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[Sentenza]

Well, depending on where you stand in regard to Ricochet 2 actually being a codeword for Half-Life 3, he has said "everyone who was working on [Half-Life 3] continues to work on [Half-Life 3]."

Maybe I'm reading in his statements more than I should, but I'm quite excited about the fact that he described "Ricochet 2" as a "gigantic story arc".

Valve has backed themselves into a corner, now. When HL3 DOES eventually come out, it will never live up to the hype no matter how good it is.

I don't know... I used to think this as well, at some point. Then I played Portal 2.

On a side note, sometime I wonder if I'm actually the only one who can't wait to know more about their rumored space game (codename "SOB").
Almost no one ever talks about it, and yet those artworks supposedly related to it were extremely intriguing for me.

 

[bengraven]

Personally, I'm in the camp that assumes Episode Three transmogrified into Half-Life 3, likely around the time Valve tightened its lips. Also, with Gabe confirming no new product announcements at E3, I suspect we won't see it until the next generation of platforms have hit. What about you, GAF? What form do you think the game will take and when will it see the light of day?

I'm assuming this is so as well, but they've always been so fair with their fan base, so why not just tell us? We can forgive six years of development on HL3, but not something that was promised us years ago.

That's what's so bizarre to me: are they just so full of themselves with with the love fans give them for how fair Steam has been, making TF2 free, and the high quality and acclaim of recent releases like L4D and Portal?

That's like Mother Teresa saying "I save and feed so many orphans that once in a while I can kick one in the face until it stops moving".

 

[Sibylus]

"The problem is, we think that the twists and turns that we're going through would probably drive people more crazy than just being silent about it, until we can be very crisp about what's happening next"

Given what happened with Half-Life 2 and a number of their other releases, that fear is probably more than a little well-founded. I know that I'd personally love to be a fly on the wall and watch all those twists and turns play out, but many others would probably feel as though Valve was jerking them around and toying with them. Most people want to take what they see to the bank.

 

[Sentenza]

"The problem is, we think that the twists and turns that we're going through would probably drive people more crazy than just being silent about it, until we can be very crisp about what's happening next"

Given what happened with Half-Life 2 and a number of their other releases, that fear is probably more than a little well-founded. I know that I'd personally love to be a fly on the wall and watch all those twists and turns play out, but many others would probably feel as though Valve was jerking them around and toying with them. Most people want to take what they see to the bank.

I remember reading that there was a very vocal group who bitched A LOT about parts of Episode 2 trailer not being in the final product... And that's when Valve stopped talking about Episode 3.

 

[Mobius1]

I remember reading that there was a very vocal group who bitched A LOT about parts of Episode 2 trailer not being in the final product... And that's when Valve stopped talking about Episode 3.

A history of entitlement

 

[Deleted member 80556]

Read Half Life 2: Episode 3 announced.

It's about how it was announced 6 years ago.

FUCK MY LIFE. Need to read threads better.

Anyway, it's done when it's done. I really can wait, I want it to be brilliant. I'm sure it'll be.

 

[Sibylus]

And yet more people who complain (and still occasionally complain) about the elements of the HL2 E3 presentations that didn't make it into the game. Some of that's fair enough, especially the aspirational stuff to do with AI and all that, but a lot of it's silly attachment to things like how a gun or particular locale looked, or this or that story detail. Fans can get clingy to promotional materials in the worst ways sometimes, well-reasoned or necessary changes be damned.

 

[bengraven]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5wqDMw2aHSc

 

[StuBurns]

And yet more people who complain (and still occasionally complain) about the elements of the HL2 E3 presentations that didn't make it into the game. Some of that's fair enough, especially the aspirational stuff to do with AI and all that, but a lot of it's silly attachment to things like how a gun or particular locale looked, or this or that story detail. Fans can get clingy to promotional materials in the worst ways sometimes, well-reasoned or necessary changes be damned.

It's not just the fans though, Valve aren't letting go either. HL2 was going to open on the Borealis at night, and that's where Valve suggested the story was going to go next.

 

[evlcookie]

I'm assuming this is so as well, but they've always been so fair with their fan base, so why not just tell us? We can forgive six years of development on HL3, but not something that was promised us years ago.

I think they are afraid. Yes that's an odd thing to say about valve and their major IP but look at what people are expecting from the title after so long.

