crimzonflame
Member
$20 is a bit pricey tbh.
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Street Fighter X Tekken balance patch details
- Thread starter Oni Link 666
- Start date
I don't think it's overpriced though, It is 12 characters. I would prefer it to be $15.
crimzonflame
Member
For this game I think it is pricey. Will jilted fans fork over $20 for a game that they are weary about? They should have apologized said "We are sorry, here is free DLC for all our fans". Of course that would never happen, but Im still salty over this game.
Jilted fans aren't going to fork over any amount anyway since they already traded it in or snapped the disc in half.
crimzonflame
Member
Sorry, Im not singling you out or anything, but I have a serious question. How well do you think the DLC will sell?
Gokurakumaru
Banned
I'd buy a patched game with a complete roster in a second. But only at retail, on a disc I can take to a friend's house. If I buy the game and the DLC at this point I'll still be paying the equivalent of a brand new release game, only I'm doing it 6 months after launch and with half the utility of being able to carry it around.
Super Street Fighter X Tekken or bust for me.
Super Street Fighter X Tekken or bust for me.
Not a clue on the acutal numbers, but relatively speaking? Far worse than UMvC3. Possibly even worse than AE.
It's pretty sad but I wonder how much money they have lost from pissing off the fans instead of doing the right thing and releasing the content for free like it was suppose to. It seems people have voted with their wallets on this, is the DLC enough to cover the lost sales? Lets assume it isn't, was it worth it Capcom?
Slamtastic
Member
Am I the only one that still likes the core idea of the Tekken characters in a 2D game enough that I really WANT this game to end up good, and am glad to see continued support?
I'm not going to go back to SSFIV to play a good 2D fighter because its been out so long and gotten stale to me, and I won't play a Tekken game because I don't play 3D fighters.
I really want to like this game :/
I'm not going to go back to SSFIV to play a good 2D fighter because its been out so long and gotten stale to me, and I won't play a Tekken game because I don't play 3D fighters.
I really want to like this game :/
Grizzlyjin
Supersonic, idiotic, disconnecting, not respecting, who would really ever wanna go and top that
Full disclosure, I was hyped as hell for this game but dropped it after a month. I think it's great, didn't realize that the community backlash against it was so great. But even looking at my own experience with it, it didn't hook me like SSFIV or MvC3 did.
I really want this game to win the fighting game community over again. I'd hate for the 2d versions of the Tekken characters to disappear after this.
I have nothing against 3d fighters so I won't miss the Tekken cast. I do hope that future SF additions more closely resemble Julia, Lili and Marduk and less Viper/Seth/Fuerte/Abel in play style though.
Slamtastic
Member
I want to see the SF series incorporate the juggles, target combos, and stance/step style moves.
I guess Dudley, especially in 3S would be the closest SF comparison. I always considered that moving forward in quality for the series.
I agree, I think $10-$12.50 would have been the sweet spot for it, even people who were dis-illusioned but not entirely pissed off would have given it a go at that price. $20 seems like a good bit to pay when you're not even sure you want to get back into the game. Maybe they should roll the costume & colour DLC and the characters into a "mega-pack" for around $30 or something.
The commercial success angle was just one of four possible reasons, one Im quite happy to cede. I think the main reason they are supporting it is because a) they feel they can salvage it - at least enough to bring it up to projected levels and make use of already created work (i.e. the DLC), b) try and salvage a third major fighting game franchise over which they have more control and c) try and build the IP so it doesnt poison the Vita release and Tekken X SF in the future.
Triple Da G.O.D!
Member
No. But you'll be hard pressed to find few who agree because of what this game became versus what it and could be if an attitude adjustment toward the game would take place.
More or less, you're on your own. If you want this game to be good then it'll have to be good for just you regardless what the growing consensus is.
And if you're happy to see the continued support then you'll have to do some things your fellow peers don't quite see eye to eye with but you'll be happy with the game and that's the most important.
Unfortunately the implementation of Tekken characters in SFxT leaves a lot to be desired. They did not do a good job of making the characters feel or play similar to the way they do in Tekken.
To be fair that's a difficult task. But they didn't even really seem to try that much.
