Bravo, you worded that impeccably well.
I still stand by my belief that the Animations and expressions in Mass Effect Andromeda are terrible, but I'll be more ingenious with my remarks.
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Scumbags Harass Woman For Working On Mass Effect: Andromeda's Animations
- Thread starter fluffydelusions
- Start date
I still stand by my belief that the Animations and expressions in Mass Effect Andromeda are terrible, but I'll be more ingenious with my remarks.
KimonoNoNo
Member
What a mealy-mouthed non-condemnation that is.
It basically boils down to; She's got nothing to do with us.
Poodlestrike
Banned
Basically this.
If it began and ended with "ha ha this animation looks funny as hell," that'd be that. But it doesn't. When we allow the hyperbole to escalate, you soon start seeing a darker element.
That kind of group mockery, light hearted as the original intent may be, spawns harassment when not properly checked.
The last time someone from Bioware got harassed (Hepler) Aaryn literally called them scumbag on twitter.
Melchiah
Member
"Chevalier Knight", eh? The name definitely doesn't suit him.
Moron has also called himself knight knight, as chevalier is the French for knight.
SafeinSound
Member
Biowares response is pure shit.
Which is totally fine. You can trash it. You can critize it.
Harassment is just not criticism.
I really don't understand why companies don't take stronger action...
I once had someone / someones report my twitter to my employer around 2014/2015 timeframe. So they had the lead community manager look through my twitter history and then tell me that they didn't think anything I had said warranted a response. But they never actually defended me to the dorks who started the whole thing. Just kinda let it silently slip by~
I don't disagree with the general sentiment, because in general there's always the idiots that will take something over the edge in their quest for 5 seconds internet fame, but in Bioware's case, there's definitely a big group of people (GG related) walking around with a hate boner because of their social stances, often reflected in their games.
It happened with most of their games at this point, so bugs or no bugs, makes little difference to this crowd.
Beyond that, most of the thread (from what I've seen) was people posting gifs and parody videos, I didn't see direct attacks or anything I'd consider over the top hatred (I'm sure some went overboard and I probably missed it, I didn't comb the thread).
"Allow the hyperbole to escalate" is also a bit of a vague concept here, especially if you decide to draw a direct line between a thread like that one we had, and these harassers.
Fixed
Yea employers are quick to fire you if you say something wrong, but they aren't quick to defend.
Part of the reason I think is because they STILL aren't hip to online harassment so to speak. Not to mention our laws are way behind when it comes to this arena.
Melchiah
Member
Sounds like an upstanding young man, who's not hypocrite at all.
Useless fix. You are not part of the community of a village in Nigeria. Or Belgium. You are part of the gaming community. Start fixing.
psychowave
Member
This guy sounds like he's bitter the only feeling his dick invokes on women is boredom.
Also the fact that people in this very thread care more about defending the "gamer community" than the fact that women are being threatened with rape because they allegedly made some bad animations for a video game makes my blood boil but I guess I should be used to that by now.
What? It's a lame statement, but the message is "that's not even the right person". It's not throwing her under the bus.
I'll never understand why people like this get a voice on twitter. They need to be banned, or if the assumption is that they'll just make a new account, ghost them. Tweets aren't protected.
Stupid, disgusting people like the oneswho posted that disgusting shit is present in both "wings".
Dutch Microwave
Member
Twitter never ceases to amaze me how much of a fuckin trash platform it is when it comes to moderation.
Then again,keeping their site clean must be hard for such a small company on a limited budget,you cant expect them to see each scumbag in the vast
ocean of people.
Then again,keeping their site clean must be hard for such a small company on a limited budget,you cant expect them to see each scumbag in the vast
green
JareBear: Remastered
Banned
It honestly makes me not want to be a part a part of the gaming community anymore.
Maybe I'm too old, or just too stupid, but I just really don't understand any of this. When GG blew up I didn't get it. When stuff like this happens, I don't get it. Why would gamers, of all people, hate women? I just don't understand all this bullshit.
