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[mclem]

I wonder how far this thing scrolls left and right? There are at least 44 challenges if the scrolling is only to make the ones that are slightly cut off full when you select them, however I think that there are a fair number more.

At the risk of overanalysing:

We see the right edge clearly on the third shot (the Frozen Hillside one); it's 3 blocks right from the 3-block chunk of frozen hillside and the two unlockables on either side.

On the final screenshot, we can see the Frozen Hillside chunk again, but this time it's scrolled off to the right, with 7 windows to the left of it.

At the very least, each row has 7 (final screenshot) + 3 (Frozen Hillside chunk) + 3 (third screenshot) = 13 windows, so at least 52 windows total.

 

[psycho_snake]

I like todays update. Its useful to have something like this that lets you know what you need to do to unlock something.

 

[thestopsign]

I wouldn't say that. In fact, part of the appeal to Jungle Beat to me was that the controller used for it was so bloody simple that you felt like a true arcade experience. Seriously; Left, Right, Jump and clap. It was beautiful and you could do so much in the game with it. Plus the enemy-pummeling bits were more satisfying on the two bongos since it felt like you were beating the shit out of that fluffy upturned pig thing with your own hands.

Unfortunately what failed the game, though, was the fact that the DK Bongos really weren't popular at all. From my understanding both of the Donkey Konga games failed in the States, and Jungle Beat failed miserably on a sales perspective because of it.

Whatever the case with Jungle Beat is, I'm glad it existed. Not only because it's an excellent game, but because it paved the way for a talented team to give us one of the best Mario games we've had in many, many years.

Nah, the first Donkey Konga game did almost a million world-wide, including a good 400k in the US. I think the game wasn't successful commercially because everyone at the time just assumed the the controls would suck, or were just plain out gimmicky or unnecessary.

 

[Teasel]

But wait, there's more:

"i'll pick character for 1000$"
err anyway did we already have the usual crazy group that identifies every trophy? i'm especial curious about the man looking one near birdo

golden hammer also sounds kinda useless... i'm pretty sure that if it isn't easy to get (say domokun in melee for example) you can't use an hammer

also yesterday i realized something... olimar B+Neutral special moves is to pluck pikmin out right? that means if kirby sucks him out he should gain that ability too but kirby can't do anything with those pikmin so do you guys think you won't get any power by sucking olimar or are they gonna change some rule just for this one?

 

[HotGarbage]

But wait, there's more:

oh lol, these are great

 

[Danthrax]

"i'll pick character for 1000$"
err anyway did we already have the usual crazy group that identifies every trophy? i'm especial curious about the man looking one near birdo

golden hammer also sounds kinda useless... i'm pretty sure that if it isn't easy to get (say domokun in melee for example) you can't use an hammer

also yesterday i realized something... olimar B+Neutral special moves is to pluck pikmin out right? that means if kirby sucks him out he should gain that ability too but kirby can't do anything with those pikmin so do you guys think you won't get any power by sucking olimar or are they gonna change some rule just for this one?

Maybe Kirby actually starts swinging Pikmin around with his normal attacks as if they're items once he's plucked them out of the ground. Dedede, too, since I think his Neutral+B sucks people in as well.

 

[Plinko]

"Keep it or put it back?"

I never thought I'd see the day when there was a Punchboard/Punch-a-Bunch reference on GAF, but here it is.

I love you guys.

 

[swerve]

Yeah, the same goes for Mario. They could have had SMG at launch if they didn't work on some throwaway game like DK: JB.

My point is, they could have outsourced Kirby to some other developer and have their A-teams work on the stuff that actually matters.

I'd hate to work for any game developer you ran...

'Oh! This game wasn't a massive success, nothing good could *POSSIBLY* have come from its development! Quick, divert all our resources to the sequel to Sunshine... '

This particular A-team was schooled on Jungle Beat. Not only making a truly amazing game (my personal favourite platform game, and I believe the best designed, since Yoshi's Island) but also building a company structure, a way to work remotely with Nintendo Kyoto, and find their strengths. And give a Nintendo icon a new identity and give thousands of people the best platformer they'd played in years.

*So* much of the brilliance of Galaxy was born in Jungle Beat, and Nintendo as a company is no doubt perfectly aware of this. There are benefits other than just financial, and Nintendo is one of the lucky companies able to consider things worthwhile even if they aren't mega-hits.

