The Main Event
Member
Link Man said:
Not really followed the rumors lately,
but isn't The Riddler supposed to be Mike Engel? That rumor was from last year.
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Rottenwatch: THE DARK KNIGHT
- Thread starter SCULLIBUNDO
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Not really followed the rumors lately,
Amir0x said:
Yeah, but the Joker is just as superficial and void as the rest of these guys, until you get a writer who makes him into a three-dimensional, living, breathing entity, like they did in TDK. No reason that other characters cant be similarly improved.
I mean, the Joker sounds utterly retarded by any description, and yet you see him in TDK and you believe it.
brandonh83
Banned
I don't think TDK is unbeatable. At all. I'd give it a perfect score but I don't think they can't do any better. Just depends on what kind of story and cast and crew they have.
Solo said:
I think by in large in works so well because you're not bogged down by an origin story. I mean from the first frame he appears, he's basically firing on all cylinders. I really liked Jonah Nolan's comment that he likes to think the first shot you see of Joker appearing holding the mask on the street, the character is a bit like an aberration, just appearing like that.
Without knowing a huge amount of detail about the other roster of Batman villians, I'm not sure if Nolan can do something similar in a new film, without some sort of set-up. I mean Begins ending was setting up Joker for Dark Knight, but I'm dubious whether they can have another character be played to the absolute, like that.
J2 Cool said:
A catalogue? No, when you have a gallery of rogues it's much harder to make most of the villains deep. Most which do it right focus on one or two villains, and by that measure yeah there are a metric fuckton of those which have deep villains.
And unlike what Solo said, JOKER actually is pretty fucking three dimensional. Even before Nolan came in, the best Batman comic writers have already zoned in on what makes him the most compelling of all Batman villains.
There has never been another villain that came close in the series, because there isn't another that is as interesting.
Fun facts:
a) There will be another Batman film
b) It has just as good a shot of being as good with Nolan at the helm
c) Joker was not always the best villain in the rogues gallery
d) He's not even the most three dimensional available
e) A good writer can make a dumb villain good (see Mr. Freeze post-TAS, Clayface, etc.)
a) There will be another Batman film
b) It has just as good a shot of being as good with Nolan at the helm
c) Joker was not always the best villain in the rogues gallery
d) He's not even the most three dimensional available
e) A good writer can make a dumb villain good (see Mr. Freeze post-TAS, Clayface, etc.)
Yeah, but the Joker was the engine of the movie. His morbid stunts drove the movie and gave it all of its sense of urgency. It dragged a little bit when it shifted to Two Face.
I love Nolan, but he'll sort of be starting from scratch. This isn't a repeatable formula.
And of course the Joker was always the best villain! Whatareya, crazy?
I love Nolan, but he'll sort of be starting from scratch. This isn't a repeatable formula.
And of course the Joker was always the best villain! Whatareya, crazy?
Vast Inspiration
Banned
ATTENTION EVERYONE
All of you need to watch the movie Felon. And pay close attention to Val Kilmer's Character.
We have found the next actor capable of carrying a third Batman movie. Val Kilmer just seems to get better and better as he gets older. His rugid deamnor, his beard, his weight, his voice, all make him look more serious and more sinister.
I don't know how, but they need to cast him as the next villian. And the idea will sell well. Former Batman coming back as incredible villian, following in the footsteps of an amazing performance by Heath Ledger.
VAL KILMER EVERYONE! VAL FUCKING KILMER!
(Watch Felon to understand what I mean.)
All of you need to watch the movie Felon. And pay close attention to Val Kilmer's Character.
We have found the next actor capable of carrying a third Batman movie. Val Kilmer just seems to get better and better as he gets older. His rugid deamnor, his beard, his weight, his voice, all make him look more serious and more sinister.
I don't know how, but they need to cast him as the next villian. And the idea will sell well. Former Batman coming back as incredible villian, following in the footsteps of an amazing performance by Heath Ledger.
