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[Tchu-Espresso]

Stay away from sound bars even if you have a modest budget.

I recently bought a 5.1.2 Focal Aria/REL system which cost a bit but am happy with it.

 

[Unknown Soldier]

I've been using a full home theater with AVR and a 5.1 setup for years.

Nothing else comes close.

 

[Optimus Lime]

If you are going to do a soundbar, do it properly - get a Sonos Arc, the Sonos Sub, two Play 1's, and you'll have a wireless DTS-ready 5.1 setup. It's not ever going to sound as good as an AVR, but it will be infinitely better than just going and buying some bullshit soundbar from Amazon.

But, really, a proper AVR 5.1/7.1 setup is what you should aiming for. HT amplifier, floorstanding left and right, center, and two rears, with Atmos speakers added.

For extra dick swinging, I run a two-amplifier setup, with a second stereo amplifier dedicated just to powering the front speakers, via pre-outs from my Denon.

The sound like like magma rising up from the bowels of hell. Sublime.

 

[Demigod Mac]

AVR, 100%. If a component needs replacement or you want to upgrade incrementally, there's no restriction to proprietary manufacturer parts or a need buy a whole new system. The effort to set it up, integrate with the room and calibrate is well worth it once you get it going.

Passive sound bars can work in combination with an AVR as your LCR's, although I prefer a soundstage with more separation between the front channels.

 

[Stafford]

I see a very interesting offer for a Onkyo AVR with Klipsch speakers, real good ones. Only issue is that the AVR is not HDMI 2.1.

But what if I were to keep my Xbox connected to the TV, so that I keep VRR, 120hz, etc, and only connect the TV to the AVR via EARC. That should work too, right?

 

[LiquidMetal14]

I have the same high end Samsung bar most have here in my PC dual monitor 28"4k144/65" LG CX. My 83" C1 has the thousand dollar Denon with 3 SVS subs and an Atmos setup. You can't compare the 2 but they're both good depending on how limited you are. I wouldn't put that AVR setup in a bedroom or entryway living room like my setup is but for the living room/theatre, it's 1000% recommendation all the time if you're asking me.

My desk setup for the soundbar

Living room

 

[Stafford]

So when looking for speakers for a home cinema setup....

Are large tower like front speakers a must or can bookshelf speakers work just as great for front speakers? And which speakers in general are known to produce the most bass? Since a sub won't be happening anytime soon.

 

[fran.fernandez]

Sonos Arc + sub and ones.
Atmos sound amazing !

 

[Diddy X]

Home cinema seems like the better option always, soundbars I think are aimed at people who prefer a smaller formfactor or don't have enough space to install a full home cinema.

 

[Laptop1991]

Got a soundbar and sub plus 5.1 surround and had 7.1 aswell, both are good but home cinema is better, no question, more speakers though and/or more wires

 

[rofif]

3d/surround audio is best with headphones anyway.
I am using lg c1 tv speakers (cinema mode, bass boost, ai crap off) and they sound great. 28w per speaker. Kinda similar to presonus e3.5.
I would put a soundbar under it but I dont have a room. but the speakers are good for most use. For critical gaming, I go with headphones anyway

 

[SScorpio]

I see a very interesting offer for a Onkyo AVR with Klipsch speakers, real good ones. Only issue is that the AVR is not HDMI 2.1.

But what if I were to keep my Xbox connected to the TV, so that I keep VRR, 120hz, etc, and only connect the TV to the AVR via EARC. That should work too, right?

As long as both your TV and the AVR support eARC, that's exactly how it's supposed to work.

So when looking for speakers for a home cinema setup....

Are large tower like front speakers a must or can bookshelf speakers work just as great for front speakers? And which speakers in general are known to produce the most bass? Since a sub won't be happening anytime soon.

It's all down to the individual speakers, and what sounds best to you. But generally, towers being larger can fit larger speakers than bookshelves. Towers typically come as either two or three-way. In two ways you have a tweeter and woofer, while three ways have a driver as well to better handle mids.

Audio comes down to personal preference, and size, shape, and things in a room can affect the sound. I used to have a nice 7.1 system with a projector, nowadays I just have sound bars. I don't even hit 25% on the volume before it gets uncomfortably loud.

If I were getting something new right now, unless I needed it immediately, wait for Black Friday sales unless you see some crazy deal by you. You could get a full sound bar system with a sub and two rear speakers for $300-400. When looking at new AVRs the prices just skyrocketed and no one is making the entry/mid-level systems anymore as everyone now just gets a soundbars.

