Bobby Roberts
Banned
...what if Luke founded the Church of the Force.
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[SPOILERS] Star Wars: The Force Awakens (Thread #2) - One Thumb Up
- Thread starter Bobby Roberts
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...what if Luke founded the Church of the Force.
Spikematic
Member
I think it would make sense if it were Kylo who decided to dump Rey on Jakku instead of killing her off with the rest of Luke's Jedi academy. I mean, Rey is supposed to be in her early 20's and Kylo looks like he's around 30 right? So that would make Rey around 10 when she was abandoned and Kylo around 20. So I don't see the age difference being the problem in the theory. I really do think that Rey was at the academy/temple when the Knights of Ren attacked.
LookAtMeGo
Member
Yeah you're probably right. I dont think there will be too much dialog hinting at anything. Now im starting to think there will be something sitting around San Tekkas place when he gives the map to Poe or something lol. Probably not though.
Clearly the movie demonstrated that, while similar and of the same lineage, the Empire and the First Order are different. The Stormtroopers are obviously better now and that could easily be down to not being used as cannon fodder. The FO probably doesn't place a high value on life, but experience.
Regardless of what might of happened as a result of lowering the shields the FO's goal was achieved. Plus an embarrassed, angry Phasma seems like someone I want to keep around.
CreepingFear
Member
I don't like the name Church of the Force, but I like the idea. Call it the Cult of the Force or Order of the Force.
Jest Chillin
Member
The Force Force: Delta Squad
CreepingFear
Member
Force Groupies
TheStruggler
Report me for trolling ND/TLoU2 threads
anyone hear of this/these theories? I actually like them
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9kggTCnPfqI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9kggTCnPfqI
BlastProcessing
Member
The more I think about it, the more I think Rey is Snoke's kid.
excelsiorlef
Member
Kills Han, Murders children and old people and an entire village. Yeah he's really a secret good guy.
Imperfected
Member
It's a moderately interesting theory, but it's really poorly articulated in that video.
excelsiorlef
Member
He's incredible, Poe has little to time in that movie but Isaac is so good he makes you love him right away, insane charisma,
So glad they didn't kill him off as originally planned
Mashin Haters
Member
you think Rey is the alien's kid?
Lionel Mandrake
Member
This has probably all been discussed to death in the thousands of posts in this thread, but I just watched again and wanted to type out some stray observations.
-Han Solo knows who Rey is. I didn't pick up on it the first time, but after she tells him her name, Han's eyes start darting back and forth while he processes it. This is immediately followed by his job proposal to keep her on the Falcon. Then in the cantina, Moz (I'm not looking up how to spell her name) asks Han who the girl is, and it immediately cuts away to another scene before we hear his answer. The fact that this is followed by Moz explaining about the Skywalker legacy really makes Rey look to be Luke's daughter. The weird thing is Moz then tells her whoever she's waiting for isn't going to come back for her, but Luke might-- which doesn't explicitly say that Luke isn't who she's waiting for, but sounds really misleading. Then again, "Darth Vader betrayed and murdered your father."
-In the dream sequence, I really thought I heard Yoda and Alec Guinness. But it's pretty indecipherable. It could all be in my head. The voices are just the right level where you think maybe you can make out what they're saying, but could totally buy that it's incomprehensible gibberish.
-I think I really like the new cantina song.
Movie holds up the second time. It felt just like I was rewatching one from the old trilogy.
-Han Solo knows who Rey is. I didn't pick up on it the first time, but after she tells him her name, Han's eyes start darting back and forth while he processes it. This is immediately followed by his job proposal to keep her on the Falcon. Then in the cantina, Moz (I'm not looking up how to spell her name) asks Han who the girl is, and it immediately cuts away to another scene before we hear his answer. The fact that this is followed by Moz explaining about the Skywalker legacy really makes Rey look to be Luke's daughter. The weird thing is Moz then tells her whoever she's waiting for isn't going to come back for her, but Luke might-- which doesn't explicitly say that Luke isn't who she's waiting for, but sounds really misleading. Then again, "Darth Vader betrayed and murdered your father."
-In the dream sequence, I really thought I heard Yoda and Alec Guinness. But it's pretty indecipherable. It could all be in my head. The voices are just the right level where you think maybe you can make out what they're saying, but could totally buy that it's incomprehensible gibberish.
-I think I really like the new cantina song.
Movie holds up the second time. It felt just like I was rewatching one from the old trilogy.
excelsiorlef
Member
You did and Ewan is in there too
Oscar Isaac is just the best.
Its confirmed their voices are in the sequence. Ewan Mcgregor as well.
BreezyLimbo
Banned
Oh another "Rey is Lukes daughter" clue is that shes a naturally good flier. Just like Anakin was a natural pilot, how Luke was a natural pilot, and now Rey is a natural pilot.
