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[Louis Cyphre]

Everything you are saying "makes about as much sense as a screen door on a submarine" as you put it. This was the launch month not the time it had very aggressive pricing. Read the date of the article. It's January 2014 talking about December 2013 sales. Xbox one launched on 22n November 2013. People were paying more for the weaker Xbox console with a shitty beta UI 'built from the ground up for ads', no BC, no sharing, streaming or apps and trying to remove all offline play. It was a bad system bought on brand alone, the definition of loyalty. In fact surveys showed that the main reason was 'brand' .

https://www.nielsen.com/us/en/insig...on-gamers-have-previously-owned-consoles.html

Most Xbox one buyers were regular xbox buyers. PS4 buyers were a better distribution of ex xbox 360 users and PS3 users. Xbox one buyers listed brand as the number one reason above all else. Not sure what more evidence you need but really everything you are saying doesn't make sense.

The PS3 was also more expensive maybe arguably even weaker but really it was in the position that X is in now in terms of people complaining about it, very few exclusive games and expensive. PS3 converted the massive amount of PS2 users with full BC. They even actually had a more consumer friendly system even if it wasn't that dev friendly. It had a standard changable HDD, it had standard flash memory support, blu-ray, free online, BC, cross play, cross-buy, region free. The xbox had proprietary HDD, no bluray, proprietary memory cards, online fees, region locked, no BC (partial some time after). There is actually very little Sony brand loyalty as much as there is for MS. If anything you can see it in the forums by the meme of "arrogant Sony" and the constant demand of features whereas there is very little complaints or demands on the other side just praise for everything they do.

You quoted me after I made an edit because i thought he was talking 2016 numbers. That year in the fall of 2013 Microsoft also dumped a shitload of systems onto retailers to ballooon actual figures. That's why it took months to get those systems off the shelves. They consider shipped as sold.

The PS3 was a disaster. Devs didn't like and once again Sony tried to leverage developers to learn their hardware, forcing them to develop exclusively. In fact the PS3 had inferior multiplat games because of how difficult the hardware was and the split in memory yet brand loyalty kept sales still rather well until the Slim came out and a major price cut. That's when sales rightfully so picked up but even in those first few years the PS3 still sold rather well. It just about bankrupt the company mind you.

 

[Three]

You quoted me after I made an edit because i thought he was talking 2016 numbers. That year in the fall of 2013 Microsoft also dumped a shitload of systems onto retailers to ballooon actual figures. That's why it took months to get those systems off the shelves. They consider shipped as sold.

I quoted before you made an edit and you thought he was showing you 2014 numbers not 2016 probably because you just looked at the year of the article. Exact quote before your edit is right here:

You just said earlier that the PS3 was a bad example because they recovered by lowering the price (which I had to correct you on because the PS3 still sold 10 million per year for the first 3 years) and now you're showing me 2014 sales at a time the Xbox One had very aggressive pricing and bundle deals. Thanks for letting us all know what a waste of time you are and how you're part of the problem by being loyal.

Glad to see you came to your senses and got rid of the part where you called FranXico a waste of time and a loyal fanboy after being shown your error nonetheless.

 

[Aintitcool]

If we combine Xbone and Switch sales, they barely outsell PS4.
It is a solid prove that PS5 will not come any time soon.

More time for better tech

 

[FranXico]

I quoted before you made an edit and you thought he was showing you 2014 numbers not 2016 probably because you just looked at the year of the article. Exact quote before your edit is right here:
[...]
Glad to see you came to your senses and got rid of the part where you called FranXico a waste of time and a loyal fanboy after being shown your error nonetheless.

Didn't read what was edited out before, I'll take the edit as a retraction.

What you mentioned before was a good point, though. Despite the absurd pricing, the PS3 still had some competitive features (some of them still missing in both HD consoles this gen, in fact). The same cannot be said about the X1 at the beginning of this gen. The launch price of the PS3, though, was the biggest contributor to its disastrous failure.

Nowadays, of course, the situation with the Xbox One has greatly changed.

 

[Three]

Didn't read what was edited out before, I'll take the edit as a retraction.

What you mentioned before was a good point, though.

