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[jstripes]

I was just going to ask. I haven't touched comics in 15 years, but when I did they were readily available in every grocery store and convenience store, though there were more options at the actual comic book store. Are they no longer available in normal stores anymore? If not, why? What happened?

They're still there, but as has always been, due to limited shelf space they only sell the big sellers.

And Archie.

 

[IrishNinja]

i wrote a 30k essay and then i threw it down a well. go read it.

hahaha that's what it feels like, yeah

Also his last twink, 'On Preordering Comics', is a good read as well:

Honestly, I hope people read both of these essays, and tell the people at Marvel to just shut the hell up when they try to blame anyone except themselves for how badly their books sell. Its all on them, every last bit of it.

This is a really dumb article. This "preorder" system as he calls it is literally how the entire retail business works. Buying a product from a store doesn't give the creator money. They get their money from the store.

i mean a lot of this stuff is kinda known but it's still interesting - and isn't that exactly what the article said?

 

[Sgt. Kabukiman]

What types of comics sell in Europe actually? Forget Japan for the moment, the costs involved in weekly anthologies of low paper quality black and white manga are vastly different and make comparison very difficult. Genuine question: in Europe's comic scene, how much of it is superheroes?

It depends on the country.
In France, superhero comics used to be a relatively small niche although it has expanded quite a bit in the last decade.
Some numbers:
http://neuviemeart.citebd.org/spip.php?rubrique91

27% des Français lisent du « franco-belge », 16% des comics, 15% des mangas

27% of french people read european comics, 16% read american comics, 15% read mangas.

But keep in mind that The Walking Dead for example is a best-seller that vastly outsells anything from Marvel and DC. Superheroes are not the dominant genre at all. There really isn't one, to be honest.

 

[jstripes]

The price would be too high. Manga magazines work because they're made of cheap black-and-white paper. Comic readers would never accept such a downgrade.

"Comic fans" would never accept it, but people who take comics less seriously might. Comic strips in newspapers have been black and white forever and no one cares.

 

[Buddha Beam]

In which case they should be shifting focus to digital anyways

I'm not sure how much of an impact digital is having though. That said, digital's apparent lack of popularity I think would be alleviated if the pricing was sane.

Bookstores are on their way out, convenience stores are not. If they're going to keep selling physical books I want them to sell them where I'm going to be anyway

Do enough people go to convenience or drug stores though? I don't feel like those places are set up to appeal to the younger audience at all. Like no young people I've ever known have ever been gung-ho about going to shop at CVS, you know?

I feel it depends on the audience you're trying to reach more than anything.

 

[The Technomancer]

"Comic fans" would never accept it, but people who take comics less seriously might. Comic strips in newspapers have been black and white forever and no one cares.

Many papers run them in color now, its not nearly as expensive as it used to be, but obviously the paper quality is much much less

 

[jstripes]

Many papers run them in color now, its not nearly as expensive as it used to be, but obviously the paper quality is much much less

Paper quality doesn't matter much if it's just going in the recycle bin at some point. Collected volumes exist to be collected.

 

[Father_Brain]

"Floppy" single-issue comics are garbage as a physical format, which would be fine if they were priced as a disposable product. Which, of course, they aren't.

Half the reason why I buy 100% digitally, despite the lack of savings, is to not have to deal with storing them.

 

[The Technomancer]

Do enough people go to convenience or drug stores though? I don't feel like those places are set up to appeal to the younger audience at all. Like no young people I've ever known have ever been gung-ho about going to shop at CVS, you know?

I feel it depends on the audience you're trying to reach more than anything.

The answer here may be all digital, or at least way more of a focus on digital, I'm not discounting that. But if its still going to be at all about the physical sales, where are people going to be naturally where they might see some comics? Your average college student isn't thrilled about going to CVS but they're still popping in twice a week to stock up on frozen pizzas and shampoo

 

[The Broken Ska Record]

Do enough people go to convenience or drug stores though? I don't feel like those places are set up to appeal to the younger audience at all. Like no young people I've ever known have ever been gung-ho about going to shop at CVS, you know?

I feel it depends on the audience you're trying to reach more than anything.

I think it was a place for kids to hang out at when I was younger. The gas station near by had a huge magazine rack and an arcade cabinet. Plus a lot of kids would go to the gas station near the high school and hang out outside.

