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[gimz]

where is DQX?

 

[HK-47]

Dead Island was better than I was expecting, Deus Ex was pretty disappointing.

Why wasn't Tomb Raider actually playable?
Uh, Hereoes of Ruin showed promise I suppose.

how could DX be disappointing? have you read the GAF impressions from the leaked demo?

 

[galian beast]

You do know that those games had a good-to-decent reception (probably not for 358/2 and obviously not including Versus XIII), you could throw in TWEWY too since Nomura was the "creative director" or something.

If you take Nomura out of the picture, the only premiere directors you'll have are Tabata (Crisis Core) and Minagawa (Tactics Ogre PSP, Final Fantasy XII). Dunno if you want to consider Toriyama as a director of premiere titles.

Kitase died?

 

[faridmon]

You do know that those games had a good-to-decent reception (probably not for 358/2 and obviously not including Versus XIII), you could throw in TWEWY too since Nomura was the "creative director" or something.

If you take Nomura out of the picture, the only premiere directors you'll have are Tabata (Crisis Core) and Minagawa (Tactics Ogre PSP, Final Fantasy XII). Dunno if you want to consider Toriyama as a director of premiere titles.

Tabata is an Example of what is wrong with SE these days. He is an aweful director.

 

[ULTROS!]

Kitase died?

What was the last game he directed?

Fake Edit: I guess you can give credit to Toriyama, he did sort of direct FFX.

 

[kitzkozan]

They can't, a lot of the talent left, they're never going to get people like Matsuno back, it's like Capcom, your best creative guys like Kamiya and Mikami are gone.

True, but Capcom is nowhere near as bad as SE these days. They can still release solid fighting games and Street fighter III: 3rd strike online look awesome. I'm sure Capcom will still be able to release decent games while they search for creative talent and eventually try to fix the bad management. It's hard to understand how or why SE is so bad, even if awful management is obvious.

 

[Yuterald]

Square barely has any good internal people/teams left and I believe that is one of the biggest problems. The SaGa games still look good, but they don't bring that shit out of their region! They have themselves to blame for poor management and decisions.

 

[Lesiroth]

They essentially tried to play king maker with the xbox360 but it didn't pan out the way they had hoped, one can always argue there's money left on the table with the 360 in terms of multiplatform titles but the platform has yet to get its foot in the door in Japan and the exclusive titles basically did nothing for the 360 when all is said and done. The result is of course a weaker PS3 and a fragmented market, and now they lack a dedicated console userbase in Japan for their games, the problem is that this problem affects other publishers as well, Capcom took the same approach, but they're not mainly a JRPG publisher.



It actually makes no sense why their fans would rebuy the same game on multiple systems, the userbase essentially is asking to be milked.

It seems like they vastly overestimated the significance of their games, and their position.

I'm a big fan of Gon Freaks myself. Which they kept the series going.

Yeah it might be a symptom, I'm not sure, but I think you should treat the symptoms.

Shame about the abrupt anime of the anime

 

[ULTROS!]

Square barely has any good internal people/teams left and I believe that is one of the biggest problems. The SaGa games still look good, but they don't bring that shit out of their region! They have themselves to blame for poor management and decisions.

The closest SaGa game you'll get this gen is The Last Remnant (if you disregard the SaGa 2 and 3 remakes for the DS). Dunno if you've tried it or not though.

 

[H_Prestige]

I think HD Collections of PS2/PSP games are very likely for a quick buck; in addition to that, I think it'd be a very, very smart thing for Squeenix to start to leverage their back catalog as you say and start doing remakes of their SNES-era catalog on the PSV and/or 3DS.

They have some of the most valuable properties on the ps2 they could port to HD.

FFX, X-2, XI, XII Internationals
KH, KH CoM, KH2 Final Mixes
DQ8

That's a lot of easy money and very good for getting their core fan base interested again.

 

[H_Prestige]

Sales don't equal quality, but when a game sells that much, you have to believe that there are a lot of people who would be looking forward to the sequel. Besides, the game was nowhere near as poorly received as some people would have you believe.

The sequel would just be the very next FF game. 6 million isn't special for an FF game. By that reasoning, every FF game since VII needed a part 2.

XIII sold fine, but it was reviewed terribly compared to all the recent FF's. That's what people mean by "no one asked for a part 2".

 

[Cheesemeister]

I'm embarrassed for S-E. Wada hasn't learned what farmers did millennia ago.

