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Skyward Sword has the most to gain from a potential remaster
- Thread starter Astral/H3X
- Start date
I was thinking the exact same thing recently.
Skyward Sword is a game I really wanted to like. I thought the motion controls were really cool, they had FINALLY made what we all wanted when the Wii Remote was initially unveiled. But the rest of the game was so... ugh...
Breath of the Wild has proven that Nintendo has realized how shitty the handholding was in Skyward Sword, and that they learned from those mistakes since then. A remaster of that game would be a perfect occasion to fix all that shit.
And yes, they need to keep the motion controls, as Skyward Sword wouldn't be Skyward Sword without them. Motion control haters gonna hate (no, it's not "waggle" you fucking idiots).
Skyward Sword is a game I really wanted to like. I thought the motion controls were really cool, they had FINALLY made what we all wanted when the Wii Remote was initially unveiled. But the rest of the game was so... ugh...
Breath of the Wild has proven that Nintendo has realized how shitty the handholding was in Skyward Sword, and that they learned from those mistakes since then. A remaster of that game would be a perfect occasion to fix all that shit.
And yes, they need to keep the motion controls, as Skyward Sword wouldn't be Skyward Sword without them. Motion control haters gonna hate (no, it's not "waggle" you fucking idiots).
Vital Tundra
Member
How about fixing the fact that the game doesn't respect the player at all? Hey I know you were in this area before, but you need an item from it that you passed by before but weren't able to get because you weren't told to yet. The game has so much back and forth between the exact same areas. Its the reason why its one of the only Zeldas I have yet to replay, it and the DS games, because they are trash too.
whyreggielie
Member
Skyward Sword is actually up there amongst my favorite games but even I acknowledge that this game has enough filler to make me not want to play it again. If they just removed the damn swimming notes portion then I would certainly reconsider. Oh and cut out a demise fight, wtf is with the demise fights.
EDIT: The motion controls is one of the best things about this game and it made the combat so damn fun. Screw you guys calling it waggle, that was Twilight Princess.
EDIT: The motion controls is one of the best things about this game and it made the combat so damn fun. Screw you guys calling it waggle, that was Twilight Princess.
While SS would definitely benefit from most of those changes (especially Fi), I think the motion controls were the least of it's problems. SS represented the series building up a critical mass of bad aspects over the years. It was the most linear and closed-feeling Zelda. All the areas felt like corridors to get to the next place. Some areas were open, like the sand sea was awesome. The area leading up there in Lanayru was such a claustrophobic corridor though. The empty sky was also a major problem, and world felt so disjointed, because there were loading screens between the sky and ground, and even between the sky and Skyloft.
A remaster of SS would still be great, but it still won't address the game's most critical flaws. It is still a good game, but definitely lower in Zelda games for me.
A remaster of SS would still be great, but it still won't address the game's most critical flaws. It is still a good game, but definitely lower in Zelda games for me.
The IR pointer is on the bottom of the right Joycon. Although all the pointer stuff in SS was gyro based and not IR.
"waggle" is what close-minded people use to dismiss all motion controls. It's usually better to just ignore them whenever they use that term.
KojiKnight
Member
This is a fight you can't win... Many have already tried. Too many people associate motion controls with Waggle even if Waggle has nothing to do with proper motion controls.
Jonneh3003
Banned
The IR on the bottom on the right joy-con isn't for pointing though, it's just to detect shapes in a proximity of a few inches.
KojiKnight
Member
#2: It's been confirmed that the Joycon are much more precise than the Motion Plus, and even the Motion Plus was at least partially held back by the system it was on. Motion games on the Wii U were a LOT more precise (Nintendo Land still being my go-to example)
I'm skeptical of this because of how much better the Pro Controller works as a gyrometer than the JoyCons in Breath of the Wild.
I'd rather have a OoT/MM 3D port on the Switch, a shame those great remakes are stuck on the horrible 3DS Screen.
Motion controls really are a key aspect of Skyward Sword, removing them would make the game really bland. Not sure how well those can be implemented with the joy-cons on Switch.
I don't know what small changes they could make to make the game significantly better.
All of the problems are quiet major, like the empty (sky) overworld, fighting Ghirahim and "The Imprisoned" 3 times or the silent realms.
I guess you could trim Fi's dialogue with little effort.
From a graphics and performance perspective I think it still looks fine on Wii/Wii U aswell.
Motion controls really are a key aspect of Skyward Sword, removing them would make the game really bland. Not sure how well those can be implemented with the joy-cons on Switch.