Although I feel like that was more of a generational thing.

 

[jstripes]

The collector aspect is also kind of funny, when you think about it. Comics were not originally intended to be collected. They were just cheap periodicals meant to be read once, maybe get passed around to your friends, and be disposed of. The reason certain old comics are so expensive is because the vast majority of of their print run was thrown in the trash and only a few remain. Comic collecting didn't become a phenomenon until the '70s, when dedicated comic shops started popping up and adult nerds started fixating on them.

"Floppy" single-issue comics are garbage as a physical format, which would be fine if they were priced as a disposable product. Which, of course, they aren't.

Half the reason why I buy 100% digitally, despite the lack of savings, is to not have to deal with storing them.

Yup. Exactly this. The comic industry is at the mercy of the collector.

 

[Sgt. Kabukiman]

"Floppy" single-issue comics are garbage as a physical format, which would be fine if they were priced as a disposable product. Which, of course, they aren't.

Half the reason why I buy 100% digitally, despite the lack of savings, is to not have to deal with storing them.

Yeah, floppies are a terrible product. Expensive, shoddily put together, filled with ads. Just garbage. I had stopped following comics a while ago but I jumped back in thanks to digital. A much better experience.

 

[Vice]

The problem is the explosive mainstream success of superhero movies brought renewed mainstream interest to the comics. Marvel wants to woo these new casual fans, and the casual fans want to read the comics, but the world surrounding comics is completely impenetrable to casuals.

So Marvel's been working on the content side of their comics for these new fans, but have done exactly jack shit to bring the casual people into the fold.

Also, as someone who read tons of comics in the '90s, the format fucking sucks. It's completely collector driven, in a modern sense. No one in their right mind these days wants to spend $4 on a flimsy little monthly bundle of paper.

And even with all their initiatives to bring in new fans even the collected volumes don't seem to be doing too well. When the NY Times listed the weekly best selling trade paperbacks the list was constantly dominated by indie books, and before splitting them intot heir own category, manga. The books being held hostage by the small amount of hardcore fans isn't helping much and until they can find a way to make bigger waves in that segment they're stuck selling single issues for $4+ to the same, maybe, 200,000 people.

 

[NamelessMonk]

Hmm, can I speak as someone who only recently got into reading American Comics, after spending most of her childhood reading Manga?

I think the biggest problem is probably accessibility to new readers imo. Usually, when I start reading manga, I can just say "What's the first chapter?" And then start reading. How do you start reading say, One Punch Man? Go get volume 1 or read chapter 1. Vagabond? Chapter 1. Naruto? Episode 1 or Chapter 1.

With comics, it's more difficult. "I wanna get into X-Men!" Alright, well have fun figuring out which arc/series/whatever is canon, then which ones are relevant and include your favorite X-Men, and then which ones you can even find in print to read (or online), and etc. etc. Even now that I "read" comics, it's only really things like SAGA or anything else from Image where I can easily figure out where to start. I want to read Birthright. Where do I start? Issue 1.

And then aside from that, it's also really hard for a lot of new comic book fans to get into the hobby because of Gatekeeping from a lot of older fans. I remember being interested in reading Thor a few years ago because I actually liked the first Thor movie (Don't judge) and decided to finally make the plunge. I'm a WOC. I walked into a comic store, and asked where I should start. The collector immediately assumed that I was only interested in Thor because of the "Female Thor" run, and then began to chastise me. I turned around and walked out, and my next exposure to comics was only because I learned about more inclusive comic books like Saga or Scalped.

I know a lot of people might think that that entire comic book store debacle isn't a big problem, but there are a LOT of people like me who are turned off by that type of behavior. When I go into a Bookstore (Where a lot of manga are sold), I never get bashed because I want to buy a volume of One Piece. So I end up returning and buying more One Piece. I've had to search for comic book stores that made me feel comfortable buying there. Geek-spaces period have a big problem with accepting different kinds of people and it's annoying. And even if I was in that shop to buy "Female Thor", so what? People should be excited to see new buyers, not rebuffed. The hell.

Then, as others here have said, there's the entire "5-7$ CDN for one issue full of ADs and barely any plot" issue. I could spend 16-20$ CDN for a volume of Manga with anywhere from 150-300 pgs and a substantial amount of plot, or i could spend up to 7$ (I'm not joking about these prices) for a issue with barely any plot progression and maybe at best 30 pages.