 

[crowphoenix]

To be quite honest, DK:JB was one of the best 2D platforming experiances I've ever had. The point system in that game was amazing, rewarding you like crazy wiuth points for mastering the levels and awesome controls. Plus, there was been no game that has created as cool a set of boss fights. I'm glad it was made, and had it never been made, I'd probably be an angrier person today.

Also, this update is awesome. I love having an idea of what I need to do, and if they make some of the tasks strange stuff that one would not normally do, then it's even better.

 

[Tonjevic]

Dedede, too, since I think his Neutral+B sucks people in as well.

He sucks people up, but I don't think he copies their moves.

 

[SuperAngelo64]

I meant if they started development right after SSBM came out, rather than waste money on garbage like Kirby Air Ride, and just going on fricken hiatus FOR NO APPARENT REASON til Fall 2005.

"It was tough for me to see that every time I made a new game, people automatically assumed that a sequel was coming. Even if it's a sequel, lots of people have to give their all to make a game, but some people think the sequel process happens naturally."

-Masahiro Sakurai on "Why he quit HAL", 2003

Spoiler

u maek sakurai am cry

 

[Danthrax]

He sucks people up, but I don't think he copies their moves.

That's weird. So he just sucks people up and shoots them back out?

 

[Gekkonidae]

Wow, talk about having to catch 'em all.

 

[Cynar]

That's weird. So he just sucks people up and shoots them back out?

Yes, that's what DeDeDe does.

 

[Somnid]

This is such a nice touch. It keeps things hidden but still lets you know what you should be doing, eliminating the need for GameFAQs. Clearly, one of the dividing lines between a good game and a great game.

 

[Holy Order Sol]

That's weird. So he just sucks people up and shoots them back out?

Well, that's what he does in the original games.

 

[SuperAngelo64]

It's said that DeDeDe's suction in his neutral-B is much more powerful than Kirby's.

It's main purpose is to draw enemies close to you/set them up for a combo after spitting out than anything else.

 

[_Alkaline_]

But wait, there's more:

:lol :lol

 

[SuperAngelo64]

Ok, I just read what Alex Trebek is saying in that picture.

I think I woke up a few people with my lol'ing.

 

[Akinola]

This update is reminiscent of the unlocking mode of Kirby Air Ride. You'd be able to see what you have to do to unlock different stuff. It was pretty cool. Glad to see that it was brought back.

I'm probably beaten by a few posts, but it's allll good.

 

[MakMan]

So, any word yet on the European release? Any hints?

 

[SuperAngelo64]

So, any word yet on the European release? Any hints?

Grab a beer and a chair, you might wanna be sitting down for this one...

Spoiler

Actually, I'm just fuckin' with ya, I don't really know.

 

[Shig]

Yeah, the same goes for Mario. They could have had SMG at launch if they didn't work on some throwaway game like DK: JB.

DK: JB is one of the best 2D platformers ever. You go to hell. You go to hell and you die.

I played it, actually, and I liked it. But it was a short little game

Uh, no it wasn't. Unlocking all 18 worlds takes quite a while unless you're getting platinums on your first try.

Admittedly, JB didn't explain itself very well... it's easy to play through a lot of it as a "get to the end of the level" platformer, and in that respect, I can see where one might find it lacking. But it's really a score-based game; if you're not trying to perpetually chain your beat counter, you're not playing it right.

 

[Wii-za]

I predict +500 windows...there you go.

Spoiler

As a matter of fact, I think 501 is gonna be the final numer.

 

[Vlad]

DK: JB is one of the best 2D platformers ever. You go to hell. You go to hell and you die.

Uh, no it wasn't. Unlocking all 18 worlds takes quite a while unless you're getting platinums on your first try.

Admittedly, JB didn't explain itself very well... it's easy to play through a lot of it as a "get to the end of the level" platformer, and in that respect, I can see where one might find it lacking. But it's really a score-based game; if you're not trying to perpetually chain your beat counter, you're not playing it right.

I thought it explained itself just enough, myself. Sure, there wasn't a tutorial that you went through in the beginning that explained everything outright, but the little videos you got here and there that suggested you try different things was enough to guide any experimentation you were going to do in the right direction.

I'd say the only bad thing about the game is the somewhat iffy clap detection, although that could be a hardware issue for all I know.

 

[Manabanana]

That's weird. So he just sucks people up and shoots them back out?

Or sucks people up and kills himself. Oh, you wanna guard the ledge?

 

[ShockingAlberto]

I meant if they started development right after SSBM came out, rather than waste money on garbage like Kirby Air Ride, and just going on fricken hiatus FOR NO APPARENT REASON til Fall 2005.

