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[JasoNsider]

This is such nonsense.

If you make a product, yes, inevitably some people won't like it. That's normal. That's also completely different than the level of backlash NMS is seeing and therefore a completely disingenuous comparison.

What comparison? I've made no comparison.

My point is there is absolutely no winning for them right now, so I'd greatly consider the actions they are taking; less talk, work ahead on possible improvements, let people know when they are ready. And I'd argue that being in their position, many others would as well.

 

[orthodoxy1095]

What exactly is "such nonsense"? Your second paragraph doesn't actually pertain to anything he said, unless I'm completely misinterpreting.

Attributing blood lust to posters which I find absurd. If they had calmly addressed this within the first week, there wouldn't have been such a furor over the game. All they had to do was sit down for an hour and write a PR statement.

Every game has people with a "blood lust" hate, I get that. But they don't have this level of backlash, and just attributing the response to "you assholes would never calm down" is complete garbage.

What comparison? I've made no comparison.

My point is there is absolutely no winning for them right now, so I'd greatly consider the actions they are taking; less talk, work ahead on possible improvements, let people know when they are ready. And I'd argue that being in their position, many others would as well.

If there really is no winning now (which I disagree with), that's a position completely of their own making, created by not coming out and addressing the issue within the inception of the backlash.

 

[Last Hearth]

At this point, there is nothing much they can say that will matter.

The game's reputation is shot, the developer's reputation is in the mud, but they've made tens of millions of dollars. All three of these facts are pretty much set in stone and will not change.

Nobody is even playing this game anymore according to steam, they've lost 98% of their players since release a month ago. There were almost as many people playing Spore the last 24 hours as NMS, Spore, the game released in 2008. The game is dead.

 

[Heckler456]

I lost no money on NMS. I'm participating in this discussion for two reasons only:

1. I care about the state of the industry and my hobby. Bullshit needs to be called out in order to prevent it from completely going down the drain.

2. I despise it when liars get away with their lies, making money off of them and never being forced to assume responsibility.

1. So you're fighting against "the little guy" instead of taking up arms against the big boys actually ripping you off? It's kind of disingenuous to at least not entertain the possibility that the game in which they put at least 4 years of their time and a ton of their own money just didn't pan out in the way that they thought it would, instead of LITERALLY painting them as the demise of the industry.

2. Let's take the game as it is, and objectively look at its merits. You think that this is a product that doesn't deserve to be on the market, and that they don't deserve compensation for the actual work they put into it, regardless of everything else surrounding the game?

 

[SlickShoes]

At this point, there is nothing much they can say that will matter.

The game's reputation is shot, the developer's reputation is in the mud, but they've made tens of millions of dollars. All three of these facts are pretty much set in stone and will not change.

Nobody is even playing this game anymore according to steam, they've lost 98% of their players since release a month ago. There were almost as many people playing Spore the last 24 hours as NMS, Spore, the game released in 2008. The game is dead.

To be fair spore was on sale for £2 or something there is usually no one playing spore.

 

[orthodoxy1095]

Oh no the "little guys" argument.

 

[thelurkinghorror]

I lost no money on NMS. I'm participating in this discussion for two reasons only:

1. I care about the state of the industry and my hobby. Bullshit needs to be called out in order to prevent it from completely going down the drain.

2. I despise it when liars get away with their lies, making money off of them and never being forced to assume responsibility.

We have Batman here!
Again, what lies? Murray was only too much vague, but lies? C'mon. The game is here and it's a magical lysergic trip like no others, not for everyone, sure, but in a sea full of samey Triple A, fuck everyone.

 

[Roussow]

Either I'm too naive or way to cynical. But this situation isn't new, I feel like a ton of games have been accused of similar stuff over the years. Jeez, practically all of my favorite games of the last few years have been "guilty" of "misleading marketing". Although, like people probably should -- I didn't pre-order, I waited for impressions, then made a purchasing decision. I bought No Man's Sky with this is mind, I like it. We get reductive enough and this might not be deemed part of the discussion, however I think that this discussion is literally just fuel for the fire.

 

[orthodoxy1095]

We have Batman here!
Again, what lies? Murray was only too much vague, but lies? C'mon. The game is here and it's a magical lysergic trip like no others, not for everyone, sure, but in a sea full of samey Triple A, fuck everyone.

