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Switch Pro, how could it help Nintendo?

Jubenhimer

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Whatever Nintendo does will sell either way. No matter how bad their games might look, how outdated the hardware and software is. It doesn't matter really. GC and Wii U never existed though.

Just because Nintendo uses older hardware and doesn't push high end graphics or resolutions doesn't make their games look bad or their game design outdated.
 
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SLoWMoTIoN

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Just because Nintendo uses older hardware and doesn't push high end graphics or resolutions doesn't make their games look bad or their game design outdated.
These are first party games





This is a phone game.
 

SonGoku

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Just because Nintendo uses older hardware and doesn't push high end graphics or resolutions doesn't make their games look bad or their game design outdated.
When games can't hit the displays native resolution in handheld mode (720p) it does look terrible because it ruins the image quality and with it the presentation
Should have used a 540p display instead.

Not even Nintendo 1st party hit native resolution in handheld
 

Thurible

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My friend, who I hung out with today, said that I should stop waiting for the pro because it isn't going to happen. It is still pretty likely going to be announced soon, right? I mean there are accessory leaks for the mini and WSJ has some good sources, it has to happen.
 
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SLoWMoTIoN

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They do?
I know botw, odisey and xeno don't. I assume any game that's big (big 3d world) doesn't hit native

tbh it looks leagues ahead that phone game you posted, my main gripe with it is IQ
Imagine playing XC2 1080p 60fps...
 

Danjin44

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It looks terribly outdated.
I guess we both have entirely different taste in regards whats looks good or not. To me both Astral Chain and Luigi mansion 3 looks gorgeous to me.
 
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SLoWMoTIoN

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I would be happy with native 720p/30fps on handheld mode
It would be a huge upgrade over the sub 30fps 360p mess it currently is.
We don't even get 30fps docked sadly because of the terribly outdate hardware.
I guess we both have entirely different taste in regards whats looks good or not. To me both Astral Chain and Luigi mansion 3 looks gorgeous to me.
I'm no graphics whore or anything I did play like 10 hours of Samurai Shodown and that is Ps2 tier. But for first party games Nintendo should be doing better IMO.
 
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Danjin44

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We don't even get 30fps docked sadly because of the terribly outdate hardware.

I'm no graphics whore or anything I did play like 10 hours of Samurai Shodown and that is Ps2 tier. But for first party games Nintendo should be doing better IMO.
I don't know, if you consider Astral Chain or Luigi Mansion 3 looks "bad" then most Nintendo games just looks bad for you no matter what. Switch may not be as powerful as PC, PS4 and Xbox but I personally love most of Nintendo's games art direction same way I do with Atlus games.
 

Jubenhimer

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It looks terribly outdated.
Um...what? Are you sure we're looking at the same game here? Did you even look at the trailers and gameplay footage?

I'm no graphics whore or anything I did play like 10 hours of Samurai Shodown and that is Ps2 tier. But for first party games Nintendo should be doing better IMO.

You don't have to do bleeding edge visuals if you don't want to though. A good Art style will look good regardless of hardware.
 
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SLoWMoTIoN

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I don't know, if you consider Astral Chain or Luigi Mansion 3 looks "bad" then most Nintendo games just looks bad for you no matter what. Switch may not be as powerful as PC, PS4 and Xbox but I personally love most of Nintendo's games art direction same way I do with Atlus games.
Danjin read my post. I said they should be doing better considering they are first party games and are unable to due to weak hardware. I never said anything about the art direction.

Um...what? Are you sure we're looking at the same game here? Did you even look at the trailers and gameplay footage?
I played BOTW and Arms they are underwhelming as a AAA title from Nintendo. Pokemon looks horrible and so does the new Fire Emblem and they don't even seem to be running at 60fps. But tbf that could be because of the devs.

You don't have to do bleeding edge visuals if you don't want to though. A good Art style will look good regardless of hardware.
That is not what I said at all.
 

Jubenhimer

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I played BOTW and Arms they are underwhelming as a AAA title from Nintendo. Pokemon looks horrible and so does the new Fire Emblem and they don't even seem to be running at 60fps. But tbf that could be because of the devs.

If you're expecting Nintendo to try and compete with the likes of EA or Ubisoft in the AAA space then don't. Their games don't have nearly as large budgets as most standard AAA games. They're much closer to a mid-tier developer if anything. And again, only Pokemon could be seen as outdated technically. Everything looks fine. Luigi's Mansion 3 especially looks really good.