SouthernDragon
Member
Capcom's business mismanagement is kinda legendary to me at this point. Case studies could be written about them.
Raonak
Banned
I wonder what the tekken team feels about SFxT's huge backlash. I mean, after Tag2, they're gonna work of Tekken x Street Fighter. And I could see a lot of people confusing it as a release of this game.
That said, TxSF has barely started development, so it's probably still a year or three out.
That said, TxSF has barely started development, so it's probably still a year or three out.
storafötter
Member
I didn't think people hated this game that much. I was looking forward to getting it on the VITA but I guess best to wait and see how this patch goes.
Sir Garbageman
Member
storafötter;39820915 said:
General consensus is that it's one of the crappier 2D fighters released this gen for the various reasons mentioned in this thread. There are a lot of better games out there for you to spend your money on imo.
scytheavatar
Member
You are definitely not the only one, and unfortunately I'll advise you to give up because the problems SFxT have is way too severe to be fixed by a few patches. The patch notes fixes the things people were complaining about but they don't seem to fix the main issue that the game isn't very fun and needs more derp and cheap things rather than less of them.
I'll post here something I've posted in the SfXT community thread
I agree with lots of bad thing people say about the game, like pandora it's almost useless right now (let's hope they can fix it) and the giant stages without a reason, but every game has problems, and they are fun anyways, because there's a lot of good stuff in it, and I think that's the case.
And to people that are afraid to pick up this game now because there's a LOT of people talking shit about it, I know some people that hates MvC3, and there's people that don't like SFIV as well, and the games aren't dead or anything like it, SfxT has a lot of online players, and I know even some top players like the game.
SfXT ISN'T DEAD! And it's fucking fun ^^
I agree with lots of bad thing people say about the game, like pandora it's almost useless right now (let's hope they can fix it) and the giant stages without a reason, but every game has problems, and they are fun anyways, because there's a lot of good stuff in it, and I think that's the case.
And to people that are afraid to pick up this game now because there's a LOT of people talking shit about it, I know some people that hates MvC3, and there's people that don't like SFIV as well, and the games aren't dead or anything like it, SfxT has a lot of online players, and I know even some top players like the game.
SfXT ISN'T DEAD! And it's fucking fun ^^
It's been clear they've been worried about this game tarnishing the Tekken name- which is why Harada's been saying the stuff he's been saying and generally being awesome lately.
(see the no paid DLC chars when they had no problem doing it for SC games, and other stuff)
The problem with the timer is that they probably realized during the development of the game that most players would likely play this game the way SF4 is played; slow and steady, because it has a very similar style and overall speed. So they figure "Hey, let's make the timer very fast, so players will understand they shouldn't be zoning!" but the problem is the game's zoning tools are pretty powerful. Some characters are incredibly effective at keeping the rest of the cast out, and this encourages zoning - if you can't get in, you have to force them to make a mistake.
It's okay to have more defensive characters who have good defensive options, but the normal effective way to take those out is to zone them. In SFxT, you can't, because if you zone and turtle, you'll lose due to the timer.
And as the UltraDavid post pointed out, the super fast timer also brings in another problem: the time cost of certain actions. Time is a resource in every fighter, but this is one of the very few where many actions take much too long, therefore draining the resource like crazy. 10 seconds off the timer for a combo that doesn't do much damage is patently stupid, because that's 1/10th of the total time for the entire ROUND dedicated to low damage stuff. It also makes it much easier for players to abuse; the jab shit, even with alpha counters, is ridiculous, because it eats up SO MUCH of the timer that it's a new form of turtling.
If this game was played instead at SF4's pace in regards to the timer and damage (because seriously, long combos that do no damage is stupid, but it's SF4's scaling system in full effect - change that scaling so that single hits do not hit as hard but lower the aggressive scaling to put more emphasis on combos) it probably would be much more interesting. But as it stands, it's broken.
The timer is broken because it's too fast and too easy to abuse.
The gems are idiotic - they are an obvious cash grab that do not make much sense - the gem system could've been much more interesting if it was a groove-like system instead of showering players with gem packs and "customization" which isn't true customization and you could have a much better system.