Thanks, and don't mind Louis Cyphre he calls everyone a fanboy for not agreeing with his point of view and his point of view is often just shitting on Sony. His facts are more often than not completely wrong though. Those sales figures you posted are from NPD they are not the channel stuffing numbers MS were putting out afterwards that he claims them to be.

 

[Louis Cyphre]

Thanks, and don't mind Louis Cyphre he calls everyone a fanboy for not agreeing with his point of view and his point of view is often just shitting on Sony. His facts are more often than not completely wrong though. Those sales figures you posted are from NPD they are not the channel stuffing numbers MS were putting out afterwards that he claims them to be.

You keep adding nothing to this conversation as per usual. At least Fran has the maturity to acknowledge good points. You just ignore them and keep talking about me without the ability to actually refute anything. The PS3 was a nightmare in more ways than one. Sony was able to turn things around but it cost them big time.

 

[it_wasn't_me]

Didn't read what was edited out before, I'll take the edit as a retraction.

What you mentioned before was a good point, though. Despite the absurd pricing, the PS3 still had some competitive features (some of them still missing in both HD consoles this gen, in fact). The same cannot be said about the X1 at the beginning of this gen. The launch price of the PS3, though, was the biggest contributor to its disastrous failure.

Nowadays, of course, the situation with the Xbox One has greatly changed.

If PS3 was a failure, then Xbone is what?

 

[thelastword]

it_wasn't_me

It's funny too because PS3 sold more than 360 coming one year later @$600 initially... It had better 1st party games by a country mile, a more diverse library, better tech and features, actual full BC, unlike a quarter morsel... It had cross play, it was the best console for dlna and media. Pretty much anything x fans are hollering about these days PS3 did it better over 360 then.

People have to understand, MS has never won a generation as market leader.. Xbox is pretty much a 40 million console base or in the range of 30-50. The 360 numbers are highly inflated due to rrod, when some persons went through 8-13 XBOX 360's last gen, that should tell you enough, (yet, lots of dedication from said persons, I must say)...Also, MS had to spend over a billion dollars to address the rrod fiasco, something we've never seen in console history beforehand.....

So yes, I find it a bit strange when people expected xbox-one to be huge this gen.??? It was not following a win from MS and the rrod inflation of the 360 install base is gargantuan and should be factored in. How did Medhi or x-fans ever expect or anticipate so much success based on these factors highlighted, especially Medhi's, "xbox-one to sell a billion in it's lifetime" spiel....... MS has made so many fans drink the mighty kool-aid this gen, even those who swore on vodka only...

Moving on, even now, a PS3 is a much better buy over a 360...The best exclusives last gen are there, the best BC on a console is still there, you can still play your blurays and ramp your dlna as you can on PS4, it still has the best ui and xmb.....

Where else are you going to play gems like folklore, journey, flow, puppeteer, the personas, the yakuzas, all the fighters and Japanese games, all the rpg's you could not play elsewhere? And that's not even including all the AAA games like GOW, Uncharted, TLOU, MGS4, LBP which topped the critical charts, rewards charts et al...Yes, the PS3 is still the better buy and value over the 360, even more so today.....

 

[Vawn]

You keep adding nothing to this conversation as per usual. At least Fran has the maturity to acknowledge good points. You just ignore them and keep talking about me without the ability to actually refute anything. The PS3 was a nightmare in more ways than one. Sony was able to turn things around but it cost them big time.

PS3 was a disaster, yet it eventually surpassed Xbox 360 in global sales despite a year head start?

Sounds like more wishful thinking on your part.

 

[Clear]

If PS3 was a failure, then Xbone is what?

In all fairness, the first couple of years of the PS3 were a disaster, no argument. They were eating huge losses on the hardware and the uptake was far slower than it should have been (perhaps fortunately) due to its high price. In hindsight had the PS3 launched when it was supposed to and competed directly against the 360 from day one maybe things would have turned out differently, but objectively the PS3 was simply too ambitious for its own good.

Once they engineered out the BC and got the price-point down to a competitive level things turned around drastically. Its weird to me why so many Xbox fans point to BC as being a system-selling feature when the PS3 offers a clear historical precedent that its pretty much a disposable value-add.

