I think it's only common sense. I look at Lost Odyssey and Last Story, and I get excited by the character designs! I look at Final Fantasy XIII or Kingdom Hearts lately, and I start to get tired. It's just how I feel about the whole matter.
I'm not dropping facts here, or some sort of thesis for scholars in the field to look over. I'm dropping opinions, which is what this thread is all about. In my opinion, Nomura is ruining Square Enix as a company from a design perspective.
UPDATE:
Well, I never said that Nomura hasn't been a big financial asset for the company, nor am I going to sit here and pretend that I will hate Versus or the next Kingdom Hearts game because I am not some hipster (although Nomura drained a lot of faith I had in KH and DDD doesn't seem to remedy those issues as far as story is concerned). I don't really know how Dissidia is an example of him getting young blood in the mix, seeing as how the majority of people working on those games had been with Square-Enix for years. If you mean giving a few people a chance to try a different position, then sure, I can see that. I just wish he would do the same for console games that have a better profile than games on a failing platform. Versus XIII seems to be using a lot of veterans and practically no young blood, so that's disappointing. I also don't see what new IPs Nomura is getting off the ground, with all due respect. Dissidia is just a mish mash of Final Fantasy characters, purely a gift to fans like Advent Children was. Versus XIII is something they planned out from the start with the whole Fabula Nova Crystallis series compilation. I just want to set that straight.
And you mention open worlds, but I honestly do not think that is the answer to the problem, and I don't know if fans were actually clamoring for that (aside from towns, but that's not really an open world in a real sense). The thing is, the series has taken a big hit in terms of character development and the fact that at least with XIII, the JRPG formula became far more basic and linear than it had been. I think he needs to solve those problems. I don't know what you mean by taking queues from XII, but I hope it has nothing to do with the license and gambit systems. lol! I think producers like Yoshida Naoki is a perfect example of someone dedicated to listening to fans. He's been extremely attentive to the fans and deserves far more praise than he gets.
I think what bothers me about Square-Enix these past few years is that they even said themselves that they are only going to focus on mainstream games. What they essentially did was leave this huge gaping hole of people who aren't buying their games that used to, whose tastes are not being met. Sure, each Final Fantasy game lately has a few million under their belt. But in my opinion, it's because there are people out there that want to believe that Final Fantasy can return to its former glory, to have that solid story and that solid cast of characters and amazing world that we grew up enjoying. I guess my tastes are different because I grew up in the 90's playing and loving the original Final Fantasy games, and to me, a lot of the spirit that were in those games are completely missing from the modern games. Instead of characters like Cloud who used to have amazing lines like "you look like a big bear dressed up as a marshmellow" something like that), you instead have these overly serious and overly dramatic characters with uninspired designs and poorly created worlds and convoluted stories... it's heartbreaking for me as a fan. I hold out hope that with Final Fantasy XV, things will really turn around, though.
StickyFingers
Member
Brave man, I quit after 10 minutes.
Oldschool Resident Evil games are the best.
UMVC3 is the best VS game ever.
Halo series are the best
CoD games are the worst
RPG's can go to hell
Realistic driving games need to dissapear
I love GTAIV
Game library PS3 is poor
I hate people who wants MP to games that are fine without them (eg, AC, BioShock)
Kai Dracon
Writing a dinosaur space opera symphony
I think people blame Nomura for so much because he is the one name attached to something highly visual they can bring up: character design.
The real joke though, is that it's a lot hazier just how much Nomura is and isn't responsible for outside of character design. And the character design gripe is the most specious point of contention.
See, I'm sure Nomura must have arbitrarily been responsible for Random Poor Decision X in any given game he's had input on. But it's hard to really call out specifics unless it's a point the man has explicitly stated "I did this and it was my call" in an interview about it. So the general cloud of "Nomura suxx and ruined every game" is what most Nomura bashing threads boil down to. Or pretending to know that Nomura was directly responsible for something you can't really know about for sure.
But the fashion! Now we know he draws him some pictures, is personally responsible for them, so there's something we can sink our teeth into and grind until we've crushed our molars to dust.
The joke is that bitching about the "metrosexual" designs in Square games usually ignores the uncomfortable fact that, well, fuck son, they're really high quality metrosexual designs. It's fashionable the last five years or so to bitch about it, but for that style, Nomura (and other designers) DO actually turn out detailed designs that make instantly recognizable characters.