The scaling plainly doesn't work. Capcom seems to have no idea how to handle long combos (Marvel is a pure example of that - everything is front-loaded with a get out of jail-free card that almost removes the scaling), especially in a SF4-like system.
There's a lot more problems: auto-combos which you can't turn off, the chain system that is supposed to help new players into combos which they seeminly can't even do (I've yet to make a newbie understand how those combos work), the Tekken characters who walk like they're in molasses all the time, not to mention are mostly useless: if you look at EVO, most of the teams had 2 Capcom characters, with the only Tekken character I saw being Julia, who is one of the strongest Tekken characters, etc.
A simple balance patch is not going to solve all these problems. Fixing the timer is one thing, but it won't fix the entire game. Hitbox and frame data changes isn't going to fix the game either.
They need to acknowledge that it's just broken and fix everything in one fell swoop, starting with their gem system, but that won't happen because they're convinced that "offering more gem packs and more gem possibilities will bring in more money", which is false; if they had gone with a groove-like system (or maybe a system similar to Arcana Heart 3, which has an insane number of "grooves") players would most likely buy a ton of grooves because they offer different gameplay options and make some characters more effective than others in specific grooves. But as it stands right now, it's never going to happen because they're much to far in with their system.
Booter
Member
agreed. I would have maybe paid $10 to try out Elena and Jack-X, but at $20 I will never purchase. this game has a bad reputation and I think Capcom could be doing more to improve that situation.
The issue w/ walk speed is the introduction of dashes.
I think if you're more familiar with 3d fighters, grapple characters will come easier to you,from their you can practice.You won't master the game in a day, i don't think you should give up.
I agree that gems are stupid, but I don't think it's a big factor (unless assist gems, that's broken), but combos don't do damage?! Magic series/launcher/two strongs+special do about 300 at least, that's almost the Super Combo damage of SF4, and combos with tags or simply using bar to do a EX do more than 350 damage, so the damage isn't low at all, because, even with damage scaling being the same as the SFIV, the combos are way longer.
Amazon ratings are a joke, people downrate stuff for the stupidest reasons (like mercenaries 3D and the save file "issue").
Bobby Roberts
Banned
$20 for 12 characters sounds like a decent deal, until you realize what a PR boondoggle this thing has been at pretty much every step; exploitative reality show spurring huge "sexism in gaming" debate, On disc DLC brouhaha, tournament attendees booing the game.
At that point, charging anything more than $10 dollars (at the MOST - it probably should be like, $5, or straight up free) just seems like a "what's the point" kinda move. The number of people still playing the game who will opt to purchase the DLC is probably gonna be less than half. So you're looking to make an extra 20 bucks off what, maybe 100k people at this point?
The idea should be to get more people who haven't bought the game to go out and get it - and this isn't going to entice a lot of people to go and grab it up after all that shit.
I know them just making it a free download is wishful thinking, but I wonder how many people, knowing that there's a balance patch, 12 extra characters and reworked mechanics, might instead go out and drop 40-60 on a game they hadn't previously owned, as opposed to maybe 100k people dropping 20 bucks on a DLC package for a game most people don't really wanna play.
At that point, charging anything more than $10 dollars (at the MOST - it probably should be like, $5, or straight up free) just seems like a "what's the point" kinda move. The number of people still playing the game who will opt to purchase the DLC is probably gonna be less than half. So you're looking to make an extra 20 bucks off what, maybe 100k people at this point?
The idea should be to get more people who haven't bought the game to go out and get it - and this isn't going to entice a lot of people to go and grab it up after all that shit.
I know them just making it a free download is wishful thinking, but I wonder how many people, knowing that there's a balance patch, 12 extra characters and reworked mechanics, might instead go out and drop 40-60 on a game they hadn't previously owned, as opposed to maybe 100k people dropping 20 bucks on a DLC package for a game most people don't really wanna play.
I do not understand why there has to be life recovery at all. You have two characters! your life recovery is switching them. This isn't supposed to be Marvel, where a round is long and hard. Rounds in SFxT should be fast and furious.
About the timer, yeah, it has to stop during supers. The counter for pandora stopping during supers would help pandora too, but IMHO the game is better without a silly comeback mechanic.