Audio is always tricky, but if you're not an audiophile, the vast amount of people would find even a budget entry-level soundbar to meet their needs. But there's no way for you to know what should right to you with hearing systems, so hopefully some place by you has some demo setups.

 

[Stafford]

As long as both your TV and the AVR support eARC, that's exactly how it's supposed to work.


It's all down to the individual speakers, and what sounds best to you. But generally, towers being larger can fit larger speakers than bookshelves. Towers typically come as either two or three-way. In two ways you have a tweeter and woofer, while three ways have a driver as well to better handle mids.

Audio comes down to personal preference, and size, shape, and things in a room can affect the sound. I used to have a nice 7.1 system with a projector, nowadays I just have sound bars. I don't even hit 25% on the volume before it gets uncomfortably loud.

If I were getting something new right now, unless I needed it immediately, wait for Black Friday sales unless you see some crazy deal by you. You could get a full sound bar system with a sub and two rear speakers for $300-400. When looking at new AVRs the prices just skyrocketed and no one is making the entry/mid-level systems anymore as everyone now just gets a soundbars.

Audio is always tricky, but if you're not an audiophile, the vast amount of people would find even a budget entry-level soundbar to meet their needs. But there's no way for you to know what should right to you with hearing systems, so hopefully some place by you has some demo setups.

The thing that puts me off on going for a home cinema setup is that I probably would only be able to buy a AVR, the cheapest HDMI 2.1 AVR is like 500 or 600. And then I still need speakers and a sub.

It's gonna take a long time before I get it all, and then the fact that my house probably isn't great for a full blown setup, since no matter what sub I'll get, neighbours are going to notice. Also, before games such as Starfield come out I would like to have better sound by that time.

I'm honestly leaning more towards Soundbar after all. Maybe I'll get that HK, see how I like it, if the bass indeed is good enough (for a bar without sub) and then later add the two rears too, if I decide to keep the bar.

I also kinda don't want to begin a whole hunt/search for the right speakers, sub etc, I'd rather take the "easy" way. But it's not decided at all yet.

 

[kutthoat5150]

I've got a full Bose 900 Soundbar/Bass/Surround setup at home paired with a Lg G3 77inch and it's amazing watching movies and how capable it is shaking the whole room. Watching John Wick 4 and Top Gun Maverick on it was a treat. I've never had a full AVR setup before as I like the cleaner look and smaller footprint soundbars take up so I can't say I'm missing what those can deliver but I've no regrets with my purchase.

 

[lachesis]

I am also for sound bar for simpler wire management and clean look and that’s what I have at my house (used to have 7.1 AVR set up and 5.1 set up as 2ndary)

- but it’s difficult to beat proper AVR setup in terms of performance and real sound spacial feel. Headphones do 3d very well, but find it too isolated and too immersive (some may prefer it as I understand totally)- as I do want my own space’s ambient natural noise in the background.

Perhaps when I gut renovate my place, I may look into proper wiring for ceiling and all - but for most folks, too much investment…

 

[FinalBossWithTheMostPower]

I got a nice Yamaha couple years back, soundbars are more than enough in the right spaces.

I rarely crank it up because my neighbor had the audacity to come pounding on my door while playing MW2, on a Saturday afternoon, saying her whole condo was shaking and it sounded like I was in Iraq.

Yes ma'am, I was.

 

[DenchDeckard]

After years of av receivers and speakers I grabbed a sonos arc, sub and rears. I'm more than happy and the reduction in cables is amazing. Sure its not as premium as the av receiver route but it works for me.

 

[hussar16]

I just bought bose 900 soundbar with rear wifi speakers .good experience can't complain at all.

 

[aclar00]

I can get a Onkyo TX-NR636 AVR (2014) plus big front speakers from Klipsch, center speaker and rears for 500 euros. Used, but in great condition. The only uncertainty I have is audio delay. If I hook the Xbox up straight into AVR, no delay, but also no VRR then.

If I hook Xbox into TV and receiver into TVs eARC then I will have VRR but when selecting Dolby Digital will have a delay. Stereo uncompressed has no delay but then there won't be surround.

Ha, pretty much my setup for thelast 9 years. Thinking of upgrading, but been waiting to fo everything at once. My 65 inch Sammy is also a 2014. Starting to have some issue with the left surround going in and out (havent troubleshoot completely yet), but otherwise still going.