I don't know what small changes they could make to make the game significantly better.
All of the problems are quiet major, like the empty (sky) overworld, fighting Ghirahim and "The Imprisoned" 3 times or the silent realms.
I guess you could trim Fi's dialogue with little effort.
From a graphics and performance perspective I think it still looks fine on Wii/Wii U aswell.
If you want to take an old Zelda and develop it based on the completely new BotW template, you're wasting resources, because you're developing a completely new game already, with about nothing gained from trying to recreate the old game.
That effort is much better spend on either developing a completely new game or remaking an old one with as little changes as possible and as much as needed. The former gives you, well, a completely new game to sell. The latter gives you revenue with comparatively small effort.
+1 for that! Should be doable with relatively little effort for Nintendo, should bring in nostalgia revenue and any major dev effort can go towards giving us a brand new Zelda instead of being wasted trying to recreate an old game.
Has such a recreation of an old game actually been done more often? I can only remember the original Goldeneye being completely remade to the contemporary CoD template on the Wii and later the PS360.
Edit: I wouldn't mind an HD-make of Skyward Sword on the Switch. Do away with the infurating "you just collected a bug" messages, all the unnecessary infuriating Fi talk, render in FullHD, bonus points for 60fps and done. The Switch's Joycons clearly have all the required capabilities.
brandonh83
Banned
I don't remember having a problem climbing a mountain in Skyward...
anyway I want this so bad.
Those 3 zones were huge and densely packed. And there was more than those "zones." Skyward was a pretty big game when you combine it all. Also the Tadtones part is like 4-5 minutes long and super easy.
I just don't get some of the complaints leveled at this game. I can understand maybe not enjoying the Tadtones part but it's such a miniscule percentage of the game.
Maybe I just have more patience, I dunno. Only thing I didn't care for were the Imprisoned fights.
anyway I want this so bad.
Those 3 zones were huge and densely packed. And there was more than those "zones." Skyward was a pretty big game when you combine it all. Also the Tadtones part is like 4-5 minutes long and super easy.
I just don't get some of the complaints leveled at this game. I can understand maybe not enjoying the Tadtones part but it's such a miniscule percentage of the game.
Maybe I just have more patience, I dunno. Only thing I didn't care for were the Imprisoned fights.
It's true.
People who don't know the difference between waggle and motion controls are likely too dumb to be able to read any explanations given to them.
brandonh83
Banned
One of my friends complained about having to "waggle" and couldn't play the game. One day I got him to show me what the problem was that he was having and before I showed him how to actually do it... oh man.
I guess a secret that not many seem to get is that the controls took very little motion. There's a difference between a small wrist flick and... well, what I've seen.
Deputy Moonman
Member
While some of the controls were wonky in Skyward Sword, and Fi constantly making noise was definitely annoying, my biggest issue with the game was the world itself. Which was very barren. And that's coming from someone whose 2nd favorite zelda game all-time is Twilight Princess. It's like Wind Waker, but take away the ocean and replace it with air... Instead of riding a boat, you fly on a goofy bird. Instead of finding secrets, you have various floating islands everywhere that you know in advance that you'll end up at eventually to find a heart or something marginally useful later in the game. Then you go to the specific regions/zones and they are largely short linear paths, which to me is completely anti-zelda. I was largely uninspired traversing the world in skyward sword. Traversing the world is half of a zelda game and skyward swords was straight up boring imo. Then you have dungeons, which are my favorite part of zelda games. While skyward sword dungeons aren't bad, most are non-memorable. When considering doing a remaster of Skyward Sword, I just don't see the point. The game isn't old enough to justify the gains that would be had from remaking it. I'm in agreement with those that think a remaster of Majora's Mask would be far more beneficial and I'm not even a big fan of Majora 's Mask.
I've been wanting a remaster of Skyward Sword, the game would look great in HD.
With a little streamlining like WWHD and TPHD the game would play great.
I think those wishing for a non-motion control version happening are going to be disappointed. They would have to change a lot, seems hard to justify that much work for a remaster.
With a little streamlining like WWHD and TPHD the game would play great.
I think those wishing for a non-motion control version happening are going to be disappointed. They would have to change a lot, seems hard to justify that much work for a remaster.