Crop rotation avoids a decrease in soil fertility, as growing the same crop in the same place for many years in a row disproportionately depletes the soil of certain nutrients. With rotation, crops that leaches the soil of one kind of nutrient is followed during the next growing season by a dissimilar crop that returns that nutrient to the soil or draws a different ratio of nutrients, for example, rice followed by cotton.

Give Final Fantasy a rest. Stop with the endless remakes and spin-offs. Let some demand get pent up.

In the meantime, appealing to followers of dormant IPs and relaunching them to bring in new players would go a long way to ease FF fatigue.

Oh, and fire Nomura.

 

[pancakesandsex]

Kitase died?

::Channels Segata Sanshiro's wandering soul::

Worse, he was promoted.

 

[Momo]

Segata Sanshiro's

Would be so epic if he made a dupe to come troll us all

 

[Hcoregamer00]

I think the thread covered the main issue, which was losing sight of what made Square great. The moment they stopped focusing on storytelling, interesting gameplay, great cast of characters, AND a regular release schedule is the moment they lost focus on what made them great.

Don't forget that they released an incredible game lineup in a short period of time on the PS1 and PS2 days. With the DS and PSP's easy to develop hardware, they could have easily done it again. While they did focus on those consoles, they didn't focus enough on making interesting new potential hit franchises like The World Ends With You. Instead they pile remake after remake of the same game we played over and over.

That isn't the biggest problem, they spent a LONG time making Final Fantasy Type 0 on a console where it shold have been easy to pump out 3 quality games over the same time period. Hell, why did they name this Final Fantasy? The franchise could have easily been called something else and the quality and word of mouth would have easily pushed this into another important future franchise. Even on handheld consoles, their business and marketing strategy has been nothing short horrible.

As a gamer and as a business person, what they are doing befuddles me. There are thousands of companies who wish that they had SquareEnix's talent, franchises, and rich history, yet they are squandering it when they could have easily capitalized on a captive audience of handheld console-loving fans.

 

[Momo]

There are thousands of companies who wish that they had SquareEnix's talent,

They are kinda ruining their next generation of talent by turning them into cobble stone girls though

 

[Rentahamster]

In the meantime, appealing to followers of dormant IPs and relaunching them to bring in new players would go a long way to ease FF fatigue.

I would go giddy over a new Bushido Blade.

 

[Ahoi-Brause]

Noctis looks like yet another self-centered, moody teenager.

This.
I wonder what's driving japan to create narcistic asshole characters like those in such high numbers... why do they do this? How did they come from self-sacrificial heroes like kenshiro to whiny angsty egoists drowing in self-pity that only care about their own tortuuureeed feeeelings?
Does this appeal to anyone except yaoi fangirls?

 

[DaBuddaDa]

This.
I wonder what's driving japan to create narcistic asshole characters like those in such high numbers... why do they do this?

These games are explicitly said to be aimed at teenagers. It should be pretty obvious from there.

 

[GeorgioCostanzaX]

True, but Capcom is nowhere near as bad as SE these days. They can still release solid fighting games and Street fighter III: 3rd strike online look awesome. I'm sure Capcom will still be able to release decent games while they search for creative talent and eventually try to fix the bad management. It's hard to understand how or why SE is so bad, even if awful management is obvious.

Asura's Wrath and Dragon's Dogma look great as well. I really don't get the hate for Capcom aside from them not announcing a new Oni FUCKING Musha! As far as Square goes, like others have said, they seem incapable of handling multiplatform development well particularly with the art heavy titles they are known for.

 

[Terrell]

Smaller games, with a singular vision. That's what they need. For fucks sake, they PUBLISH Dragon Quest. That model is the savior of their business and they don't even know it.

I wholeheartedly agree. Heck, out of all the games developed internally by Square Enix, the one I keep going back to with frequency is My Life As A Darklord, and it doesn't get any simpler than that. And even within their own business model, Chaos Rings sells like gangbusters and made them enough cash to do a sequel.
As scary as it might be, perhaps the time for new IPs that are developed on a smaller scale to grow their business.

 

[Vilam]

Funny, I posted this as my facebook status on day 2 of the show...

"First time I ever wanted to spend a chunk of time in Square-Enix's booth. Acquiring Eidos really helped them out... and I guess really helped Eidos as well. Nice to see that deal working out for everyone involved."

Guess he had the same thoughts.

 

[Brandon F]

Reminds me of CES '94 in Chicago(pre-E3). Square had one tiny little kiosk with a semi-translated FFVI on the floor.

Of course at the time FF didn't have the branding in the US it eventually did, but it was the highlight of the show for me(outside of Mario All-Stars) and the industry didn't give a shit.

