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[reinking]

Exactly. Microsoft is just like any other third party publisher who counts MAUs. OP is trying to make it out to be some grand "gotcha" for Microsoft with this "trojan horse" nonsense.

I like the spin Xbox are spinning these days. I bet even ManaByte still thinks console first instead of services/MAU when he hears the Xbox name. I doubt there are many people that do not. This whole shift is out of necessity. IMO, I think it happened about the time MS/Sony agreed to keep COD on PlayStation for at least 10 years. I believe at that point, there were also discussions about bringing other Xbox titles to PlayStation consoles. I have no knowledge but that is my guess because if I remember right, that is when Jim Ryan backed off a bit on fighting the acquisition.

 

[Little Chicken]

People just hate that Microsoft's strategy will work in the long run

 

[Three]

Why? You should think of Xbox as Steam, that’s where Microsoft wants to be, and more. And do you have to clarify your hardware if you say you’re playing something on Steam?
They want people to say they’re playing on Xbox no matter if they play on an actual Xbox console, old or new, another console, handheld, laptop, desktop PC, mobile, tablet, TV, cloud streaming service, possibly even Mac and Quest. And they want to track it all into their monthly active user number, for PR and showing platform strength. Essentially turn Xbox into a launcher platform.

Steam users weren't busy creating threads akin to

"The orangebox on PS3 reveals Valve's Trojan Horse to turn millions of PS3 users into Steam users!"

Pretty daft wouldn't you agree?
Steam never had an alternate meaning. It was always the PC store. Xbox was always the hardware. Each part of the Steam ecosystem has a separate name

Steam
Steamworks
Steambox
Steamdeck

It would be like trying to turn Steambox into a success by trying to turn the meaning of steambox to mean steamworks.

Xbox Network is the official rename of MS' live network . "Turn millions of PS5 users into Xbox Network users" didn’t quite have the same effect though when you're trying to turn something trivial and obvious into some kind of calculated win for a struggling hardware brand.

 

[Topher]

Steam users weren't busy creating threads akin to

"The orangebox on PS3 reveals Valve's Trojan Horse to turn millions of PS3 users into Steam users!"

Pretty daft wouldn't you agree?
Steam never had an alternate meaning. It was always the PC store. Xbox was always the hardware. Each part of the Steam ecosystem has a separate name

Steam
Steamworks
Steambox
Steamdeck

It would be like trying to turn Steambox into a success by trying to turn the meaning of steambox to mean steamworks.

Xbox Network is the official rename of MS' live network . "Turn millions of PS5 users into Xbox Network users" didn’t quite have the same effect though when you're trying to turn something trivial and obvious into some kind of calculated win for a struggling hardware brand.

 

[reinking]

People just hate that Microsoft's strategy will work in the long run

Many people believe Microsoft's strategy is going to work. It is Xbox's strategy that failed.

 

[DragonNCM]

The Sea of Thieves beta is ending early tomorrow morning on PS5, and I posted impressions on the improvements in the PS5 client here. I've put 12 hours into the beta so far and will probably play several more today, but something happened yesterday that was eye opening and revealed the real reason MS is porting these games to PlayStation, and it's not because "people don't buy games on Xbox and they'll buy them on PS5". In fact, I wouldn't be shocked if SoT (and possibly Grounded) show up on PS+ in the future as the true reason for their existence isn't sales of the game client.

When you download SoT on the PS5 it works exactly as it does on Steam. You are REQUIRED to link or create a Microsoft account. You cannot log into the game and play without one. While most people just shrugged and assumed it was for cross progression/cross play, the shocker is that when you're playing Sea of Thieves on a PS5, you're still playing it on Xbox.

Trophies are disabled in the beta (but they're still being tracked so they'll pop on release), and I unlocked two achievements while playing. While the PS5 trophies are disabled, my Xbox mobile app notification popped up showing the achievements were unlocked - while I was playing on the PS5. Those 12 hours I played in the PS5 beta were also added to my tracked playtime on Xbox for the game.

So even though you're using a PS5 to run the game and playing with a DualSense with its haptics, you're still logged into and playing the game on the Xbox services. Meaning MS is going to count every PS user in SoT as an Xbox user when reporting MAU.