WrenchNinja
Member
Which puzzle is this? Changing the surface automatically to day sounds fine to me. I just find it really annoying that you can be the this chosen hero but can't possibly fly at night while these other skyloft knights can
I know the game at least has night variations for the lumpy pumpkin and beedle's island. I'm not sure if the game loads up a new version of the area with a night backdrop or if the whole sky really is displaying the night. Either way, this more of want more than anything else.
brandonh83
Banned
The sky isn't "the world." It's there to provide a quick way to get between the zones. And it does have some stuff in it. Skyloft is pretty dense and full of secrets, you have the Thunderhead place, Pumpkin Landing, the bug island, and other small islands with treasure. Riding the bird for a minute or two to get somewhere sure beat sailing for what felt like an eternity, for me at least. Getting around in Skyward was much quicker and more efficient to me and that's the main purpose behind the sky and bird travel.
But you're not supposed to consider that some "overworld" because it's not. Just like with Hyrule Field in Ocarina (which was mostly a big empty circle with a few grottos and Lon Lon Ranch by the way) it's a central hub area that connects all the points. In fact if you look at the sub-areas of Ocarina like the woods or Death Mountain, they're pretty linear. Look at the path to Zora's Domain or up Death Mountain. Linear. Not really more open than Skyward.
The zones in Skyward had a lot to them, a lot to find, a lot to see, were populated with denizens and dungeons to find. They're also very well designed and for me that beats HUGE GIANT OPEN WORLD to be honest. While playing BOTW, I'm impressed by the size of the world, but I actually had more fun with the smaller focused places like the mazes and things like that because I felt like those had actual level design.
And most of Skyward Sword's zones feel very focused in design; I don't think that because they're "linear" means that they're empty or barren or whatever. They had plenty to them.
Really the bomb stuff are the only controls that I can see why people don't love. That and maybe swimming. Everything else works fine and is super easy.
Alex_Mexico
Member
OP don't forget about the excessive backtracking, and the fucking Imprisioned that artificially pads the game to be longer than it should!
Oh and we can also make do without Link having to stop every time you grab a a different collectible in each new play session (meaning that the next time you'd turn the game on Link would stop and show when you get that same collectible again!)
Oh and we can also make do without Link having to stop every time you grab a a different collectible in each new play session (meaning that the next time you'd turn the game on Link would stop and show when you get that same collectible again!)
Alex_Mexico
Member
Just maybe? Swimming suuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuucks with SS' motion controls! Having to collect those godforsake tadtones underwater while trying to aim Link with the gyro sensors was a pain! I'd keep missing one and having to turn around to try again only to miss the thing again is not my definition of fun at all!
capylikesgames
Banned
You know, it's funny, b/c this is not the first time gyro implementation has been messed up like this. Valve similarly cranks up a smoothing setting by default for their Steam Controller that eats up movement. It's probably the reason why most ppl feel gyro can't match a mouse. However, it hurts the trackpad even more. Many people have tried it and just assume it's unresponsive, when it's actually just being filtered to an impractical level.
Learning that Skyward Sword uses it actually makes a lot of sense. It probably affects actual swordplay, too. In contrast to Nintendo Land, which allows gyro input to come in raw for the Zelda mini-game, and ends up feeling snappy, SS's implementation feels a bit delayed. I'd definitely love to see a Skyward Sword re-release that at least addresses that, because response issues aside, I really enjoyed my time with that game.
NOLA_Gaffer
Banned
As I said in the gryo aiming thread, the general public views motion controls as an overall bad thing, even with they're accurate and put to good use as they are in Skyward Sword. They're still viewed as "waggle" even though they're anything but.
FaintDeftone
Junior Member
Can we get rid of at least one of those Imprisoned fights too? After the third time I'm like "ah god not again."
MaverickHunterX
Member
If I can add to the OP:
1. Make motion controls optional. I don't care if the game has to be reworked. The sooner they do that, the faster it can be preserved for later generations (like how I'm guessing that Wind Waker/Twlight Princess HD will be the standard for those games from now on)
2. Make an option to turn on/off the hint system, so it doesn't annoy.
3. Fix the save system. Make it more convenient
4. Add some Amiibo support. I know people hate the, but I'd love to see some Skyward Sword figures in the future.
5. And better graphics, of course!
I know this sounds like heresy, but I really did love the story of the game despite the somewhat-crummy controls. The Link and Zelda presented here are amongst my favorites, maybe rivaled by Toon Link and
Just because of stuff like this. It broke my heart to see Link
Come on, Ninty! Those kids deserve a way better port to have their story told!
