Himuro said:
Ultimecia is not in the background in the story at all. You don't see her until the final battle, but she consumes three people throughout the course of the game: Edea, Rinoa and Adel.
You speak with indoctrinated Edea, personally. Ultimecia is controlling these characters through manipulation and most of the story events, such as controlling Galbadia, even as far as making the Garden her base because she fears and loathes Seed, is entirely central to the plot. Ultimecia has a big presence the whole game.
Think of it like Mass Effect. Saren and his legion of dickheads are indoctrinated by Sovereign throughout the course of the story. Just because you don't find out Sovereign itself is the thing controlling Saren and his men, does not mean Sovereign has no central impact on the plot, its story and the rest of the antagonists.
Just as a warning, this post will contain some Mass Effect 1 spoilers. If you're still on the ME1-Grind, then you might want to read with caution.
It's interesting that you mention Saren, because the Saren/Sovereign duality represents something rather interesting depending on how things play out. However, the main issue with the indoctrination example is that Saren and Matriarch Benezia still had glimmers of their original personality and consciousness (and most players usually take advantage of such in Saren's case). You get both Saren and Benezia's perspectives as Saren and Benezia respectively depending on Shepard's interactions with them, not
solely as Sovereign's puppets. You get a fair bit of perspective on Sovereign as a character himself to the point where he
is an identifiable character after his introduction.
I personally just had issues with Ultimecia in relation to attempting to identify with her. After her existence is made known in the Space incident, Ultimecia still remains rather divorced from the story's events personally (at this point, her influence over Rinoa is gone and you don't even see Sorceress Adel until the beginning of Disc 4, and Adel doesn't even speak then) Again, yes, in retrospect Ultimecia was essentially Edea during the few times you see her Disc 1 and 2 (you mostly see Seifer involved in the major Disc 2 set pieces, like the prison or the first portion of the Garden battle). But by saying "in the background", I also refer to her
active involvement in the story itself, not merely indirect consequences of her actions. Even as Edea, Ultimecia merely talked
at the party rather than with them ("run down seeds, gardens, seed must die"). The most interaction and glimpse of characterization I saw in Ultimecia was her final speech in the last battle. That speech says a lot about her as a character, her warped perception of time, and the events that will occur immediately after. When considering that these group of teenagers will be her eternal downfall, I expected more exchanges like that from her in the game.
Freshmaker said:
I don't see how having to hold the player's hand at all times amounts to a better story. It amounts to a dumbed down story. FF8 was not an inscrutable mess. You just had to pay attention.
Again, you're misunderstanding some really key things in my response. I specifically noted that you could still make a good story (and villain in this case) with a considerable level of mystique without "dumbing down the story" with excessive flashbacks and exposition on Ultimecia's part in particular, let alone the story in general. When it comes down to it, the most important factor about a story is how it is told, and I have described through enough detail on why I thought FF8 fell short of this goal.
Aside from the GF memory wipe stuff, none of the details I've posted about is buried in an information section. If you pay attention, it is possible to understand Ultimecia's motivations. It's all in the dialogue.
The worst you have to do is think, "if Edea was possessed, then what she was saying up til now was really Ultimecia." This is not a difficult bridge to cross. It doesn't really take any kind of intuitive leap to then figure out that Seifer is acting as Ultimecia's proxy as well. From that, you can construct her back story.
What you said was that since they were shown Edea, that's the only person people are capable of remembering or understanding as a villain. You argued that a possession is bad plot device because nobody understands it. This operates from the assumption that the reader is stupid. It's condescending.
This goes far beyond merely Ultimecia's motivations, but more so a criticism of the story structure itself (namely, there is one NPC in Fisherman's Horizon or Balamb that describes the Hyne back story, but the Lunar Cry, GFs, other important factors concerning the sorceress, even
better elaboration on Ultimecia, all things in the information section). But you're still acting as if every one who has an issue with Ultimecia as a character missed a step or just doesn't get it when it's quite the opposite; they understand it, but they don't really like it that much.
And as for me arguing that "possession is a bad plot device because nobody understands it," I'm really, really bamboozled as to how you reached that conclusion. I argued that possession is a bad plot device in my experience because it is rarely ever handled well at all. I'm still really, really confused on how you reached that conclusion even after re-reading that post I made concerning the subject.
