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Opinion Star Citizen redefine "ahead of it's time", Needs The Industry To Catch Up To It

MegaZoneEX

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I'll try to keep this short.

Just watched a video review of the new Assassin's Creed where the reviewer had emphasis how open and beautiful the world is.

Jokingly, in the comments, someone alluded to Assassin's Creed 50 open world would be the entire earth. Mentally I said to my self "if that's the case, then Star Citizen would be done''

That got me thinking.

With all of the technology being used in Star Citizen, all of the new discoveries in it's feature set, and the amount of advancement in gaming it hope to achieve, we could all agree it's one of those moments where something within a giving category, gaming, tries to push forward. It's ahead of it time.

but what if it's not?

What if rather than being the game that pushes the gaming Industry forward, Star Citizen Instead needs the Industry to catch up for it to be ready?

I'm no Star Citizen defender in it's development cycle but, Star citizen might need everything that its trying to achieve to already be standards in gaming.

Analogy: it's not the same case like the first Apple iPhone where the technologies were there but haven't been put together in one product. In SC case, to my understanding, most of the tech, though somewhat present yet not being used, are being built themselves.

And when you add in that the gaming industry has shifted from client, instance base PC MMOs to server cloud Mobile MMOs, Star Citizen seems even more.... Far far away.
 
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Abriael_GN

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Star Citizen's tech has been progressing pretty steadily. At this point, it has reached the point in which the tech isn't the issue anymore (there are two big things left, and at the rate they've been going over the past 2 years, I seriously doubt these two will go beyond 2021), but making content to complement the tech.
 
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ethomaz

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It was one of the few games that indeed tried to push the PC gaming industry forward without rely in the new consoles hardware push... that generated a lot of issues to them that even if they took time they happily fixed most of them.

Now with next-gen consoles that push transition will be faster and easier.
 
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diffusionx

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Guess someone with a Pokemon avatar would have absolutely no idea of the existence of something called "innovation," let alone knowing how it works. 😂

Yes, I have a fat Pikachu avatar not because I like fat Pikachu, but because I only play Pokemon, and I do not know innovation, especially when it presents as some cult-like company throwing out cobbled together shit so old boomers can spend their kids' inheritance on $1000 JPEGs to chase the dragon and try to relive their youth playing Wing Commander.
 
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Starfield

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Making more then 1 new star citizen thread in a year should be an instant ban on gaf.
 

ThatGamingDude

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Guess someone with a Pokemon avatar would have absolutely no idea of the existence of something called "innovation," let alone knowing how it works. 😂
Forgive my ignorance, but isn't your avatar an anime character?
Funny ass self-aware reaction here
I was gonna legit tag you in this thread if you weren't already watching it lmao

Bias for the game aside, whatcha think of OPs take?
 

Abriael_GN

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Yes, I have a fat Pikachu avatar not because I like fat Pikachu, but because I only play Pokemon, and I do not know innovation, especially when it presents as some cult-like company throwing out cobbled together shit so old boomers can spend their kids' inheritance on $1000 JPEGs to chase the dragon and try to relive their youth playing Wing Commander.

Apparently, not only you don't have the slightest idea of what innovation is, but you also know nothing about the state of this specific project. The Jpeg meme is so out of touch and obsolete that it's the perfect telltale sign of someone wearing their ignorance on their sleeve. With over 100 ships perfectly flyable and growing, Star Citizen is well-beyond that.

But hey, keep regurgitating old reddit memes to show how dreadfully ignorant you are while you grind your Pikachu to level 100 for the 20th time. 😂

Forgive my ignorance, but isn't your avatar an anime character?

Not really. Mind you, even Anime had more innovation than Pokemon over the past 20 years.
 
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Nickolaidas

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Yes, I have a fat Pikachu avatar not because I like fat Pikachu, but because I only play Pokemon, and I do not know innovation, especially when it presents as some cult-like company throwing out cobbled together shit so old boomers can spend their kids' inheritance on $1000 JPEGs to chase the dragon and try to relive their youth playing Wing Commander.
DAMN, BRO!
 

jaysius

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It was one of the few games that indeed tried to push the PC gaming industry forward without rely in the new consoles hardware push... that generated a lot of issues to them that even if they took time they happily fixed most of them.

Now with next-gen consoles that push transition will be faster and easier.

We'll be on PS6 by the time this thing is ready for a console.
 

ethomaz

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We'll be on PS6 by the time this thing is ready for a console.
That was not my point.