I wish the overall speed of the game would be increased too. I mostly mean the walking speed of the characters. Even rolento crawls along.
About the timer, yeah, it has to stop during supers. The counter for pandora stopping during supers would help pandora too, but IMHO the game is better without a silly comeback mechanic.
I wish the overall speed of the game would be increased too. I mostly mean the walking speed of the characters. Even rolento crawls along.
This is not actually always the case; some retailers (such as GAME) have a "pay only for what was sold" policy, so any stock they didn't manage to sell, they don't pay the publisher for (and return it). This is why retailers sometimes order the minimum amount required and run out of stock.
Interficium
Banned
Seraphinianus
Banned
would be $8 per character for Blaz Blue and there would be a disc only upgrade 2 months later that makes the purchase meaningless
finalboss2
Member
hmmm
RedNumberFive
Banned
Yup. I'd definitely pick up an all-in-one package, but I'm not buying into this game with the shameless nickel and diming going on at the moment.
Interficium
Banned
The only way they're saving this is with the "nuclear option" of making all the upcoming character DLC free as a mea culpa. You could get even the most hostile FGC players to come back to the game (at least for a couple weeks) with that.
The gems are a factor because believe it or not, the game is "balanced" around them, yet everyone disables them because they are just not *fun*.
As for the damage, the problem is that to do 300+ damage in a single combo, you have to spend an inordinate amount of time in a long-winded combo, which in turn kills the timer. And 300 damage isn't much when you effectively have at least 1600+ life (2 characters), but that's not the core of the issue.
The core of it is that the scaling is broken. In SF4 it's fine, because it's not a game meant for huge, long combos, and there is still a benefit to performing long combos that don't do as much damage: you can use that to build up stun, which doesn't exist in SFxT. The scaling hurts SFxT quite a bit too, because instead of rewarding long combos, like the system *should* do (long combos require more execution which in turn makes them more difficult) it just scales like crazy after the first few hits, making long combos nearly useless. In a game where the fighting system is completely made up of long chains, juggles and the like, this is *ridiculous*.
How is the balance in the game, now? I own it, but got disinterested quickly and left it due to jabjabjabjabjabjab and it seeming like certain characters had no chance due to how the system worked (Balrog, Bison, etc).
I also despised the lack of normal throw range since that screamed to me "they can't throw you, just turtle".
And yeah, $20 is great for a liked fighting game. It's horrible for a game with a bad rep trying to draw people back in.
That's not fair, but it's true.
I also despised the lack of normal throw range since that screamed to me "they can't throw you, just turtle".
And yeah, $20 is great for a liked fighting game. It's horrible for a game with a bad rep trying to draw people back in.
That's not fair, but it's true.
~Devil Trigger~
In favor of setting Muslim women on fire
Shouta
Member
But the thing is that a lot of combos can do a ton of damage if they're shortened so as not to get hit with the scaling. That's why the scaling is set in such a manner. With better scaling, a tekken character combo goes from 500 possible to 600-700 easy. The solution isn't changing the scaling but making getting the bigger hits into combos more viable so that characters can do much better damage rather than flat adjusting the scaling.
Of course, Capcom will probably adjust the scaling instead because it's easier. =/
Well I wouldn't just adjust the scaling by itself and not touch damage values - both need to work together for it be viable.
If, for example, damage values were reduced but scaling was adjusted so that longer combos would be rewarded more, it would make for a better and probably more "logical" system.
Say, your initial hit does 100%, the second does 95%, the third does 90%, the fourth 85%, etc. but your damage values are lower so that in the end, short combos will still do damage, and long combos will do more damage with the tradeoff that they are more difficult to execute and have a higher risk/reward ratio.
As it is right now, the system greatly encourages just frontloading your combos as much as possible and making them as short as possible because additional hits into them are worthless. Spending meter at the end of a combo is idiotic because the scaling has hit it so damn hard that you're not doing any sort of damage anymore. Getting hit with a 90% damage reduction modifier is, I doubt, anyone's definition of fun, nor is it fair.
In SF4, as I said, it works, because the game system is not about creating long combos, whereas it seems to be the focus of SFxT.