VAL KILMER EVERYONE! VAL FUCKING KILMER!
(Watch Felon to understand what I mean.)
Mandark said:
So because a villain was the engine of one movie, we're incapable of making another Batman movie? It's been done!
Not really. He's been the arch-nemesis, but not really the best villain. The Joker owes a lot to a handful of talented writers that have fleshed him out in the past two decades.
Mike Works
Member
The Blob is in the X-Men universe, not Batman.Vast Inspiration said:
Watched it yesterday.
Excellent movie. A bit too long for me, but still, it's fucking great. Though, I do wish there were more Joker scenes.
My favorite part was
Even though i'm more of a Marvel fan, TDK tops every Marvel release so far.
I'd give 9.5/10
Excellent movie. A bit too long for me, but still, it's fucking great. Though, I do wish there were more Joker scenes.
My favorite part was
when Joker tells everyone that he's going to blow up a hospital if someone doesn't shoot guywhosenameiforgot in 60 minutes. What really amazed me is how much power Joker has over the people. He says he's going to blow up a hospital and all of them get evacuated and everyone starts shooting at guywhosenameiforgot. Of course, the twist with him clearing the hospitals so he can chat with Harvey was a nice moment too, albeit predictable (atleast to me).
Even though i'm more of a Marvel fan, TDK tops every Marvel release so far.
I'd give 9.5/10
yeah i really glossed over this for several days, but now it's hit home..... i never liked the sonar scenes. at all. i actually remember tuning out emotionally during those parts, but the memories of the rest of the movie easily overwhelmed that disappointment for a while. but i suppose it should be said/repeated: the sonar kinda sucked, at least relative to an otherwise brilliant film.
they may not be able to top TDK, but i feel they can match it or at least come close. would it really be so disappointing if most of us felt: "not as wonderful as TDK, but still excellent". if they can keep everyone together, which i'm sure they will, i would deeply regret them not doing a third film. i seriously doubt a third film, since it is in such hands, could possibly taint the series or do any less than contribute a great deal.
they may not be able to top TDK, but i feel they can match it or at least come close. would it really be so disappointing if most of us felt: "not as wonderful as TDK, but still excellent". if they can keep everyone together, which i'm sure they will, i would deeply regret them not doing a third film. i seriously doubt a third film, since it is in such hands, could possibly taint the series or do any less than contribute a great deal.
Mike Works
Member
PS: people who say THIS CAN NEVER BE TOPPED are fucking retarded
everything can be topped
ever
that being said, this probably WON'T be topped... but good god is there anyone in this thread who doesn't want to give the nolan brothers a shot?
everything can be topped
ever
that being said, this probably WON'T be topped... but good god is there anyone in this thread who doesn't want to give the nolan brothers a shot?
amirox doesn't count because the majority of his posts and opinions are just awful, just... just really bad stuff
Mgoblue201
Won't stop picking the right nation
I hope that Nolan is more concerned with continuing the story than trying to trump his masterpiece. I hope to God that no one would degrade a third movie if it was merely excellent but not up to the level of TDK. I just want a story to tell something, and there are still dimensions in which a third film could go. Stories should be judged on that measure, and I don't think that any story should be nullified before it is made just because of the impossible standards it might be held to. I don't know about anybody else, but I don't stop eating steak because I had the best steak that I could ever imagine. I still get hungry, and steak still tastes really good. I don't know where this metaphor is going, but Nolan has created something rather unique, and as long as he has something new to tell in that universe, it doesn't make sense to stop now. In fact, I would love to see this as a big saga in which the Batman character keeps evolving from one film to the next.godhandiscen said:
Witchfinder General
punched Wheelchair Mike
Ugh, just came back from seeing it with the wife.
Outside of the opening bank scene and Heath Ledger's amazing performance the movie was fairly horrible. The first one wasn't that great but at least I didn't have to sit through nearly three hours of a bloated, schizophrenic mess.
