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Should one of the console manafactures go free online?

Nintendo really shouldn't be. they've not up to scratch in terms of online infrastructure and the price of the console is extortionate for what it actually is. free online would have at least softened the blow a little.
 
Real_Madrid said:
Yeah, PC gamers wouldn't allow that even physical PC games can't be sold anymore.
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I'm having a hard time wrapping my head around what you're saying here. The statement just isn't good English. Is this saying that PC gamers are no better because we allowed digital only to happen on the platform essentially? Because PC games have never been able to be resold. Even physical disks had one time use CD keys. Like floppy disk days, sure I guess? The transition to digital has not only saved devs and publishers money and increased their profits, but also helped to reduce the cost to consumer often.

Digital is markedky more porfitable than physical.
 
If Nintendo tried to get the core-gamers from the Ps4/One no online fee could have been used as an not to be underestimated advantage.
But Switch being in no way an alternative to the others consoles there was no reason to not go with fees.
 
Aztechnology said:
I'm having a hard time wrapping my head around what you're saying here. The statement just isn't good English. Is this saying that PC gamers are no better because we allowed digital only to happen on the platform essentially? Because PC games have never been able to be resold. Even physical disks had one time use CD keys. Like floppy disk days, sure I guess? The transition to digital has not only saved devs and publishers money and increased their profits, but also helped to reduce the cost to consumer often.

Digital is markedky more porfitable than physical.
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It was a reaction to some pc gamers on here who apparently view console gamers are people who let Microsoft and Sony take all their money away. I find that quite funny.
I know how good digital is, that isn't relevant in this case. Used gaming doesn't exist anymore on PC and that's not a good thing.

But yeah, this a reply to someone who says that people should not be buying consoles.
 
The console makers should offer whatever product they want at whatever price point they think will be profitable.

Consumers are better informed now than ever before, with more choice than ever.

Don't like it, don't buy it.

People complaining that multiplayer on consoles should be free just because it's free on PC and free in previous consoles, don't understand how business works.
 
Real_Madrid said:
It was a reaction to some pc gamers on here who apparently view console gamers are people who let Microsoft and Sony take all their money away. I find that quite funny.
I know how good digital is, that isn't relevant in this case. Used gaming doesn't exist anymore on PC and that's not a good thing.

But yeah, this a reply to someone who says that people should not be buying consoles.
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But that's exactly what happened. If you decide to buy a console as your primary gaming machine, you accept any and all decisiom made on a closed system. You have no choice but to accept their rules. They say pay for multiplayer and subscription and if you want to play multiplayer you have to pay. That's a choice that people made willingly.
 
Lets be honest, we had plenty of chances to go free online last gen and reject paid online. Squandered it all.
 
^So true. Look what happened with the orig XBO policies. If only folks were that adamant about not paying for online with the 360..... Maybe thats why the policies were rejected so strongly. Knowing what could happen if folks didnt speak up.
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Well 2 of them did already.

Those same two are also keeping it free for their older consoles.

I think thats the best we can hope for. Like many have said, thats money left on the table, why not go and get it?

As a consumer I dont like it but I understand why its done.
 
jelly said:
Isn't there an opportunity here for someone to get more users on board or is the subscription money just too good and free doesn't necessarily mean more users?

I'm just thinking if games as a service is becoming more of a thing, wouldn't you want the least barriers to content that makes you more money. Change the subscription to something else without online play.
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All of them should! I know it isn't a popular opinion.. especially not with Dudebros that think they get soooo much out of it...

But really it is nothing more than peer 2 peer connections that get hooked up via some matchmaking service that costs peanuts to run. Due to giving the full control over to these companies they can even end "online" in like 2 years in.. as happens with Fifa games to force customers into buying the new one!

If there was ever a need for "tunnelling software" like "Warppipe" for the gamecube? It is NOW!
 
is there an argument to be made that online infrastructure and curation costs money - sure.

is it a good idea to be the third mover, with a niche console with barely any multiplats (i.e. many / most people's "second console") - i don't think so.
I think this'll kill the Splatoon franchise and seriously hurt Mario Kart or Smash sales in the long run.

It was smart of Sony to do it, because it's great for ecosystem lock-in. They used the PR momentum from MS launch (pricing and customer messaging) screwups and got people to switch into their ecosystem. Nintendo doesn't have that kind of momentum. It's not a lock-in, it's a lock-out.
 
Fliesen said:
is there an argument to be made that online infrastructure and curation costs money - sure.

is it a good idea to be the third mover, with a niche console with barely any multiplats (i.e. people's "second console") - i don't think so.
I think this'll kill the Splatoon franchise and seriously hurt Mario Kart or Smash sales in the long run.
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Seriously. The irony is they probably think more people will be playing multiplayer online on their system for games like Splatoon so people will begrudgingly pay that cost. I think instead what you are saying will come to pass.