For me, looking at the PS3's life-cycle is a tremendously instructive thing in terms of what really drives sales. Over the second half of the PS3's life you see Sony pushing hard to establish their first-party line-up as a distinct USP. In a sense they were taking a page from Nintendo's book, but I think the key thing was the realization that the CELL architecture was hindering third-party efforts.

 

[Freedom Gate Co.]

If PS3 was a failure, then Xbone is what?

PS3 was objectively a commercial failure, a large one.

 

[Freedom Gate Co.]

it_wasn't_me

It's funny too because PS3 sold more than 360 coming one year later @$600 initially

This never happened otherwise Sony would have said so. Last numbers for last gen was Xbox 360 having 80 a month before PS3 late 2013, and 360 having over 84 million in the summer of 2014. Only thing I've seen that would suggest the PS3 passed the 360 is a very very small gap among ESTIMATES by a company associated by NPD which has it way inside the margin of error.

 

[Louis Cyphre]

If PS3 was a failure, then Xbone is what?

A system you likely ignored due to loyalty?

it_wasn't_me

It's funny too because PS3 sold more than 360 coming one year later @$600 initially... It had better 1st party games by a country mile, a more diverse library, better tech and features, actual full BC, unlike a quarter morsel... It had cross play, it was the best console for dlna and media. Pretty much anything x fans are hollering about these days PS3 did it better over 360 then.

People have to understand, MS has never won a generation as market leader.. Xbox is pretty much a 40 million console base or in the range of 30-50. The 360 numbers are highly inflated due to rrod, when some persons went through 8-13 xb 360's last gen that should tell you enough , (that's dedication though)...Also, MS had to spend over a billion dollars to address the rrod fiasco, something we've never seen in console history.....

So yes, I find it a bit strange when people expected xbox-one to be huge this gen.??? It was not following a win from MS and the rrod inflation of the 360 install base is gargantuan and should be factored in. How did Medhi or x-fans ever expect or anticipate so much success based on these factors highlighted, especially Medhi's, xbox-one to sell a billion spiel.....Sigh! ... MS has made so many fans drink the mighty kool-aid this gen, even those who swore on vodka only...

The first couple of years were nothing special as far as exclusives go but knowing you I imagine you thought Lair and Haze were better than any games on the 360 that you couldn't play on your PS3. Once MGS4 came the system was starting to hit its stride.

PS3 was a disaster, yet it eventually surpassed Xbox 360 in global sales despite a year head start?

Sounds like more wishful thinking on your part.

Sounds like brand loyalty in the beginning for the ps3,which I've been saying all along, and Kinect being a waste of time later on for the 360.

 

[it_wasn't_me]

PS3 was objectively a commercial failure, a large one.

A system you likely ignored due to loyalty?

Sounds like brand loyalty in the beginning for the ps3,which I've been saying all along, and Kinect being a waste of time later on for the 360.

Looks who talking to me about brand loyalty. Simple question for you, Xbox fans, if you think that PS3 is a failure, what is Xbone then?

 

[MP!]

pokemon and Smash will surely have something to say about this soon

 

[Freedom Gate Co.]

A system you likely ignored due to loyalty?



The first couple of years were nothing special as far as exclusives go but knowing you I imagine you thought Lair and Haze were better than any games on the 360 that you couldn't play on your PS3. Once MGS4 came the system was starting to hit its stride.



Sounds like brand loyalty in the beginning for the ps3,which I've been saying all along, and Kinect being a waste of time later on for the 360.

Kinect is the reason 360 still ended up in second place and sold around 90 million units.

Kinect boost even worked in japan partially.

I'm not a kinect fan but people throw that thing under the bus too easily. over 28-30 million sales after the Xbox One came out on 360 alone. That's more than a 4th of the Wiis sales in a few years.

 

[it_wasn't_me]

Kinect is the reason 360 still ended up in second place and sold around 90 million units.

Kinect boost even worked in japan partially.

I'm not a kinect fan but people throw that thing under the bus too easily. over 28-30 million sales after the Xbox One came out on 360 alone. That's more than a 4th of the Wiis sales in a few years.

According to 3rd party reports, X360 ended last.