99% of games on PC are hold by console hardware... very few like Star Citizen tries to push the industry ahead without need a new generation of console hardware.
 
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Fbh

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At now over $300 million (and raising) it definitely should be a game pushing things forward and not waiting for the rest of the industry and other games with lower budgets to create the tech it needs.

But they need to hurry up with this or by the time it's actually out it will be old news. The graphics have already gone from "amazing" "next gen" and "an example of the amazing stuff you can do on PC when it's not held back by shitty consoles" to " It looks nice but it also looks like the console we are getting in a couple of days can easily run it"
 
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AJUMP23

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They envisioned the game to be state of the art, not beyond current technical capabilities. They just killed themselves with Scope creep. So far they have overpromised and underdelivered.
 

Starfield

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I was gonna legit tag you in this thread if you weren't already watching it lmao

Bias for the game aside, whatcha think of OPs take?
I wanted to reply but I was busy so, yeah actually I agree. The tech CIG is developing or has developed is amazing. Like truly something you don't see in any game yet.

Yes they don't have raytracing in the game but thats not their focus right now and if they wanted to implement it they can do it once the important parts of the game are in place.

They've made milestones in things like:

  • never before seen procedual tech at planet size
  • procedual tech with varying biomes such as complete city worlds
  • a physics grid system for ships in CryEngine with rooms that can change in size on the fly (eg. docking)
  • 64bit coordinate system
  • a never before seen detailed world that even in its current barren state is much more impressive than most if not any open world game that ever came out (that part is a bit exeggerated but in theory its true)
  • everything in the system is a real thing or will be at some point. a cargo isnt just some values in your ship, cargo physically exists and you have to load it on your ship and unload it. People can steal or destroy it, youll have to manage it, etc..
  • there is so much that this game is already doing right now but once all other puzzles come into place its going to be something never seen or done before, time will tell when that happens and yes there is still alot of sceptism but so far CIG has always delivered on their promises...except for release dates :p

The game doesn't look outdated as of today. It still looks on par with most next gen games or slightly better.

Graphis are also something you can work on in the end. When all of the core tech or main features are implemented.
Like I said, stuff like Ray Tracing or other stuff can always be implemented. Afaik textures aren't even at full rez right now, you can always improve the quality of textures. Assets are already at modern standards you'd expect.
 
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Exede

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So far i had a lot of fun in this alpha. And the tech behind the *not yet game* is pretty amazing.
 

Bo_Hazem

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I wanted to reply but I was busy so, yeah actually I agree. The tech CIG is developing or has developed is amazing. Like truly something you don't see in any game yet.

Yes they don't have raytracing in the game but thats not their focus right now and if they wanted to implement it they can do it once the important parts of the game are in place.

They've made milestones in things like:

  • never before seen procedual tech at planet size
  • procedual tech with varying biomes such as complete city worlds
  • a physics grid system for ships in CryEngine with rooms that can change in size on the fly (eg. docking)
  • 64bit coordinate system
  • a never before seen detailed world that even in its current barren state is much more impressive than most if not any open world game that ever came out (that part is a bit exeggerated but in theory its true)
  • everything in the system is a real thing or will be at some point. a cargo isnt just some values in your ship, cargo physically exists and you have to load it on your ship and unload it. People can steal or destroy it, youll have to manage it, etc..
  • there is so much that this game is already doing right now but once all other puzzles come into place its going to be something never seen or done before, time will tell when that happens and yes there is still alot of sceptism but so far CIG has always delivered on their promises...except for release dates :p

It was so ambitious, or too ambitious, or too greedy. All of them apply to the situation. I was eagerly waiting for this game, but it's not coming out.

I would wait for Ubisoft's Beyond Good and Evil 2 to fill the void.
 
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jaysius

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I wanted to reply but I was busy so, yeah actually I agree. The tech CIG is developing or has developed is amazing. Like truly something you don't see in any game yet.

Yes they don't have raytracing in the game but thats not their focus right now and if they wanted to implement it they can do it once the important parts of the game are in place.

They've made milestones in things like:

  • never before seen procedual tech at planet size
  • procedual tech with varying biomes such as complete city worlds
  • a physics grid system for ships in CryEngine with rooms that can change in size on the fly (eg. docking)
  • 64bit coordinate system
  • a never before seen detailed world that even in its current barren state is much more impressive than most if not any open world game that ever came out (that part is a bit exeggerated but in theory its true)
  • everything in the system is a real thing or will be at some point. a cargo isnt just some values in your ship, cargo physically exists and you have to load it on your ship and unload it. People can steal or destroy it, youll have to manage it, etc..
  • there is so much that this game is already doing right now but once all other puzzles come into place its going to be something never seen or done before, time will tell when that happens and yes there is still alot of sceptism but so far CIG has always delivered on their promises...except for release dates :p

The game doesn't look outdated as of today. It still looks on par with most next gen games or slightly better.