I still think though on the subject that if people really want to see console makers stop charging for online MP they have to migrate away from the consoles. There's no other option. Well aside from just not playing online games. Then and only then will you see them cutting back on that kind of stuff in an attempt to bring back/appease users.
 
Who the hell cares at this point really? The most important and successful online games are on PC anyways, and Steam is miles better than the crap they put behind a paywall in consoles.

Anyways, Nintendo is hilarious. If their joke of a launch wasn't a bomba on its own, they bury it with an online paywall. Good luck with that, greedy scoundrels.

"Hey guys we can't charge you yet for our worthless paywall because our online infraestructure is so bad that we can't manage subscriptions. While we work on it, go ahead and enjoy the exact same online experience you'll have to pay for a few months down the line at no additional cost!"

Consoles are a complete joke right now compared to PC and people putting up with the kind of bullshit practices they force on users –the biggest one being online paywall– should be ashamed of themselves. It's because of them that the console manufacturers are shitting all over the players, but hey, you can play used games, #4theplayers right? Shu <3, Hirai the god and all that garbage.

Do they not realise they are downright extorting them? Stop. Paying. For. Online. Moreso when it's fucking P2P.

PEER-TO-PEER. Behind a paywall.
 
Nev said:
Who the hell cares at this point really? The most important and successful online games are on PC anyways, and Steam is miles better than the crap they put behind a paywall in consoles.

Anyways, Nintendo is hilarious. If their joke of a launch wasn't a bomba on its own, they bury it with an online paywall. Good luck with that, greedy scoundrels.

"Hey guys we can't charge you yet for our worthless paywall because our online infraestructure is so bad that we can't manage subscriptions. While we work on it, go ahead and enjoy the exact same online experience you'll have to pay for a few months down the line at no additional cost!"

Consoles are a complete joke right now compared to PC and people putting up with the kind of bullshit practices they force on users –the biggest one being online paywall– should be ashamed of themselves. It's because of them that the console manufacturers are shitting all over the players, but hey, you can play used games, #4theplayers right? Shu <3, Hirai the god and all that garbage.

Do they not realise they are downright extorting them? Stop. Paying. For. Online. Moreso when it's fucking P2P.

PEER-TO-PEER. Behind a paywall.
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P2P behind a paywall for 99% of Switch titles is exactly what it is going to be. They have to reverse this. Time to pull an E3 Microsoft move.
 
Wollan said:
I'm actually sort of expecting Xbox Live to become free for online gaming come E3. They have to with their UWP approach no? Would seem kind of schizophrenic not to. They are looking at reviving the trust of gamers following the Xbox One and closing of Lionhead studios, cancelling Scalebound etc and this would do that in a major way.
They will still offer a premium subscription of some kind but I think online gaming will become free.
And you will see Sony and Nintendo deservedly being put to shame for a year or two before giving in.
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PFFFTT... MS will just announce "Xbox Live for Business!" tell some sharepoint buying idiots that they need it and developers/administrators will get headaches incorporating this useless thing into a network or they loose their job.
 
Wollan said:
I'm actually sort of expecting Xbox Live to become free for online gaming come E3. They have to with their UWP approach no? Would seem kind of schizophrenic not to. They are looking at reviving the trust of gamers following the Xbox One and closing of Lionhead studios, cancelling Scalebound etc and this would do that in a major way.
They will still offer a premium subscription of some kind but I think online gaming will become free.
And you will see Sony and Nintendo deservedly being put to shame for a year or two before giving in.
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I will be floored if they do. They pioneered the whole service subscription on console. It's been for both Sony and Microsoft one of their most profitable pieces of the business. Why would they kill it while there's tens of millions of Xbox players still paying for it. People are stupid and don't seem to mind too much so why stop milking them?
 
Aztechnology said:
Seriously. The irony is they probably think more people will be playing multiplayer online on their system for games like Splatoon so people will begrudgingly pay that cost. I think instead what you are saying will come to pass.

I still think though on the subject that if people really want to see console makers stop charging for online MP they have to migrate away from the consoles. There's no other option. Well aside from just not playing online games. Then and only then will you see them cutting back on that kind of stuff in an attempt to bring back/appease users.
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the issue is, most people seem to be finde with having one online subscription. - and that's gonna be the platform they're going to play most multiplayer / multiplatform games on. If you're on XBL because of Halo, you're gonna buy your Fifa, your CoD, your Madden, your Destiny, your Overwatch on that platform.
The switch isn't gonna get most of these games, and if it does, the number of players online is going to be ridiculously small.

And it's pretty ridiculous. Super Mario Maker wouldn't have been as big a phenomenon if only people with a paid subscription would've been able to share their creations. Splatoon would have been dead in the water.

