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[Takuan]

Once it goes live, there's supposed to be a free trial available to combat this specifically.

Can you elaborate? Is this a free trial for existing FFXI/FFXIV subscribers specifically, or are you talking about the free month that comes with all MMOs with the initial purchase?

I prefer sub-based over F2P, but I question the viability of this given that the genre has been stagnant for a few years now. I don't know whether the FF fanbase will come through the way SE expects. Seems really, really dangerous for them to hedge their bets on XIV.

 

[kayos90]

I can't stand F2P. It's just awful. If the game had a cash shop that sold different skins for the characters that do absolutely *nothing*, no buffs, no additional skills, nothing, just textures and color, it's ok I guess.

But games that give an advantage, however slight, have a fundamentally broken model as the incentive to keep playing suffers from the fact that you can simply buy stuff to make it easier, or just buy whatever "stuff" it may be, even if you don't plan to -- it's still there.



Why would anyone want to play it like that?

Not all non-subscription models are bad.

 

[Paracelsus]

Can you elaborate? Is this a free trial for existing FFXI/FFXIV subscribers specifically, or are you talking about the free month that comes with all MMOs with the initial purchase?

I guess new adopters still need to purchase a copy to play the free trial.

 

[djplaeskool]

Can you elaborate? Is this a free trial for existing FFXI/FFXIV subscribers specifically, or are you talking about the free month that comes with all MMOs with the initial purchase?

From the initial 2.0 reveal, it was stated there was going to be some sort of trial available at or soon after launch. I'm guessing since the software is free to 1.x users, it will at least be there for us. A trial for everyone would be nice, though.

 

[2San]

Excuse me?

If SE wnet public years and years ago. That money is used and spent. What money have they gotten from the public investors since unless they sell bonds? Everything since would be earnings from games and the other stuff they sell. And yes I understand that they need to protect the shareholder price etc, but it's nice that they're looking past that and trying to ensure the best possible product gets delivered.

Your logic makes no sense. The shareholders are the owners of the company. The money SE earns isn't SE's. Shareholders are simply allowing them to reinvest the money.

 

[Castor Krieg]

Your logic makes no sense. The shareholders are the owners of the company. The money "SE" earns isn't theirs either.

Exactly my point, thank you. All the money S-E is spending on FFXIV is not "theirs", it belongs to shareholders. Now, as someone pointed out they could make a convincing case that they should repair and pour additional resources into FFXIV, esp. considering how much money FFXI got them. However this is not the quote featured in the OP. Instead it is some idiotic definition of what S-E considers is money to spend as they please.

This ignores the fact (again, case of Olympus) that Wada should've been booted for FFXIV fiasco if Japanese corporate boards were anything else than places where barely-alive Japanese execs live the rest of their lives.

 

[2San]

Exactly my point, thank you. All the money S-E is spending on FFXIV is not "theirs", it belongs to shareholders. Now, as someone pointed out they could make a convincing case that they should repair and pour additional resources into FFXIV, esp. considering how much money FFXI got them. However this is not the quote featured in the OP. Instead it is some idiotic definition of what S-E considers is money to spend as they please.

This ignores the fact (again, case of Olympus) that Wada should've been booted for FFXIV fiasco if Japanese corporate boards were anything else than places where barely-alive Japanese execs live the rest of their lives.

Kinda wondering who the major shareholders of SE are atm.

 

[demosthenes]

Your logic makes no sense. The shareholders are the owners of the company. The money SE earns isn't SE's. Shareholders are simply allowing them to reinvest the money.

Yea but on a day to day basis the shareholders don't make the decisions, the board does. We have no idea what's going on but given the money invested into XIV I would imagine that the board is ok with this path that they're taking.

Exactly my point, thank you. All the money S-E is spending on FFXIV is not "theirs", it belongs to shareholders. Now, as someone pointed out they could make a convincing case that they should repair and pour additional resources into FFXIV, esp. considering how much money FFXI got them. However this is not the quote featured in the OP. Instead it is some idiotic definition of what S-E considers is money to spend as they please.

This ignores the fact (again, case of Olympus) that Wada should've been booted for FFXIV fiasco if Japanese corporate boards were anything else than places where barely-alive Japanese execs live the rest of their lives.

And I agree with you on Wada =)

 

[Khezu]

I'm going to be honest here, I don't trust Square Enix to make a reasonable F2P model, Id rather them just stay subscription based, much harder for them to fuck up.

Then again, I will never ever play this game, so it doesn't really matter what I think.

 

[MagiusNecros]

I don't even know what argument I stumbled upon. All I know is SE and any company always will want money.

Of course they aren't in any hurry if they want this to become a money pump.

 

[Kokonoe]

Good. I'd rather this be a pay to play MMORPG.

 

[Lumpy Onion]

Good. I'd rather this be a pay to play MMORPG.