CreepingFear
Member
I LOLed. Maybe, it's the vodka in me.
BlastProcessing
Member
Do we know he is an alien and not just a fucked up human? I can't pin down a species for him online.
TheStruggler
Report me for trolling ND/TLoU2 threads
sacrifices need to be made for a greater good one day. What if this is actually Lukes plan? Luke being the master Jedi he is sense an evil presence but does not know how to locate snoke. So Luke makes the First Order with Ren in an attempt to "lure" him to the dark side to get in touch with snoke due to his abilities. This is not only to reveal snoke but eventually take him out. Ren is being the ultimate sacrifice for the greater good, and to complete the act Ren must kill his father to prove he is officially "turned". you can even see throughout the movie he wants/feels the light side while talking to the vader mask, he hates what he is doing because he is a good man, but must continue to do evil
EDIT: And in all honesty you can draw the parallels between vader a ren. Ren is trying so hard to be the symbol of Vader to be snoke to buy into him even more because for so many years vader was the face of the sith
Anakin turned to the dark side for selfish reasons
While Ren "turns to the darkside" for selfless reasons. That is what makes him different, and better than vader
Silphonica
Banned
Eh, if he genuinely believes this is best to way to confront Snoke, then he would have to prove himself to gain Snoke's trust. Not only that, we can actually draw parallels in reallife with undercover FBI agents.
Not saying thats what i believe, but your dismissive phrasing holds no ground as a reply.
Future Foundation
Member
I finally, FINALLY, got my turn on this fucking ride. And it was so so so much better than I could have hoped for. So, I'll hop into full-on discussion with you guys soon. But it's 3 AM here and I'm gonna go sleep.
Saw it a second time, liked it noticeably more now that I've had time to digest various plot issues and was just sitting back to enjoy it with family. Glad Episode 8 has a relatively quick turnaround, shouldn't even be long until that hype machine gets started.
I still couldn't pick up half the voices reportedly in Rey's vision though.
I still couldn't pick up half the voices reportedly in Rey's vision though.
TAJ
Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that.
I don't think you'll find anything. Of all the things that have been discussed about this movie the only one I didn't notice the first time I watched it was C-3PO getting his gold arm back at the end. There's just not a lot of that sort of detail.
Imperfected
Member
I mean, Ren killing his father to get to Snoke would be one thing, but he kind of participated in the wholesale destruction of multiple inhabited planets, there.
Also, I have to think by now Luke is enough of a non-dipshit that he realizes Sith are always going to exist, and sacrificing half the galaxy just to root out a single Sith Lord isn't a particularly good trade.
Also, I have to think by now Luke is enough of a non-dipshit that he realizes Sith are always going to exist, and sacrificing half the galaxy just to root out a single Sith Lord isn't a particularly good trade.
TheStruggler
Report me for trolling ND/TLoU2 threads
All i saw was Ren watching from a distance in his spaceship, i didnt see him pull the trigger so to speak. If he truly is "undercover" he must not bat an eye to it.
I know normal people don't use this type of logic as motivation for what they're doing, but if I was a super ambitious force wielder who wants to rule the galaxy I would know I need training and skills first. I would definitely feign interest in Snoke's schemes if I could learn valuable skills. Suck his knowledge dry then kill him. Learn all I can under Luke then learn all I can under Snoke, then rule the galaxy as a balanced force user. Good leaders can't be sanctimonious all the time, sometimes the hammer must be used. Light side and dark side users are both perverse worshipers of a narrow slice of the force anyway.
But Star Wars would never do that. Dark side must always be bad.
But Star Wars would never do that. Dark side must always be bad.
Imperfected
Member
Please tell me that this was your knee-jerk reaction, and after thinking about it more than not at all you understand inherently why the ethics here don't work.
Freyjadour
Member
Guinness says "Rey.." (apparently pulled from "afraid") and Ewan McGregor follows up with "these are your first steps" much like Guinness's "you've taken your first steps into a larger world" from ANH.
Bespin flashbacks are pretty awesome too considering how much the Han / Ben bridge scene takes from it.
Much better scene on the second watch. First time I was just reeling.
TAJ
Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that.
Ether_Snake saying it's been confirmed that Rey wasn't there for what happened during the rainy flashback made me go back and look up who was arguing against me when I speculated that was the case. It was Ether_Snake, lol.
Freyjadour
Member
Also, Ren punching his blaster wound to amp himself up / blunt the pain and the reaction to it is pretty god damned great.
I've slightly revised the post I made a few days ago.
Going along with the Darth Plagueis is Snoke theory. Rumors from before about Anakin's birth was that Plagueis actually did figure out how to manipulate the force (or midicholorians, whatever) to create life, and therefore he created Anakin (which is why his midicholorian count was off the charts) essentially being his "Father".