1. Make motion controls optional. I don't care if the game has to be reworked. The sooner they do that, the faster it can be preserved for later generations (like how I'm guessing that Wind Waker/Twlight Princess HD will be the standard for those games from now on)
2. Make an option to turn on/off the hint system, so it doesn't annoy.
3. Fix the save system. Make it more convenient
4. Add some Amiibo support. I know people hate the, but I'd love to see some Skyward Sword figures in the future.
5. And better graphics, of course!
I know this sounds like heresy, but I really did love the story of the game despite the somewhat-crummy controls. The Link and Zelda presented here are amongst my favorites, maybe rivaled by Toon Link and
Tetra
"I'm still your Zelda"
The best cutscene in Zelda history and the most memorable quote of the entire series. I need that cutscene in beautiful HD. They really nailed their portrayal of Zelda in this game. I was so moved by that moment.
Just because of stuff like this. It broke my heart to see Link
bust his ass to make it through dungeons to catch up with Zelda, only to be told by Impa that he's a second too late, and have her bust his balls over it. You could see the pain and overall feeling in such scenes.
Come on, Ninty! Those kids deserve a way better port to have their story told!
Astral/H3X
Member
Gyro is weird in the sense that if it's done right, it seems dead fucking simple not only in how it works but also how to use it (well), yet for some reason people have a lot of difficulty both programming it correctly as well as understanding it.
Like, the best gyro, is the gyro that just treats it like a mouse more or less. None of this smoothing crap -- you know what your hands are doing, you can compensate for the natural wiggle of your hands just fine, stop trying to smooth it so much!
Orniletter
Banned
And yet it's still the best 3D Zelda (or just about tied with OoT) before Breath of the Wild came out.
there is no waggle on SS
First reply is spot on.
I stopped playing Skyward Sword right after the intro part due to the controls. I haven't dug too much into Breath of the Wild yet (schedule conflicts, no large chunks of time available) but would welcome a switch remaster of Skyward Sword for when I do have time!
I stopped playing Skyward Sword right after the intro part due to the controls. I haven't dug too much into Breath of the Wild yet (schedule conflicts, no large chunks of time available) but would welcome a switch remaster of Skyward Sword for when I do have time!
efyu_lemonardo
May I have a cookie?
Yeah, screw these stupid hands of mine!
Why can't I drink coffee by pressing a button!?
SkywardBeam
Member
Yeah,remove the motion-based swimming controls and I definitely won't buy this game, as good as all the other overhauls might be. It was an absolutely fantastic experience, I never enjoyed underwater sequences as much in SkyS. Also the tadtone trial was just pure fun, I never got the hate for this section. The atmosphere in the flooded Faron woods was extremely nice, the music was ace and swimming just felt natural for me. If anything is bad, it's the traditional swimming controls in Zelda which make you constantly press a button to swim faster. I loathed swimming through Lake Hylia in TP because it felt so slow and monotonous. Felt more like work than playing.
Also what's the problem people have with dowsing? You do know that you don't have to actually use it, don't you? As soon as Fi adds a new dowsing target, you can just switch back to the standard first-person view (the eye symbol) and then you're good. No beeping and all. You can easily find the key fragments and the other stuff without it.
Also LOL at people suggesting to substitute to motion control with the right stick. The whole gameplay is designed about the motion controls, it just wouldn't work with traditional controls. Have you ever even played a game where you control your melee weapons with a stick? That shit is atrocious. Alone in The Dark for PS3/360 instantly comes to mind *shudder*
One aspect that really needs to be tweaked for a potential Remaster is the text speed in this game, I swear that's slow as molasses. Especially when you have to go through the same dialog for the umpteenth time (bazaar, mini-games). Also they seriously need to cut the exposition the mini-game characters give after the first time. And give us an immediate retry option after failing, going through the same sequence on Fun Fun Island ten times in a row is infuriating. It's like the developers are purposely mocking you.
Also what's the problem people have with dowsing? You do know that you don't have to actually use it, don't you? As soon as Fi adds a new dowsing target, you can just switch back to the standard first-person view (the eye symbol) and then you're good. No beeping and all. You can easily find the key fragments and the other stuff without it.
Also LOL at people suggesting to substitute to motion control with the right stick. The whole gameplay is designed about the motion controls, it just wouldn't work with traditional controls. Have you ever even played a game where you control your melee weapons with a stick? That shit is atrocious. Alone in The Dark for PS3/360 instantly comes to mind *shudder*
One aspect that really needs to be tweaked for a potential Remaster is the text speed in this game, I swear that's slow as molasses. Especially when you have to go through the same dialog for the umpteenth time (bazaar, mini-games). Also they seriously need to cut the exposition the mini-game characters give after the first time. And give us an immediate retry option after failing, going through the same sequence on Fun Fun Island ten times in a row is infuriating. It's like the developers are purposely mocking you.
brandonh83
Banned
I didn't find it hard at all. Took a brief adjustment.