Did any of that make any sense? Some of the things I mentioned above are specific to Marvel/DC, others apply to the entire industry.

 

[jstripes]

And even with all their initiatives to bring in new fans even the collected volumes don't seem to be doing too well. When the NY Times listed the weekly best selling trade paperbacks the list was constantly dominated by indie books, and before splitting them intot heir own category, manga. The books being held hostage by the small amount of hardcore fans isn't helping much and until they can find a way to make bigger waves in that segment they're stuck selling single issues for $4+ to the same, maybe, 200,000 people.

The collected volumes carry decades of baggage with them, whereas the indies and manga start and then end after a rational amount of volumes. As I said, "comics" are virtually impenetrable and live and die with the fanbase they've raised and nurtured over the years.

There's zero chance of fixing this without enraging the loyal fans and dismantling the staggeringly large "universes". Even spinoff books that start anew will piss off the fans, because they expect to be the target audience ffor everything.

 

[Vice]

The collected volumes carry decades of baggage with them, whereas the indies and manga start and then end after a rational amount of volumes. As I said, "comics" are virtually impenetrable and live and die with the fanbase they've raised and nurtured over the years.

Yup, and any attempt to make things easier quickly gets tossed into the traditional super hero cycle like the Ultimate universe and various reboots.

 

[Guileless]

I'm still shopping my 50k word jeremiad about the state of Archie Comics.

 

[shingi70]

I'm still shopping my 50k word jeremiad about the state of Archie Comics.

Do it, they're in a pretty bad state right now, since the heat of the horror and reboot has cooled.

 

[Sgt. Kabukiman]

And then aside from that, it's also really hard for a lot of new comic book fans to get into the hobby because of Gatekeeping from a lot of older fans. I remember being interested in reading Thor a few years ago because I actually liked the first Thor movie (Don't judge) and decided to finally make the plunge. I'm a WOC. I walked into a comic store, and asked where I should start. The collector immediately assumed that I was only interested in Thor because of the "Female Thor" run, and then began to chastise me. I turned around and walked out, and my next exposure to comics was only because I learned about more inclusive comic books like Saga or Scalped.

I know a lot of people might think that that entire comic book store debacle isn't a big problem, but there are a LOT of people like me who are turned off by that type of behavior. When I go into a Bookstore (Where a lot of manga are sold), I never get bashed because I want to buy a volume of One Piece. So I end up returning and buying more One Piece. I've had to search for comic book stores that made me feel comfortable buying there. Geek-spaces period have a big problem with accepting different kinds of people and it's annoying. And even if I was in that shop to buy "Female Thor", so what? People should be excited to see new buyers, not rebuffed. The hell.

That really sucks. As you said, it's such a small market, they should be happy to see new customers.
And Marvel and DC can definitely be a pain to get into. But to be fair, it's a tough problem to solve on their end. Their characters are popular so they keep making more content. And the more content they publish, the more confusing it becomes.

Personally, I learned not to be attached to continuity when it come to superhero comics, it makes it easier. It would never cross my mind to start a manga with any volume other than the first one but when it comes to superheroes, I don't care. If a book or character looks appealing or if I hear good things about a certain writer, I'll just pick up an issue whenever a new story-arc starts and 99% of the time, I'll understand everything just fine. It's just a different mindset. And you can always ask GAF for recommandations!

 

[Gattsu25]

Honestly, this is well worth a read, as its well thought out and he makes some good point. As far as people complaining about the engine, I think that it actually works here, and is a lot more readable. Here's a point about the way comics are actually sold, as a small excerpt:

That was EXACTLY the section I wanted to highlight.

Still reading it but it's worth a read. The entire thing is just a single HTML file that you can read through but it's well organized and well argued.

 

[jurgen]

Hmm, can I speak as someone who only recently got into reading American Comics, after spending most of her childhood reading Manga?

I think the biggest problem is probably accessibility to new readers imo. Usually, when I start reading manga, I can just say "What's the first chapter?" And then start reading. How do you start reading say, One Punch Man? Go get volume 1 or read chapter 1. Vagabond? Chapter 1. Naruto? Episode 1 or Chapter 1.