 

[CHC]

What matters now, as always, is what we do rather than what we say. We’re developers, and our focus is first on resolving any issues people have with the game as it is, then on future free updates which will improve, expand and build on the No Man’s Sky universe.

Right there on their site. But that's not what people want, they want more personal tweets from Sean so they can scrutinize them or meme the shit out of them.

Obviously they made a lot of missteps and bad decisions but they are working on the game and updating their audience on what they're doing. Realistically there is nothing more you could ask for.

 

[thelurkinghorror]

Either I'm to naive or way to cynical. But this situation isn't new, I feel like a ton of games have been accused of similar stuff over the years. Jeez, practically all of my favorite games of the last few years have been "guilty" of "misleading marketing". Although, like people probably should -- I didn't pre-order, I waited for impressions, then made a purchasing decision. I bought No Man's Sky with this is mind, I like it. We get reductive enough and this might not be deemed part of the discussion, however I think that this discussion is literally just fuel for the fire.

So this.


Ah, snd it's a little bit funny talk about Hello Games "lies" in a thread with a misleading title.
That's the story of NMS in a nutshell.

 

[Heckler456]

Attributing blood lust to posters which I find absurd. If they had calmly addressed this within the first week, there wouldn't have been such a furor over the game. All they had to do was sit down for an hour and write a PR statement.

Every game has people with a "blood lust" hate, I get that. But they don't have this level of backlash, and just attributing the response to "you assholes would never calm down" is complete garbage.

You don't think this post is clouded by "blood lust". (and of course not actual "blood lust", but more of a sense of "facts don't matter, let's just get these guys")

I'm sure as we speak they are working on a complex version of Joe Danger, where you will be able to build a motorcycle. It will have millions upon millions of obstacle courses and the chances of seeing another actual player on a course is minimal.
Hello Games is to busy to comment on NMS. That is so last month.

I mean, it's factually provable that they're working on improving the game.

Oh no the "little guys" argument.

Did you just read "little guys" and think that I was defending their mistakes based upon that? Maybe read the actual post. I was using it in the sense of that they're not the ones who will "destroy this industry", which is a preposterous notion to begin with, but regardless.

 

[Bedlam]

...

1. No one expected an MMO.

2. People expected the "slim chances of meeting each other". What people got was "zero chances" because the functionality isn't in the game. Clear lie.

3. Murray himself cited Journey and Dark Souls as comparisons for NMS multiplayer interaction. Those games are SP first and foremost with additional and seamless MP components. This is what people thought they would be getting. They didn't. Clear lie.

4. The developers knew the functionality wouldn't be in the game months before release but continued to play with these expectations right up until release. On the first day of release, Murray tweeted that his mind is blown that two people have already found each other. What he referred to but didn't mention: it was a failed attempt of two people meeting each other in person in the game.

So yeah, them knowing that no MP functionality beyond naming stuff wouldn't be in the game but still talking about and alluding to meeting other players months prior to release and even on the first day after release is absolutely malicious intent.

We have Batman here!
Again, what lies? Murray was only too much vague, but lies? C'mon. The game is here and it's a magical lysergic trip like no others, not for everyone, sure, but in a sea full of samey Triple A, fuck everyone.

I can't ... this is too much. Amazing.

This is why consumers are fucked in this industry.

 

[No_Style]

Unfortunately, gamers will forget about it and fall into the next hype trap right away. They have been warned about NMS expectations too but some gamers just don't give a shit about being rational about videogames.

Was there any crow-eating from Gaf users who were in denial and came up with all kinds of excuses for the things we critized in the original "can't see other players in NMS"-thread? That was so sad and hilarious at the same time.

I've been telling friend of mine that every generation (console and people) needs a reminder like this. NMS is this generation's Fable to me. I'm very curious what the demographic of the most upset people are. Is this their first game that was over promised and under delivered like this? The cycle will continue to repeat itself.

Also as Jeff Gerstmann said on the Bombcast a couple of weeks ago, scammers don't continue to patch a game. Getting into video game development and making 2 Joe Danger games just to pull the big No Man Sky swindle is the most inefficient scam history. They simply over promised and under delivered.

Now it seems they're trying to speak with their actions via ongoing patch support, Unfortunately, game development is a slow process, so it's going to be a while before we hear what kind of message they're going to deliver.