...they wanted to make a sequel, Sakurai's said this many times. He just wasn't on board with one. When Iwata took over, an Online Melee was on his agenda, but he wanted time to get Sakurai to come back and make the next game.

They don't pump out Smash Bros. games because only one man can make them competently and he doesn't want to make the same game over and over. It would shock me if there was a sequel to Brawl, actually.

Yeah, the same goes for Mario. They could have had SMG at launch if they didn't work on some throwaway game like DK: JB.

Oh, you're an idiot. That explains things.

Game development does not just "happen". Without the experience from making a platformer for the Gamecube, do you really think Tokyo EAD would have caught the next Mario project? Really? More to the point, without said development experience from a team that has admitted that they didn't know how to do big games and wanted to make something small for the GBA or DS before they made Jungle Beat, do you really think Galaxy would even be as good? Talent only takes you so far.

But you're in pretty hardcore denial, anyway, so I doubt this phases you.

 

[Keru_Shiri]

But wait, there's more:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v382/RagnarokX/jeo3.jpg

:lol :lol

Masterfully done!

When games have an unlockable difficulty level or fighting games have unlockable characters, are those called "achievements" too?

This is nothing like an achievements system.

I don't know about the rest of the thread, but I brought up the achievements comparison as a joke.

 

[Shikamaru Ninja]

They don't pump out Smash Bros. games because only one man can make them competently and he doesn't want to make the same game over and over.

That is 1000% false. If different people can develop Super Mario and Zelda and Metroid within Nintendo, even more can develop a game like Smash Bros. Infact, the game does have a relevant assistant director and designers carrying on from the original.

It would shock me if there was a sequel to Brawl, actually.

Uhmm that is insane. There will be sequels.

Game development does not just "happen". Without the experience from making a platformer for the Gamecube, do you really think Tokyo EAD would have caught the next Mario project? Really? More to the point, without said development experience from a team that has admitted that they didn't know how to do big games and wanted to make something small for the GBA or DS before they made Jungle Beat, do you really think Galaxy would even be as good? Talent only takes you so far.

They developed Super Mario Sunshine as a team. Individually, over a decade worth of experience. I think Koizumi originally wanted to work on something quirky non-ip related that his team could get crazy with and develop more freely. As opposed to the pressure of creating a Mario game that would make use of the Wii hardware and controller.

 

[Iam Canadian]

I think that Donkey Kong Jungle Beat is one of GAF's most overrated games (and I'm a platforming fanatic), but suggesting that it shouldn't have been made is just plain ludicrous. It's a good game and took nothing away from Galaxy. If anything, it gave the Galaxy team experience that helped to make Galaxy the masterpiece it was. Instead of developing an endless chain of sequels, developers should pursue other avenues as well.

 

[ShockingAlberto]

That is 1000% false. If different people can develop Super Mario and Zelda and Metroid within Nintendo, even more can develop a game like Smash Bros. Infact, the game does have a relevant assistant director and designers carrying on from the original.

Other people can make the game, in the same sense that anyone can make a sequel to a movie that they did not originally make. It is certainly not advisable, though.

Uhmm that is insane. There will be sequels.

I am sure there will be a dumbed down DS game and maybe some attempt to spin the series off, but I really don't consider any Smash game not made by Sakurai to be a sequel.

They developed Super Mario Sunshine as a team. Individually, over a decade worth of experience. I think Koizumi originally wanted to work on something quirky non-ip related that his team could get crazy with and develop more freely. As opposed to the pressure of creating a Mario game that would make use of the Wii hardware and controller.

I am unsure how this conflicts with what I said.

 

[Tathanen]

Other people can make the game, in the same sense that anyone can make a sequel to a movie that they did not originally make. It is certainly not advisable, though.

Now this is just silly.

The point is that people give Sakurai WAY too much credit. Sure, I'm sure he's doing a bang-up job directing the game, but it's not like everyone else in the team is just blindly doing what he says. It is a TEAM EFFORT, after all. I would not be at all surprised if they contract the same team for an eventual Brawl sequel, as the philosophies behind the franchise would be well-baked into them at that point.

A Brawl sequel would not be contracted out to AlphaDream. It would still be developed internally with all the love Brawl received, just without Sakurai as the driving force behind it. After Brawl's development, we'll have three distinct versions of the series with a league of veterans left knowing what they're all about. Just as Eiji Aonuma took over Zelda quite successfully, and how Yoshiaki Koizumi is directing Marios now instead of Miyamoto, I have no worry that a future SSB game would manage just fine without Sakurai at the helm. Hell, I honestly think that Sakurai will end up creatively bankrupt after Brawl is done anyway, and it probably wouldn't hurt to get a new mind behind the wheel.