 

[Freedom Gate Co.]

Looks who talking to me about brand loyalty. Simple question for you, Xbox fans, if you think that PS3 is a failure, what is Xbone then?

PS3 was a commercial failure. Stop with the fanboy wars stuff. It was a commercial failure. Fact.
Lost Sony a LOT of money and made them restructure. Wiped out PS1/PS2 profits, other impacts on the company happened as well.

Xbox One is not a massive commercial failure like the PS3. Which didn't start going out the red until 4 years later in 2010.

 

[Freedom Gate Co.]

According to 3rd party reports, X360 ended last.

There is not a single valid report out that shows the 360 is last. The closest to reliable was an NPD related company but the gap was so small you could say the margin of error along was big enough to negate what the data shows. This is why know gaming database has updated. Most still have 84 million 360 and 80 million PS3 since those were the last official numbers to come out.

of course the point of that post was that Kinect has a large part in late 360 sales and shouldn't be thrown out so easily. Theres a reason Microsoft though it had life when the One came out.

 

[Ostrava04]

Spiderman doing great

 

[it_wasn't_me]

PS3 was a commercial failure. Stop with the fanboy wars stuff. It was a commercial failure. Fact.
Lost Sony a LOT of money and made them restructure. Wiped out PS1/PS2 profits, other impacts on the company happened as well.

Xbox One is not a massive commercial failure like the PS3. Which didn't start going out the red until 4 years later in 2010.

But Xbone will reach a half LTD X360 numbers. Yes, Xbone is a success then.

There is not a single valid report out that shows the 360 is last. The closest to reliable was an NPD related company but the gap was so small you could say the margin of error along was big enough to negate what the data shows. This is why know gaming database has updated. Most still have 84 million 360 and 80 million PS3 since those were the last official numbers to come out.

Fact is MS abandoned X360 much ealier than Sony did for PS3. Yes, you have 3rd party data ( not Chartz ) like EEDAR os Superdata.

 

[Freedom Gate Co.]

But Xbone won't even reach a half LTD X360 numbers. Yes, Xbone is a success then.



Fact is MS abandoned X360 much ealier than Sony did for PS3. Yes, you have 3rd party data ( not Chartz ) like EEDAR os Superdata. Fact is MS

Listen if you don't know what "commercial failure"is just say it. Stop trying to equate failures if you don't understand what's being talked about. It's got nothing to do with "selling as much as the 360" it has to do with finances and money and the PS3 was a commercial failure. Please leave the fanboy wars out of it because you're making a pointless argument.

EEDAR margin of error is much wider than their numbers and Superata is not accurate. No gaming database is going to update until a valid third-party or first party source comes.

 

[Clear]

Saw this gem in ResetError's NPD thread:

The Xbox One X System 1TB Black is the best-selling Xbox One hardware item of the year in both dollars and units sold.

Kinda proves my point about how X would cannibalize sales of the other SKU's and lead to a distorted picture of overall market penetration. Factor in the price difference per unit, the extreme likelihood of X sales being largely to preexisting Xbox users, and suddenly their resurgent performance seems far less convincing a case for future success.

 

[it_wasn't_me]

Listen if you don't know what "commercial failure"is just say it. Stop trying to equate failures if you don't understand what's being talked about. It's got nothing to do with "selling as much as the 360" it has to do with finances and money and the PS3 was a commercial failure. Please leave the fanboy wars out of it because you're making a pointless argument.

EEDAR margin of error is much wider than their numbers and Superata is not accurate. No gaming database is going to update until a valid third-party or first party source comes.

I know what you talked about. About how Sony took a money loss with PS3. Go figure.
Sales numbers is also a commercial failure. So, Wii U is a success then too according to your logic. Either way, EEDAR's or Superdata's error or not this is the closest you can get.

