Support NeoGAF

[mollipen]

It's not a matter of knowing what to do with the series, but a matter of whether there is anymore to do with the series.

Yes, I keep hearing this from people, and it's wrong. Resident Evil, RE2, RE3, Code Veronica, RE0, the Gun Survivor games, Outbreak #1 and #2... there was nothing left to do with the series, and people were starting to not care anymore. RE4 came along, and the series was suddenly relevant again.

In the right hands, you could have at least ten more SH games come out, and have them all be great and exciting and fun and worth playing. But when you have a team that says there's nothing to do with the series anymore, that the town is boring and that they have to do something "new" with the series to keep it fresh, of course the series will feel like it has nowhere to go.

Get people in there again who give a s**t about the town and the series and the idea behind the games, and the series will be fine.

 

[Ravidrath]

Yes, I keep hearing this from people, and it's wrong. Resident Evil, RE2, RE3, Code Veronica, RE0, the Gun Survivor games, Outbreak #1 and #2... there was nothing left to do with the series, and people were starting to not care anymore. RE4 came along, and the series was suddenly relevant again.

In the right hands, you could have at least ten more SH games come out, and have them all be great and exciting and fun and worth playing. But when you have a team that says there's nothing to do with the series anymore, that the town is boring and that they have to do something "new" with the series to keep it fresh, of course the series will feel like it has nowhere to go.

Get people in there again who give a s**t about the town and the series and the idea behind the games, and the series will be fine.

This won't happen. It's just a brand to Konami now, and the guy in charge of the brand doesn't really get why the series is popular in the first place.

 

[Kittonwy]

Yes, I keep hearing this from people, and it's wrong. Resident Evil, RE2, RE3, Code Veronica, RE0, the Gun Survivor games, Outbreak #1 and #2... there was nothing left to do with the series, and people were starting to not care anymore. RE4 came along, and the series was suddenly relevant again.

In the right hands, you could have at least ten more SH games come out, and have them all be great and exciting and fun and worth playing. But when you have a team that says there's nothing to do with the series anymore, that the town is boring and that they have to do something "new" with the series to keep it fresh, of course the series will feel like it has nowhere to go.

Get people in there again who give a s**t about the town and the series and the idea behind the games, and the series will be fine.

I'm not quite sure if RE4 really gave RE a second life as a series, because RE was always a big seller regardless. RE4 was a great game, it changed some of the gameplay mechanics which probably made it more playable than before, obviously the gameplay mechanics needed to be updated big time, especially with a greater emphasis on combat. And then there was the graphics which was arguably the best out there which was by far its biggest selling point, but in the end the story still wasn't all that interesting, and the characters had lost much of their charm in RE2.

It's RE, it can sell on name brand alone, which is something which cannot be said when it comes to Silent Hill. Silent Hill in a sense relies on the fixed camera angles for the suspense, it already has some of the best graphics (i.e. Silent Hill 3), it's not like you can just bring a few things up-to-date and see the game go through a huge transformation.

The last thing I want to see is a bunch of fans running the series into the ground, fan novels do not creative vision make, and I don't see Toyama and Sato ever coming back to the series and they have absolutely no reason to do so. KCET will probably continue to milk the series, especially with the movies, gameplay-wise and story-wise the creative vision is no longer there, and it's much harder to make a survival horror game with appeal than something that is much more action-oriented.

The fact that you think it's about the town of Silent Hill in a way already limits what one can do with the series.

 

[Gyrian Seed]

After reading all the recent talk on Origins, I'm going to have to say too that it'll probably be for the best if they can it (gasp!). All I need at this point is for Yamaoka to release the music he's already finished for it.

 

[TheJollyCorner]

I'm not quite sure if RE4 really gave RE a second life as a series, because RE was always a big seller regardless. RE4 was a great game, it changed some of the gameplay mechanics which probably made it more playable than before, obviously the gameplay mechanics needed to be updated big time, especially with a greater emphasis on combat. And then there was the graphics which was arguably the best out there which was by far its biggest selling point, but in the end the story still wasn't all that interesting, and the characters had lost much of their charm in RE2.