Outside of the opening bank scene and Heath Ledger's amazing performance the movie was fairly horrible. The first one wasn't that great but at least I didn't have to sit through nearly three hours of a bloated, schizophrenic mess.
Oh! My Car!
Member
Oh no you didn't!Witchfinder General said:
AGAIN!
JimiNutz
Banned
Amir0x said:
I'm inclined to agree, especially as Nolan has been saying TDK is his definitive Batman story. The only way I can see it going is (copied and pasted from another thread)
NutJobJim said:
Don't get me wrong I wouldn't want a direct translation of the book-although I haven't actually read it I've read a synopsis and know what happens in the story. I imagine The Dark Knight Returns could serve as a loose inspiration for the third Nolan movie similar to how Batman Begins was loosely based on Year One. Doing a Batman story in the future with an older Bruce is something that has not yet been seen on screen as far as Batman movies goes and there's a lot of new themes for Nolan to explore.
Went to see the movie yesterday night, i was BLOWN AWAY.
Fuck, it's insanely amazing... i came out speechless, astonished by it...
It's BY FAR the best movie taken from a comic EVER, and it's an incredible movie itself.
Now Oscar award to Ledger please, his performance is just memorable.
And i know if won't happen due to the stellar numbers at the boxoffice, but i wish they don't make a sequel... it's perfect like this and it would be hard to top this one...
Fuck, it's insanely amazing... i came out speechless, astonished by it...
It's BY FAR the best movie taken from a comic EVER, and it's an incredible movie itself.
Now Oscar award to Ledger please, his performance is just memorable.
And i know if won't happen due to the stellar numbers at the boxoffice, but i wish they don't make a sequel... it's perfect like this and it would be hard to top this one...
me so Grant
Neo Member
Although I don't want a third one, I'm coming around to the Dark Knight Returns idea.
But it doesn't need an older Bruce Wayne. It can take place now, in Wayne's younger years, where we already are.
Scoop out the ideas that could work from DKR because there are plenty. Adapt them loosely to fit within the structure that exists.
Adapt the idea of crime becoming more outwardly, regularly violent due to Batman/The Joker (we don't need the name "The Mutants" though). They have better equipment. They're not afraid to use it. They have no motive other than destruction. Basically its a mix between The Mutants and The Jokerz (from BatmanBeyond).
Man, I want a version of the DKR mudhole scene so badly.
We'd get to see how Batman grapples with the realization that he hasn't served as much of an inspiration. He's inspired the wrong people. And The Joker pushed that inspiration further in that wrong direction.
Meanwhile, keep a big focus on the police hunting Batman. Again, there's plenty from DKR to take here. The Mayor's hand is forced, maybe he suspends Gordon or something, but either way he sets up a more dedicated Batman Task Force. And the person in charge is as ballsy and determined as Yindel was in DKR.
Someone mentioned the idea of pushing toward a somewhat political-ish thriller. I like that idea. As all of the law agencies in Gotham want Batman dead because of public outcry, Batman still considers himself part of the establishment in a way. Maybe we have Deadshot with a contract on the Mayor. Or Gordon.
Since the movie needs a female, Catwoman seems logical. Keep her origin as it is in Year One (maybe minus the hooker angle) -- she's a Batman imitator. Just wants a better life for herself. Nothing but a crook. Maybe Batman works with her in some capacity. Not a partnership, but he realizes her usefulness. Plus he wants to nail her.
Anyway, I agree with others. This must be a movie focused on Bruce Wayne.
But it doesn't need an older Bruce Wayne. It can take place now, in Wayne's younger years, where we already are.
Scoop out the ideas that could work from DKR because there are plenty. Adapt them loosely to fit within the structure that exists.
Adapt the idea of crime becoming more outwardly, regularly violent due to Batman/The Joker (we don't need the name "The Mutants" though). They have better equipment. They're not afraid to use it. They have no motive other than destruction. Basically its a mix between The Mutants and The Jokerz (from BatmanBeyond).