When people go batshit crazy over review scores, I don't agree with it, but at least I can fathom that it's just "rabid gamer being rabid." I can't wrap my head around why gender has anything to do with gaming related things though.
This is basically what I am gathering. The line between 'a bit of a laugh' and 'outright fucking scary' is apparently pencil thin in gaming culture, at least that's what I've learned now. Professional harassers latch on to this as an excuse for terrorism as we have a fringe in games who will latch onto any 'problem' they can and use it as a vector for abuse, we are a recruiting ground for the far right, we have abusers who operate within our purview. It's frequently the same bunch of f abusers who've been doing it for ages still as then. Bioware is especially a good target because of their openness about identity politics (despite their failings).
Spacejaws
Member
As much as this is centered on gaming I still can't accept that it is the result of this hobby. I gotta think that these disgusting individuals exist everywhere and this has given them a outlet to voice their true colours.
I've met many racists and they seem like normal ass people until you are in a situation where it comes out.
I've met many racists and they seem like normal ass people until you are in a situation where it comes out.
Perhaps because gamers aren't a homogeneous group with the same ideology. Racist and sexist people play games too. Some are just pure trolls though.
Here's my long-form speculation.
1. Gaming as a space has been lazer focused on demographics for some time. This results in a space that is largely dominated by young men. Not that it is overwhelming populated by young men, but that they are the visible and audible focus of the space.
2. Due to this perception of demographic makeup, developers accept the notion of "boys will be boys" and other assumptions like "can't have hetero sex scenes if female protagonist cuz gay scary"
3. This pandering and focus becomes cyclical in nature, and is observable to women and minorities who do not fit the core demo.
4. The core demo then perceives criticism by this outside observing group as hostile, as they are outsiders and the space is *meant* for them, they are after all the core demo.
Lokimaru
Member
This is why you need to physically disipline your kids. This generation of pain in the asses is the direct result of outlawing corporal punishment in the home. Some people just need a good ass kicking to put them on the straight and narrow. Where's Jay and Silent Bob when you need them.
You didn't fix shit.
Well, this is horrific. We need to band together to stamp this abhorrent behaviour out. I even hear misogynistic stuff from students in my lectures at university, and the course just happens to be based around programming and making games. I'd say about 95% of them are men. I feel uncomfortable being in my lectures because of it. Just last year, a large group of the students relentlessly harassed one of the female lecturers because of her race for months which I had never even thought that I would witness. It's truly awful.
CitizenCope
Member
Mr. Giggles
Member
You didn't fix shit.
I have a Ph.D in child development and everything you've said her is scientifically proven to be wrong.
Physical Discipline doesn't stop bad behavior. It increases aggression, and teaches children to hide their bad behavior, not to behave better.
NoThis is why you need to physically disipline your kids. This generation of pain in the asses is the direct result of outlawing corporal punishment in the home. Some people just need a good ass kicking to put them on the straight and narrow. Where's Jay and Silent Bob when you need them.
This is why you need to physically disipline your kids. This generation of pain in the asses is the direct result of outlawing corporal punishment in the home. Some people just need a good ass kicking to put them on the straight and narrow. Where's Jay and Silent Bob when you need them.
Maybe you're joking, but beating up kids is no joke and it's seriously not funny. There's a reason why it's outlawed in many countries and five decades of research all confirm the harm it does to children. It's appalling to read someone advocating for child abuse.
This is why you need to physically disipline your kids. This generation of pain in the asses is the direct result of outlawing corporal punishment in the home. Some people just need a good ass kicking to put them on the straight and narrow. Where's Jay and Silent Bob when you need them.
Surely you can't be serious... I don't think this has anything to do with that, the internet is abused daily and it's incredible to me your solution is "we don't hit our kids enough."
Weaponized autism at work.
Games aren't​ an outlet just for socially impaired and clinically depressed males, but sometimes it seems futile to argue otherwise.