Everything else comes down to kvetching about taste. So you don't like pretty people, well... boo hoo :lol:
I actually get a friendly laugh out of a lot of frilly designs in that category myself, but you know what? It's no worse than any other trope. I can't deride Square Enix Belt Buckle Heroes when every western game has the same fucking 30 year old white male with a five o' clock shadow and short cropped hair, that is strategically tousled just so. They seem more acceptable just because they tend to be dirty like real men or something. I guess.
But, this is the main thing people bitch about even though it is by far the most shallow. Especially since The Other Guy's literally worshipped character designs and art basically NEVER made it into the games in a form that was recognizable outside of a few character portraits.
The real joke though, is that it's a lot hazier just how much Nomura is and isn't responsible for outside of character design. And the character design gripe is the most specious point of contention.
See, I'm sure Nomura must have arbitrarily been responsible for Random Poor Decision X in any given game he's had input on. But it's hard to really call out specifics unless it's a point the man has explicitly stated "I did this and it was my call" in an interview about it. So the general cloud of "Nomura suxx and ruined every game" is what most Nomura bashing threads boil down to. Or pretending to know that Nomura was directly responsible for something you can't really know about for sure.
But the fashion! Now we know he draws him some pictures, is personally responsible for them, so there's something we can sink our teeth into and grind until we've crushed our molars to dust.
The joke is that bitching about the "metrosexual" designs in Square games usually ignores the uncomfortable fact that, well, fuck son, they're really high quality metrosexual designs. It's fashionable the last five years or so to bitch about it, but for that style, Nomura (and other designers) DO actually turn out detailed designs that make instantly recognizable characters.
Everything else comes down to kvetching about taste. So you don't like pretty people, well... boo hoo :lol:
I actually get a friendly laugh out of a lot of frilly designs in that category myself, but you know what? It's no worse than any other trope. I can't deride Square Enix Belt Buckle Heroes when every western game has the same fucking 30 year old white male with a five o' clock shadow and short cropped hair, that is strategically tousled just so. They seem more acceptable just because they tend to be dirty like real men or something. I guess.
But, this is the main thing people bitch about even though it is by far the most shallow. Especially since The Other Guy's literally worshipped character designs and art basically NEVER made it into the games in a form that was recognizable outside of a few character portraits.
I haven't really enjoyed a WRPG (outside of The Witcher series) since the 90's, so I can't really comment about the design of those characters. lol
As far as Amano is concerned when it comes to only seeing sprites, even as a kid, I never saw sprites. I saw character portraits. Shouldn't blame them for technological hurdles. FF9 shows some of Amano's work though, at least when it came to characters like Zidane and Kuja. My feelings on Nomura grew over time, anyway. I'm not some hipster who thought it was cool to hate on him so I joined the crowd. I honestly didn't even know it was a popular thing until people reacted the way they did. I mean, I spend a lot of my time defending FF7. hehe
As far as Amano is concerned when it comes to only seeing sprites, even as a kid, I never saw sprites. I saw character portraits. Shouldn't blame them for technological hurdles. FF9 shows some of Amano's work though, at least when it came to characters like Zidane and Kuja. My feelings on Nomura grew over time, anyway. I'm not some hipster who thought it was cool to hate on him so I joined the crowd. I honestly didn't even know it was a popular thing until people reacted the way they did. I mean, I spend a lot of my time defending FF7. hehe
Rahxephon91
Banned
No one here is acting like he is untouchable. So who could you be talking about. And pretending? Yes thats it. I'm merely asking how this is true.
How did he do this? I mean only 1 main FF since X has presented his art. There have been many FF and Sqaure games on portables or whatever that don't feature art. Probably more that do. I mean outside of the Comp of VII(which makes sense) what spin-offs have his art? Dissidia? And even after Nomura, each FF has reinvented itself and even if they didn't why is it his fault? He's not in charge of the games and his actual FF does look to be an actual reinvention.
What is his lead? What are his standards? Can you answer those? Is it the standard of having girly gackt characters in everything? No, because a good portion of FF does not have that.
But then you said this.
So much for this..
And I ask you how? How is Nomura to blame for this? How is it even true?