 

[Jacksinthe]

But they did ~_~

"No matter what feedback you gave us, you have been heard and we are listening carefully. Thank you."

That's an acknowledgement to you?

Let's take a look at this:

"What matters now, as always, is what we do rather than what we say. We’re developers, and our focus is first on resolving any issues people have with the game as it is, then on future free updates which will improve, expand and build on the No Man’s Sky universe."

Wait... what?
"What matters now, as always, is what we do rather than what we say"

Wut?
"is what we do rather than what we say"

Oh... so what they say doesn't matter? How convenient!

"our focus is first on resolving any issues people have with the game as it is."

Ahem...
"with the game as it is"

...
"as it is"


So... "but they did"?
But they didn't.

 

[thelurkinghorror]

Too easy... btw, I would choose him rather than the usual team of 100 anonymous people, at any time

 

[orthodoxy1095]

Did you just read "little guys" and think that I was defending their mistakes based upon that? Maybe read the actual post. I was using it in the sense of that they're not the ones who will "destroy this industry", which is a preposterous notion to begin with, but regardless.

Your post was just the typical whataboutism we see with NMS.

"Why don't you go after the big bad corporations instead of the little guys?!?!?!"

As if you know that we don't.

 

[Sidewinder]

Lock'em up!

Just played it yesterday and will every now and then until I reach the center of the universe. Glad I didn't read up every little interview, article and Tweet about this game and didn't watch hours of (fake) vids, because I went in with reasonably sized hype and I really enjoy it!

I knew it wouldn't be a grand life changing experience, procedurally generated levels just can't compete with real handcrafted stuff! I'd rather have fifty "real" small planets than a gazillion "fake" ones.

 

[Heckler456]

Your post was just the typical whataboutism we see with NMS.

"Why don't you go after the big bad corporations instead of the little guys?!?!?!"

As if know that we don't.

Did you just do what I said you did twice?

 

[karasu]

remember when they found that Kony 2012 guy naked, drugged out and flipping his shit on a street corner after raking in all that money? that's going to be Murray pretty soon.

That was a psi-op!

 

[Jebusman]

"the little guy"

The moment they charge $60 is the moment they decided to put on the big boy pants and get treated like everybody else.

Who the developer is, their origins, their size, their budget, whatever, all goes out the window when they decide that they want to charge the same price that AAA does.

This isn't about "The big guys and the little guys" and every single time you try and bring that up it's you white knighting for what is at the end of the day a company. No matter for what argument you think you're trying to make.

They are not our friends. They are not comrades in arms. They are a business, that sold the idea of a product, that is not the same as the product eventually became, and continue to misrepresent this product on official channels.

Take that "little guy" shit out of here. They wanted to play in the major league and now they get to deal with the major league problems, and so far they have done a horrendous job of dealing with the fallout.

I don't doubt they're actually working hard at trying to fix their game, but they waited way, WAY too long to cop up to what was actually wrong with it in the first place.

Did you just do what I said you did twice?

You brought up "the little guys". You can't then immediately try to claim you're not making the little guys argument when the entire thrust of that sentence relies on us being able to see the "difference" between the big guys and the little guys. Like come on now.

 

[orthodoxy1095]

Did you just do what I said you did twice?

Yep. Going after the little guy. I'm a bad, bad man.

"No matter what feedback you gave us, you have been heard and we are listening carefully. Thank you."

That's an acknowledgement to you?

Let's take a look at this:

"What matters now, as always, is what we do rather than what we say. We’re developers, and our focus is first on resolving any issues people have with the game as it is, then on future free updates which will improve, expand and build on the No Man’s Sky universe."

Wait... what?
"What matters now, as always, is what we do rather than what we say"

Wut?
"is what we do rather than what we say"

Oh... so what they say doesn't matter? How convenient!

"our focus is first on resolving any issues people have with the game as it is."

Ahem...
"with the game as it is"

...
"as it is"


So... "but they did"?
But they didn't.

Actually I glossed over that first sentence. But now that you drew my attention to it, it's frigging hilarious.

I take it back, they haven't been radio silent. They've been perfectly honest and admitted that their word means nothing*. A+ for the upfront honesty I guess.

Spoiler

Even ignoring the logical inconsistency that what you say is part of what you "do."