With comics, it's more difficult. "I wanna get into X-Men!" Alright, well have fun figuring out which arc/series/whatever is canon, then which ones are relevant and include your favorite X-Men, and then which ones you can even find in print to read (or online), and etc. etc. Even now that I "read" comics, it's only really things like SAGA or anything else from Image where I can easily figure out where to start. I want to read Birthright. Where do I start? Issue 1.

I understand that. It's complicated with comics. You have a shared universe of multiple titles that come and go over the course of decades. Superman and Batman both have been around for over 75 years, so things are going to be more muddled.

Marvel makes it unnecessarily difficult to get into things at time. There's a new "initiative" or relaunch every 8-12 months. Hell, Captain Marvel - the character that Marvel has been pushing as their iconic female character to match DC's Wonder Woman - just had her fifth #1 issue in five years...

 

[Mabase]

So, I just spent, dunno 1,5 hours reading that article (which is more like a book and as mentioned before, should have a table of contents for mere accessability), and it's really darn interesting.

As someone who used to love superhero comics as a teen in the nineties, but at some point got annoyed by the market and got so much more enamored by manga/european/indie stuff in comparison, many of the points made speak _directly_ to my personal experience.

These past 10-15 ish years I spent with a vague feeling that superhero comics weren't doing that well any more - but reading about these examples (like Marvel's Storm, cancelled after 11 issues!) is truly baffling. I googled a bit just now on some of these, and these sales numbers are crazy, considering how gigantic the mind share of these heroes is in popular culture. And how little comics like the X-Men/Avengers/Batman etc. could capitalize on that.

One personal anecdote, more as a sidenote: "All good things must come to an end." Neither me nor any of my friends enjoy media that goes on, constantly, without some kind of ending in sight, and superhero series definitely give that impression.
It's just so hard for me to care about hyped up story events (especially the infamous "deaths" of heroes) that I have the feeling, ultimately, won't matter. I.e yesterday I saw that Captain America thread in OT about his "shocking revelation", skimmed the thread and was like, Harrison-Ford-Who-gives-a-shit.gif.

I freely admit though that this is more of a feeling, and/or prejudice by now, festered over many years, and is unfair towards all good and well written superheroes hidden in this mess. Maybe I should give some superheroes another chance. But if it feels so cumbersome just to get back into it, and it's so much moe accessible to pop in one of the Marvel movies instead, or start reading a new manga at volume 1,.....why should I care?

Difficult.

PS: Thanks OP for the link, this was a very good read, and I genuinely learned something interesting, about something that barely interests me anymore!

 

[Man God]

Grocery stores in particular got hit with the morality police going after edgy late 90's comics but even more than that was the draconian ordering process forcing quotas on stuff that wasn't going to sell, and being burned by the special edition craze that really popped off after the death of superman. Grocery stores just aren't comic book stores, so they decided they didn't have to put up with the nonsense and gave more of their limited shelf space for periodicals to the last gasps of magazines instead. Archie somehow managed to avoid all of this and I have no idea of the particulars but maybe they're independent of Diamond or had a return policy or something?

Convenience stores are just grocery stores with higher margins and less shelf space, but they had an even stronger connection with comics so they usually have better selection even today.

A bunch of factors just pushed everything into comic book stores which are not usually at all friendly to new customers a lot of the time. For every good store you get ten stinky infested hellholes of comic nerds.

 

[ThoseDeafMutes]

The price would be too high. Manga magazines work because they're made of cheap black-and-white paper. Comic readers would never accept such a downgrade.

Digital samplers might be a good idea, however. Every week, fortnite or month you'd get a cheap bundle of marvel, dc and independent issues, typically new or under-performing series, with some regular favorites thrown into the mix.

 

[The Silver]

I got into the comics a few years ago, by far the most annoying part to me was those fucking crossovers that interrupted storylines and then they spanned multiple books and I had to go figure which came first and blah blah. Got damn it got annoying reading X-Men for a time.

 

[Man God]

I got into the comics a few years ago, by far the most annoying part to me was those fucking crossovers that interrupted storylines and then they spanned multiple books and I had to go figure which came first and blah blah. Got damn it got annoying reading X-Men for a time.

Marvel gonna Marvel.

It's even worse when DC looks over at Marvel and goes...hmm, brand wide event where we also reset everything back to issue 1, why not?!?