 

[Kagey K]

 

[prinz_valium]

RANKINGS
Physical and Full Game Digital for publishers in the Digital Leader Panel, ranked on dollar sales

1. Marvel's Spider-Man
2. NBA 2K19
3. Assassin's Creed: Odyssey
4. FIFA 19^
5. Shadow Of The Tomb Raider
6. Madden NFL 19^
7. Forza Horizon 4
8. Destiny 2^
9. Super Mario Party*
10. NHL 19
11. Dragon Quest XI: Echoes Of An Elusive Age
12. WWE 2K19
13. Grand Theft Auto V
14. Mario Kart 8*
15. Naruto To Boruto: Shinobi Striker
16. Tom Clancy's Rainbow Six: Siege
17. Crash Bandicoot: N. Sane Trilogy^
18. Super Mario Odyssey*
19. The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild*
20. Minecraft***

* Digital sales not included
^ PC digital sales not included

Xbox One

1. NBA 2K19
2. Forza Horizon 4
3. Assassin's Creed: Odyssey
4. FIFA 19
5. Shadow Of The Tomb Raider
6. Destiny 2
7. Madden NFL 19
8. NHL 19
9. WWE 2K19
10. Grand Theft Auto V

PlayStation 4

1. Marvel's Spider-Man
2. NBA 2K19
3. FIFA 19
4. Assassin's Creed: Odyssey
5. Shadow Of The Tomb Raider
6. Madden NFL 19
7. Dragon Quest XI: Echoes Of An Elusive Age
8. Destiny 2
9. NHL 19
10. WWE 2K19

Nintendo Switch

1. Super Mario Party
2. Mario Kart 8
3. Super Mario Odyssey
4. The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild
5. Mega Man 11
6. Mario Tennis Aces
7. Splatoon 2
8. Donkey Kong Country: Tropical Freeze
9. Monster Hunter: Generations Ultimate
10. Crash Bandicoot: N. Sane Trilogy

Year To Date

1. Far Cry 5
2. God of War 2018
3. Marvel's Spider-Man
4. Monster Hunter: World
5. NBA 2K19
6. Madden NFL 19^
7. Grand Theft Auto V
8. Call of Duty: WWII^
9. Dragon Ball: Fighterz
10. Mario Kart 8*

 

[demigod]

Saw this gem in ResetError's NPD thread:

The Xbox One X System 1TB Black is the best-selling Xbox One hardware item of the year in both dollars and units sold.

Kinda proves my point about how X would cannibalize sales of the other SKU's and lead to a distorted picture of overall market penetration. Factor in the price difference per unit, the extreme likelihood of X sales being largely to preexisting Xbox users, and suddenly their resurgent performance seems far less convincing a case for future success.

So its over 50% compared to the One S? I'm calling BS on this. Even Amazon has 2 One S Skus on the list and one of them is beating the One X.

 

[Louis Cyphre]

Looks who talking to me about brand loyalty. Simple question for you, Xbox fans, if you think that PS3 is a failure, what is Xbone then?

It was a failure in the beginning, you not know what I was talking about? Diffennce is I actually bought a PS3 slim, did you give up your brand loyalty and buy an Xbox 360?

 

[Clear]

The bottom line is that if X sales were truly additive, we'd see a far bigger jump in units and revenue; remember we're talking a SKU nearly double the price of S units. This says clearly to me that S sales are down very substantially YoY, and that while the X is taking up the slack nicely, and boosting revenue in the process, market penetration has likely slowed.

 

[prinz_valium]

So its over 50% compared to the One S? I'm calling BS on this. Even Amazon has 2 One S Skus on the list and one of them is beating the One X.

No it's the highest individual Xbox One Console.
500GB and 1TB S are different SKUs for example.

 

[AgentP]

It tells me most people buying Xbox units are existing Xbox owners upgrading. I was one. This does not add much to SW or XBL sales though.

 

[Clear]

My main interest in the situation is what its going to mean for future "mid-gen upgrades", as in who got it right from a business perspective.

My suspicion is that Sony's early but modest up-step, will be considered a better move than MS's later but far more impactful upgrade. My reasoning being that as the fundamental premise is that hardware basically exists to provide a vector for the platform's sales and service ecosystem, sales volume as opposed to sales value in hardware is the way to go.

Selling X's to existing S owners is good, but selling either to a new customer is better as it adds more value to the ecosystem. The way Sony have managed the PS business has been with an eye to keeping the base PS4 strong, with the Pro being basically a minority interest offering. The reality is that what we're seeing is that the console with by far the highest penetration, STILL outselling the competition at the tail-end of a generation. A time when you'd reasonably expect saturation and the arrival of newer competitors in the marketplace to start weighing it down.