I use to ha e a Vizio 5.1 soundbar combo a few years that was actually pretty great, but it was toslink and eventually crapped out. It was otherwose good.

It had wired surround speakers that hooked up to a wireless subwoofer. Was a great setup to limit cables. They were small satellite speakers that i attached to each side of the headboard with velcro. Great, cheap setup. Dont know if theyre still made with wireless subwoofers though.

 

[Yamisan]

When my old Onkyo receiver died 2 years ago and I was on a strict budget I couldn't live with out 5.1 My cheap $200 Vizio 5.1 sound bar with subroofer and 2 rear speakers sounds so much better.

VIZIO V-Series 5.1 Home Theater Sound Bar with Dolby Audio, Bluetooth, Wireless Subwoofer, Voice Assistant Compatible, Includes Remote Control - V51x-J6​

great if on a budget from amazon under $200 now

 

[Stafford]

When my old Onkyo receiver died 2 years ago and I was on a strict budget I couldn't live with out 5.1 My cheap $200 Vizio 5.1 sound bar with subroofer and 2 rear speakers sounds so much better.

VIZIO V-Series 5.1 Home Theater Sound Bar with Dolby Audio, Bluetooth, Wireless Subwoofer, Voice Assistant Compatible, Includes Remote Control - V51x-J6​

great if on a budget from amazon under $200 now

About 300 bucks for me because it needs to be shipped to The Netherlands. Man I wish my country would finally offer VIZIO.

300 is still a nice deal, but there's always a chance I don't like it and it needs to be shipped back, whole lot of hassle.

 

[Aguero9320]

Count me in the Sonos camp. Arc, Ones and Sub - have done both this and a receiver, and for sheer convenience (and it’s still awesome sounding) Sonos all the way.

 

[Zuzu]

I personally just use stereo KEF LS50 Wireless speakers and an SVS PB3000 sub but if you wanted to go down the soundbar route then maybe look into the Sonos Arc with Sub (or two Subs) and the new Sonos Era 300s for the rear speakers.

 

[The Alien]

Sonos Arc with surrounds and sub.
Paired with Series X and a new TV...

Gears 4 & 5 supports Dolby Atmos and sounds (and looks) amazing. Gears 5 specifically is rediculous. Very clear...every crackle of fire, gun fire, direction of footsteps, etc. Its actually saved my ass a few times in multiplayer.

 

[violence]

I was told if you’re spending $300 on a sound bar, you’re just being silly. You may as well get a decent receiver and cheap speakers

 

[SScorpio]

I was told if you’re spending $300 on a sound bar, you’re just being silly. You may as well get a decent receiver and cheap speakers

How long ago did you get this advice? Good luck getting a decent AVR for just $300 then you still need to purchase speakers.

AVR setups have become the domain of enthusiast and carry a high price point. The budget and mid range had been dead for several years.

 

[Topher]

I'm using the same Yamaha 5.1 home theater setup I bought 20+ years ago. Works fantastic.

 

[violence]

How long ago did you get this advice? Good luck getting a decent AVR for just $300 then you still need to purchase speakers.

AVR setups have become the domain of enthusiast and carry a high price point. The budget and mid range had been dead for several years.

It was 2019 so pre-Covid.

 

[coffinbirth]

Friends don't let friends buy soundbars...

HDMI 2.1 chips in AVRs and AV processors - transition to 40/48 Gbps, issues with video and graphics features

HDMI 2.1 chips in 2020, 2021, 2022, 2023 models of AVRs and AV processors Reliability of chips, updates, bugs, video signal, gaming features, port speed and issues surrounding the roll out of HDMI 2.1 specification in AV machines HDMI board upgrade - free and paid Eligible current models...

www.avforums.com

Give this a thorough read and then you'll know exactly which AVR is right for you. After that, just buy a 5.1 speaker package. Klipsch makes pretty good mid-tier speakers. You can dial all that in at under $1K, no problem.

 

[LavitzSlambert]

Honestly if you have to ask the question, you are probably a candidate for a soundbar. But go with a good one, not cheapo. Sonos Arc/Sub/Surrounds are my setup and I really enjoy it. Wireless and the ease of use beat out the better audio quality of a full AVR setup.i

 

[Godfavor]

So when looking for speakers for a home cinema setup....

Are large tower like front speakers a must or can bookshelf speakers work just as great for front speakers? And which speakers in general are known to produce the most bass? Since a sub won't be happening anytime soon.

It is really difficult to find speakers that produce the same amount of bass like a subwoofer much more so for the bookshelf's, you have to look out for expensive options like the devialet.