 

[righthandmouse]

Has anyone found a planet with a forest yet? All I got were deserted fields and hills.

 

[Bedlam]

1. So you're fighting against "the little guy" instead of taking up arms against the big boys actually ripping you off? It's kind of disingenuous to at least not entertain the possibility that the game in which they put at least 4 years of their time and a ton of their own money just didn't pan out in the way that they thought it would, instead of LITERALLY painting them as the demise of the industry.

2. Let's take the game as it is, and objectively look at its merits. You think that this is a product that doesn't deserve to be on the market, and that they don't deserve compensation for the actual work they put into it, regardless of everything else surrounding the game?

1. HG is not the "little guy" that some seem to think. Not since they are backed by Sony and received front-row PR during the biggest gaming press conferences. It also shouldn't matter how many employees a studio has. I spoke against bs coming from deceiving indie devs on Steam and I spoke against bs coming from EA, Ubisoft and Activision.

2. I'd describe it as a poor game with nice art style and an amazing soundtrack. It's not a disaster. But I do think players deserve compensation for missing features and frequent crashes.

 

[TheDinoman]

I cannot wait for the inevitable book written about this whole mess.

I feel like this game is probably just gonna fall out of people's memories over the years, same thing that happened to SPORE, really.

 

[thelurkinghorror]

I can't ... this is too much. Amazing.

This is why consumers are fucked in this industry.

I don't deny the miscommunication, and the vague words he often used in the past. But pick a random preview video on the subject and look: it's the same game.

I think consumers are fucked because they are now trained by the marketing to buy something early, not because this summer a game like no others arrives on the shelves

And I think something goes wrong during the final months in production...

 

[orthodoxy1095]

Has anyone found a planet with a forest yet? All I got were deserted fields and hills.

First planet for me. Not a huge forest, but a decidedly large amount of trees.

I feel like this game is probably just gonna fall out of people's memories over the years, same thing that happened to SPORE, really.

Spore does live on as a game that people always bring up when they think a game will fail or be too ambitious, alongside typical Peter Moly comparisons though! NMS will be fated to those kind of rememberances probably.

 

[JasoNsider]

Attributing blood lust to posters which I find absurd. If they had calmly addressed this within the first week, there wouldn't have been such a furor over the game. All they had to do was sit down for an hour and write a PR statement.

Every game has people with a "blood lust" hate, I get that. But they don't have this level of backlash, and just attributing the response to "you assholes would never calm down" is complete garbage.

If there really is no winning now (which I disagree with), that's a position completely of their own making, created by not coming out and addressing the issue within the inception of the backlash.

I agree with the other poster that you honestly sound up in arms exactly as I described. As others pointed out, Hello Games isn't looking to have their every word scrutinized and meme'd. Threads like these are looking for public hangings where they aren't warranted. You, specifically, are miscategorizing the situation as one that absolutely demands a response because...it's more prolific? It's got louder detractors? This isn't a personal wronging where the Hello Games team needs to apologize for their wrongdoings. It's a space video game that, to some people, isn't as great as they'd hoped. Just because some people are screaming about it doesn't change the situation.

Again, I think their current strategy is one of the better ones, considering the climate surrounding the game.

 

[Jebusman]

I agree with the other poster that you honestly sound up in arms exactly as I described. As others pointed out, Hello Games isn't looking to have their every word scrutinized and meme'd. Threads like these are looking for public hangings where they aren't warranted. You, specifically, are miscategorizing the situation as one that absolutely demands a response because...it's more prolific? It's got louder detractors? This isn't a personal wronging where the Hello Games team needs to apologize for their wrongdoings. It's a space video game that, to some people, isn't as great as they'd hoped. Just because some people are screaming about it doesn't change the situation.

Again, I think their current strategy is one of the better ones, considering the climate surrounding the game.

Please explain to me how

"Can you please make a statement as to whether or not the previously alluded to features are actually in the game or did not make development cutoff"

is the same as a

"public hanging".

Like how. Please, walk me through this. Because that's all people seem to want, and would've put this ENTIRE THING to rest from the get go. The climate surrounding the game is there precisely BECAUSE of their current strategy.

 

[Oersted]

At this point, there is nothing much they can say that will matter.