Graphis are also something you can work on in the end. When all of the core tech or main features are implemented.
Like I said, stuff like Ray Tracing or other stuff can always be implemented. Afaik textures aren't even at full rez right now, you can always improve the quality of textures. Assets are already at modern standards you'd expect.

If they don't have some excellent procedurally generated stories and other stuff to make those Cities come to life, then there's no point in making them generate, just making blocks appear and look nice is one thing, giving those things PURPOSE is an entirely different thing.
 

Starfield

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If they don't have some excellent procedurally generated stories and other stuff to make those Cities come to life, then there's no point in making them generate, just making blocks appear and look nice is one thing, giving those things PURPOSE is an entirely different thing.
They are working on a system now called "Quanta" which exactly does what you described...and more. If its going to add interesting stories or places to city worlds...I highly doubt it but it WILL give the universe the feeling of being a living and breathing thing.

 

iHaunter

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It's actually quite impressive what they do have now. But outsourcing your FPS to another studio for millions of dollars was a dumb idea. It delayed the FPS by 2 years. Also doing SQ42 and SC at the same time with a studio less than 1k people was also a dumb idea.
 
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Even if SC comes out with a full release one of these years, any idea how big the download will be?

What's this game going to be? 1 TB?
 
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lefty1117

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It feels like for all of the energy and resource being pumped into it, the SC wheels aren't turning as they should. Like a few pistons are misfiring. It could be that there are elements of the technology that they've had to build rather than buy or license and this has set their progress back a great deal. With that perspective, being ahead of its time or needing the industry to catch up is a valid point of view in my opinion. I'm just not convinced that they've made the best decisions in terms of how they've gone about the build, the prioritization and focus (or lack of). The polar opposite approach to study is that of Elite Dangerous - a complete and high performing game, but seemingly limited in depth, that has opted to release with a narrow focus and add on from there. Whereas SC is putting it all in at once. Either way, it will prove for an interesting study years down the road when the industry can look back and decide on which approach worked better.
 
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I play games, don't make them. I make other things, like you, and other people here with various professions. Do you make your movies as well?
No I don't. Just so much inertia in minds. I'm a backer since 2018 and oh boy it's so much better than older builds.

I don't mind about when project started - it's never feels old because the tech gets updates constantly. It's making progress faster and faster. I never saw in other games what I saw I SC. Online fun is just incredible. Absolutely worth $60.
 
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Bo_Hazem

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No I don't. Just so much inertia in minds. I'm a backer since 2018 and oh boy it's so much better than older builds.

I don't mind about when project started - it's never feels old because the tech gets updates constantly. It's making progress faster and faster. I never saw in other games what I saw I SC. Online fun is just incredible. Absolutely worth $60.

I really hope it comes to its complete form, my PC is ready!
 
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There are some really amazing nextgen features in the project like their I/O asset streaming tech that makes use of an NVME M.2 drive, more than just load times like every other PC game out there. Their custom server meshing and most importantly the very impressive object container streaming tech written into their engine side of things, which is responsible for the insane level of detail on planetary terrain/tessellation and which eventually leads into their FTL travel mechanic.

That said, without content, the backers and the constructive critics (not trolls) aren't wrong in saying that the project is grossly mismanaged, in desparate need of an industry veteran producer who can get things done on time + hit milestones, and not turn into a feature creep even further.

The existing systems are enough. Build the game's content now, instead of chasing something like the ray tracing dream and starting all over again with another goddamn "roadmap".
 

Bboy AJ

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I've been excited for Scam Citizen for a very long time. That said, I don't even think about it anymore. If the developers want to continue riding the backs of whales and take advantage of them, ok. Frankly, if this "amazing tech" were built on the wallets of a publisher, they would have had something out by now for sure. I'm ignoring the game until it's properly out. Until then, there are plenty of other games to play.
 

Ribi

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Yes, I have a fat Pikachu avatar not because I like fat Pikachu, but because I only play Pokemon, and I do not know innovation, especially when it presents as some cult-like company throwing out cobbled together shit so old boomers can spend their kids' inheritance on $1000 JPEGs to chase the dragon and try to relive their youth playing Wing Commander.
No sure of you're talking about star citizen or pokemon here.
 

namekuseijin

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the industry will catch up to Star Citizen in 10 years, when it's finally released
 

magaman

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the industry will catch up to Star Citizen in 10 years, when it's finally released

It will not release within the next 10 years, at least not with its current scope. There is simply no way.