Man, I want a version of the DKR mudhole scene so badly.
We'd get to see how Batman grapples with the realization that he hasn't served as much of an inspiration. He's inspired the wrong people. And The Joker pushed that inspiration further in that wrong direction.
Meanwhile, keep a big focus on the police hunting Batman. Again, there's plenty from DKR to take here. The Mayor's hand is forced, maybe he suspends Gordon or something, but either way he sets up a more dedicated Batman Task Force. And the person in charge is as ballsy and determined as Yindel was in DKR.
Someone mentioned the idea of pushing toward a somewhat political-ish thriller. I like that idea. As all of the law agencies in Gotham want Batman dead because of public outcry, Batman still considers himself part of the establishment in a way. Maybe we have Deadshot with a contract on the Mayor. Or Gordon.
Since the movie needs a female, Catwoman seems logical. Keep her origin as it is in Year One (maybe minus the hooker angle) -- she's a Batman imitator. Just wants a better life for herself. Nothing but a crook. Maybe Batman works with her in some capacity. Not a partnership, but he realizes her usefulness. Plus he wants to nail her.
Anyway, I agree with others. This must be a movie focused on Bruce Wayne.
me so Grant
Neo Member
Timbuktu said:
Compare the dialogue between Begins and TDK. That gives you an immediate answer.
Nevermind that the themes are handled with a bit more subtlety, the charcterization is more natural, we spend less time twiddling our thumbs waiting for things to happen, etc..
SpeedingUptoStop
will totally Facebook friend you! *giggle* *LOL*
Johnathon Nolan is indeed a ballin' writer. IMDB says he's working on a spielberg film - any truth to this?
SonicMegaDrive
Member
There's been so much written about this film, it's all so hard to take in.
HOW good is this movie? When the credits started to roll after my first viewing of the film, I don't think I'd ever been as satisfied or pleased with what I'd witnessed on screen as I have with 'Dark Knight'.
But where does this film rank? Is it really one of the best films of the year? Does this movie deserve an Oscar nomination for 'Best Picture'? I thought the film was earnestly that good. But was my enthusiasm for this film blurred because I'm a pretty big Batman buff? Or would I have enjoyed this film, regardless of any pre-existing hype or knowledge of it's history or characters?
Either way, the movie feels genuine. It's good, damned good.
What will history say about 'The Dark Knight'? Best 'Comic book movie', and the one that will set the standard for years to come, much like 'Superman' and the first 'Batman' before it?
Or something a bit more?
HOW good is this movie? When the credits started to roll after my first viewing of the film, I don't think I'd ever been as satisfied or pleased with what I'd witnessed on screen as I have with 'Dark Knight'.
But where does this film rank? Is it really one of the best films of the year? Does this movie deserve an Oscar nomination for 'Best Picture'? I thought the film was earnestly that good. But was my enthusiasm for this film blurred because I'm a pretty big Batman buff? Or would I have enjoyed this film, regardless of any pre-existing hype or knowledge of it's history or characters?
Either way, the movie feels genuine. It's good, damned good.
What will history say about 'The Dark Knight'? Best 'Comic book movie', and the one that will set the standard for years to come, much like 'Superman' and the first 'Batman' before it?
Or something a bit more?
SpeedingUptoStop
will totally Facebook friend you! *giggle* *LOL*
The general consensus a lot of the time is either "best comic book movie ever made" or "(one of my) favorite film(s) of all time".SonicMegaDrive said:
I don't think many people agree with the consensus of best film of all time.
I do not think however it'd be particularly unwarranted to say it is the best film of the year so far, however. But the year is basically a little over half over and studios tend to throw their best films out near the end for oscar consideration. So who knows exactly what will turn up between now and the end.