Blah blah. It's the same argument where I guess Amano is some god who's art never looks bad. Let me tell you, Amano can create some art that looks like too much shit being thrown at you. It's the same argument where it's Zippers, zippers, zippers, but they ignore Scarfs, Scarfs, Scarfs. beads, beads, random adornments. I get it, he's a good artist. I won't argue that he isn't. He still made girly men and no the 2d FFs did not really reflect his art very well. I'm not an art major. I really don't care. They both are fine to me.
Yes, notice that their name's aren't Nomura. I mean thats the point, why saddle Nomura with XIII's faults and claim that the series can't reinvent itself and is bad?
Of course they would pass on it. It wouldn't be a big success relative to what they want out of their games. They dropped WKC2 for the same reason. That doesn't aply to Atlus , a niche company and most of their costs come from localization. Releasing a game where that work is done is not a big risk. If it failed the online would be cut and it wouldn't be a big deal. And a special edition doesn't mean much. Atlus knows their main target is the hardcore who eat those things up. Having a special edition attracts them, they do it for most of their games. It means nothing.
I don't find anything risky in what they do. Shounen infused portable games targeted at that audience who is on portables, not really risky. A puzzle game on the system that made Brain Training a hit, not really risky. Ni No Kuni is not in fact critically acclaimed, and no it isn't that much anticipated. It will probably bomb hard when it is released. It also looks like garbage like most level 5 games. It also isn't really risky. A game with anime by the most well respected Japanese anime studio? Yes real risky. Level 5 sucks. Tier rpgs are bland filled with unremarkable storytelling and mechanics. But this is unimportant.
My mistake. But he sure is a big part of it.
Thats fine. I don't care about what you think about his character designs. I never cared. But this talk of designs was not completely what you said. You claimed Sqaure was all about him. That FF couldn't reinvent itself because of him. That he was behind the milking. None of this is true and I'm still trying to figure out what following his lead and standards means. Or maybe it is true, but I'm looking for an explanation. Falling back on "i don't like his character designs is not an explanation" when it doesn't explain how FF can't and hasn't reinvent itself or is all about milking because of him. Or how is to blame for everything.
This is not this
So basicly since he does the character designs you don't like(not for every game either) the series can't reinvent itself and is milked and it's all his fault?
I think this:
Pretty much ended the argument because you never intended to listen to what I had to say, and instead just wanted to launch this all-out offensive on me without any rhyme or reason. When you only want to take my words out of context and pull unfair accusations out of thin air, I don't want to chat about it anymore. When I start a comment with, "I think", it's pretty damn clear I'm strictly speaking from my own perspective, my OPINION, and not speaking as an entire audience. I THINK he's ruining Square Enix with his poor creative aptitude. I THINK he's ruining Kingdom Hearts because he milked it to an annoying degree and alienated me as a fan. I THINK it's awful he's stringing fans along by having a game be this long in production, no matter the stage it was in, and playing with fans' emotions. I THINK I'm talking to a brick wall and I'm not going to speak further on this.
Pretty much ended the argument because you never intended to listen to what I had to say, and instead just wanted to launch this all-out offensive on me without any rhyme or reason. When you only want to take my words out of context and pull unfair accusations out of thin air, I don't want to chat about it anymore. When I start a comment with, "I think", it's pretty damn clear I'm strictly speaking from my own perspective, my OPINION, and not speaking as an entire audience. I THINK he's ruining Square Enix with his poor creative aptitude. I THINK he's ruining Kingdom Hearts because he milked it to an annoying degree and alienated me as a fan. I THINK it's awful he's stringing fans along by having a game be this long in production, no matter the stage it was in, and playing with fans' emotions. I THINK I'm talking to a brick wall and I'm not going to speak further on this.
Rahxephon91
Banned
Please tell me what is the context of this?
Whats the context? Where you always talking about just character designs? Well I guess that fits number three, but that ignores the fact that hardly every FF game has or will feature his designs. So no in terms of character designs, they were able to reinvent themselves. Hell, Nomura was as well. TWEY and KH feature art not quite like his KH art. And Versus features grounded and different character designs for him. If it wasn't about graphics then it also wasn't true.
I also doesn't explain why Nomura is to be blamed for things like XIII or FF's fan reception at all. When the things most disliked about newer FF games goes beyond character design.