It's RE, it can sell on name brand alone, which is something which cannot be said when it comes to Silent Hill. Silent Hill in a sense relies on the fixed camera angles for the suspense, it already has some of the best graphics (i.e. Silent Hill 3), it's not like you can just bring a few things up-to-date and see the game go through a huge transformation.

The last thing I want to see is a bunch of fans running the series into the ground, fan novels do not creative vision make, and I don't see Toyama and Sato ever coming back to the series and they have absolutely no reason to do so. KCET will probably continue to milk the series, especially with the movies, gameplay-wise and story-wise the creative vision is no longer there, and it's much harder to make a survival horror game with appeal than something that is much more action-oriented.

The fact that you think it's about the town of Silent Hill in a way already limits what one can do with the series.

Toyama did one game... and his other games have been completely hit and miss (Siren 1 being a miss and Siren 2 being improved enough to warrant a third). I really don't think the SH series without him is that big of a deal, especially considering how SH2 and 3 turned out.
Sato did great work with SH1 and 2, but SH3 proved that Team Silent's character modelers no longer needed CG. Their in-game work was masterful. Hell, just look at the almost daily posts of "Old Silent Hill Guy" around here. Also, the overall 'style' of the characters in SH3 (and even SH4) were still along the lines of SH1 and 2, so the loss seems only linked to CG, which (with the exception of Square) probably won't even be a factor in this next gen.

I'd love to see Sato back, especially since his CG talents have raised significantly since '01, but to me he isn't as critical as others on the staff.

The key players- Imamura, Tsuboyama, and Yamaoka- are still there. To all of our knowledge, so is creature designer Ito (even though he didn't participate in Room 302). Those are the four names people should care about- especially Imamura, who masterminded SH2 and IMO has the right idea about the direction the series should go in. Back in 2001, prior to SH2's release, he mentioned he wanted the series to become like a 'Twilight Zone-esque' serial series, with new stories releasing every few months, even via download if neccessary, since at the time Sony had ridiculous ambitions for their online capabilities. Different characters, different twisted stories, different time periods, but all connected soley by the town of Silent Hill- basically the spirit of what SH2 was.
Even though that probably won't ever happen (especially considering the idea has since been shot down by a direct-sequel in SH3 and a game that wasn't even suppose to be in the series in SH4), I still have faith in their SH Next project after some of the ideas they revealed.

Team Silent also has some of the most talented graphics/effects people in the business... and the core development staff hasn't worked on a game since SH3. If anything, we can expect SH Next to look ****ing unbelievable.

 

[Ceb]

Sato did great work with SH1 and 2, but SH3 proved that Team Silent's character modelers no longer needed CG. Their in-game work was masterful. Hell, just look at the almost daily posts of "Old Silent Hill Guy" around here. Also, the overall 'style' of the characters in SH3 (and even SH4) were still along the lines of SH1 and 2, so the loss seems only linked to CG, which (with the exception of Square) probably won't even be a factor in this next gen.

I'd love to see Sato back, especially since his CG talents have raised significantly since '01, but to me he isn't as critical as others on the staff.

Sato was also involved in the story conception, but I also think they can manage without him.

The key players- Imamura, Tsuboyama, and Yamaoka- are still there. To all of our knowledge, so is creature designer Sato (even though he didn't participate in Room 302). Those are the four names people should care about- especially Imamura, who masterminded SH2 and IMO has the right idea about the direction the series should go in.

You probably mean "Ito", not Sato. I think Hiroyuki Owaku (scenario writer, SH1-3) should also be considered being part of the core creative team.

I was hoping that Origins was gonna adapt the aforementioned concept of a collection of short stories. A bunch of scenarios a la "Born from a wish" would've been snazzy.

 

[Oni Jazar]

Man I was hyped up for this game. If the rumors are true then it's time to bail out. (Release the soundtrack though please)

 

[TheJollyCorner]

just move the songs from the trailers over to SH5

 

[Kittonwy]

Toyama did one game... and his other games have been completely hit and miss (Siren 1 being a miss and Siren 2 being improved enough to warrant a third). I really don't think the SH series without him is that big of a deal, especially considering how SH2 and 3 turned out.