Entire backend systems are nonexistent. The flight model (for a space game) is not done. Dozens of ships to release. 100 systems promised, and 1 delivered after 8 years of dev. Entire gameplay loops (medical, salvage, engineering, discovery, and many more) have not even seen their first iterations.

They have to integrate base building, pets, farming, trading, dynamic economy, dynamic missions, NPC roles (e.g. pilot, gunner, etc.), physicalized components, docking, and dozens more.

Even if they released one new solar system per month, it would take them 8 years from this point. We have seen one solar system in 8 years.

To give you an idea as to how absurd this is, they're teasing that we may see medical gameplay in some form in 2021. That's one gameplay system out of literally dozens to be done, and they're 6+ months out in showing anything of substance.

Now couple in that NPCs have to populate the universe. Now couple in the fact that thousands of players are supposed to connect to the same instances.

It is not going to happen.
 
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Lort

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So now i know what they REALLY mean by ahead of its time...
 

Skifi28

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I'm sure it's going to release in 10 years when the industry finally catches up. They're doing this as a favor to everyone else apparently, good guys.
 
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ShadowNate

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Company with zero games released aims to push industry forward and/or waits for the tech to catch up, 8 years in development, after selling (concept) ships, collector's packages and land for $100+, with misleading trailers, and fake demos on annual conventions. Latest updates include preparing a roadmap for a roadmap.

Or, it is a scam.

Should be an easy call.
 
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DeepEnigma

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Yes, I have a fat Pikachu avatar not because I like fat Pikachu, but because I only play Pokemon, and I do not know innovation, especially when it presents as some cult-like company throwing out cobbled together shit so old boomers can spend their kids' inheritance on $1000 JPEGs to chase the dragon and try to relive their youth playing Wing Commander.
 

ReBurn

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It still amazes me how people just keep throwing money at this game. Do people want to believe this "ahead of its time" thing because they don't want to admit they're being taken for a ride?
 

LordOfChaos

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What if rather than being the game that pushes the gaming Industry forward, Star Citizen
fucking launched
 
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DeepEnigma

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It still amazes me how people just keep throwing money at this game. Do people want to believe this "ahead of its time" thing because they don't want to admit they're being taken for a ride?

Or, now hear me out...

They are essentially paying for an MMO that updates over time. Like all MMOs and Season Pass games within the past 2 decades.
 

magaman

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It still amazes me how people just keep throwing money at this game. Do people want to believe this "ahead of its time" thing because they don't want to admit they're being taken for a ride?

Imagine spending $500+ on the game. Would you rather admit you're being scammed, or play nicely and defend your huge investment?

I feel sorry for those who spent anything on it. It may be worth playing in 5 years, but it'll literally take that long for it to reach any semblance of a game. I'm not joking - they have already projected what to expect in 2021, and it ain't much.
 
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DeepEnigma

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What if rather than being the game that pushes the gaming Industry forward, Star Citizen
fucking launched

If they slapped a "Launched" label on this at this point in time, would that make a psychological difference? Intradasting!

Take RDO for example. Was in "beta" for some time, then they launched it "out of beta", yet nothing really changed other than the labeling. It still gets updates like GTAO and the like. Bugs and all.
 

magaman

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If they slapped a "Launched" label on this at this point in time, would that make a psychological difference? Intradasting!

Take RDO for example. Was in "beta" for some time, then they launched it "out of beta", yet nothing really changed other than the labeling. It still gets updates like GTAO and the like. Bugs and all.

Yet RDO had gameplay loops. Additionally, you're comparing a game that took 5 years to concept and complete (Red Dead Redemption 2 + Online) and a game that has taken 8 years to deliver a glorified screenshot generator.
 
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LordOfChaos

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If they slapped a "Launched" label on this at this point in time, would that make a psychological difference? Intradasting!

Take RDO for example. Was in "beta" for some time, then they launched it "out of beta", yet nothing really changed other than the labeling. It still gets updates like GTAO and the like. Bugs and all.


I don't mean just changing a label, obviously, but stop chasing whizbang new features, put all efforts into launching a viable product, and do that. There's effectively many incomplete games within this currently. Do all you want later, but ship _something_, counteract the dwindling faith it'll ship in a final form at all.
 
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