The game's reputation is shot, the developer's reputation is in the mud, but they've made tens of millions of dollars. All three of these facts are pretty much set in stone and will not change.

Nobody is even playing this game anymore according to steam, they've lost 98% of their players since release a month ago. There were almost as many people playing Spore the last 24 hours as NMS, Spore, the game released in 2008. The game is dead.

I always wonder why so many are so eager to point out they made millions with No Man's Sky.

 

[Heckler456]

Yep. Going after the little guy. I'm a bad, bad man.

What?

I'm going to repeat it for a third time, I guess.

He made the argument that No Man's Sky is ruining the industry. I'm saying there are bigger fish to fry. I'm not saying that they're beyond reproach due to the size of their studio. It's within this context that the "little guy" comment lives, not without.

Do you understand now?

1. HG is not the "little guy" that some seem to think. Not since they are backed by Sony and received front-row PR during the biggest gaming press conferences. It also shouldn't matter how many employees a studio has. I spoke against bs coming from deceiving indie devs on Steam and I spoke against bs coming from EA, Ubisoft and Activision.

2. I'd describe it as a poor game with nice art style and an amazing soundtrack. It's not a disaster. But I do think players deserve compensation for missing features and frequent crashes.

As to your second point, do you expect compensation in the myriad of other games that have technical issues or otherwise underdelivered? I mean, Iron Galaxy delivered a completely broken product onto the market for example. Were you there as well?

I guess my point essentially boils down to the fact that the reaction is completely out of proportion or what is going on here. And I've yet to see a single criticism from some of you guys that even has a semblance of "giving the benefit of the doubt", as if it's somehow impossible that there is a perfectly valid explanation for all of this. It's like that Jeff Gerstmann quote someone posted here said: You're acting like it's beyond a doubt that he's scamming you, but in actual fact, it's completely illogical to presume that that's what's going on here.

 

[Jebusman]

I always wonder why so many are so eager to point out they made millions with No Man's Sky.

It's a counterpoint to people constantly quoting them as the "little guys" or the "indie dev", when people might still associate the old "basement coders" view of what indie devs are, rather than the multimillion dollar company that it actually is.

They're not poor starving artists. At least they're not anymore.

 

[Oneself]

I have the game deleted, and will never touch it again, or buy anything made by these frauds.

Lol. Did someone spit in your coffee?

 

[SuperBanana]

We have Batman here!
Again, what lies? Murray was only too much vague, but lies? C'mon. The game is here and it's a magical lysergic trip like no others, not for everyone, sure, but in a sea full of samey Triple A, fuck everyone.

No, he was very direct about a lot of certain things.

"Can you play with your friends?"
"Yes"

Nothing vague about that.

 

[Bedlam]

I don't deny the miscommunication, and the vague words he often used in the past. But pick a random preview video on the subject and look: it's the same game.

Where do some of you get the notion from that only the trailers and video previews should count? (and even those are deceiving and full of stuff that isn't in the game)

No, every single video, article, interview and even every single tweet coming from the developers count.

I think consumers are fucked because they are now trained by the marketing to buy something early, not because this summer a game like no others arrives on the shelves

That part I can agree with. It's only half of the problem though.

 

[orthodoxy1095]

I agree with the other poster that you honestly sound up in arms exactly as I described. As others pointed out, Hello Games isn't looking to have their every word scrutinized and meme'd. Threads like these are looking for public hangings where they aren't warranted. You, specifically, are miscategorizing the situation as one that absolutely demands a response because...it's more prolific? It's got louder detractors? This isn't a personal wronging where the Hello Games team needs to apologize for their wrongdoings. It's a space video game that, to some people, isn't as great as they'd hoped. Just because some people are screaming about it doesn't change the situation.

Again, I think their current strategy is one of the better ones, considering the climate surrounding the game.

Who wants a public hanging?

I want what I've wanted from the beginning, a statement on what happened to key features and why they never clarified the status of those features.

If that's a "hanging," maybe the game development world was too much for Hello Games.

 

[Outrun]

Theres nothing wrong. 99% of the problems have been fixed :^)

Isn't the universe 99% vacuum?

I jest. I hope they don't it out soon.

 

[Joey Ravn]

I saw many interviews with Sean Murray where he said this was a single player experience and that it should be thought of as such. That it wasn't a MMO.