But it was under Toyama's direction that all the key concepts in the series were conceived (the siren, the transformation from normal to nightmare Silent Hill, the multiple endings), the problem is that Toyama isn't exactly working with an experienced team at Sony Japan when it comes to the Siren series and the hardware probably was a limiting factor, but it's definitely getting better and they're getting awesome hardware to work with now. There really hasn't been much gameplay innovation after Toyama left, the Siren series probably did more innovating during that time, obviously it takes more than one man to make a great game, on the other hand game design-wise they really haven't done much after Toyama's departure.

Sato did great work with SH1 and 2, but SH3 proved that Team Silent's character modelers no longer needed CG. Their in-game work was masterful. Hell, just look at the almost daily posts of "Old Silent Hill Guy" around here. Also, the overall 'style' of the characters in SH3 (and even SH4) were still along the lines of SH1 and 2, so the loss seems only linked to CG, which (with the exception of Square) probably won't even be a factor in this next gen.

At least according to his site, Sato did a ton of work outside of just CG:

http://www.satoworks.com/SilentHill2page.html

"CGI DIRECTOR / DIVISION MANAGER
In 2000 I moved to California to create Team Sato Works/USA, which included 3 artists, 1 technician, and myself.
Here I created the storyline, all character design, atmosphere design, some gameplay elements, and directed all of the CGI sequences for Silent Hill 2.
"

I'd love to see Sato back, especially since his CG talents have raised significantly since '01, but to me he isn't as critical as others on the staff.


The key players- Imamura, Tsuboyama, and Yamaoka- are still there. To all of our knowledge, so is creature designer Sato (even though he didn't participate in Room 302). Those are the four names people should care about- especially Imamura, who masterminded SH2 and IMO has the right idea about the direction the series should go in. Back in 2001, prior to SH2's release, he mentioned he wanted the series to become like a 'Twilight Zone-esque' serial series, with new stories releasing every few months, even via download if neccessary, since at the time Sony had ridiculous ambitions for their online capabilities. Different characters, different twisted stories, different time periods, but all connected soley by the town of Silent Hill- basically the spirit of what SH2 was.
Even though that probably won't ever happen (especially considering the idea has since been shot down by a direct-sequel in SH3 and a game that wasn't even suppose to be in the series in SH4), I still have faith in their SH Next project after some of the ideas they revealed.

None of those were key players the same way Toyama and Sato were in terms of their influence on the game, these people became "key players" after the real key players left the series. Both Toyama and Sato were much more involved with the series, and had much more influence on the series during their tenure than either Imamura, Tsuboyama or Yamaoka, the game is basically still relying on many of the ideas pioneered during Toyama's time as the director, as well as Sato time as CG/character designer there. I'm not sure why Imamura would even get more credit than Sato when it comes to SH2 when Sato did the storyline, maybe that's why Sato got pissed off and left KCET for good. SH3 never truly managed to capture the Silent Hill magic in SH1 and SH2, they tried something different with SH4 but the concept just didn't work. The post-SH2 Silent Hills didn't do anywhere nearly as well in sales either.

Team Silent also has some of the most talented graphics/effects people in the business... and the core development staff hasn't worked on a game since SH3. If anything, we can expect SH Next to look ****ing unbelievable.

I don't doubt their next game will look good but I'm not sure if the series can regain its relevance in the survival horror genre.

 

[Ceb]

At least according to his site, Sato did a ton of work outside of just CG:

http://www.satoworks.com/SilentHill2page.html

"CGI DIRECTOR / DIVISION MANAGER
In 2000 I moved to California to create Team Sato Works/USA, which included 3 artists, 1 technician, and myself.
Here I created the storyline, all character design, atmosphere design, some gameplay elements, and directed all of the CGI sequences for Silent Hill 2.
"

Or, from a GamaSutra interview:

There was a writer, but I provided the dialog and storyline for the women. The basic storyline was based on Crime and Punishment. The background story of my university was also kind of twisted into Silent Hill 2.