 

[LordRaptor]

The price would be too high. Manga magazines work because they're made of cheap black-and-white paper. Comic readers would never accept such a downgrade.

"collectors" wouldn't, but you can still sell them their 'prestige format' singles via specialist stores, and still sell them their deluxe hardcover trades.
People that would be interested in reading a comic if it was a cheap weekly anthology sold at a local retailer they go to anyway but not hunting down a dedicated comics shop for a weekly pull list wouldn't care. Its those people that comics have lost.

 

[The Silver]

Marvel gonna Marvel.

It's even worse when DC looks over at Marvel and goes...hmm, brand wide event where we also reset everything back to issue 1, why not?!?

I didn't mind the events, it's just keep that shit to one series by itself I can read start to finish. I don't wanna go to issue 22 of this series and then go to issue 19 of another book I wasn't reading and then issue 28 of a different one, fuck off bro.

 

[Gattsu25]

I got into the comics a few years ago, by far the most annoying part to me was those fucking crossovers that interrupted storylines and then they spanned multiple books and I had to go figure which came first and blah blah. Got damn it got annoying reading X-Men for a time.

Yeah, I'm trying to get into comics but it gets annoying because I spend almost as much of my time finding out what freaking issues I need to put on my reading list and where and how to buy them as I do reading the actual comics.

 

[Cipherr]

i wrote a 30k essay and then i threw it down a well. go read it.

lmao

 

[tolkir]

The ramifications kills me each time I try to read american comic books. Too many spin-offs, too many alternative universes, too many mentions to other series, too many everything.

Even when I tried to read the origins with Fantastic Four, human torch had a spin-off after a few numbers.

 

[Aaronrules380]

I didn't mind the events, it's just keep that shit to one series by itself I can read start to finish. I don't wanna go to issue 22 of this series and then go to issue 19 of another book I wasn't reading and then issue 28 of a different one, fuck off bro.

I'm going to agree. Having supplementary material that explores the series from another angle isn't a bad thing in and of itself. Tons of popular manga have had side stories in the form of books and spinoffs that are technically canon. The difference is that they usually keep those segregated enough that you don't feel like you're losing out by missing them. And when there are exceptions, manga fans typically shit all over them (a recent example is the shonen jump manga Black Clover getting characters from a connected novel dropped into the manga with little context beyond "read the novel" and everyone pretty much shat on that decision)

 

[flaxknuckles]

I didn't mind the events, it's just keep that shit to one series by itself I can read start to finish. I don't wanna go to issue 22 of this series and then go to issue 19 of another book I wasn't reading and then issue 28 of a different one, fuck off bro.

This is about to kill me with the new Deathstroke/Titans event. I don't want those Titans books i my collection just make a standalone event and time-skip the books or something.

 

[border]

Yeah, I think that by and large the solution to attracting a larger audience would be ending massive crossovers, ending forced continuity among all the books, and seriously throttling back even on continuity within a single series. The problem is that enthusiasts will throw a fit if this happens, and they're the only audience Marvel has left.

Is diversity a problem? Not really. I'm generally of the opinion that big changes (Thor's a girl now! Spider Man is Mexican!) don't really help though. They generate a temporary bubble of interest at the time they're announced because it's a huge change to an established character, but the readers they pick up slowly burn off as the other hassles of reading/collecting comics begin to rear their head.

 

[BreezyLimbo]

Yeah, I think that by and large the solution to attracting a larger audience would be ending massive crossovers, ending forced continuity among all the books, and seriously throttling back even on continuity within a single series. The problem is that enthusiasts will throw a fit if this happens, and they're the only audience Marvel has left.

Yup. Make it a procedural-like thing with comics. Each comic is a stand alone story. A few bits of a grandeur storyline. Maybe standalone team ups.

Basically like a show like NCIS or Bones, in that someone can tune in, know the basic premise, and get a neatly wrapped story thats stand alone.

 

[firehawk12]

I can't get over the fact that floppies are like 4 bucks a pop now. Who would buy that?

 

[Number_6]

Essay had some great points. It's infuriating how dense Marvel have been for the past, what, two decades? Everything is about that short-term boost, even though it's long since worthless.

Then there's the tweets. Oh my, how shitty of those Marvel boys.

