• Hey Guest. Check out your NeoGAF Wrapped 2025 results here!

SC: Blacklist | Spies Vs Mercs (Full 20 min match)

legacyzero said:
See, I'm in the opposing camp that says Remote Hacking is a must. Its good gameplay, its good strategy. To be standing at the terminal is just fucking dumb.
Click to expand...

One thing I noticed about people who get attached to one game (including me) is that we hate change. :-P I spent hours and hours on SvM CT playing Clubhouse and Aquarium. So. Much. Fun.

I definitely have my eyes peeled for this though.
 
The Stealth Fox said:
One thing I noticed about people who get attached to one game (including me) is that we hate change. :-P I spent hours and hours on SvM CT playing Clubhouse and Aquarium. So. Much. Fun.

I definitely have my eyes peeled for this though.
Click to expand...
I think I remember some Orphanage fro CT. That wasa cool map!
 
legacyzero said:
See, I'm in the opposing camp that says Remote Hacking is a must. Its good gameplay, its good strategy. To be standing at the terminal is just fucking dumb.
Click to expand...

I felt that stationary hacking added another layer of strategy to the game. Instead of the challenge being simply rushing to the objective, you had to actually plan out an ambush or communicate with your partner to keep the Mercs at bay.
 
Finally watched the video. It really isn't classic SvM. It's still a version of SvM that plays to the same basic concept and rules, and may even be fun for some of the same reasons, but they can't really call it "classic."

A lot of the kills were from mistakes on both sides from what I could tell. I don't think either side was experienced with the roles. Didn't see spies making very much use of caution or the shadows.

Remote hacking is an interesting rule change that definitely makes things harder on the mercs. Now instead of "distract and hack" it's a more straightforward game of cat-and-mouse. Forcing role switches is also good.

I'm still gonna try it out through a PS3 rental or something.
 
Sober said:
If you really want to cringe and call this a bomba betrayalthon of a failure ... well, there's a video for that.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q48-ui877Aw
Click to expand...

Ouch...Ouch...

So many lethal moments going on there that completely take the tension away from the previous games. As a spy, you HAD to be very alert and play like a mouse until you can get to the Merc's back (or head) but now that whole tension is gone and you can just pop out of the shadows and take them out head on. Sure, the Mercs are better armed still, but all you need is that one second advantage to run out and stab them in the eye and it's over now.

I don't get why we HAVE to play the game to voice our concerns with it. "Buy the game first and THEN complain". It's the same as any other game where you judge it based on what's available except it doesn't take much to see that this isn't some minor changes to "evolve" the franchise but rather core changes that drastically affect how the game feels. Dumb any game down to this level from previous iterations and their fans are sure to be pissed too.

Not to mention, how can people not be concerned about MP after what they've done to SP? How are we supposed to have blind faith that these are all great changes that evolve the series when we heard the same shit about SP and then watch these videos?

I think the issue here is people have no more faith left in the series to remain optimistic and these videos sure aren't helping.
 
legacyzero said:
See, I'm in the opposing camp that says Remote Hacking is a must. Its good gameplay, its good strategy. To be standing at the terminal is just fucking dumb.
Click to expand...

h3pBNHA.gif



Standing as the terminal requires good strategy and teamwork.

Remote hacking requires neither.
 
I really don't understand the mentality of people who show up late to a franchise and tell the people who were there from day one, what "good gameplay" is.

Want to know how they could've improved and built upon on Spies vs Mercs without this bullshit?

  • Better controls all around. Splinter Cell has always controlled kinda clunky. This was something Conviction actually did well.
  • New and improved gadgetry for both sides. Get rid of stuff like flares and replace them with things like placeable cameras. Give the spies something to tag and track a merc on a map. Even something like the drone can fit in, as it gives the mercs the ability to do what they should be doing. Hunting. Not being hunted.
  • Four on four can be totally fine. As long as the maps are scaled appropriately. This is something Blacklist does wrong, as instead of going the route of Chaos Theory, which had large maps. They constrained the size to give you a death match arena.
But instead? They went the opposite route. Look at the video I posted earlier. Notice how security cameras and lasers are now absent. Notice how unlimited lives are not the standard. Anything that would slow down gameplay, like proper stealth should, is removed. This game is made for the "but I want it now, I'm tired of waiting" type of mentality. The lazy crowd who view their stats as the most important statistic in the match. This is exactly why people that played death match on Warehouse were disliked by the community; and it's exactly why people that were Splinter Cell fans since the first feel spurned. They're changing the genre of the game to empower the player who wasn't buying the game in the first place.