Better get a smaller dimensions sub than relying on speakers for the base. Sonos is really small and minimal looking, like others have recommended, never sounds boomy or disconnected. You can buy them and if you dont like them, you can send them back. (Sonos has a great return policy)

 

[S0ULZB0URNE]

If one wants the HTIB experience and doesn't mind spending a few grand....

Nakamichi DRAGON 11.4.6 | Quad Subs | Omni-Motion Surrounds

World’s first wireless surround sound system with 15 digital amplifiers, quad subwoofers, 6 upfiring speakers and 2 Omni-Motion Reference Surrounds

dragon.nakamichi-usa.com

Or you could build your own rack but for my tastes that would be even more expensive.

 

[kiunchbb]

Buy a mid range AVR, and 2 nice speaker for a 2.0 set up, then when you save up more money, upgrade slowly to 2.1, then 5.1... Or if you have the budget already go straight to 5.1, there are plenty of reddit post that will tell you what is the best speakers for your budget. Speaker don't really "evolve" or upgrade like phone or PC, just invest in some good speakers, it'll last you a decade or more.

 

[Stafford]

Buy a mid range AVR, and 2 nice speaker for a 2.0 set up, then when you save up more money, upgrade slowly to 2.1, then 5.1... Or if you have the budget already go straight to 5.1, there are plenty of reddit post that will tell you what is the best speakers for your budget. Speaker don't really "evolve" or upgrade like phone or PC, just invest in some good speakers, it'll last you a decade or more.

What I know now is that I don't have to be dead set on getting a HDMI 2.1 AVR, as long as it has eARC. So that means I won't have to spend a huge amount of money on a AVR, which means I get to spend that money on speakers and sub sooner. The AVR does at the very least has to support Dolby Digital, but that shouldn't be too hard to find.

And since Atmos just hasn't blown up for console gaming, I guess it's not a must. I'm definitely thinking things through carefully before making a decision.

 

[soulbait]

This may be out of your budget, but I got the Onkyo TX-NR6100 AVR. It fully supports HDMI 2.1, so I am able to run both my PS5 and XSX in VRR and 120hz modes. It also supports Dolby Vision and all that jazz.

It is pricey, but you do not have to worry about eARC and the audio delay it can introduce.

Also, I feel with an AVR you get more adjustments for making sure you get good sound without worrying about your neighbors. Most subwoofers you would hook up the AVR will have the ability for you to control its maximum volume output on the subwoofer itself, along with the setup controls on the AVR. I feel most soundbars have less control, but also my experience with them is limited. I have a Samsung sound bar in my living room that cost me $500 and it gives very little control overall. Makes it easy to setup and go, but you can not tweak it as well as you can an AVR.

An AVR of course somes with the added cost of needing to buy speakers, which can get costly, but you can control what speakers you get. You get to choose how large of a sub-woofer you get and such.

 

[soulbait]

And since Atmos just hasn't blown up for console gaming, I guess it's not a must. I'm definitely thinking things through carefully before making a decision.

Do you watch movies and/or TV though? If so, Atmos does add a lot. And for the games that do support Atmos on XSX, it sounds really good.

 

[Stafford]

Do you watch movies and/or TV though? If so, Atmos does add a lot. And for the games that do support Atmos on XSX, it sounds really good.

Yeah, I do watch movies and shows. Hmm, I guess Atmos is not something to just ignore.

I've been looking into some soundbar options today, ideally those supporting VRR (so that I can connect the Xbox to it, because keeping my Xbox connected to TV will get me audio delay in Atmos, DD. DD not as bad, but still not perfect)

The annoying thing is that several of these bars were said to get VRR support in later updates, but it's just unclear as hell if they have it now. Sony A5000 and A7000, most recent result on Reddit is early this year, the update still wasn't there.

Surprisingly the HK seems to offer it. The Klipsch Cinema 1200 supports it all, but I'm hearing about tons of issues with the soundvar overall, unfortunately.

As for AVR, that Onkyo is a bit steep for me. But apparently there are Denon AVRs supporting HDMI 2.1 fully.


The AVR-S760H sets me back 519 euros and it has it all. And since I can use my Sony A95K as center speaking, that's pretty sweet.

Better yet, there is one even cheaper.

450-485 euros for the Denon AVR-X1700H.

 

[Stafford]

Is Teufel a good speaker brand? Anyone with experience with them?