Why are they doing this? Sony explained why in 2017:

Sony Talks Shift From Hardware to Monthly Active Users; Plans to Explore Microtransactions

Sony Executives talk about the shift of the business model from hardware units to monthly active users, and the possible exploration of microtransactions.

www.dualshockers.com

Every single person playing SoT (and again possibly Grounded) on PS5 can be counted as part of Xbox's MAU metric as they are technically logged in and playing on an Xbox service despite using a PS5 as the doorway to access it. That's why these GaaS games are being ported and why CoD will forever be cross platform. As CoD uses the Activision account (which is now MS) they'll be counting CoD players as "Xbox" users in the MAU metrics going forward.

 

[nemiroff]

I never did that. I never mentioned hardware in the OP. People who don't know how to read derailed the thread into hardware stupidity.

You know what, I agree with you. Sorry for the clickbait comment earlier.

 

[JohnnyFootball]

If Microsoft wants to give me achievements and trophies for their games while I play on PlayStation. More power to them.

I can only get so erect. Please stop.

 

[OmegaSupreme]

People just hate that Microsoft's strategy will work in the long run

Any day now.

 

[BlackTron]

Ecosystem and hardware used to be synonymous with each other. When we think of getting into an ecosystem as a "trojan horse", it's because of the assumptions of being in this reality that we are used to. The users bite, and then it snowballs as they are exposed to more in your ecosystem. Parading this as some sort of "trojan horse" for Xbox without acknowledging that this is obviously not happening is silly. Xbox ecosystem is not growing in a way that creates more growth by counting people that log in to play a game on Playstation.

Xbox has a launcher on PC too, I've been able to log in to my account and play games I bought for the console, with the same saves and achievements, for years. When I switched to using the Steam version of Halo Infinite, I had to log into my Xbox account and Steam immediately gave me a ton of achievements it saw from Xbox.

You heard it here first -Xbox planted a trojan horse in Steam JUST to boost their MAU on Xbox! Sure, they're a third party publisher, with a game running on their own servers, which requires an account to sign on and play it for free...can you guys remind me which game we are talking about actually? Because I thought all third party developers released these games with the intent of increasing their MAU? Or did I miss something that made this a "trojan horse?"

This is so perilously close "you're wrong, Xbox is stronger than ever. Xbox doesn't need a console it invades urs lol". Yah because you had to log in to your third party account. Clowns

 

[geary]

Is steam counting as steam users the accounts who opens the steam app outside of the propietary hardware (steamdeck)?

 

[ManaByte]

Is steam counting as steam users the accounts who opens the steam app outside of the propietary hardware (steamdeck)?

Yes

 

[SenkiDala]

Well, I mean it was obvious from the beginning... People really thought MS did this just "for the gam3rs"? If you make a product available to some store and sell it it is to make money...

MS will gain some users of their games, $$$ from the games sales, people who never touched a MS game before thinking "hey that's not bad", Sony get a good percentage on every sale... Win win.

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

People just hate that Microsoft's strategy will work in the long run

Beta Tested In The Future™

 

[DragonNCM]

PS5 will only transform to Xbox when it has Gamepass on it...and that is

 

[King Dazzar]

I loves you man. And always remember. I'll never see you as a vagina.

 

[Topher]

Is steam counting as steam users the accounts who opens the steam app outside of the propietary hardware (steamdeck)?

So Steam on Steam Deck is a trojan horse to turn Steam Deck users into Steam users?

 

[Portugeezer]

Halo Infinite would help increase that number too, Phil.

 

[geary]

So Steam on Steam Deck is a trojan horse to turn Steam Deck users into Steam users?

Who said anything about Trojan Horse. Thats stupid.

 

[HeisenbergFX4]

Halo Infinite would help increase that number too, Phil.

Phil wanted the MP on PS5 at launch but I have brought that up before, even brought it up they were trying to get that worked out prior to launch

 

[Banjo64]

When Xbox’s actual market share shrinks to 20m consoles sold overall next gen, losing Xbox hundreds of millions annually in revenue from their 30% cut, we’ll still have people on GAF touting 5m PlayStation players as a net gain for the company. This is chimpanzee logic sorry.