Source 2.0: We all sorta want this and assume it has to be in the works but so far there's been no evidence of valve moving to a newer engine. I'm sure in interviews over the past 12 - 18 months they stated there was no development on a new source engine.

F-stop: Could this now be used in HL? Considering it was meant to be an amazing game design idea for portal for i think puzzles? I could imagine it being moved to a new HL instead of just more physics puzzles.

Bio feedback: We all know valve are looking into this. Could we get a really dynamic experience with HL that modifies itself to how you are feeling at any given time? What if your heart rate is beating at a faster rate, there's a hint of fear in what the bio feedback tool is reading as you move through some area. Could alex turn around and say, There's no need to be afraid gordon, I've got your back. (Fuck i hope it's better than that sentence!) Could the NPCs sense that mr freeman is actually scared and then themselves start to worry about what could happen. What if you're a stone cold son of a bitch who is calm, Will the NPCs act differently again.

These are the sort of things gamers seem to assume is going to come out whenever we get a new half life. What if we don't get ANY of that. No new source engine, F-Stop is saved for a brand new IP and biofeedback was just internal testing for valve that doesn't see the light of day. Are gamers going to be pissed off that after 6, 7 years of waiting it's just another Half life on the original but slightly updated source engine? There's a good chance they might be.

 

[Sibylus]

It's not just the fans though, Valve aren't letting go either. HL2 was going to open on the Borealis at night, and that's where Valve suggested the story was going to go next.

Not really the same thing in my mind. One is an ornery penchant to latch onto the smallest thing and feel robbed to see it being changed, the other is a return to ideas one wasn't able to implement in the past, and to see if they could work and add something to the new experience one is building in the present.

The former builds this, an awkward mishmash of cut, "pet" ideas (Missing Information):

The latter builds this, a strong and coherent game that incorporates cut ideas where they make sense (and not just for the sake of doing it):

 

[StuBurns]

F-stop: Could this now be used in HL? Considering it was meant to be an amazing game design idea for portal for i think puzzles? I could imagine it being moved to a new HL instead of just more physics puzzles.

F-Stop in HL3 is an interesting idea. We don't know what it is of course, but one common speculation was that it relates to light manipulation. One thing we do know about HL3 is Gabe wanted it to be more of a horror experience. Horror and light manipulation could be a very cool combination.

 

[evlcookie]

F-Stop in HL3 is an interesting idea. We don't know what it is of course, but one common speculation was that it relates to light manipulation. One thing we do know about HL3 is Gabe wanted it to be more of a horror experience. Horror and light manipulation could be a very cool combination.

He wanted it to be more like a horror game / experience? Oh god i will never play it.

 

[StuBurns]

He wanted it to be more like a horror game / experience? Oh god i will never play it.

I can't recall the quote exactly, I think he said he'd like to see the series return to it's more horror roots. Having only played Half-Life after HL2, I can't say that it's at all a horror experience personally, but perhaps it was at the time, and Gabe would like HL3 to evoke that.

 

[The Librarian]

And yet more people who complain (and still occasionally complain) about the elements of the HL2 E3 presentations that didn't make it into the game. Some of that's fair enough, especially the aspirational stuff to do with AI and all that, but a lot of it's silly attachment to things like how a gun or particular locale looked, or this or that story detail. Fans can get clingy to promotional materials in the worst ways sometimes, well-reasoned or necessary changes be damned.

I just want a direct yes or no answer as to whether or not they're working on it.

 

[StuBurns]

I just want a direct yes or no answer as to whether or not they're working on it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0d7cjaJKR_8&t=11m0s

There you go.

 

[Sibylus]

I just want a direct yes or no answer as to whether or not they're working on it.

We've had a fair many over the years (usually to the effect of "yes, the game still exists, but we can't talk about it yet"), with the Ricochet allusion being pretty damned definitive with regard to whether or not they're actively working on it. Gabe popping by the forums and saying explicitly that Ep3 was actively under development, it wouldn't tell us anything we didn't already know by this point.

 

[hypernima]

i remember the first time seeing that concept art.
jeez it is what made me want to be a concept artist. so good.

 

[Artadius]

Can't unsee his right hand trying to break through his left arm.

 

[The Librarian]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0d7cjaJKR_8&t=11m0s

There you go.