Wish I had a picture still of that lonely little kiosk. It would be hilarious to show today.

 

[Rpgmonkey]

Not sure how much it would help, but it'd be nice to see promising people within the company get their chance to shine and make a new IP, or let the old guys experiment more. It seems like almost everyone at SE isn't doing much anymore besides something based on the Kingdom Hearts or Final Fantasy properties.

One of the things I liked about late 80s-late 90s Square was that while it was apparent Final Fantasy was the core IP of the company, they had lots of "side games" that came out inbetween FF games, like SaGa, Mana, Parasite Eve, and Chrono, in addition to one-shot games like Live-A-Live.

 

[badcrumble]

Asura's Wrath and Dragon's Dogma look great as well. I really don't get the hate for Capcom aside from them not announcing a new Oni FUCKING Musha! As far as Square goes, like others have said, they seem incapable of handling multiplatform development well particularly with the art heavy titles they are known for.

People are upset with Capcom because their new franchises this gen are not that impressive and because they've dropped the ball horribly on Resident Evil and Devil May Cry. They've been great as far as fighting games are concerned, but they've allowed some of their very best franchises to wither on the vine.

 

[Freeza Under The Shower]

Eidos saving the day.
Now who would have predicted that in recent years? Anyone feeling lucky enough to say 'I' and get torn to pieces for it?
Somewhere, I find this to be excellent news to be quite honest. Eidos has published about the only IPs I give a damn about (Deus Ex, Legacy of Kain, Thief) and I am quite pleased to see it return to glory. (and even Just Cause 2, ffs)

As for the "Japanese" aspect: TWEWY had global appeal (even if it was never promoted and bombed as a result), FF has bored people to tears in it's last FOUR outings. Bury it and start doing adventurous things like TWEWY. It can't be that hard.

crop rotation, indeed.

 

[Rei_Toei]

In my more cynical moments I expect SE to keep their shit together for at least another 5-10 years capitalizing re-releases, HD remakes, handheld remakes and ports, combined with more fan-service Final Fantasy side-projects. And they'll probably will, occasionally

Spoiler

accidentally

make a good, if not great, game.

What I hope will happen is they get their shit together, bring down the amount of projects, build smaller games (I've got no problem with more of a focus on digitale distribution and handhelds) and rebooting the important stuff, mainly Final Fantasy. If there's still some expertise in 2D left at SE I'd wish they'd capitalize that. They used to be good at it and it isn't dead, not on handhelds and digital distribution. Vanilla is getting attention by the boatloads just by showing really pretty HD 2D graphics. SE should be there too.

 

[perfectnight]

Eidos saving the day.
Now who would have predicted that in recent years? Anyone feeling lucky enough to say 'I' and get torn to pieces for it?
Somewhere, I find this to be excellent news to be quite honest. Eidos has published about the only IPs I give a damn about (Deus Ex, Legacy of Kain, Thief) and I am quite pleased to see it return to glory. (and even Just Cause 2, ffs)

As for the "Japanese" aspect: TWEWY had global appeal (even if it was never promoted and bombed as a result), FF has bored people to tears in it's last FOUR outings. Bury it and start doing adventurous things like TWEWY. It can't be that hard.

crop rotation, indeed.

Hell yes. This industry needs more DE, LoK and Thief! S-E must stay alive for that reason only.

 

[Go_Ly_Dow]

Noctis looks like yet another self-centered, moody teenager.

Nomura said he would be the opposite of this, IIRC.

 

[MidgarBlowedUp]

Final Fantasy 12 has single-handedly pwned everything Squeenix has produced this entire generation. I do love my Tomb Raider though so at least something good came out of all of it.

 

[AgentChris]

I hope the reason a lot of Japanese games were missing was because they are saving them for TGS.

 

[Dr. Kitty Muffins]

I think they should condense the best talent into just a few studios (I don't care if they cut some exisiting projects) and then open some brand new studios from scratch to build new IP's with.

 

[H_Prestige]

Final Fantasy 12 has single-handedly pwned everything Squeenix has produced this entire generation.

+1

 

[Shalashaska161]

Final Fantasy 12 has single-handedly pwned everything Squeenix has produced this entire generation. I do love my Tomb Raider though so at least something good came out of all of it.

Agreed. That game felt like the future, and then XIII had to go and ruin it.

 

[Special J]

^is this reality? i thought xii was pretty much hated by all. i dont feel so alone now :3

i loved programming the partner's a.i. (gambit system)

 

[DarkKyo]

^is this reality? i thought xii was pretty much hated by all. i dont feel so alone now :3

I also loved XII.