PHOENIXZERO
Member
As if we needed more reasons to be embarrassed to be considered "gamers".
broscientific
Member
Messofanego
Banned
Cycle of abuse
Social outcasts who became gamers in the 70s-80s grew up to then perceive more women come into the gaming community (even though women having played games from the start busts that myth). These male gamers who got abused because of being nerds, they finally found a time in the 2000s where they could exercise some power dynamics on women. The bullied got to become the bullies.
It's why children of abusive parents become bullies themselves because that's the only kind of normalised behaviour they learn.
Joke post? The three old guys I work with sit around making racist and sexist comments to anyone and everyone all day. If they could figure out twitter they'd be all over it telling Obama and Hillary how they feel.
You can make your point that they're shitty people without dragging autistic people in to the dirt.
SmokedMeat
Gamer™
Don't deflect blame from the gaming community, because it is in fact a cesspool of social degenerate shit.
Not this shit again.
This is on the money.
JareBear: Remastered
Banned
I guess maybe I'm an idiot but before all the GG stuff took off I would have guessed that "Gaming" would be one of the safer industries for women to work in.
Obviously I would have been wrong.
Obviously I would have been wrong.
Hairsplash
Member
Can not imagine what they are saying about Horizon Zero Dawn ... with the lead female character, and the
matriarchal society it presents... (the society is run by a "queen" instead of a "king"...)
BTW, isn't MASS effect : Andromeda about Aliens?... so are they complaining about Alien faces?
matriarchal society it presents... (the society is run by a "queen" instead of a "king"...)
BTW, isn't MASS effect : Andromeda about Aliens?... so are they complaining about Alien faces?
texhnolyze
Banned
No.. The aliens faces are mostly fine. Humans, not.
Vigilant Walrus
Member
Employers are not your friends. Companies have ethical standards that push the boundaries of what the law permits. Hench why deregulating capitalism has been proven to backfire. Companies are in their own bubble and they don't know how to properly articulate their value systems based on growth, net worth, bad pr and good will, versus being decent in the face of losing financial gain or face an avalanche of bad PR for doing what is right.
Many companies idea of having an ethical body that is self scrutinizing, self reflecting and self moderating is business HR major employees who are designated to to help people from the perspective of the company.
If you are in a company where they treat you well and the ethics and morales superseed the usual tendencies, then it's a rarity, not the norm.
Companies are not evil. Capitalism is not evil. It's simply that they are not equipped to handle this. It's not their job. Their only job is to do what they can to maximize revenue and abiding by the rule of law. That's it. But people continue to expect them to be more. We're seeing a change trend with value based on SRI (Social Responsibility Index) and as a lot of governments are failing to provide legislation, people are beginning to look to companies to be a force of good since deregulation cannot. That is the libertarian dream essentially. Reduce taxes to near zero, and companies will be ethical and save the world and do a better job at it.
But do most people really believe that is going to be the norm for most?
If you've dealt regularly with HR people and really see how it works on the inside, you'll be amazed at the amount of people who get thrown under the bus because being fair or good would potentially be bad for the company. This goes from sexual harassment claims going ignored, to unsubstantial accusations causing a firing due to not wanting to create controversial, to people complaining, to people being fired over pettiness.
Imagine you go to school, land a dream gig working for a stable company, get to work on a flagship product and it's a fucking nightmare of crunch and then, before the game even ships, people are tearing it down. Not only tearing it down but threatening a person, a woman of course, that may not have even worked on the project.
Seriously, game development is so unbelievably thankless.
Also, fuck gamers.
Seriously, game development is so unbelievably thankless.
Also, fuck gamers.
It is still a pretty good industry for women, most devs I've worked with are either progressive or brogressive. There are times where ingrained things are hard to change, and generally the same issues that are present in most fields are still somewhat present in gaming. You know, stuff like people talking over you or taking your ideas as their own. However, a lot of people will be introspective if ever pressed on the subject and admit their fault.
in terms of frequency, sheer numbers, and the tepid response from the industry, the gaming community has a problem that goes beyond douchebags everywhere.