Whatever side you're on, you have to admit Sony are apparently doing everything right in terms of managing their business. Which isn't to say that MS are failures, just that if you look at the sheer amount of hardware and service options they've introduced over the last year or so, its not really affecting the competitive balance.

Sony talk little, change less (in terms of hardware and services,) and just put out a few strong first-party games which is apparently enough to maintain their unassailable lead.

 

[LittleBusters]

The bottom line is that if X sales were truly additive, we'd see a far bigger jump in units and revenue; remember we're talking a SKU nearly double the price of S units. This says clearly to me that S sales are down very substantially YoY, and that while the X is taking up the slack nicely, and boosting revenue in the process, market penetration has likely slowed.

Why would anyone buy an 'S' instead of the 'X'? It's an underpowered piece of shit.

 

[LittleBusters]

My main interest in the situation is what its going to mean for future "mid-gen upgrades", as in who got it right from a business perspective.

My suspicion is that Sony's early but modest up-step, will be considered a better move than MS's later but far more impactful upgrade. My reasoning being that as the fundamental premise is that hardware basically exists to provide a vector for the platform's sales and service ecosystem, sales volume as opposed to sales value in hardware is the way to go.

Selling X's to existing S owners is good, but selling either to a new customer is better as it adds more value to the ecosystem. The way Sony have managed the PS business has been with an eye to keeping the base PS4 strong, with the Pro being basically a minority interest offering. The reality is that what we're seeing is that the console with by far the highest penetration, STILL outselling the competition at the tail-end of a generation. A time when you'd reasonably expect saturation and the arrival of newer competitors in the marketplace to start weighing it down.

Whatever side you're on, you have to admit Sony are apparently doing everything right in terms of managing their business. Which isn't to say that MS are failures, just that if you look at the sheer amount of hardware and service options they've introduced over the last year or so, its not really affecting the competitive balance.

Sony talk little, change less (in terms of hardware and services,) and just put out a few strong first-party games which is apparently enough to maintain their unassailable lead.

Microsoft is still reeling from decisions they made in the early 2010s. By the early 2020s they should be doing just fine assuming the new studios will be pumping out 95/100 Metacritic rated games.

 

[flashfire926]

Saw this gem in ResetError's NPD thread:

The Xbox One X System 1TB Black is the best-selling Xbox One hardware item of the year in both dollars and units sold.

Kinda proves my point about how X would cannibalize sales of the other SKU's and lead to a distorted picture of overall market penetration. Factor in the price difference per unit, the extreme likelihood of X sales being largely to preexisting Xbox users, and suddenly their resurgent performance seems far less convincing a case for future success.

Keep in mind XBO-S has had multiple different sku's this year (Sea of thieves bundle, PUBG bundle, Minecraft bundle, standalone, starter game pass bundle). While the X I think only had it's base model. S sales are divided between many sku's, a thing the X does have to face.

There is no chance in hell the X is outselling the S, in any territory.

 

[flashfire926]

If PS3 was a failure, then Xbone is what?

The Xbox One didnt lose Microsoft millions of dollars like the PS3 did for Sony.

 

[LittleBusters]

The Xbox One didnt lose Microsoft millions of dollars like the PS3 did for Sony.

The XB360 lost Microsoft $3 billion over the RROD issue.

 

[Vawn]

It was a failure in the beginning, you not know what I was talking about? Diffennce is I actually bought a PS3 slim, did you give up your brand loyalty and buy an Xbox 360?

You say "brand loyalty" in every single post. Quit calling people fanboys. You are one of the biggest fanboys on here.

Personally, I owned an original Xbox, an Xbox 360 and an Xbox One. Right now, PS4 is killing Xbox One in quality software. Brand loyalty has nothing to do with it. It's hardly even a comparison at this point.

If next generation that changes, I'll gladly state the opposite. I can tell you'll be arguing for Xbox regardless of what either puts out. So there's your "brand loyalty". Hypocrite.

 

[anothertech]

If we combine Xbone and Switch sales, they barely outsell PS4.
It is a solid prove that PS5 will not come any time soon.