 

[Fimbulvetr]

And don't get me on FF13. This was a final fantasy so entirely lacking in ambition, it almost makes me cry thinking this was a company I grew up with.

It didn't lack ambition, it lacked direction.

A problem that existed with XII, but it wasn't nearly as bad.

 

[Relaxed Muscle]

No wonder.

No Type-0, no versus, no KH 3DS, not even that awful looking chocobo game for 3DS, but also no new 3DS announcements or vita ones. I wonder why the japanese division went to the E3.

 

[beyond-digital]

This happens when you have a fool running the company like Wada.

 

[MalboroRed]

Nomura said he would be the opposite of this, IIRC.

So Nomura is making Noctis the opposite of a self-centered, moody teenager by making Noctis into a self-centered, moody teenager?

^is this reality? i thought xii was pretty much hated by all. i dont feel so alone now :3

i loved programming the partner's a.i. (gambit system)

I love FFXII, my favorite FF on the PS2.

 

[Cmagus]

pfft embarrasing seems to be becoming an excuse with these guys but I agree the lack of japanese games was sad I am interested in FFXIII-2 but I really wanted to see some more JRPG's.

Square enix wont change unless they restructure that company the entire thing seems incompetent at times and its sad because the teams at square have some serious talent but it seems like those running it are out of touch and the fact it takes them years to make a game.I wonder how much people will put up with stuff like this though I mean it seems like no matter how this company fucks up the fans are so loyal that they can get away with it if it was 95% of any other company out there people would tell them to take a hike.

 

[Jeels]

The sequel would just be the very next FF game. 6 million isn't special for an FF game. By that reasoning, every FF game since VII needed a part 2.

XIII sold fine, but it was reviewed terribly compared to all the recent FF's. That's what people mean by "no one asked for a part 2".

You are still ignoring all his points. If any FF post VII got an announces sequel, there would be people paying attention.

 

[DaBuddaDa]

^is this reality? i thought xii was pretty much hated by all. i dont feel so alone now :3

XII was critically lauded (92 meta) and every Final Fantasy game has tons of fans and detractors. I don't think XII is hated any more than any other Final Fantasy. Each game is pretty polarizing (besides IX).

 

[Cmagus]

XII was my favourite in the entire series

 

[Magnus]

Agreed. That game felt like the future, and then XIII had to go and ruin it.

It really *did* feel like the future...

 

[Special J]

honestly square enix should just make shorter games 15-20 hours for the core story game and polish the hell outta that.

then the side story/optional stuff kinda less produced this will help their games so much. they would release games in a time and be more relevant. take fallout3/oblivion/masseffect1 for example all the side mission/story related stuff are recycled crap but it doesnt affect reviews because reviewers focus on the core game since they are under deadlines. hell even most gamers now are the same way (gafers seem like they have at least a 10 game backlog), and the hardcore loyalists are going to love the game regardless.

they need better development direction, focus on things that matter and not spend it all on making lightnings hair perfect in every shot

 

[Aeana]

^is this reality? i thought xii was pretty much hated by all. i dont feel so alone now :3

i loved programming the partner's a.i. (gambit system)

What happened was that the next game in the series came out, so people chilled out on the last one they hated. Happens with Zelda too.

 

[Go_Ly_Dow]

Would love another XII style game, but only if Matsuno is at the helm. The lack of Type-0 at E3 annoyed me greatly.

So Nomura is making Noctis the opposite of a self-centered, moody teenager by making Noctis into a self-centered, moody teenager?

Haha, here's what I could find anyway. There was a bit more about his character somewhere.

Noct isn’t an unsociable person but he is shy.
He usually smiles except for the party scene where he meets Stella. He tries to hide his shyness by acting in a calm, confident manner.
It’s difficult to define his character. It’s hard to tell what’s really going on inside.

http://finalfantasy-xiii.net/2008/1...erview-what-you-should-know-about-noctis.html

Judging from his dialog in the latest he came across as loud and hot headed.

 

[Negator]

Agreed. That game felt like the future, and then XIII had to go and ruin it.

Ugh. If XII was the future, that is a future I don't want to be a part of.

 

[darkhunger]

XII was critically lauded (92 meta) and every Final Fantasy game has tons of fans and detractors. I don't think XII is hated any more than any other Final Fantasy. Each game is pretty polarizing (besides IX).

Eh... IX was pretty polarizing too, with certain people hating on its character designs, story, and slow as molass battle system.

EDIT - You should have said, "Each game is pretty polarizing (besides XIV)." XIV is hated by everybody.