I've dismissed the event books since Civil War (the first one) and only came back for Secret Wars because Hickman. Events and relaunches really are a drain on good books, killing their momentum and essentially ruining them in the long term. My wife, a new comic reader, loves Ms. Marvel. She cracks up laughing and smiling while she reads it, pretty special since she's a bit of an introvert. Of course, she was quite put off to see the book sucked into the Civil War II black hole. Now, if the book gets cancelled, Marvel would blame readers like her, I'm sure.

There is something incredibly ironic in that a large part of his argument is how the comic industry accidentally segregates their content from the average person's eyes, and his essay about it involves jumping through hoops to read. What a stunning lack of self awareness.

Hoops? Click download. Open with a browser.

The comparison of the complexity in the US comics market to the simplicity in the Japanese manga market falls apart once you look outside DC and Marvel. Those are really the only two companies with confusing continuity and excessive tie-ins. If you want to read Walking Dead or Invincible or Empowered you just start at volume 1. Marvel and DC get a lot of attention for their cape books but there's a whole lot more to comics.

Did you read the essay? It's a comparison of Marvel to the Japanese Manga market. Not US vs Japan, but Marvel vs Japan. He even talked about the ease of accessiblity of The Walking Dead and Saga, as opposed to Marvel books.

 

[Htown]

Hmm, can I speak as someone who only recently got into reading American Comics, after spending most of her childhood reading Manga?

I think the biggest problem is probably accessibility to new readers imo. Usually, when I start reading manga, I can just say "What's the first chapter?" And then start reading. How do you start reading say, One Punch Man? Go get volume 1 or read chapter 1. Vagabond? Chapter 1. Naruto? Episode 1 or Chapter 1.

With comics, it's more difficult. "I wanna get into X-Men!" Alright, well have fun figuring out which arc/series/whatever is canon, then which ones are relevant and include your favorite X-Men, and then which ones you can even find in print to read (or online), and etc. etc. Even now that I "read" comics, it's only really things like SAGA or anything else from Image where I can easily figure out where to start. I want to read Birthright. Where do I start? Issue 1.

It seems harder than it actually is.

The way to do it is to stop looking at American superhero comics as single long-running stories, like novels that happen to come out a chapter at a time. They're more like very long running episodic TV franchises with a bunch of different writers, and individual storylines that sometimes have lasting effects. There is a problem in that the publishers are REALLY REALLY BAD at pointing the good stuff out to readers, but if you really want to get into comics, it's not much harder than (for example) looking at a website to tell you which episodes of an anime are filler.

 

[B-Dubs]

Digital samplers might be a good idea, however. Every week, fortnite or month you'd get a cheap bundle of marvel, dc and independent issues, typically new or under-performing series, with some regular favorites thrown into the mix.

Or maybe publish a cheap JUMP-like magazine along side that week's issues. That way you still have the single issue stuff for the big fans, but you get more market penetration and newer fans with the weekly magazine.

 

[Big One]

Events are a plague on the comic book industry. They're almost always complete shit in execution and rarely help boost sales. Even stuff like Secret Wars and the OG events were the drizzling shits.

 

[BreezyLimbo]

Or maybe publish a cheap JUMP-like magazine along side that week's issues. That way you still have the single issue stuff for the big fans, but you get more market penetration and newer fans with the weekly magazine.

That's another way to do it, but it would mean abandoning the 20 page comic format and switch to the graphic novel of having a larger book of a hundred pages from chapters done in the weekly magazine.

 

[oneils]

i wrote a 30k essay and then i threw it down a well. go read it.

Lol, seriously. How do I read thus on my iPad. Wtf.

 

[B-Dubs]

That's another way to do it, but it would mean abandoning the 20 page comic format and switch to the graphic novel of having a larger book of a hundred pages from chapters done in the weekly magazine.

I mean, like do both. Do a weekly anthology (maybe in black and white on newsprint) of whatever they're putting out that week. Still put out those 20-page comics, but also put out a lower quality version of all of them in an anthology format (a single magazine) that goes on sale in more places.

 

[Lashley]

a 30k essay to whine over marvel

pathetic

 

[Sandfox]

Or maybe publish a cheap JUMP-like magazine along side that week's issues. That way you still have the single issue stuff for the big fans, but you get more market penetration and newer fans with the weekly magazine.