Not chasing high end visuals and framrates isn't always down to hardware limitations.
 
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SLoWMoTIoN

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If you're expecting Nintendo to try and compete with the likes of EA or Ubisoft in the AAA space then don't. Their games don't have nearly as large budgets as most standard AAA games. They're much closer to a mid-tier developer if anything. And again, only Pokemon could be seen as outdated technically. Everything looks fine. Luigi's Mansion 3 especially looks really good.
I'm expecting them to make better hardware. I'm expecting them to care again about stuff like stability in their titles. I want more than just ports. I want Metroid to not be vaporware. That is all.
 

Danjin44

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Danjin read my post. I said they should be doing better considering they are first party games and are unable to due to weak hardware. I never said anything about the art direction.
Astral Chain is not first party game and it’s port either but in you never give a proper explanation what’s makes Astral Chain and Luigi’s Mansion 3 looks “terrible” so I assumed you talking about not liking the art direction.
 

Jubenhimer

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I'm expecting them to make better hardware. I'm expecting them to care again about stuff like stability in their titles. I want more than just ports. I want Metroid to not be vaporware. That is all.

What Bette hardware? Nintendo went with the most affordable cutting edge mobile processor they could've gotten at the time. What did you want them to do, shove a PS4 pro into a tablet?
 
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SLoWMoTIoN

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Astral Chain is not first party game and it’s port either but in you never give a proper explanation what’s makes Astral Chain and Luigi’s Mansion 3 looks “terrible” so I assumed you talking about not liking the art direction.
I was refering to the titles I used. Astral Chain isn't anything special outside being a Plat game and looks like it could run on the ps3 or wii u. So does Luigi's Mansion. They aren't bad looking games but again, Nintendo could be doing better.
What Bette hardware? Nintendo went with the most affordable cutting edge mobile processor they could've gotten at the time. What did you want them to do, shove a PS4 pro into a tablet?
What I wanted from the start? A console, not a hybrid. Or at least something that could run most of their games on 60fps. I got mine for XC2 mostly since the other games are TBD and as a weeb machine. God yes the hardware should be better. I'm not alone in this right?
 

Jubenhimer

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What I wanted from the start? A console, not a hybrid. Or at least something that could run most of their games on 60fps. I got mine for XC2 mostly since the other games are TBD and as a weeb machine. God yes the hardware should be better. I'm not alone in this right?

That's your fault for getting your hopes up. Besides, Nintendo had a floundering home console, and a handheld under-seige by smartphones. They had to do something to adapt to the changing climate. Hybrid is actually the smartest route they could take. Sure they could've technically taken on Sony and Microsoft with a generic power-box, but that's not really their style. Besides, more power means more need to take advantage of it. And AAA visuals aren't cheap. So you just get less games, less different games, and have to wait even longer for AAA games from Nintendo to release.
 
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SLoWMoTIoN

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That's your fault for getting your hopes up.
No I knew what I got.
Besides, Nintendo had a floundering home console, and a handheld under-seige by smartphones. They had to do something to adapt to the changing climate. Hybrid is actually the smartest route they could take. Sure they could've technically taken on Sony and Microsoft with a generic power-box, but that's not really their style.
Japan is a small market. Most of their sales are overseas. Look at the Ps4 and its sales.
Besides, more power means more need to take advantage of it. And AAA visuals aren't cheap. So you just get less games, less different games, and have to wait even longer for AAA games from Nintendo to release.
There is just so much wrong with this post I don't even know where to begin. More power means the hardware isn't gonna shit itself when running current gen ports. Or keep a stable framerate. The SNES was a powerful console as well yet look at the diversity it had. Power doesn't restrict.
 

Jubenhimer

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There is just so much wrong with this post I don't even know where to begin. More power means the hardware isn't gonna shit itself when running current gen ports. Or keep a stable framerate. The SNES was a powerful console as well yet look at the diversity it had. Power doesn't restrict.