I think there is enough ground between "having multiplayer" and "being an MMO" for Sean Murray to communicate exactly where NMS fell. He mentioned by name Dark Souls and Journey as the type of multiplayer that HG was going for: seamless drop-in/drop-out interaction with other players.

Up until the very last minute he keep the "very little chances of finding another player, but the chances are there" rhetoric. Take that as you will.

 

[Par Score]

I always wonder why so many are so eager to point out they made millions with No Man's Sky.

Because otherwise people try to weave some sob story about Hello Games' "reputation being ruined" and how the poor indie devs don't deserve all this scrutiny over a tiny little indie game, rather than the truth, which is that they bilked millions of people out of $60 and are now a studio of multimillionaires.

 

[thelurkinghorror]

No, he was very direct about a lot of certain things.

"Can you play with your friends?"
"Yes"

Nothing vague about that.

Absolutely, the multiplayer part is the real problem here, not doubt.
But they start saying that NMS is a single player game a couple of months prior the release... I think something has changed as a result of some issue they encounter in the final part of the development.

This is enough to act like they killed your dog? I don't think so.
They tried, I have no doubt, and then released what they can... that's something I always loved in videogame. It's good for the industry to have developers that aim high. Look what Dylan Cuthbert said in the The Tomorrow Children thread:

"Idon't make games for jaded people, I make them for people who want something fresh and different, perhaps with a few flaws because it's a brand new genre, but something with a dream"

 

[rawd]

I have the game deleted, and will never touch it again, or buy anything made by these frauds.

I'm all over a new Joe Danger

 

[Heckler456]

Who wants a public hanging?

I want what I've wanted from the beginning, a statement on what happened to key features and why they never clarified the status of those features.

If that's a "hanging," maybe the game development world was too much for Hello Games.

Snideness aside, why do you believe you're owed that?

 

[TheVoidDragon]

I was assuming " Most of the time it's just with graphics or target renders so it's not as much as a problem really" was talking about the games listed beforehand.

Graphics were one the main complaints for most of those games i listed, including Aliens: Colonial Marines, but what i meant by "not as much of a problem really" was that while graphics downgrades are disappointing, i don't think they don't tend to have quite as much of a significant impact on the game overall than actual missing features do. With something like the Witcher 3 or Farcry 3, while people were obviously unhappy with the downgrade, overall it didn't really make any difference to the game itself and thus seems a bit easier to overlook after a while...unless it's a very severe downgrade like what happened with Aliens: Colonial Marines.

 

[orthodoxy1095]

Absolutely, the multiplayer part is the real problem here, not doubt.
But they start saying that NMS is a single player game a couple of months prior the release... I think something has changed as a result of some issue they encounter in the final part of the development.

This is enough to act like they killed your dog? I don't think so.
They tried, I have no doubt, and then released what they can... that's something I always loved in videogame. It's good for the industry to have developers that aim high. Look what Dylan Cuthbert said in the The Tomorrow Children thread:

"Idon't make games for jaded people, I make them for people who want something fresh and different, perhaps with a few flaws because it's a brand new genre, but something with a dream"

Oh wait, let's post the full quote by Dylan so people can judge it for themselves:

Why does anyone read anything Jim Sterling writes? He should call himself jaded gamer reviewer. I don't make games for jaded people, I make them for people who want something fresh and different, perhaps with a few flaws because it's a brand new genre, but something with a dream. Jim Sterling just shits over all games like that - go check out his other reviews and you'll see what I mean - if it's not easy classifiable it is shit.
He should probably spend less time writing reviews and more time playing games with an open mind.

Here is a much intelligent read, that lists up the bad and the good (no game is perfect) http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/20...side-an-enigma

 

[Bedlam]

As to your second point, do you expect compensation in the myriad of other games that have technical issues or otherwise underdelivered? I mean, Iron Galaxy delivered a completely broken product onto the market for example. Were you there as well?

I guess my point essentially boils down to the fact that the reaction is completely out of proportion or what is going on here. And I've yet to see a single criticism from some of you guys that even has a semblance of "giving the benefit of the doubt", as if it's somehow impossible that there is a perfectly valid explanation for all of this. It's like that Jeff Gerstmann quote someone posted here said: You're acting like it's beyond a doubt that he's scamming you, but in actual fact, it's completely illogical to presume that that's what's going on here.