I think, way beyond the "omg it's >300&#8364;!" issue, which i feel is overblown, because - after all, it's mostly a rather powerful handheld with a dock, not an underpowered home console. - this paywall is a super dumb move by Nintendo, and i feel like they still don't get online :P
 
Now that they're all doing it, it's just more of an opportunity for them to keep it because it's the norm. There'll just be possibly more competition in terms of what they offer for that sub fee, which could be a good thing.
 
Hibiki Kurosawa said:
Now that they're all doing it, it's just more of an opportunity for them to keep it because it's the norm. There'll just be possibly more competition in terms of what they offer for that sub fee, which could be a good thing.
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Nintendo hasn't been a direct competitor in the core gaming market for a while. Prices were just raised on PS+ and Microsoft won't likely change too much either. Unless as stated above they make a power play by consolidating PC and Xbox together and axing the fee for live in hopes of bringing many people back alongside the Scorpio. That would prompt Sony to do drastic things if it were measurably successful. I just don't see those things happening though.
 
If MS wont fund new games, they better go with free online. I pay for gold because I asume it is used to improve the infrastructure (which is improving) and to fund new games.
Also, Nintendo charging for online wont affect MS or Sony, it Will just damage nintendo.
 
Any extra money gained from having more users is offset by the cost of the subscription. Besides the way things have worked out, the motivation is very weak to go free online unless one of them takes the plunge. It's circular reasoning. Everyone is fine with the status quo.
 
Yes, they should but they won't because all of them are doing it now. Nintendo had a shot to build some goodwill by not charging for online on the Switch, but they decided to take the money instead.
 
I think MS would rather ditch the console before they kill xbox live as a service.

Sony has really no reason to even contemplate such a move.

It'll be interesting if Nintendo intends keeping the fee, or at least, significantly increases what they are offering for it.
 
On Demand said:
I still can't believe Nintendo did this. What a terrible trend.
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Well everyone's basically sending Nintendo a message that it is ok. Look at the money Sony and Microsoft is getting for the past few years over these.
 
they make more online than they do winning over fans that choose the console for free online.

And when all 3 of them charge for online, and only 2 of them are competing against each other more closely, the online price becomes a non factor
 
On Demand said:
Yeah. Sony charging for online basically gave everyone the ok. There should have been a backlash but people were too distracted by the XB1 DRM nonsense.
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But that's the problem. What Backlash can you truly do that makes you think it will change. If people buy the console and subscribe to it's service than it doesn't matter and eventually it becomes normal.

Voting with your wallet is the only form of Backlash that truly matters and makes a difference. But people want what they want, damn the consequences.
 
WhoaIsThatMars said:
no because it makes money...
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Only post required. MS proved it could be done and fans bought in literally and figuratively. There was no going back after that. Every company's goal is to push the envelope as far as possible so they'll all keep trying to build on this even more.
 
Seems unlikely. At least one should if they want my money. Lol. It's weird being done with console gaming because of this. Saw it from the beginning tho and it was a great run! No going back now, way too many fools giving up their loot for nothin.
 
From my perspective? yes. From a business perspective? Hell no it makes them a ton of cash.

With 53m PS4s in the wild, even if only 10m are paying for Plus thats what, $500m a year?
 
Yes, and it should have been Nintendo. They don't get many 3rd party games, and their own 1st party stuff utilizing online is generally pretty minimal. They also have the worst online infrastructure and account system.

I didn't mind paying for Xbox Live for many, many years, it's been great. I didn't even mind when Sony required PS+ in 2013. But Nintendo? This is a bridge too far.
 
jelly said:
....or is the subscription money just too good and free doesn't necessarily mean more users?.
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DING! DING! DING!

Console users are now paying a usage tax essentially. Going free at this point wouldn't create a massive exodus from other consoles or an influx of PC gamers, at least not enough to off-set the costs of the subscriptions. It's free money and here to stay.
 
fabricated backlash said:
Nah, we console gamers deserve to be milked. And like the good sheep we are, we've actually started to believe that it's beneficial to us. I mean look at all the value, that value.

... fucking bollocks.
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This..

The console gaming communities made their bed and now have to lie in it. Anyone who has ever paid for a live/plus subscription is part of the problem, and bears blame for this.

My online multiplayer gaming will remain on PC (and Wii U for however long some of those communities last).
 
Aztechnology said:
But that's the problem. What Backlash can you truly do that makes you think it will change. If people buy the console and subscribe to it's service than it doesn't matter and eventually it becomes normal.

Voting with your wallet is the only form of Backlash that truly matters and makes a difference. But people want what they want, damn the consequences.
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I would think if more people expressed their disappointment, Sony would of thought about it. Or lowered the price maybe? A longer paid term? Don't know. They said themselves they were very worried about how everyone would react to them charging for online now.

They announced it right after the no used games segment on purpose. People were so happy it didn't settle in till after the conference. lol.
 
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