I don't think you get how development costs work. AAA games aren't like the 16-bit days. They costs often hundreds of millions of dollars. We see less of them each generation because they're so expensive to make now. It's a reason why a lot of publishers died last gen, why others have abandoned AAA development for the most part, and why publishers who still make AAA games, stick to their safe bet cash cows or gaurenteed hits. What you seem to want is for Nintendo to return to the days where it ruled the industry with an iron fist with a powerful console that is the best place to play every game and they competed with other AAA developers in budget. That's not going to happen, and it doesn't have to happen. Companies can cater to alternative markets with different products. There's no rule that Nintendo has to put out a generic slab of metal and plastic that plays games with Pro controller like everyone else.

Japan is a small market. Most of their sales are overseas. Look at the Ps4 and its sales.

Considering how well the Switch is selling worldwide, Nintendo made the right move for non-Japanese players as well.
 
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#Phonepunk#

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They do?
I know botw, odisey and xeno don't. I assume any game that's big (big 3d world) doesn't hit native

interesting. i played BOTW and Odyssey on portable and it was incredible. games look amazing on the Switch screen. if it dipped below 720p i couldn't tell.

Nintendo is just better at art design. they don't need the powerful graphics.
 
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SLoWMoTIoN

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I don't think you get how development costs work. AAA games aren't like the 16-bit days.
It was a comparison. You brought up a more powerful machine as a con for Nintendo to not make "less different" games. 3rd party companies still make most of the unique games you see on any platform so ???
They costs often hundreds of millions of dollars. We see less of them each generation because they're so expensive to make now. It's a reason why a lot of publishers died last gen, why others have abandoned AAA development for the most part, and why publishers who still make AAA games, stick to their safe bet cash cows or gaurenteed hits. What you seem to want is for Nintendo to return to the days where it ruled the industry with an iron fist with a powerful console that is the best place to play every game and they competed with other AAA developers in budget. That's not going to happen, and it doesn't have to happen. Companies can cater to alternative markets with different products.
Nintendo can afford it.
There's no rule that Nintendo has to put out a generic slab of metal and plastic that plays games with Pro controller like everyone else.
But it did? The Switch is just a more powerful Dev Ps Vita. Accessories at a premium price as well. What price were the joycons and docks being sold at again?
Considering how well the Switch is selling worldwide, Nintendo made the right move for non-Japanese players as well.
Yes that was my point.
 

Jubenhimer

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It was a comparison. You brought up a more powerful machine as a con for Nintendo to not make "less different" games. 3rd party companies still make most of the unique games you see on any platform so ???

If you're talking about AA and indie devs, yeah because they don't chase the mythical graphics dragon a lot. But AAA games have become a homogenized blob of shooting mechanics and loot boxes. Most of them just kind of blend together at this point. Point being, the more money you pour into a project, the less risk you can afford to take with it because there's more money at stake. More money also means larger teams and higher costs, which means less games overall.


Nintendo can afford it.

Sure they can afford it, but they tradeoff would be less games a year from them, and little to no weird odities like Labo, or ARMS, or Astral Chain.


But it did? The Switch is just a more powerful Dev Ps Vita.

Sure, call me when Sony and Microsoft make a tablet toaster with two candy colored motion controllers you can split up for multiplayer.
 
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SLoWMoTIoN

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If you're talking about AA and indie devs, yeah because they don't chase the mythical graphics dragon a lot. But AAA games have become a homogenized blob of shooting mechanics and loot boxes. Most of them just kind of blend together at this point. Point being, the more money you pour into a project, the less risk you can afford to take with it because there's more money at stake. More money also means larger teams and higher costs, which means less games overall.
I mean what are Nintendo's AAA games again?

A platformer
A multiplayer 3rd person shooter
An open world rpg
JRPG game
Vaporware
Basically what Sony has outside Mario and Nintendo is missing a few boring ass brown shooters?

Companies are gonna make what they want to make regardless. If you want to say it is ok for them to NOT take risks (and make games run better since they don't have to on weak hardware) because profit you are pretty much being pro-company over pro-customer which I assume everybody in here is. Hypothetically.





Sure they can afford it, but they tradeoff would be less games a year from them, and little to no weird odities like Labo, or ARMS, or Astral Chain.
Astral Chain is Plat's baby though. Labo can fuck off that cardboard crap was terrible. Arms was just punch out with Wii motes and could have totally been made for a more powerful system. Where are my Wii Sports damn it?


