Support NeoGAF

[AniHawk]

Of course I'm not going to give NSMBW credit for introducing vertical power ups and Yoshi. Because it didn't introduce those things; it reintroduces them. For better or worse, it's still a game in the Super Mario Bros./2D Mario lineage. So I don't think it deserves any credit for bringing back old gameplay elements.

As for multiplayer, it's just a useless mode for me. Because NSMB is a 2D Mario game, the expectation for me, as I've grown up with the series, is that it will live and die on its singleplayer mode. The same for 3D World.

I wouldn't say that about a Mario Party game because those are made to be multiplayer games. But I also wouldn't buy a Mario Party game.

well just because it's useless to you doesn't mean it isn't a significant new feature. if i saw a screenshot of a mario game and saw two players at the same time, i would know right away that it was likely nsmbw or nsmbu

Well, you say "I'm not sure how much more you can evolve the series," but you give the example of the SML games that play quite differently with more of an action focus.

Honestly, I have no clue where to take the game design. I'm not a game developer. But I'm not willing to throw up my hands and declare that the series cannot evolve.

examples of the 2d series evolving from other installments that happened 20 years ago? if nsmb3 or nsmbu2: the joshua tree had an action focus or the same world structure that sml2 had, would you claim those entries to be weak because they're simply reintroducing things?

there's only so many ways you can make a world map. and i think at this point, we've pretty much figured out all of them. i'm not even limiting this to mario.

You could've said after Mario 64 and Sunshine, "Well, it should be somewhat clear where this is going from now on." And then they made Galaxy which really rocked my socks. For the most part, it pleased both people looking for new experiences and long-time fans of the series. It satisfied both critics and players.

super mario galaxy was essentially making a full game out of the fluddless segments from super mario sunshine. just a lot of abstract stuff happening with the addtion of gravity for an extra visual flair. gravity impacting the level design and how the player performed feats of platforming did not happen until smg2. smg2 also played with expectations like what happens when you flick your wii remote, or just where the hell most of the green stars are.

Sure, that's 3D Mario, but why give up on new ideas in 2D Mario? I'm critical because I truly believe EAD Kyoto could do better with 2D Mario. And at their best, EAD Tokyo are obviously very creative people. That's what makes it disappointing when they put out a game like 3D World.

well when people do suggest new ideas like the penguin suit/ice flower, multiplayer, and propeller hat, you suggest they don't matter or impact the way the game is played, when they're actually very essential to seeing the end of 9-8.

to me, 3d land was an extremely disappointing game. keep in mind, it was everything i'd imagined a 3d mario would have been, back when i was a kid. but like smg1, they played it very safe, to the point where the level select was a straight line. the back end of the game should have been accessible from the start as the game's 'hard mode', and the requirements to reach the final final level were absolutely ridiculous.

i haven't seen enough of 3d world to totally discount it, but i have faith based off the way smg and nsmb progressed that it should improve from 3d land.

Don't get caught up on the semantics of it. If someone says "level pack" and you'd rather they say "sequel", who cares? It's the sentiment behind what they're trying to say that matters.

If you'd rather I say "sequel", I'll say NSMB is a series of stale sequels that don't introduce enough new mechanics. Is that really much better than me saying level pack? The criticism is what matters and calling NSMB2 a level pack gets quickly to the matter of what the critique of the game is.

yes, it is much better, because you're actually criticizing something for specific reasons.

 

[Roo]

Probably this has been discussed to death but it is new to me
I didn't know they're using SMB3's dying tune. (1:40)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b3RFROLMuZ4

This is great. One of my most anticipated games this year
Screw the haters!

 

[Solid SOAP]

I'm certainly excited for this game because it's a new 3D Mario platformer and they're all pretty damn good, if not great, but I can say with 100% honesty that I've never been so... lukewarm about an upcoming "big" Mario title in my life. On one hand, it is most definitely going to be an absolute blast with friends. Most of my console gaming is spent with a friend usually commentating or us playing together, so being able to play the next big Mario game with friends is going to be a blast if we go through the whole thing together.

On the other hand, there's no denying how derivative it looks of previous Mario entries with its visuals, music, animations, level design tropes, and practically everything about it. I know these are very superficial complaints and at the end of the day, level design is truly all that matters when it comes to what makes a great platformer truly GREAT, but there's no denying that presentation, story, characters, setting and moments have made the previous 3D Mario games so memorable. Seeing the Mushroom Kingdom in 3D for the first time, traveling and getting to know Isle Delfino and all its inhabitants, and blasting through space in Mario Galaxy while a bombastic orchestra perfectly captivated the feeling of adventure might only be the superficial qualities of those games, but they might be what I remember most and have become the image of what made those games special to begin with, prying them apart from what would ordinarily be a "level pack" like how some feel about the NSMB games.

In other words, 3D World just doesn't seem to have it's own identity, while previous entries did. Perhaps I'll be proved wrong upon it's release and Nintendo will pull the rug from under our feet, revealing what's considerably more inspired and delightful than what was shown thus far, but as of now it just looks like... "More Mario... with 4-players!" It is sure to be fun, but I can't say that I'm frothing at the mouth for it.

 

[Sorta Maximus]

Not a fan of seeing everybody twice

We're not drunk Nintendo

It's because it's in 3D.

 

[TheSpaceBetween]

I don't know how you can love the series and NOT see it as a platformer. Is it because they shoot guns instead of jumping on bad guys? Because in the R&C games I've played (OG, Future, Quest for Booty, and some of Free 4 All) there are copious amounts of platforming. Yes there is some adventuring and exploring but there's also shitloads of jumping from one platform to another platform and swinging from a platform to another platform and floating moving platforms over bottomless pits that you have to jump across. I've been playing through QFB with my girlfriend recently and we just did the part with the power generator towers and if that isn't platforming then I don't know what is. Ratchet & Clank is essentially Mario 64 With Guns.

I don't consider it a platformer because it has much more shooting than it does platforming. Yeah, it has platforming elements. God of War also has a lot of platforming elements. Never have I heard anyone call God of War a platformer. Also, comparing R&C to SM64 isn't helping your case, as it is the furthest from a pure platformer out of all the main Mario games.

 

[TheSpaceBetween]

gravity impacting the level design and how the player performed feats of platforming did not happen until smg2.

but like smg1, they played it very safe.

I could not disagree more with these (isolated) statements regarding Galaxy 1. I'm genuinely curious how you came to these conclusions. Might you explain?

 

[Nibel]

It's because it's in 3D.

It's not

 

[Penguin]

With the new trailer, I think the box art makes PERFECT sense now with the cherry power-up!