What if Snoke is Plaguies, and saw Anakin as a failed attempt, so he tried again with Rey. Creating her. Sure it still leaves it open to who her mother may be. But, this could also explain her connection to Luke/Skywalker's since essentially she is like Anakin's sister.
Revision. We will be lead to believe that Rey is Luke's daughter. Because the characters themselves will believe it. Luke will have had a woman love interest whom gets pregnant. Luke believes he is the father. However! Plagueis/Snoke actually created Rey using Luke's love interest as a host for birth. So we as an audience will get hit with the one two punch. Luke revealing he is Rey's father only to later find out he was mistaken and it is actually Plagueis/Snoke who is her creator, just like Anakins.
Disney shoulda hired me.
Going along with the Darth Plagueis is Snoke theory. Rumors from before about Anakin's birth was that Plagueis actually did figure out how to manipulate the force (or midicholorians, whatever) to create life, and therefore he created Anakin (which is why his midicholorian count was off the charts) essentially being his "Father".
What if Snoke is Plaguies, and saw Anakin as a failed attempt, so he tried again with Rey. Creating her. Sure it still leaves it open to who her mother may be. But, this could also explain her connection to Luke/Skywalker's since essentially she is like Anakin's sister.
Revision. We will be lead to believe that Rey is Luke's daughter. Because the characters themselves will believe it. Luke will have had a woman love interest whom gets pregnant. Luke believes he is the father. However! Plagueis/Snoke actually created Rey using Luke's love interest as a host for birth. So we as an audience will get hit with the one two punch. Luke revealing he is Rey's father only to later find out he was mistaken and it is actually Plagueis/Snoke who is her creator, just like Anakins.
Disney shoulda hired me.
Worse. Bowcasters fire metallic bolts.
They really need to not waste him in future films. He's the best young actor of his generation. They're extremely lucky to have him.
It's confirmed in the novelization and art book he's a humanoid alien.
I hope Ray isn't Lukes daughter, that seems way too predictable. If we can reach into the expanded universe, is it possible she's Ezra's daughter (from Rebels)? I'm not up to date on that show, but is it possible it's his and Sabine's kid? Or maybe Kanan's?
Also, on the subject of the expanded universe, are there any theories about how the Shattered Empire comic connects to Force Awakens? I was expecting the magic tree thing to be in the final scene, but theres no mention of it, or anything else from that comic anywhere that I could see.
Also, on the subject of the expanded universe, are there any theories about how the Shattered Empire comic connects to Force Awakens? I was expecting the magic tree thing to be in the final scene, but theres no mention of it, or anything else from that comic anywhere that I could see.
VARIA
Member
An episode from Tim and Eric's Bedtime Stories has a similar plot. Haha, I really hope this is not the case.
Well Poe's mom got one of the force trees. So it's possible Poe is force sensitive which makes him an extraordinary pilot.
Like someone said earlier, they should have been the same character but not dead.
Doctoglethorpe
Member
The movie makes it seem like Kylo knows her without even using that cut line.
And the cut line reinforces it no matter which way you say it. "It IS you" may be a bit more blatant, but "it is YOU" can just as well be said like "you, the girl i know, you are the awakening I felt"
Or not. I dont really care that much about that line and what it means. The earlier one where he reacts to the information a jakku girl is involved is far more telling. That line alone, the moment he says it, made me think he knew her.
Them Han and Chewie act like they know her.
Then Leia acts like she knows her.
Then Luke acts like he knows her.
Btw since we forgot, we all assumed to know her before the movie released because she looks like them, duh.
Shes so a Skywalker its ridiculous.
And the cut line reinforces it no matter which way you say it. "It IS you" may be a bit more blatant, but "it is YOU" can just as well be said like "you, the girl i know, you are the awakening I felt"
Or not. I dont really care that much about that line and what it means. The earlier one where he reacts to the information a jakku girl is involved is far more telling. That line alone, the moment he says it, made me think he knew her.
Them Han and Chewie act like they know her.
Then Leia acts like she knows her.
Then Luke acts like he knows her.
Btw since we forgot, we all assumed to know her before the movie released because she looks like them, duh.
Shes so a Skywalker its ridiculous.
Probably. But that won't sell as many toys
When the first teaser released I thought she was meant to be Han and Leia's daughter.
Doctoglethorpe
Member
Almost all of us did. But why are people so adamant that she can't be Luke's daughter instead? Its crazy. It seems to me like the denial is a knee jerk reaction to being wrong on the first guess, even though its the logical backup.
To me its more of hoping that she isn't Luke's daughter because that's so predictable and not surprising. Like if they were gonna make it so predictable just tell us in the first movie. Don't make us wait 2 years for a "Duh, everyone coulda guessed that" moment. I want something to make me go, "Damn, didnt see that coming!"
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