Sorry. That's a non-answer (he even says it himself). All he says is "hang in there." He does not say, "Yes, we are working on Half-Life 3/Episode 3" or, "No, we are not working on Half-Life/Episode 3."

That's a carrot-on-a-stick response. Doesn't cut it.

We've had a fair many over the years (usually to the effect of "yes, the game still exists, but we can't talk about it yet"), with the Ricochet allusion being pretty damned definitive with regard to whether or not they're actively working on it. Gabe popping by the forums and saying explicitly that Ep3 was actively under development, it wouldn't tell us anything we didn't already know by this point.

But we would know it's being worked on, and so we can expect it some time down the line. I'm not even sure it's being worked on.

 

[Sentenza]

Seriously, guys, how cool is this stuff? It looks so unique. I can't be the only one desperately curious about this space game.

 

[StuBurns]

Sorry. That's a non-answer (he even says it himself). All he says is "hang in there." He does not say, "Yes, we are working on Half-Life 3/Episode 3" or, "No, we are not working on Half-Life/Episode 3."

That's a carrot-on-a-stick response.

He said you will see it. Do you expect it to spawn from thin air? The process of having the next Half-Life exist requires it's development.

Gabe talking about 'Ricochet 2' is effectively no different than him talking about Half-Life 3. I don't see why it matters how literal their transparency is, as long as it's transparent.

 

[The Librarian]

He said you will see it.

Yes but that doesn't mean it's be worked on at the moment. If it's being worked on right now then that probably means we'll see it within a reasonable amount of time (for Valve, anyway). If it's not, well, probably not for another ten years or so. That response doesn't tell me anything.

Gabe talking about 'Ricochet 2' is effectively no different than him talking about Half-Life 3. I don't see why it matters how literal their transparency is, as long as it's transparent.

Not really. As far as I know, everyone is guessing as to what "Ricochet 2" is, and if Gabe were to come out and say "Half-Life 3 is being worked on" or "Episode 3 is being worked on" we'd have an idea about the size of the project.

 

[StuBurns]

Not really. As far as I know, everyone is guessing as to what "Ricochet 2" is, and if Gabe were to come out and say "Half-Life 3 is being worked on" or "Episode 3 is being worked on" we'd have an idea about the size of the project.

No, we're not. Either you haven't heard the interview in question, or you're not a native speaker. It is blatantly apparent what he means.

 

[Sibylus]

But we would know it's being worked on, and so we can expect it some time down the line. I'm not even sure it's being worked on.

The only particular detail I was in doubt about was how steadily it was being worked on all these past years. That it was being worked on in some fashion wasn't in doubt, even before the Ricochet quote, but what that did was more or less confirm that the work on it has been much more steady than the "off-and-on, people shuffling around to different projects constantly" state that the community thought might have been happening behind the scenes. That sort of confirmation probably could have come a lot earlier, but as it is, it's a nice little way of reassuring the community that Ep3 isn't an afterthought or backburner project that they tinker with on Fridays now and again.

Seriously, guys, how cool is this stuff? I can't be the only one desperately curious about this space game.

You saw the video snippets of what looked like SOB ships and assets, right? Was fairly interesting, albeit short and non-specific.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sfTNzFrV2BA

Not really. As far as I know, everyone is guessing as to what "Ricochet 2" is, and if Gabe were to come out and say "Half-Life 3 is being worked on" or "Episode 3 is being worked on" we'd have an idea about the size of the project.

There's really, really no other way to spin that comment. Taken at face value, the comment is nonsense, Ricochet was a niche, multiplayer-only title that is generally regarded as being a novelty item by virtually everyone, Valve included. There was no giant narrative arc to be spoken for, and the interviewer (and Gabe) knew fully well what the question was really about.

 

[Rapstah]

Seriously, guys, how cool is this stuff? It looks so unique. I can't be the only one desperately curious about this space game.

Those were unrelated to Valve. They were just previous works of some artist who works there printed out for whatever reason. Someone checked it out when the story first appeared and they had been on his or her site forever.

 

[The Librarian]

No, we're not. Either you haven't heard the interview in question, or you're not a native speaker. It is blatantly apparent what he means.

I haven't listened to it, but I'd still like direct confirmation. Is it Episode 3? Is it Half-Life 3? I don't see the harm in saying either or.

 

[Sentenza]

Those were unrelated to Valve. They were just previous works of some artist who works there printed out for whatever reason. Someone checked it out when the story first appeared and they had been on his or her site forever.