I would only ever consider buying this as a Switch remaster if they removed all of the motion control gameplay. Or at least game the option for traditional controls.
The pacing was also god-awful. I thought I was at the end of the game, but nope, now go fetch music notes for no real reason. It added a bunch of boring, tedious busy work just to increase play length. If they cut that part out, I think the game would be much better.
The pacing was also god-awful. I thought I was at the end of the game, but nope, now go fetch music notes for no real reason. It added a bunch of boring, tedious busy work just to increase play length. If they cut that part out, I think the game would be much better.
Why press a button to do anything?
The controls stay calibrated as long as you don't move out of the sensor bar area. Then you press a button and it immediately fixes. Easy. They can improve it next time, but removing the motion controls is removing the identity of SS, and calling it "shit" is just plain exaggeration unless you are utterly incapable of playing in a relaxed, normal posture in front of your tv.
"Not working ONE time is horrible" is a Hyperbole sandwich I won't eat. The controls are not shit. The worked great for me sitting in a normal posture on the couch in front of my TV playing like a normal person.
OP also needs to add "make text scroll super fast like in TP"
SS's text scrolls so slowly that it makes replays a nightmare. it's baffling they already had the perfect text solution in the previous game but ditched it for no reason.
they also need to let you skip cutscenes on both difficulties. it's annoying only Hero Mode gets the privilege.
SS's text scrolls so slowly that it makes replays a nightmare. it's baffling they already had the perfect text solution in the previous game but ditched it for no reason.
they also need to let you skip cutscenes on both difficulties. it's annoying only Hero Mode gets the privilege.
Make a control sheme to please motion control dislikers.
Keep the motion control in for the people that liked it just let the people choose their control sheme before starting a new game and let them be able to change it in the options menu.
A fix i can see working:
Let one of the joysticks be able to replicate in wich way to slash. Like Metal Gear Rising's Cut mode. This needs to be done in a very good way otherwise it would not be worth using at all. It should be responsive and fast and easy to do.
But then we have a problem how to control the camera.... Maybe just make Link hit in the right way automaticly but that would also make the game way too easy....unless just let the camera auto focus in combat and outside of it you can use the joystick as a camera button again. The directions you press with the joystick will immediatly cause a slash ofcourse to keep it smooth and easy to do only need to press the generic attack button to take your weapon out to switch to combat mode.
I think this would work and make it possible to keep both motion control in and a controller (without motion) only control option.
All other motion required things can be added as gyro/joystick control.
This way they can also port it forever when motion control dies in the future for example.
Keep the motion control in for the people that liked it just let the people choose their control sheme before starting a new game and let them be able to change it in the options menu.
A fix i can see working:
Let one of the joysticks be able to replicate in wich way to slash. Like Metal Gear Rising's Cut mode. This needs to be done in a very good way otherwise it would not be worth using at all. It should be responsive and fast and easy to do.
But then we have a problem how to control the camera.... Maybe just make Link hit in the right way automaticly but that would also make the game way too easy....unless just let the camera auto focus in combat and outside of it you can use the joystick as a camera button again. The directions you press with the joystick will immediatly cause a slash ofcourse to keep it smooth and easy to do only need to press the generic attack button to take your weapon out to switch to combat mode.
I think this would work and make it possible to keep both motion control in and a controller (without motion) only control option.
All other motion required things can be added as gyro/joystick control.
This way they can also port it forever when motion control dies in the future for example.
I'd be in for a remaster without a doubt. I know they can't do anything about revamping the controls (though at this point I don't mind most of the motion controls in SS, they'd just need to get rid of motion flying and motion swimming), and adding a second controller based controls cheme is probably too complicated.
But this game NEEDS to be in HD. It's so gorgeous, and the story and characters are too good not to, not fter WW and TP got remasters. I'd be there day 1, buying it with whatever amiibo they inevitably release alongside it. Even with just a few minor fixes I'd be all about playing it again.
But this game NEEDS to be in HD. It's so gorgeous, and the story and characters are too good not to, not fter WW and TP got remasters. I'd be there day 1, buying it with whatever amiibo they inevitably release alongside it. Even with just a few minor fixes I'd be all about playing it again.