I do not think however it'd be particularly unwarranted to say it is the best film of the year so far, however. But the year is basically a little over half over and studios tend to throw their best films out near the end for oscar consideration. So who knows exactly what will turn up between now and the end.
SonicMegaDrive
Member
Well, I don't want to go as far as to say "best film ever made", obviously.
In fact, I don't think there is such a thing. There's just too many invariables, too many things that can define the greatness of a film.
However, to simply say it's the "Best Comic Book film ever made" sounds like a grave disservice.
I guess what I'm trying to get at is, can we - we, the internet-reading comic book and pop culture geeks that we are - look at this movie with clarity and judge it for what it really is?
It just seems so surreal to me. Comic book movies have traditionally been throw-away entertainment. Even the very best. Sure, a few of them have tried to reach outside the box and provide us with more than just simply a good popcorn flick. But not to the same degree that 'Dark Knight' has attempted and succeeded in doing.
To think that a movie based on a comic book can be this good, seems so surprising to me, it's almost terrifying.
In fact, I don't think there is such a thing. There's just too many invariables, too many things that can define the greatness of a film.
However, to simply say it's the "Best Comic Book film ever made" sounds like a grave disservice.
I guess what I'm trying to get at is, can we - we, the internet-reading comic book and pop culture geeks that we are - look at this movie with clarity and judge it for what it really is?
It just seems so surreal to me. Comic book movies have traditionally been throw-away entertainment. Even the very best. Sure, a few of them have tried to reach outside the box and provide us with more than just simply a good popcorn flick. But not to the same degree that 'Dark Knight' has attempted and succeeded in doing.
To think that a movie based on a comic book can be this good, seems so surprising to me, it's almost terrifying.
Christopher
BDE (Big Dad Energy)
:lol who said we need an older Bruce Wayne? fuck that.
I like these series of the films in the modern era/time. All I want is one more from Nolan and I can go away from the Batman franchise happy.
Man though being a Batman fan as a kid till now has been amazing...honestly though I really did hate Batman Forever, and Batman & Robin...totally the death of mainstream Batman in America.
One more Nolan
And to whoever hates this film, let them...its' their opinion, (a wrong one ;p) but thiers.
I still think Dent stole the show...really good good acting from him. Ledger was pretty good too, but not all that and shome chips.
I like these series of the films in the modern era/time. All I want is one more from Nolan and I can go away from the Batman franchise happy.
Man though being a Batman fan as a kid till now has been amazing...honestly though I really did hate Batman Forever, and Batman & Robin...totally the death of mainstream Batman in America.
One more Nolan
And to whoever hates this film, let them...its' their opinion, (a wrong one ;p) but thiers.
I still think Dent stole the show...really good good acting from him. Ledger was pretty good too, but not all that and shome chips.
SpeedingUptoStop
will totally Facebook friend you! *giggle* *LOL*
Will probably end up being the best spielberg film ever.jett said:
Anton Sugar
Member
Mike Works said:
I agree with everything this guy says.
Mike Works said:
I dunno you don't seem confident that it'll be topped either. I mean because if you were, your best argument wouldn't be basement bin insults combined with a mild 'well it could happen, theoretically! It probably won't though!'
Also nobody is saying the Nolan Brothers shouldn't be given another shot, despite your reading deficiencies itt. As has been established over and over in this thread, while I don't personally want another movie I sure as shit believe they can make another GOOD one. The argument is only that it has no chance of being better than DARK KNIGHT.
I saw it on Thursday and thought it was really good. Just under Iron Man for me though. Ledger was incredible and pretty much made the film. I still hate the voice of batman though. It's really hard to understand what he's saying. Spiderman can talk normally without being discovered so why can't Batman?
Nazgul_Hunter
Member
The voices in this and BB are basically the same, the big difference was that Batman got way too many lines in this movie. Anything longer than 4 words sounded weird. I didn't mind it as much as other people seem to have, though. (Then again, I saw the movie with spanish subtitles, so I didn't need to understand everything he said)
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