It's hard to take the other points in any other context. You are blaming him for the FF milking and quality that you deem bad. I guess his character designs at the end of the day are the sole reason that every FF after IX is terrible, but yet he shouldn't hold all the blame. And he hardly can be blamed for all Square's problems, which you said he was the reason for. You are blaming him for a direction that is following his lead. Which is still unclear. Why you just wont define how Sqaure/FF is only following his lead and standard and what that is, I have no idea. But there's no other context here.
So I'll never get an explanation on what following Nomura's lead and standard meant? Not that you probably had one.
The Wheel of Fortune
Member
I hate The World Ends With You. I played for quite some time, but couldn't get into it. I had no problems understanding how to play, but the game overall sucked for me. I would like it if we got a 3DS entry, but just so that the 3DS audience expands.
I also hate Super Mario Bros 3 and New Super Mario Bros Wii. I really liked the DS one and Super Mario World, though, and Yoshi's Island is one of my favorite games ever.
I hate everything Bethesda related. Tried to get into(in order): Oblivion, New Vegas, Fallout 3 and Skyrim. Didn't like any of them, played all of them for a good while (except New Vegas).
I really liked GTA IV.
I liked Super Paper Mario, even though I'm a really big fan of the series. Surprisingly, I played it for the first time expecting a turn based game, but still ended up liking it a lot. I really liked the villians, every single one of them. Specially the main villian, which I think is the best one of the Mario series. BTW, I have low expectations for the 3DS entry.
I was disappointed by Super Mario 3D Land. It was my most anticipated game of 2011, and it turned out to be bland and lacking. But I still played it a lot(well, I think. 28 hours) and finished the really hard level.
I think WiiU is a stupid name and should be changed(I saw in a poll[not here] that the mayority liked or didn't mind the name, that's why I post this).
My favorite Pokémon region is, and will always be, Hoenn(Before playing it, my favorite were the originals). I have played(extensively) and owned every single main Pokémon game, for that matter.
I liked Frogger 3D and, aside from some ocasional texture pop-ins; I think it was a really solid game.
I don't like Call of Duty, except for the Zombies mode which I play regularly with my IRL friends.
I also hate Super Mario Bros 3 and New Super Mario Bros Wii. I really liked the DS one and Super Mario World, though, and Yoshi's Island is one of my favorite games ever.
I hate everything Bethesda related. Tried to get into(in order): Oblivion, New Vegas, Fallout 3 and Skyrim. Didn't like any of them, played all of them for a good while (except New Vegas).
I really liked GTA IV.
I liked Super Paper Mario, even though I'm a really big fan of the series. Surprisingly, I played it for the first time expecting a turn based game, but still ended up liking it a lot. I really liked the villians, every single one of them. Specially the main villian, which I think is the best one of the Mario series. BTW, I have low expectations for the 3DS entry.
I was disappointed by Super Mario 3D Land. It was my most anticipated game of 2011, and it turned out to be bland and lacking. But I still played it a lot(well, I think. 28 hours) and finished the really hard level.
I think WiiU is a stupid name and should be changed(I saw in a poll[not here] that the mayority liked or didn't mind the name, that's why I post this).
My favorite Pokémon region is, and will always be, Hoenn(Before playing it, my favorite were the originals). I have played(extensively) and owned every single main Pokémon game, for that matter.
I liked Frogger 3D and, aside from some ocasional texture pop-ins; I think it was a really solid game.
I don't like Call of Duty, except for the Zombies mode which I play regularly with my IRL friends.
You will be my arch-nemesis and I will thwart you at every turn.
Just started playing the Uncharted series ( finally decide to buy first game for PS3 since i bought it this past holiday, so I bought the collection), and I'm not seeing what's so special ( I'm playing the first one), does it get better, or is this just a graphics showpiece (which doesn't even look THAT mind blowing as I thought it would)???
Hah, agreed, and I have had to review a fair share of them. So bad...
Vorg
Banned
I finished the first one and hated it all the way through. Here's my LTTP thread. Uncharted 2 is amazing, though.
Combichristoffersen
Combovers don't work when there is no hair
The first one is good, but shit doesn't get real until you get to UC2.
Are you talking about 3D Land, Mario Kart, or Ghost Recon?
Revelations, I assumed.