Do I need to have played this game to know it's probably bad? No. That's what happens when you've been committed to a franchise since it's inception. I've watched Ubisoft shit on this series for what will be three games now (not counting the handheld releases.) Which means that they will now have put out an equal number of bad Splinter Cell games as they have good. But yeah, you're right, these absolutely fundamental gameplay changes will probably pan out and I'm just wrong. What would I know?
 
Nightshade1765 said:
I really don't understand the mentality of people who show up late to a franchise and tell the people who were there from day one, what "good gameplay" is.

Want to know how they could've improved and built upon on Spies vs Mercs without this bullshit?

  • Better controls all around. Splinter Cell has always controlled kinda clunky. This was something Conviction actually did well.
  • New and improved gadgetry for both sides. Get rid of stuff like flares and replace them with things like placeable cameras. Give the spies something to tag and track a merc on a map. Even something like the drone can fit in, as it gives the mercs the ability to do what they should be doing. Hunting. Not being hunted.
  • Four on four can be totally fine. As long as the maps are scaled appropriately. This is something Blacklist does wrong, as instead of going the route of Chaos Theory, which had large maps. They constrained the size to give you a death match arena.
But instead? They went the opposite route. Look at the video I posted earlier. Notice how security cameras and lasers are now absent. Notice how unlimited lives are not the standard. Anything that would slow down gameplay, like proper stealth should, is removed. This game is made for the "but I want it now, I'm tired of waiting" type of mentality. The lazy crowd who view their stats as the most important statistic in the match. This is exactly why people that played death match on Warehouse were disliked by the community; and it's exactly why people that were Splinter Cell fans since the first feel spurned. They're changing the genre of the game to empower the player who wasn't buying the game in the first place.

Do I need to have played this game to know it's probably bad? No. That's what happens when you've been committed to a franchise since it's inception. I've watched Ubisoft shit on this series for what will be three games now (not counting the handheld releases.) Which means that they will now have put out an equal number of bad Splinter Cell games as they have good. But yeah, you're right, these absolutely fundamental gameplay changes will probably pan out and I'm just wrong. What would I know?
Click to expand...

+1

i've seen the same apologist speak when the DA multiplayer was being dished out, and the reality of it was that it wasn't very good. theres a constant emphasis on streamlining the experience, from removing gadget complexity, to reducing map complexity, to minimizing the barriers to engage (frontal assaults), to minimizing the penalty for deaths (infinite lives). I'm still keeping a (semi)-open mind about this all, but they really have to show me some actual compelling gameplay. Theres very little actual strategy at play here, and most of it boils down to twitch reflexes instead of planning foresight.
 
Bumped because here are some impressions. Ubi held a SvM Tournament (invite only I guess) in London.

From a post from the official forums:

Hello All My Name is Aaron. I was one of the Contestants at the London Blacklist Tournament. My Team was Competing as Team 7.

The Tournament was Based on the Blacklist Mode [4 VS 4] Of which My Team Finished in Second Place overall. The Prizes for Our Performance was the following.


a 4GB Usb Karambit USB Stick.
a 4GB 5,7 Pistol USB Stick.
a Blacklist T-shirt.​


Overall the Spy VS Merc Blacklist Mode is a Big Improvement Over Double Agents Spy VS Mercs Mode. I would say the main reason for this is due to how Fluid the Motion is for both the Spies and the Mercs.

It is evident that a lot has been taken from the Assassins Creed Games, with respect to the Rapid Smooth Traversal of the Environment.

Both the Spies and Mercs will Vault over Low Objects, or Down from Railings and Windows Automatically whilst holding the Sprint Button.

The Game Features Infinite Lives, The Penalty for Death is about 8 Seconds. Death comes very easy for both Teams so the Unlimited Lives makes a lot of sense.

The Spies are now Agile and Dangerous, So Camping as a Merc is not advised, Unless You like being Stabbed.

Gone is the Ability to Break Lights, not that this matters much, there are plenty of Dark Corners for both sides to use as Ambush Points. And given the speed of the Gameplay in this Game, this would only serve as a pointless Distraction.