 

[Topher]

Who said anything about Trojan Horse. Thats stupid.

Agreed, it is stupid.

 

[geary]

Agreed, it is stupid.

Well, thats phrased in stupid way.

 

[bender]

People just hate that Microsoft's strategy will work in the long run

 

[Unknown?]

Well you made the thread, Xbox has been more than just the Xbox console for a long time. Are you surprised about this? In the future there won’t be traditional consoles FOR MICROSOFT, you’re seeing the direction things are moving.

Fixed.

 

[HeisenbergFX4]

When Xbox’s actual market share shrinks to 20m consoles sold overall next gen, losing Xbox hundreds of millions annually in revenue from their 30% cut, we’ll still have people on GAF touting 5m PlayStation players as a net gain for the company. This is chimpanzee logic sorry.

I play on both consoles so I have no dog in this fight but it begs the question what's more profitable for them, selling consoles at their current pace or selling software to the many more millions of PS users

I do think Xbox hardware is in serious trouble after next gen though.

 

[jonnyp]

Absolute cringe.

 

[Unknown?]

Negative. You're actually playing on your ISP account & hardware. Hence you're part of your ISP MAU's. That's how it works. It doesn't matter if you're on a Xbox console, PC, a phone, tablet, PS5, or Switch.

But to even be on your internet, you need to subscribe to your local electric utility. You're really your utility company's MAU.

 

[Badlucktroll]

 

[diffusionx]

When Xbox’s actual market share shrinks to 20m consoles sold overall next gen, losing Xbox hundreds of millions annually in revenue from their 30% cut, we’ll still have people on GAF touting 5m PlayStation players as a net gain for the company. This is chimpanzee logic sorry.

Xbox shills are huffing on copium these days, but the 30% cut is the cost of doing business to sell to an audience many times larger. This is why MS puts their games on Steam.

 

[King Dazzar]

Live footage of green rat assimilation.

 

[SteadyEvo]

What does it matter whether MS counts them as part of the metric or not?

Because console warriors want Xbox dead? I dunno.

Is there any game y’all can compare sea of thieves to? I played years ago. Just remember wandering what appeared to be empty space. Never touched it again

 

[FunkMiller]

People just hate that Microsoft's strategy will work in the long run

I don't think anyone here doubts for one moment that Microsoft can be one of - if not the - largest third party publisher.

This is a very different conversation than the fate of the Xbox.

And if Xbox fans are trying to use Microsoft's move into third party as being a 'gotcha' about Xbox's 'success' then they're in a state of delusion, frankly.

 

[kikii]

It’s the same account!

so since ive had hotmail for ages im an xbox user ? =D

 

[Bumblebeetuna]

Is it just the wording of “on Xbox” that is triggering or confusing people? My understanding of the OP is it’s just saying Xbox is a service and playing their games on other platforms means you’re still on that service. The resistance to that seems strange considering so many here spent a lot of time earlier this year proclaiming that Xbox was done with hardware

Maybe I am not getting the OP though, I could be wrong.

 

[Fredrik]

I answered that here....

I understand your thinking but tbh that is a dated way to look at the industry, especially regarding Microsoft who has been using services and monthly active users on multiple devices in PR for years. MS are pushing full speed ahead to be an account based platform holder on multiple devices. Xbox as a launcher.

Upside, you already have the next gen Xbox. It’s your PC! No new hardware needed in 2026.

 

[welshrat]

Nonsense. I won't buy another Xbox. But being able to play some of their titles on ps and earn a few trophies is good news. Looking forward to game pass ultimate for ps and pc. Was the only reason I bought a series x this time but it wasn't enough for me to keep it and have two consoles in the living room.

 

[BlackTron]

Nonsense. I won't but another Xbox. But boring able to play some of their titles on ps and wrath a few trophies is good news. Looking forward to game pass ultimate for ps and pc. Was the only reason I bought a series x this time but it wasn't enough for me to keep it and have two consoles in the living room.

Thanks to the power of ambiguity and doublespeak, the joke is on you. Despite your intention not to buy an Xbox, you will still be playing on Xbox anyway! Wait what?