 

[Haly]

Now this is just silly.

The point is that people give Sakurai WAY too much credit. Sure, I'm sure he's doing a bang-up job directing the game, but it's not like everyone else in the team is just blindly doing what he says. It is a TEAM EFFORT, after all. I would not be at all surprised if they contract the same team for an eventual Brawl sequel, as the philosophies behind the franchise would be well-baked into them at that point.

A Brawl sequel would not be contracted out to AlphaDream. It would still be developed internally with all the love Brawl received, just without Sakurai as the driving force behind it. After Brawl's development, we'll have three distinct versions of the series with a league of veterans left knowing what they're all about. Just as Eiji Aonuma took over Zelda quite successfully, and how Yoshiaki Koizumi is directing Marios now instead of Miyamoto, I have no worry that a future SSB game would manage just fine without Sakurai at the helm. Hell, I honestly think that Sakurai will end up creatively bankrupt after Brawl is done anyway, and it probably wouldn't hurt to get a new mind behind the wheel.

Well right now they're just pulling all the best elements from old kirby games. I don't think Sakurai will go into a slump after Brawl, though he probably will take a well deserved break from updating sites and lurking on Gaf.

 

[Gekkonidae]

I am sure there will be a dumbed down DS game and maybe some attempt to spin the series off, but I really don't consider any Smash game not made by Sakurai to be a sequel.

Twilight Princess wasn't made by Miyamoto. It's not a real Zelda game!

 

[Meta-Knight]

Awesome update. This is one part of Kirby Air Ride that I really liked. Good thing it's in brawl. Adds even more depth to the game.

 

[A Link to the Past]

Does this mean I no longer have to look up the roster when it's revealed, since I can find the solution to unlocking characters within Challenge mode?

 

[Iam Canadian]

Does this mean I no longer have to look up the roster when it's revealed, since I can find the solution to unlocking characters within Challenge mode?

You'll be given tasks, but you won't know what they unlock until you do them. At least, that's how I'm reading this update, anyway.

 

[SuperAngelo64]

Does this mean I no longer have to look up the roster when it's revealed, since I can find the solution to unlocking characters within Challenge mode?

Yeah, I was thinking this too actually.

I remember a few people said they were going to post the requirements for getting the characters without actually saying who the characters were for those who enjoys surprises.

I think now we may be able to cut out the middle-man.

 

[DDayton]

anyway without mentioning any specific character for fear of bannage,
who do you think the 3rd and 4th third party character will be?
capcom is a favorite

Wakka wakka wakka wakka wakka

 

[Iam Canadian]

Yeah, I was thinking this too actually.

I remember a few people said they were going to post the requirements for getting the characters without actually saying who the characters were for those who enjoys surprises.

I think now we may be able to cut out the middle-man.

Once again, Sakurai knows his audience.

 

[Fireblend]

Characters I'd like as third 3-party characters:

1. Klonoa
2. Banned
3. Bomberman

...in that order. Anything else I wouldn't be too excited about, specially if it's any realistic characters like Snake.

 

[SovanJedi]

anyway without mentioning any specific character for fear of bannage,
who do you think the 3rd and 4th third party character will be?
capcom is a favorite

Duff McWhalen.

 

[A Link to the Past]

You'll be given tasks, but you won't know what they unlock until you do them. At least, that's how I'm reading this update, anyway.

I don't mind stumbling looking for them.

Yeah, I was thinking this too actually.

I remember a few people said they were going to post the requirements for getting the characters without actually saying who the characters were for those who enjoys surprises.

I think now we may be able to cut out the middle-man.

Although, like Canadian said, we may not be able to find out how to get them right away, so one of those guys would be really helpful.

 

[SuperAngelo64]

Personally, I would like to be surprised by the hidden characters...

...except the third-party guys. I really want to know who those are asap.

 

[RoboPlato]

Third party wise I'm hoping for a Capcom rep (pulling for Ryu) and a Square-Enix rep that isn't a generic character like a Moogle or Black Mage, although that one is far less likely. If Konami is allowed another rep I'm really hoping for Simon Belmont.

 

[Holy Order Sol]

Damn, All Hail Shadow and His World grew on me. Now I want them in Brawl.