 

[TheJollyCorner]

Both Toyama and Sato were much more involved with the series, and had much more influence on the series during their tenure than either Imamura, Tsuboyama or Yamaoka.

I guess we'll just absolutely agree to disagree on this one, pal.

 

[Matix]

Seems like SHO, is still a go..

Forum member Leonstars resently email Climax member Steve Merrett, after a couple of tries he got through and asked him some questions about the development issues. Steves responce made it clear that the rumours are nothing but rumours.

Leonstar's email:

"Yes i was wanting to know if the psp game silent hill origins having troubles
like is the game still coming out
and is it going to be a pretty big game
i have read on the internet that is was having troubles
and i was wondering if it is just a rumor or not
i am a big fan
and a big fan of silent hill
Thanks"

Steve Merrett's reply:


from: "Steve Merrett"
RE: Trouble Silent Hill Origins
Date: Fri, 3 Nov 2006 09:58

Hi,

There are loads of rumours out there, but that is all they are – unsubstantiated gossip. Silent Hill Origins is still on track for the early 2007 release it always was.

Steve Merrett

Yay!

 

[cvxfreak]

It's RE, it can sell on name brand alone, which is something which cannot be said when it comes to Silent Hill. Silent Hill in a sense relies on the fixed camera angles for the suspense, it already has some of the best graphics (i.e. Silent Hill 3), it's not like you can just bring a few things up-to-date and see the game go through a huge transformation.

The last thing I want to see is a bunch of fans running the series into the ground, fan novels do not creative vision make, and I don't see Toyama and Sato ever coming back to the series and they have absolutely no reason to do so. KCET will probably continue to milk the series, especially with the movies, gameplay-wise and story-wise the creative vision is no longer there, and it's much harder to make a survival horror game with appeal than something that is much more action-oriented.

The fact that you think it's about the town of Silent Hill in a way already limits what one can do with the series.

I don't think the general public cares much WHO makes the Silent Hill games. The series' lasting power simply pales in comparison to RE's and the original guys coming back won't make a difference since they don't even have a name as recognizable as Mikami's or Kojima's.

It's time to move on. Konami thought that their series was a masterpiece people would follow until the end of time, but SH2ifying a game won't bring the fanbase back. The same popularity even happened with the RE series, but the RE series is much more popular so it seems less worse than SH, which didn't have the greatest sales in the world to begin with.

EDIT: I see this post is old. Oops. :lol

 

[Reavr]

Man, am I glad to hear this game is still alive..

 

[Fady K]

I don't think the general public cares much WHO makes the Silent Hill games. The series' lasting power simply pales in comparison to RE's and the original guys coming back won't make a difference since they don't even have a name as recognizable as Mikami's or Kojima's.

It's time to move on. Konami thought that their series was a masterpiece people would follow until the end of time, but SH2ifying a game won't bring the fanbase back. The same popularity even happened with the RE series, but the RE series is much more popular so it seems less worse than SH, which didn't have the greatest sales in the world to begin with.

EDIT: I see this post is old. Oops. :lol

I love Resident Evil. But Silent Hill is almost just as awesome. Not just Silent Hill 2.

Silent Hill rocked. Silent Hill 3 did too. Silent Hill 4 wasnt bad at all. Silent Hill the movie was the best game movie ive seen, certainly more enjoyable than Resident Evil movie. Silent Hill experience was pretty cool too.

But there are two RE games I love more than any Silent Hill - the gamecube remake of the original (the one true horror game!!) and Re4.

But I believe in Silent Hill

 

[Ravidrath]

The game is still alive, but projects this troubled don't usually turn out well. Either it's going to be total shit, or they're going to cut the amount of content way back to accommodate their new schedule, or both. Even if they threw twice as many people at it, there is still going to be a lot of time lost to transitioning the project and picking up where the previous team left off.

I wouldn't expect this in "early 2007" - they're probably at least six months off from alpha, assuming there isn't any major reworking.

Not saying this will definitively suck, but the odds aren't in its or your favor.