That's... not the story I knew.
For what I know know they aren't confirmed (yet?) to be related to an actual project, but these images were supposed to be pinned to a wall in Valve's offices.

 

[StuBurns]

I haven't listened to it, but I'd still like direct confirmation.

Listen to it, I promise you, you will have no doubt HL3 is in active development.

 

[Sibylus]

I haven't listened to it, but I'd still like direct confirmation.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TS9zD_LPhw0

Can't get more blatant without Gabe dropping "Episode Three!" or "Half-Life 3!" at the end of the segment.

 

[The Librarian]

Listen to it, I promise you, you will have no doubt HL3 is in active development.

Ah, ah, ah! You don't know if it's HL3. Botolf's link was far more of an answer than the one you posted.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TS9zD_LPhw0

Can't get more blatant without Gabe dropping "Episode Three!" or "Half-Life 3!" at the end of the segment.

Probably because it's out of context, but how did the questioner know to refer it as Richochet 2?

 

[StuBurns]

Ah, ah, ah! You don't know if it's HL3. Botolf's link was far more of an answer than the one you posted.

I know that you're internally debating a meaningless semantic distinction.

After five years, Half-Life 2: Episode 3 wouldn't be any smaller than a Half-Life 3 would. The name means nothing. Logically speaking, it'll be called Half-Life 3, but it doesn't matter what it's called. The next Half-Life has been in development for years, and is on it's way.

It's not as if the name is going to dictate if it's four hours around a boat looking for Aperture stuff, or a twenty hour epic.

 

[The Librarian]

I know that you're internally debating a meaningless semantic distinction.

After five years, Half-Life 2: Episode 3 wouldn't be any smaller than a Half-Life 3 would. The name means nothing.

Chill, dude. It was a joke response. Hence the ""

 

[StuBurns]

Chill, dude. It was a joke response. Hence the ""

That wasn't meant to sound heated or anything. I'm sorry if it does. I know it wasn't serious. I was more wanting to know why you care what the game is named, you mentioned it above too. Will your expectations really change depending on what it's called?

 

[Sibylus]

Probably because it's out of context, but how did the questioner know to refer it as Richochet 2?

I listened to the entire episode from which that snippet was taken, there's no context sitting outside that segment that could rationalize it in any meaningful way. The interviewer leads up to the question in a way that leaves little room for doubt as to what he actually refers to, and Gabe picks up on that right away and plays along. Ricochet just happened to be a good cover name, but it's even more aptly chosen given how Gabe's responses are transparently inapplicable to Ricochet in every sense (there is no clamor for a ricochet 2, there's no frustration at the utter silence over a possible ricochet 2, there is no narrative arc for ricochet in general, etc). Every Half-life fansite on the net saw the meaning in bold print, as did many gaming sites in general.

And I definitely agree with Stuburns, the name is meaningless to me. It's evident that the game took on greater importance than when it was first envisioned as a simple episodic followup to 2.

 

[Rapstah]

I listened to the entire episode from which that snippet was taken, there's no context sitting outside that segment that could rationalize it in any meaningful way. The interviewer leads up to the question in a way that leaves little room for doubt as to what he actually refers to, and Gabe picks up on that right away and plays along. Ricochet just happened to be a good cover name, but it's even more aptly chosen given how Gabe's responses are transparently inapplicable to Ricochet in every sense (there is no clamor for a ricochet 2, there's no frustration at the utter silence over a possible ricochet 2, there is no narrative arc for ricochet in general, etc). Every Half-life fansite on the net saw the meaning in bold print, as did many gaming sites in general.

And I definitely agree with Stuburns, the name is meaningless to me. It's evident that the game took on greater importance than when it was first envisioned as a simple episodic followup to 2.

It's in reference to this video. Apparently Gabe has seen it.

 

[szaromir]

The next Half-Life has been on hold for years, and is not on its way.

Fixed.

 

[The Librarian]

That wasn't meant to sound heated or anything. I'm sorry if it does. I know it wasn't serious. I was more wanting to know why you care what the game is named, you mentioned it above too. Will your expectations really change depending on what it's called?

Calling it "Episode 3" or "Half-Life 3" would, for me, imply the scope (and length) of the game. I mean, it's been five years, but we have no idea why it's taking so long, so it could end up just being another episode. My expectations wouldn't be diminished either way.