Sure, call me when Sony and Microsoft make a tablet toaster with two candy colored motion controllers you can split up for multiplayer.
The Vita lets you use DS4/DS3 controllers. The Dev version had micro sd support, (without mods) and a hdmi out. It was essentially a proto Switch.
 

mcz117chief

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You gotta be trolling me, two of those games look (360p) and play (sub 30fps) like absolute horseshit on handheld mode
No they don't, they look fine on Switch. Maybe I am not the biggest graphics connoisseur but I played through about 4 levels of DOOM on Switch and I am amazed by how well it looks and plays. It is a tablet not a big ass gaming console like PS4 Pro, your expectations are pretty unrealistic if you expect the same level of graphic fidelity from Switch like we have on PC or PS4. Considering its size and the fact that it is hand held you can't help but be amazed how well DOOM runs on it, reminds me of DOOM on Gameboy Advance which is my most played game on that system.
 
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Jubenhimer

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I mean what are Nintendo's AAA games again?

A platformer
A multiplayer 3rd person shooter
An open world rpg
JRPG game
Vaporware
Basically what Sony has outside Mario and Nintendo is missing a few boring ass brown shooters?

Nintendo's AAA isn't the same as other companies though. Their games are typically much lower in both budget and scope compared to most conventional AAA games. Plus, first party games aren't quite as bad with homogenization as others, but they still have their moments. Look how many of Sony's AAA games on PS4 are Third person cinematic action games. Or Microsoft who's AAA is almost entirely Halo, Gears and Forza. Even Nintendo is guilty with their AAA titles sometimes.

Companies are gonna make what they want to make regardless. If you want to say it is ok for them to NOT take risks (and make games run better since they don't have to on weak hardware) because profit you are pretty much being pro-company over pro-customer which I assume everybody in here is. Hypothetically.


I'm for both actually. I want companies to succeed, do cool things, and make good choices, that way consumers benefit from more options and different types of products.


Astral Chain is Plat's baby though. Labo can fuck off that cardboard crap was terrible. Arms was just punch out with Wii motes and could have totally been made for a more powerful system. Where are my Wii Sports damn it?

Even if you don't like all of them, they still have an audience, and a Nintendo who focuses strictly on AAA graphics fests would have no time or patience for niche but profitable ventures.

The Vita lets you use DS4/DS3 controllers. The Dev version had micro sd support, (without mods) and a hdmi out. It was essentially a proto Switch.

That's not the same as a tablet with detachable Wiimote controllers that can be used separately between two players. Vita may have been able to let you use a DS4, but that isn't the same as how the Switch handles this concept.
 
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SLoWMoTIoN

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Nobody said anything about them ENTIRELY focusing on graphics though? The entire point of the Switch Pro would be for people that want to pay (more) to have their games run properly and MAYBE look current gen though.
 

mcz117chief

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Expecting the game to run higher than 360p/480p is unrealistic?

No i dont expect that, i coulnt care less about gfx
I expect games to hit the displays native resolution (720p) on handheld mode
I suppose that is reasonable, but I am more than satisfied with what I got now, I would not buy PRO Switch myself.
 

Jubenhimer

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Nobody said anything about them ENTIRELY focusing on graphics though? The entire point of the Switch Pro would be for people that want to pay (more) to have their games run properly and MAYBE look current gen though.

Yes, but the Switch as it is now, is fine enough. True, a more powerful Pro model can help Nintendo in the long run, but considering the current system can run Doom 2016 better than anybody thought it could, nobody's gonna loose sleep if it's not out immediately.
 

SonGoku

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I suppose that is reasonable, but I am more than satisfied with what I got now, I would not buy PRO Switch myself.
if you seen both those games at native 720p your opinion would change. Its a massive improvement in IQ and presentation
 
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SLoWMoTIoN

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Yes, but the Switch as it is now, is fine enough. True, a more powerful Pro model can help Nintendo in the long run, but considering the current system can run Doom 2016 better than anybody thought it could, nobody's gonna loose sleep if it's not out immediately.
I disagree. Just because it ran doesn't give it a pass. 30fps running at sub 720p is not acceptable for current gen imo.
 

Jubenhimer

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I disagree. Just because it ran doesn't give it a pass. 30fps running at sub 720p is not acceptable for current gen imo.
It's a mobile device, you have to give it some slack. Besides, it's good enough if you want to take it on the go.
 