Marvel is partnering up with Archie to digests so we'll see how that goes.

 

[Staccat0]

I grew up reading comics and when I got back to the cape based stuff now (especially Marvel) it's just impenetrable. Luckily my comic shop was like "yo you should look at this other stuff" and turned me onto stuff like Sandman and Invincible.

It's not just continuity either. A lot of the comics just read like plot for plot's sake. Just trash writing. I had expected it to have evolved since I was a kid.

 

[Candescence]

Either drop the massively linked continuity bullshit, make sure it's easy for readers or one book to know what exactly is going on without needing to read specific issues in another fucking series, or bundle multiple books together so readers can read them together to easily understand what's going on. Or just ignore continuity altogether if you need to. Continuity is a sacred cow that has to be butchered every once in a while in service of keeping things standalone and understandable for readers, even if continuity buffs will throw a damn fit.

I can handle indefinitely-running series, but plan shit out in advance and avoid line-wide crossovers as much as possible, keep crossover shit in its own books. The movies don't have this problem, they have continuity but it's a bonus for the fans for the most part. Plan shit out ahead of time so it doesn't become a fucking mess. That's how we got Marvel editorial trying to kill Peter Parker's marriage for decades because they didn't originally think shit through and they tried to undo the "mess" they created for so long that by the time they did they kicked up a stink from the fans who did enjoy married Spidey and were incredibly annoyed not just because the 'divorce' occurred but the ridiculously contrived means Marvel implemented to make it happen.

Also, I'd be cool with cheap black and white magazines like manga, collectors can get coloured editions that come with the more expensive trades. Single issues are too fucking expensive, even on digital.

 

[TTOOLL]

I didn't mind the events, it's just keep that shit to one series by itself I can read start to finish. I don't wanna go to issue 22 of this series and then go to issue 19 of another book I wasn't reading and then issue 28 of a different one, fuck off bro.

Yeah, this shit is the worst. Do they even provide a reading order? Or do we have to wait for a good soul to do it and post online??

 

[BreezyLimbo]

I mean, like do both. Do a weekly anthology (maybe in black and white on newsprint) of whatever they're putting out that week. Still put out those 20-page comics, but also put out a lower quality version of all of them in an anthology format (a single magazine) that goes on sale in more places.

Mhm. The only reason I really got into comics wayback when, was do the serialized collections they did with the Ultimate comics-that and because it was a 'fresh' universe, I didn't need to know 50 years of comic history.

 

[Big One]

This is how I would restructure the comic book industry and I'm going to get hate for some of these but whatever:

• I'll remove the pre-order problem by getting rid of single issue physical releases (outside of rare occasions). This will make collector's salty as fuck but in 2017 single issue comics are only bought by a select niche of people. We live in the digital age now, and despite not knowing any of the digital sales I'm willing to bet they're much much better than issue releases.
• .99 for digital, 1.99 for physical release for all comics (that is IF you keep physical single issues)
• When a new series or volume launches I'll give it a quasi-animated trailer on youtube to promote said series, using a narrator to give you a gist of what you can expect from the comic. Think of the Magic the Gathering promotional videos they have for their sets.
• Drastically reduce the amount of spinoffs and mini-series, focus primarily on runs. Mini-series will still exist but will only be done by prolific writers ala Grant Morrison and etc.
• Relaunches will be tied entirely to movie releases to get people interested in the comic versions. The relaunches will be released a week or so before the movie to drum up interest for the film as well as get people buying it once they see the film.
• For longrunning series like Spiderman, Iron Man, Batman, Superman and etc. there will be a mandate to have entire arcs to be resolved in the span of one tradepaperback's worth of content (sometimes two in bigger arcs). Each trade-paperback will have a beginning, middle, and end, even in long runs with the same writer and artist. Readers should be able to pick up a whole trade paperback and get a full story out of it imo.
• Not only will trailers be given to new series but as well as new arcs for long-running series like the stated above. When Batman faces off against Bane in a new storyline, it's going to be promoted as a big deal to build up hype.
• No more events, period. They suck. Instead, there will be massive crossover mini-series but they'll be self-contained stories not tied in with ANY of the other comics in any capacity.

This is just my fantasy booking for comics, but this is how I've always wished the model was like.