Dam, but it's still coming end of 2019

 

[flashfire926]

The XB360 lost Microsoft $3 billion over the RROD issue.

I was talking about the xbox one.

 

[SonGoku]

Wow is spiderman responsible for ps4 sales?

wow wow wow I can't believe the X outsold its base console all year, the X really is a BEAST
The pro could only dream of outselling the slim ps4

 

[SonGoku]

sorry dp

 

[thelastword]

This never happened otherwise Sony would have said so. Last numbers for last gen was Xbox 360 having 80 a month before PS3 late 2013, and 360 having over 84 million in the summer of 2014. Only thing I've seen that would suggest the PS3 passed the 360 is a very very small gap among ESTIMATES by a company associated by NPD which has it way inside the margin of error.

First off, Sony announced 80 million in 2013, MS announced 84 million in 2014.....Do you really believe PS3 stopped selling in 2013 after Sony's announcement? When TLOU, GT6, Beyond Two Souls, God of War Ascension landed that year......when 360 had no games of note then, no bluray, was a louder system, worse ui etc....... Besides, PS3 had already shipped more units over 360 globally before that.....and PS3 had the momentum in all parts of the world, except the US and perhaps the UK.... Remember, this is a console that came 1 year later and even later in other regions.....Also, from 2013 and up, it was a bit hard to track PS3 figures since they bumped the PS family together, but the momentum was clearly in PS3's favor in the latter years....I mean what does it matter that you sold 84 million units when a huge chunk of that was rrod machines anyway......Still, if you go by Wikipedia, PS3 is at >83.8 Million vs 84 million locked for MS, which clearly puts PS3 ahead......But you want links, so here goes...

https://www.ign.com/articles/2013/01/10/report-ps3-surpasses-xbox-360s-worldwide-shipped-total

https://www.techradar.com/news/gaming/consoles/how-the-playstation-3-won-the-console-war-1196215

http://www.vgchartz.com/article/250980/playstation-3-lifetime-sales-overtakes-the-xbox-360/

https://www.geek.com/games/ps3-surpasses-xbox-360-in-console-sales-1535446/

The latter was since 2008 in Europe...As for Japan and Other Regions, I mean we won't go there.....
https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/ps3-has-outsold-xbox-360-in-europe

Even in PS3's worse regions, they had the momentum in 2013, PS3 was able to outsell 360 even in it's strongest region (the US) in Septemeber 2013 and PS3 was outselling 360 the whole summer of 2013 in the UK on account of LOU etc...

https://www.mcvuk.com/business/ps3-outselling-xbox-360-in-the-uk-this-summer

The first couple of years were nothing special as far as exclusives go but knowing you I imagine you thought Lair and Haze were better than any games on the 360 that you couldn't play on your PS3. Once MGS4 came the system was starting to hit its stride.

Lair was a 2007 game and Haze was a 2008 game.....At PS3's launch or launch window, there were gems like Resistance FOM, Genji, Mobile Suit Gundam, F1 Championship Edition (one of the best racers that gen), Motorstorm (another), Ridge Racer 7, GT-HD Concept... and just a bit beyond, Folklore and Hotshots Golf in 2007, along with Uncharted Drakes Fortune (my favourite UC game btw).....Ehh! what about Warhawk, Ratchet and Clank TOD, Ninja Gaiden Sigma, Eye of Judgement (which I still have btw, stand, mat and all).....So yes, I'm sure I'm mising a tonne, since I could also play the PS2 copy of GOW2 on my PS3 if I wanted, but anybody who says PS3 had no games early on are straight out lieing....

Obviously there is brand loyalty on both sides (which you seem unwilling to admit and think Microsoft has more loyal fans which is bizzarre and biased on your part) and the Xbox One only outsold it in the USA. The PS4 didn't exactly have a great line-up either (they usually don't as Sony is usually still support previous generation). Xbox One had Ryse, Killert Instinct, Forza 5 and Dead Rising 3. PS4 had Killzone and Knack.