Same here. If it had all the f2p micro transactions and shit I wouldn't even bother. Ff xi was my favorite mmo of all time and I would pay the money to get that kind of support and quality from this.

 

[2San]

Yea but on a day to day basis the shareholders don't make the decisions, the board does. We have no idea what's going on but given the money invested into XIV I would imagine that the board is ok with this path that they're taking.

What the board decides is irrelevant. The 100% SE money comment is still pretty damn stupid. It simply isn't.

 

[Rentahamster]

I dunno, I pretty much lost all will to play this after they started charging.

And this is me we're talking about. (For those of you who were around then).

 

[kuroshiki]

I dunno, I pretty much lost all will to play this after they started charging.

And this is me we're talking about. (For those of you who were around then).

Hmm. I think I remember you. Have we played together before?

 

[Rentahamster]

Hmm. I think I remember you. Have we played together before?

I helped organize shell events back in the dark ages and did the original design of the LS page.

 

[Clear]

This is getting somewhat blown out of proportion I think. The fundamental issue that's being related to is receiving funding from a parent organization offers a lot more rope than dealing with venture capital. VC deals are typically fixed-term satisfactory ROI or termination agreements, they are heavily skewed to favour the investor's chances of not losing out badly from the deal. This is not the same thing as buying publicly traded stock.

 

[Hazanko]

I prefer subscription compared to free to play. Unfortunately some do subscription and micro transactions, if it doesn't go down that road, then it's fine by me.

 

[Teknoman]

I dunno, I pretty much lost all will to play this after they started charging.

And this is me we're talking about. (For those of you who were around then).

As long as you check out the free trial.

 

[Toth]

To be fair, Wada has been a major presence in the entire rebuilding of FFXIV and has even been in all the live producer videos showcasing with Yoshi. It's safe to say that his future is tied in to how well RR is received. SE has a big opportunity to make much of their money back from PS3 sales alone.

 

[QisTopTier]

I prefer subscription compared to free to play. Unfortunately some do subscription and micro transactions, if it doesn't go down that road, then it's fine by me.

Free to play models for mmo's will never match up to a subscription game in terms of content.

And yes subscription mmo's with a cash shop that's for more than silly cosmetic stuff is lame as fuck

The old saying goes, "Pick two choices, A.Free to play B.MMO C. Good

 

[kayos90]

To be fair, Wada has been a major presence in the entire rebuilding of FFXIV and has even been in all the live producer videos showcasing with Yoshi. It's safe to say that his future is tied in to how well RR is received. SE has a big opportunity to make much of their money back from PS3 sales alone.

The MMO market is very difficult to break into and succeed. If XIV fails to generate profit and is not received critically, this will severely injure SE.

 

[Ainaurdur]

Free to play models for mmo's will never match up to a subscription game in terms of content.

And yes subscription mmo's with a cash shop that's for more than silly cosmetic stuff is lame as fuck

The old saying goes, "Pick two choices, A.Free to play B.MMO C. Good

Agree. Decent F2P MMOs are designed for F2P from the beginning. I have never seen a good transition from pay to free.

LotRO might be an exception, but I have not made time for it since it went F2P to see how it is first-hand.

I am glad that FFXIV is staying a paid subscription game.

 

[Shinta]

This is awesome. Anyone who played FFXI knows that F2P would be a complete disaster. The drops and gear are everything. If people were just buying it, the entire thing would fall to pieces. It would be like RMT ran the game.

I'm glad SQEX is thinking long term, and is doing whatever they can to just make the best games they can. I don't see how anyone can complain about that.

The MMO market is very difficult to break into and succeed. If XIV fails to generate profit and is not received critically, this will severely injure SE.

If Dragon Quest X has 400k subscribers just in Japan, I think XIV will still do fine. It'll take a few years, but if they have even 500k subscribers you would think the game would be profitable in 2-3 years. ~ $6.5 million a month, ~ $78 million a year, not counting money from the initial game sales. They wouldn't invest in it if the game had no chance.

 

[QisTopTier]

This is awesome. Anyone who played FFXI knows that F2P would be a complete disaster. The drops and gear are everything. If people were just buying it, the entire thing would fall to pieces. It would be like RMT ran the game.

I'm glad SQEX is thinking long term, and is doing whatever they can to just make the best games they can. I don't see how anyone can complain about that.

This is not how Cash shops on MMO's work

 

[theMrCravens]

Free to play models for mmo's will never match up to a subscription game in terms of content.

And yes subscription mmo's with a cash shop that's for more than silly cosmetic stuff is lame as fuck

The old saying goes, "Pick two choices, A.Free to play B.MMO C. Good

Guild Wars 2 is pretty much that, except you buy the box once.

Good MMO, and has a cash shop with mostly cosmetic things.