Spy Gadgets and Equipment.
  • SMG - Capable of Killing Mercs in Light Armor.
  • Sonar Goggles - Periodic Sweep that Highlights Merc Positions for the User.
  • Intel Sweep - Red Radar Sweep that Highlights All Mercs on the Map for a Brief While.
  • Cloak - Cloaks the Spy for around 10 Seconds, Moving Rapidly causes the Cloak to Flicker.
  • Grenade Types: Flashbang, Smoke, Emp.

Merc Gadgets
  • Assault Rifle, Pump Action Shotgun.
  • Motion Scanner - Works much the Same as the Aliens Scanner. Semi Circle Field of View that Pics Spies when movement is Detected. Blind Spot Behind the Merc.
  • UAV Drone - Same drone as what is the Single Player Videos. No Attacks Except for Self Destruct.
  • Jamming Device - Small Circle around the Merc, that Disables all Electronics. Removes Tagged Mercs, and De cloaks Hidden Spies.
  • Intel Device - Sweeps a Local Area and Highlights Nearby Spies.
  • Proximity Mine - Detonates and Kills Spies that get to Close.
  • Grenade Types: Frag, VX Gas.


There are more Gadgets but they were locked behind a Customization Wall that needs unlocking with in game Credits.

Overall I am Happy with the Update to Splinter Cell Blacklists Spy VS Merc Multiplayer. And Fans of this Mode should not be disappointed.

Thank You. Aaron.
Click to expand...

Ok The Maps are Large and Divided into 3 Zones. With Lots of Rapid Traversal for the Spies, and Limited Traversal for the Mercs. By this I mean the Mercs can Hop down from any Height. But have Lmited climbing Abilities and can only climb over low Obstacles and Up Ladders.

The Spies However can like the Mercs drop down from any Height, but can Also Climb Up from any Height. In a Similar Fashion to the Assassins Creed Games. And also make Use of the Overhead Pipes for Death From Above Takedowns.

The Maps are Very Different and Unique. The Maps I got to Try was:

Train Yard. This was Divided into a Train Yard Section with Train Cars to Weave in and out of, and to climb onto. And Two Warehouse Sections, that Had lots of Places for the Spies to Hide.

Particle Collider. This Map is Hard to Explain, but has lots of Up and Down Elevation for the Spies to take advantage of, and a Lot of Dark Corners that can be used by both sides for Sneaky Ambushes.

Stealth can Be Employed to Lethal Effect by both Teams. Only this time the Spies are worthy of being Feared. Don't Run in Alone, Lest You fall Victim to the Karambit Knife.

The Spies are Fragile and Usually go down with only a short Spray of Your Assault Rifle or a Close Up Blast from Your Shotgun. But Yes Agro Spies are back in a big way. So Check Those Corners and Don't Run in Alone. And most of all Don't Camp.

In Terms of Movement Both the Spies and the Mercs Feel Very Smooth. The Movement of the Spies Feels very much like the Movement of Archer and Kestrel from Deniable Ops, Conviction.

And the Mercs Movement is somewhat like Call of Duty, only not quite as fast. And the Traversal is a bit like Battlefield in the Way that You Vault over Low Obstacles.

The Re spawn Mechanic works like this. Zone 1 is Under Attack, If You die as the Spies You will re spawn in the middle of zone 2 or 3 and the same will happen for the Mercs. Needless to say Spawn Killing did not seem to be an Issue.

Both the Spies and the Mercs Feel Very Powerful and the Variety of the Gadgets and Methods of attack keep You on Your Toes. Overall it felt Balanced. Some Advice, Do not Camp it will get you killed.
Click to expand...


Positive spin? Obvious PR Plant? Someone new to the franchise but faking it? Race traitor? You decide.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

  • Poll
Daigo vs MenaRD FT10 exhibition match on 4/29
2
90
463
Diddy X replied
  • Locked
DLSS5 vs PSSR vs FSR vs XESS etc
3
272
daninthemix replied
  • Poll
Tainted Grail vs. Hell is Us vs. Cronos vs. Dying Light Beast
46
307
xenosys replied
Steam Machine may get full HDMI 2.1 support, AMD confirms plans for full AMDGPU implementation
2
65
156
S0ULZB0URNE replied
A24 Elden Ring movie releasing March 2028. Full cast announced.
2 3
106
645
Bert Big Balls replied
Top Bottom