Convenient to only name Knack and Killzone, where Killzone is a solid shooter with great MP, Knack was popular with the kids and adults too and I'm sure it outsold Ryse and Killer Instinct, seeing as how Killer Instinct was dead not too long after release....Absolutely buried in the FGC at that....Awful looking game too, no wonder this run at 90fps on a XBOX-ONE....Dead Rising 3 and Ryse? ok....Well there was also Resogun, Lou Remastered and not too long after, Infamous Second Son.......At that time, more persons were playing GT6 online on their PS3's over Forza 5 btw..

 

[demigod]

No it's the highest individual Xbox One Console.
500GB and 1TB S are different SKUs for example.

He didn’t mention individual skus, but what you said would make sense. Lord knows how many different skus the one S has.

 

[thelastword]

Wow is spiderman responsible for ps4 sales?

wow wow wow I can't believe the X outsold its base console all year, the X really is a BEAST
The pro could only dream of outselling the slim ps4

Ha, no.....It's only the best selling SKU, there are many SKU's between XBONEX and XBONES......So if the 1Tb XBONEX sold 50 units and the Blackops XBONES sold 45 units, the 1 Tb XBONEX sold more...but then the 500Gb XBONEX sold 10 units and the Forza XBONES SKU sold 40 units, more xbox slim units are sold but XBONEX is still the highest SKU because 1.) It's more expensive and 2.) It moved the most units as a SKU......So if you tally XBONES's combined units, it outsold XBONEX overall, just that more persons bought the 1TB XBONEX SKU.....Keep in mind there are lots and lots of skus here...

Also, PRO is tracking a bit worse because of the shortages mainly, though the last few exclusives has boosted PRO's numbers significantly and also demand.....Sony is just not making enough to meet said demand.....I doubt MS has that problem

 

[SonGoku]

Ha, no.....It's only the best selling SKU, there are many SKU's between XBONEX and XBONES......So if the 1Tb XBONEX sold 50 units and the Blackops XBONES sold 45 units, the 1 Tb XBONEX sold more...but then the 500Gb XBONEX sold 10 units and the Forza XBONES SKU sold 40 units, more xbox slim units are sold but XBONEX is still the highest SKU because 1.) It's more expensive and 2.) It moved the most units as a SKU......So if you tally XBONES's combined units, it outsold XBONEX overall, just that more persons bought the 1TB XBONEX SKU.....Keep in mind there are lots and lots of skus here...

Also, PRO is tracking a bit worse because of the shortages mainly, though the last few exclusives has boosted PRO's numbers significantly and demand.....Sony is just not making enough to meet said demand.....

Oh i see thanks for explaining, makes sense

 

[it_wasn't_me]

It was a failure in the beginning, you not know what I was talking about? Diffennce is I actually bought a PS3 slim, did you give up your brand loyalty and buy an Xbox 360?

I bought Wii and Nintendo 3DS instead years ago. Fan of Zeldas.

 

[it_wasn't_me]

The Xbox One didnt lose Microsoft millions of dollars like the PS3 did for Sony.

Phil Spencer never said is Xbone S or X are profitable. He always dodged a question. So, guess is they aren't.

 

[Louis Cyphre]

Convenient to only name Knack and Killzone, where Killzone is a solid shooter with great MP, Knack was popular with the kids and adults too and I'm sure it outsold Ryse and Killer Instinct, seeing as how Killer Instinct was dead not too long after release....Absolutely buried in the FGC at that....Awful looking game too, no wonder this run at 90fps on a XBOX-ONE....Dead Rising 3 and Ryse? ok....Well there was also Resogun, Lou Remastered and not too long after, Infamous Second Son.......At that time, more persons were playing GT6 online on their PS3's over Forza 5 btw..

It probably did, thanks to brand loyalty!

Oh, since you are such a fan of Metacritic, what was the score again? Oh wait for it....54. Yup, a staggering 54. You've seen it here folks, this guy will promote anything as long as this logo is on it.

I must be saying all the right words to have him come out and reply.

Phil Spencer never said is Xbone S or X are profitable. He always dodged a question. So, guess is they aren't.

Well to be fair, Microsoft never had to sell buildings and streamline its company to stay afloat either.

 

[xStoyax]

Xbox being up 60% from last year....
How far were they down tho the previous years?