Danjin44

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Nobody said anything about them ENTIRELY focusing on graphics though? The entire point of the Switch Pro would be for people that want to pay (more) to have their games run properly and MAYBE look current gen though.
Nintendo stopped caring about having powerful system after gamecube, they just don't care. Same reason Atlus wont ever make high end graphics even when Persona 6/SMTVI comes out. But in honestly I dont care because what I like about Nintendo and Atlus is most their games have fantastic art direction that makes up for not having most high tech graphics.

If you think is not acceptable for not having most advance graphics then you are more than free to buy PC, PS4 or Xbox to satisfy your needs. I bought Switch for the games that I cant get from my PS4 like Astral Chain and SMTV.
 
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SLoWMoTIoN

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Nintendo stopped caring about having powerful system after gamecube, they just don't care. Same reason Atlus wont ever make high end graphics even when Persona 6/SMTVI comes out. But in honestly I dont care because what I like about Nintendo and Atlus is most their games have fantastic art direction that makes up for not having most high tech graphics.
Atlus isn't owned by Nintendo but by Sega. They will NEVER make games that look amazing and rely on "aesthetics" because of budget reasons and because people aren't expecting much. I sure don't I've been playing their games for over 2 decades. They also aren't a fair comparisson to Nintendo which can make better looking games. But at the moment they don't have to because people will like I said before, buy anything they do regardless of faults in hardware.

If you think is not acceptable for not having most advance graphics then you are more than free to buy PC, PS4 or Xbox to satisfy your needs. I bought Switch for the games that I cant get from my PS4 like Astral Chain.
This entire thread is about the possibility of a Switch Pro and how it could help it. I gave my reasons and why I would want one. I already have a Switch and that is all.
Yup same. 2025. :/
 
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SLoWMoTIoN

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It's a mobile device, you have to give it some slack. Besides, it's good enough if you want to take it on the go.
I really want a Pro though. If that means my games can run at 60fps I could do without portability.
 

Danjin44

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Atlus isn't owned by Nintendo but by Sega. They will NEVER make games that look amazing and rely on "aesthetics" because of budget reasons and because people aren't expecting much. I sure don't I've been playing their games for over 2 decades. They also aren't a fair comparisson to Nintendo which can make better looking games. But at the moment they don't have to because people will like I said before, buy anything they do regardless of faults in hardware.
That is true for Nintendo as well, at this most people don’t expecting powerful system from them even with their next gen. What I and most people want from Nintendo is fun games and so far for me, they are delivering on that.

This entire thread is about the possibility of a Switch Pro and how it could help it. I gave my reasons and why I would want one. I already have a Switch and that is all.
Even there is Switch pro don't expect to have huge power boost. Best case is we get something similar to New 3DS.
 
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Jubenhimer

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They also aren't a fair comparisson to Nintendo which can make better looking games. But at the moment they don't have to because people will like I said before, buy anything they do regardless of faults in hardware.

Nintendo deliberately chooses not to chase high end graphics to keep development cost low, while still maintaining quality. They're not the type of company who likes blowing $80-100 on something that won't end up profitable. Lower dev costs means more games. More games means more niche products for different types of people. And it also means they can take more risks with their AAA franchises since they can still be successful with less copies sold. BotW only needed 2 million to break even for example.
 
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SLoWMoTIoN

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Nintendo deliberately chooses not to chase high end graphics to keep development cost low, while still maintaining quality. They're not the type of company who likes blowing $80-100 on something that won't end up profitable. Lower dev costs means more games. More games means more niche products for different types of people. And it also means they can take more risks with their AAA franchises since they can still be successful with less copies sold. BotW only needed 2 million to break even for example.
Niche products are mostly graphically low and are made by 3rd party devs though. It has no correlation with the Switch. In fact they need to get a different group of people to downgrade ports so that they can even run on said system. The rest of the market doesn't. It is a just a simple functional port. A pro system could greatly help out said devs and the player base will like having the choice of purchasing one.
 

Jubenhimer

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Niche products are mostly graphically low and are made by 3rd party devs though. It has no correlation with the Switch. In fact they need to get a different group of people to downgrade ports so that they can even run on said system. The rest of the market doesn't. It is a just a simple functional port. A pro system could greatly help out said devs and the player base will like having the choice of purchasing one.

Even with a Pro, you'd still need a specialized porting company because it still isn't going to give you PS4 performance. Mobile tech just isn't there yet I'm afraid. Look the fact is, Nintendo decided to go with a mobile device over a traditional console. You either like it, or don't. Beggars can't be choosers.