 

[diffusionx]

I'm planning to move to a small condo and getting rid of my 5.1 setup in favor of a soundbar. The technology that has developed in the past 5-10 years with soundbars is really impressive, and it's a much cleaner, simpler setup. I like the sounds that come out of my 5.1, but, you know, it's a bunch of speakers, and tons of wires, and then a big AVR, and even now the AVR (from 2016) is getting outdated, and I'm just over it.

 

[Stafford]

I'm planning to move to a small condo and getting rid of my 5.1 setup in favor of a soundbar. The technology that has developed in the past 5-10 years with soundbars is really impressive, and it's a much cleaner, simpler setup. I like the sounds that come out of my 5.1, but, you know, it's a bunch of speakers, and tons of wires, and then a big AVR, and even now the AVR (from 2016) is getting outdated, and I'm just over it.

Aren't there many wireless solutions for full home cinema these days?

 

[EverydayBeast]

Most gamers normally have audio coming out of their tv, you probably could use speakers https://www.ebay.com/itm/1554521384...Zr3r63GSoa&var=&widget_ver=artemis&media=COPY

 

[diffusionx]

Aren't there many wireless solutions for full home cinema these days?

I don't know. like i said it is part of a overall decluttering/downsizing operation too.

 

[Schmendrick]

Is Teufel a good speaker brand? Anyone with experience with them?

Teufel is I´d say a mid tier brand. Most of their soundproducts aren`t bad for the price but they`re not really competing at the high end. They have some high end offerings but at that price point you might just as well go for Nubert, Elac or Klipsch f.e.
In my personal opinion for a home cinema I´d always go for as top of the line as budgetary wise possible since good speakers can literally last you a lifetime.

 

[EviLore]

If one wants the HTIB experience and doesn't mind spending a few grand....

Nakamichi DRAGON 11.4.6 | Quad Subs | Omni-Motion Surrounds

World’s first wireless surround sound system with 15 digital amplifiers, quad subwoofers, 6 upfiring speakers and 2 Omni-Motion Reference Surrounds

dragon.nakamichi-usa.com

Or you could build your own rack but for my tastes that would be even more expensive.

The Nakamichi setups are really good by any standard.

 

[S0ULZB0URNE]

The Nakamichi setups are really good by any standard.

They offer amazing sound and a neat setup due to parts of them using wireless parts.

 

[Stafford]

The Nakamichi looks awesome, but I can't justify that price for myself. Hell, I had to justify the price of the Sony A95K because I was so fucking tired of the inconsistent shit I had with Samsung S95B and just wanted a great TV, no bullshit.

If Nakamichi was 1000 or even 1500 I'd definitely consider it.

 

[EviLore]

The Nakamichi looks awesome, but I can't justify that price for myself. Hell, I had to justify the price of the Sony A95K because I was so fucking tired of the inconsistent shit I had with Samsung S95B and just wanted a great TV, no bullshit.

If Nakamichi was 1000 or even 1500 I'd definitely consider it.

The Nakamichi Shockwafe at $1500 is a great system.

 

[Stafford]

The Nakamichi Shockwafe at $1500 is a great system.

The problem is, they don't seem to ship to The Netherlands, sigh. Ffs. That kinda shit always pisses me off.

 

[cinnamonandgravy]

ever notice how almost everything you watch on tv has sound?

then invest in speakers.

sound bars are for people with notable budget/space/i-just-cant-deal-with-wires constraints. a buddy of mine has one, and it's a good fit for him.
otherwise, get an AVR (or better yet, separate processor/amps) and some big boy speakers for the best performance.

and don't forget about used speakers.
audiophiles like to upgrade a lot, so you can snag some really high end stuff at a great price.

 

[Stafford]

The Nakamichi Shockwafe at $1500 is a great system.

Actually, I can get them, it's not ideal because it's import, so that's gonna be troublesome if I have to return it for whatever reasons, but Ebay is an option and a online that imports from Nakamichi and ships to my country among many others.

Did you mean this one?

https://www.ubuy.co.nl/en/product/4...woofers-wireless-amp-4-rear-surround-speakers


At that store it's significantly under 1500 bucks even. But I'm sure there will be shipping costs.

And Holy shit, these come with two subs? That's insane, lol. This has my attention though, I've seen a lot of praise online about their soundbars. It's actually nonsense to call it a soundbar anymore considering what's in the box.

But since they apparently are so damn good, I don't get why they wouldn't bother letting The Netherlands sell them too. I just don't get it at all.