 

[Gekkonidae]

Third party wise I'm hoping for a Capcom rep (pulling for Ryu) and a Square-Enix rep that isn't a generic character like a Moogle or Black Mage, although that one is far less likely. If Konami is allowed another rep I'm really hoping for Simon Belmont.

If Street Fighter is represented I'd much rather it be Chun-Li.

 

[MrCheez]

I am still so PUMPED that Olimar is playable!

You know what I was thinking about today? Not only will Olimar be very unique to play... but also to play AGAINST. It's going to create very different strategies for everyone involved in a match that includes him!

 

[Oblivion]

But wait, there's more:

:lol :lol That's actually the first thing I thought when I saw it. Well done.

I'd hate to work for any game developer you ran...

'Oh! This game wasn't a massive success, nothing good could *POSSIBLY* have come from its development! Quick, divert all our resources to the sequel to Sunshine... '

This particular A-team was schooled on Jungle Beat. Not only making a truly amazing game (my personal favourite platform game, and I believe the best designed, since Yoshi's Island) but also building a company structure, a way to work remotely with Nintendo Kyoto, and find their strengths. And give a Nintendo icon a new identity and give thousands of people the best platformer they'd played in years.

*So* much of the brilliance of Galaxy was born in Jungle Beat, and Nintendo as a company is no doubt perfectly aware of this. There are benefits other than just financial, and Nintendo is one of the lucky companies able to consider things worthwhile even if they aren't mega-hits.

I'm talking about the business side of things here. So, although you may love it, it was still a relative bomb, that most would have realized coming a mile away.

"It was tough for me to see that every time I made a new game, people automatically assumed that a sequel was coming. Even if it's a sequel, lots of people have to give their all to make a game, but some people think the sequel process happens naturally."

-Masahiro Sakurai on "Why he quit HAL", 2003

Spoiler

u maek sakurai am cry

Again, that's understandable, but it doesn't explain why Nintendo didn't have someone else at least starting preliminary work on the sequel, if Sakurai wasn't there.

...they wanted to make a sequel, Sakurai's said this many times. He just wasn't on board with one. When Iwata took over, an Online Melee was on his agenda, but he wanted time to get Sakurai to come back and make the next game.

They don't pump out Smash Bros. games because only one man can make them competently and he doesn't want to make the same game over and over. It would shock me if there was a sequel to Brawl, actually.


Oh, you're an idiot. That explains things.

Now why'd you have to go with the name calling? And you was one of my favorite posters too.

I can understand if Iwata wanted Sakurai to be on board, but not doing jack shit til he came back really makes me wonder what the heck is going through their minds.

Also, you say they won't make any more sequels and then call ME an idiot? :lol

There will definitely be a sequel to Brawl. We may get it after 6 years most likely, especially if Nintendo follows the same route they did from Melee --> Brawl, but we'll definitely get it.

Game development does not just "happen". Without the experience from making a platformer for the Gamecube, do you really think Tokyo EAD would have caught the next Mario project? Really? More to the point, without said development experience from a team that has admitted that they didn't know how to do big games and wanted to make something small for the GBA or DS before they made Jungle Beat, do you really think Galaxy would even be as good? Talent only takes you so far.

But you're in pretty hardcore denial, anyway, so I doubt this phases you.

Er, let me get this straight. The fact that they were able to create a 2D Drum based platformer, was able to make them ready to tackle on a 3D platformer with a completely different mechanic? Interesting....

(also, I know there were 2D areas in SMG, so no need to bring that as a defense if you were thinking so)


What makes this even more aggravating is that people seem to like the fact that many of Nintendo's A teams experiment with other ideas and whatnot. That by itself might have been okay, but why the hell do some teams, such as the FE team always get to make FE games? Instead Nintendo lets them keep working on the same (relatively far less unpopular) series, instead of trying something new, when they're one of the teams that SHOULD be doing something new.

Also, as far as Sakurai's involvement next time, I imagine he'll probably get a big bonus for this, and Nintendo may fund whatever project he has planned at Sora, but they'll probably make him a producer for the sequel. So he can do both those things without investing too much time into the sequel.

 

[Jiggy]

I do agree that people who think this is the last Smash Bros. are probably kidding themselves. Now, granted, the next one may not be released until 2015, but I think it's safe to assume it's coming eventually.

I'm just hoping they don't pull an SMW --> NSMB where SSB4 doesn't show up until 2023 and is a step backward in many ways (while being a step forward in others).



On a happier note, we're exactly one day less than four weeks away from February 10th.