I guess it's just my desire to know something – anything! – even if it is just the name. Is it still Episode 3? NEWS! Is it now Half-Life 3? NEWS!

 

[VGChampion]

I still don't think it's become Half-Life 3. An episode could be just as long as a full game.

 

[StuBurns]

I still don't think it's become Half-Life 3. An episode could be just as long as a full game.

At which point, what is the difference though?

It's been five years, whatever they choose to call it, it's obviously not going to be a four hour expansion to HL2.

The only thing sticking with the Half-Life 2: Episode Three title will do is hamper marketing.

 

[derFeef]

I still don't think it's become Half-Life 3. An episode could be just as long as a full game.

TBTH if it's Episode 3 and just a 4 hour ride in the marks of EP2 I will be a bit disappointed. I am expecting a little more now after all those years. Technology, gameplay, and content wise.

Who knows what they have in the oven, but a full HL3 is surely more likely I think.

 

[Visualante2]

I still don't think it's become Half-Life 3. An episode could be just as long as a full game.

While I think in this case it's just semantics, typically an incremental step means a big leap forward in gameplay, concepts. The reason why CS:GO isn't Counter Strike 2 is very specific.

 

[Hylian7]

Seriously, guys, how cool is this stuff? It looks so unique. I can't be the only one desperately curious about this space game.

http://half-life.wikia.com/wiki/Prospero

I still think those are from a revived version of Prospero. This one is pretty deep in Valve history.

 

[StuBurns]

The reason why CS:GO isn't Counter Strike 2 is very specific.

That was a poor reason he gave. In the same interview he was preaching about why Dota 2 is obviously the sequel to DotA.

Those games are in a very similar situation I think, in terms of how they relate to their previous iterations I mean.

 

[Sibylus]

It's in reference to this video. Apparently Gabe has seen it.

Now that is a stretch, barring a clarification stating that he was referring to the video. There's been joke references amongst the community now and again with regard to Ricochet 2 over the years, but nothing to warrant him responding in the way he did. This was some next tier wink-wink-nudge-nudging going on.

 

[Visualante2]

That was a poor reason he gave. In the same interview he was preaching about why Dota 2 is obviously the sequel to DotA.

Those games are in a very similar situation I think, in terms of how they relate to their previous iterations I mean.

Well I don't think I was referencing that interview because Dota 2 wasn't announced back then. But when I made the post I was like.. yeah but that doesn't explain Dota 2...

 

[I H8 Memes]

Fixed.

You sure do love trolling Half-Life threads.

 

[StuBurns]

Well I don't think I was referencing that interview because Dota 2 wasn't announced back then. But when I made the post I was like.. yeah but that doesn't explain Dota 2...

There was an interview at some European event recently (in fact, maybe it was when they first showed Dota 2, so not that recently) where he talked about why Dota 2 is the sequel to DotA, and why CS:GO wasn't the sequel to CS.

I think the real reason is they don't intend to support CS:GO like Dota 2 or TF2. It'll just remain what it is forever more or less. Dota 2 will change radically over the next few years I'm sure.

 

[JaseC]

I think they are afraid. Yes that's an odd thing to say about valve and their major IP but look at what people are expecting from the title after so long.

Source 2.0: We all sorta want this and assume it has to be in the works but so far there's been no evidence of valve moving to a newer engine. I'm sure in interviews over the past 12 - 18 months they stated there was no development on a new source engine.

There won't be a Source 2 insofar that a new engine will be built from scratch, but they are overhauling Source. All we know of their plans so far is that the content creation tools will be improved (even internally, people consider the current toolset a pain to use -- this likely lead to the creation of Portal 2's SLE) and fundamental aspects of the engine will be bettered (for instance, we know they're working on data streaming). Gabe's also said that their plans for Source will split the code base, meaning that we'll have Source 2007 and its ilk (Half-Life 2 -> Portal 2) as well as what is bound to be "Source 2.0" in everything but name (in other words, don't expect Half-Life 2 to receive a belated data steaming patch). Of course, we don't know when we'll see this, but debuting it with Half-Life 3 makes the most sense.

 

[JaseC]

At first I thought, "Oh, cool, somebody else noticed", but then I realised he aped my thread and forgot to remove the Aussie sub-domain from the GameSpot URL.