I surely missed thousands of occasions where I could've spoke out against some bs. I'm not an omnipresent being, you know?

The proportion of the backlash is btw directly related to the hype they generated with the game, partly with misleading messaging also. Without this misleading messaging, they likely wouldn't have gotten that amount of hype. Yet, they chose to go ahead with this all for the sake of sales numbers. I would not call NMS a complete scam but the way it was sold and presented is scummy and malicious.

 

[orthodoxy1095]

Snideness aside, why do you believe you're owed that?

Why is a consumer owed clarification on advertised featuresets?

Really?

 

[TheVoidDragon]

Absolutely, the multiplayer part is the real problem here, not doubt.
But they start saying that NMS is a single player game a couple of months prior the release... I think something has changed as a result of some issue they encounter in the final part of the development.

When did they say it was a singleplayer game before release? The only time i can remember something like that was Sean's comment right before release about how players shouldn't expect it to be a multiplayer game...meaning multiplayer wasn't the focus of it, not that it was gone.

 

[Jebusman]

It's like that Jeff Gerstmann quote someone posted here said: You're acting like it's beyond a doubt that he's scamming you, but in actual fact, it's completely illogical to presume that that's what's going on here.

Jeff's statement that Sean had essentially Molyneux'd his way into this position wasn't exactly one of "We should give him the benefit of the doubt". Molyneux has a terrible history of overpromising and underdelivering, and in his last few projects has been absolutely fucking railed against by people (especially that RPS interview). People don't doubt that Molyneux (and by extension Sean) were being sincere in their desire to see the features they describe take form, but by that same measure between the two of them, only Molyneux has ever made a public apology for his previous mistakes (even if he then goes and causes them all over again).

As well, when people asked Jeff about whether he thought Sean was being held back by HR/PR on making a statement, he joked that unless Sean made himself sign his own NDA, it wasn't likely. That's not absolving him of the issue nor is it stating that we should give him the benefit of the doubt.

Just simply that if Sean wanted to make a statement, he could. And he chose not to. And here we are today.

I truly believe that had he come out from the beginning of all this to clarify, we would not be at the point we're at today.

SPECIFICALLY, the focal point was the two players meeting stream. During all their difficulties to actually see each other, had he put out a statement clarifying that you could not, in fact, actually see/meet each other, that would've put the issue to rest. Instead, he stoked the flames by stating that he was so shocked two players had actually met, when his definition of "met" is apparently at odds with literally everyone else, and then NEVER FOLLOW UP OR CLARIFY THIS STATEMENT.

 

[Bedlam]

Absolutely, the multiplayer part is the real problem here, not doubt.
But they start saying that NMS is a single player game a couple of months prior the release... I think something has changed as a result of some issue they encounter in the final part of the development.

Saying NMS is a SP experience and following it up with a "wow, two people have already met" tweet leaves just enough room to let the imaginations of players continue running wild. Especially when you cited Dark Souls and Journey as comparisons forplayer interaction in NMS before, games that are first and foremost SP experiences as well. The messaging from Sean became deliberately obtuse.

This is enough to act like they killed your dog? I don't think so. ...

I haven't seen people act like some of you describe. Not in this thread and not in other threads (I'm not active on twitter, however).

 

[Gabe3208]

I can't ... this is too much. Amazing.

This is why consumers are fucked in this industry.

I completely share this sentiment, and when you have so many people saying stupid shit like "oh, well whatever, they're all millionaires now." I mean, fucking seriously? Are you all just COMPLETELY ignoring the fact that they took advantage of OUR industry by selling us an idea a few key things on this game that never came to be? That by us allowing this to happen and stay quiet (which we haven't been) would only send signals across the world telling people, "Hey, let's make some pretty good marketing and tell these video game idiots that this will be the best game ever. We'll put out a shit product, but we'll make millions, and then we can look for something else to do." (I'm not saying this was Hello Games' position)

And then people wonder why pirating still exists. People would rather try it out and then say "this is DEFINITELY not worth $60" or "cool game, I'll support the developer and go buy it." but not like it mattered for NMS, since all my friends and I ended up getting refunds even after playing for 4 hours and realizing that something just "wasn't right" with this game. Thankfully I'm now playing and enjoying Deus Ex Mankind Divided.