 

[rodrigolfp]

Sega doesn't have a platform agnostic account system so that's a disingenuous comparison.

Mine says here on PC "MS Store account". Not Xbox account.

 

[Fredrik]

So will MS also explain how their MAUs by the end of 2024 are different from what their MAUs represented in 2019? And explain why knowing the difference is necessary going forward?

No they’ll boast about the higher numbers just like they did when converting Xbox Live Gold into Xbox Game Pass Core to increase Gamepass subscriber numbers.
It’s PR. Don’t think so much about it, everything will always be spun to make it seem like things are great.

 

[Varteras]

 

[ManaByte]

Mine says here on PC MS Store account. Not Xbox account.

We’re now in the land of delusion where Microsoft accounts are not Xbox accounts. It’s he same thing.

 

[rodrigolfp]

We’re now in the land of delusion where Microsoft accounts are not Xbox accounts. It’s he same thing.

They being "interconnected" =/= being the same. PS5 is the same as PS4, PS3, PSP and PSVita because their use the same PSN account???

 

[BouncyFrag]

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

It is always funny to see some people saying that every Xbox decision is just part of a 4D chess move.

I just wonder... when are all these strategies going to pay off? Is part of all of them to destroy your brand, console, and ecosystem?

Because as far as I know, what they are trying to do on PS, they already did with PC... and how is that going?

 

[ManaByte]

They being "interconnected" =/= being the same. PS5 is the same as PS4, PS3, PSP and PSVita because their use the same PSN account???

In the case of MS accounts they are the same. When you play SOT with a MS account you’re accumulating Xbox playtime and unlocking. Xbox achievements. This has been explained multiple times in this thread.

 

[rodrigolfp]

In the case of MS accounts they are the same. When you play SOT with a MS account you’re accumulating Xbox playtime and unlocking. Xbox achievements. This has been explained multiple times in this thread.

Here only says playtime and achievements, the work Xbox doesn't applie.

 

[Fredrik]

Steam users weren't busy creating threads akin to

"The orangebox on PS3 reveals Valve's Trojan Horse to turn millions of PS3 users into Steam users!"

Pretty daft wouldn't you agree?
Steam never had an alternate meaning. It was always the PC store. Xbox was always the hardware. Each part of the Steam ecosystem has a separate name

Steam
Steamworks
Steambox
Steamdeck

It would be like trying to turn Steambox into a success by trying to turn the meaning of steambox to mean steamworks.

Xbox Network is the official rename of MS' live network . "Turn millions of PS5 users into Xbox Network users" didn’t quite have the same effect though when you're trying to turn something trivial and obvious into some kind of calculated win for a struggling hardware brand.

You still just say you’re playing a game on Steam and you’re still in the hardware independent Steam concurrent player stats no matter if you play on your desktop PC, laptop, Steam Deck, Mac etc.

This is how Microsoft will do it. Xbox was the hardware. But now you’re going to be in their monthly active user stats and in their logged hours on their games in their PR no matter if you play their games on PC, console, mobile, tablet, handheld, cloud. # of players. # of monthly active users. It’s PR. Don’t overthink it.

 

[ManaByte]

Here only says playtime and achievements, the work Xbox not applies.

So you’re trying to claim Xbox achievements unlocked on an Xbox account aren’t Xbox achievements?

 

[BlackTron]

Is it just the wording of “on Xbox” that is triggering or confusing people? My understanding of the OP is it’s just saying Xbox is a service and playing their games on other platforms means you’re still on that service. The resistance to that seems strange considering so many here spent a lot of time earlier this year proclaiming that Xbox was done with hardware

Maybe I am not getting the OP though, I could be wrong.

Ambiguity that blurs the line between Xbox as a service and Xbox as a console. It suggests that "you no longer need to use Xbox hardware to play on Xbox", while the context of "playing on Xbox" has always been as a contest vs. PS, and when you use phrases like "trojan horse", what are you really getting at?

By framing it as a trojan horse it makes it seem like Xbox is making some savvy move in their age-old war against Playstation that Sony does not expect. The reality is that they are simply a third party publisher releasing a game on PS and the fact that you log into MS/Xbox account to play it isn't a "trojan horse" of any significance.