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[qirex99]

No. This is PRECISELY their problem with GTA4. They try to reinvent it and fail doing so instead of improving on the old formula that had EXTREME ROOM to expand/improve.
If GTA4 had focused on becoming more of a complex sandbox and improving the freedom, it would have rock the fucking world. But not, they put GTA4 into a completely story driven linear action game -- but in an open envirronement. Bad idea.

.

precisely!

 

[Rad-]

Why I didn't care for the DLCs:

1. GTA4 wasn't that great.
2. Came way too late.

I bet these are the main reasons why people skipped on them.

 

[JoshuaJSlone]

I own four GTA games, but have never actually finished one. The appeal to me is largely mucking about rather than finishing every story mission. So asking me to pay money for more of something I already have too much of isn't going to work.

 

[KaYotiX]

After GTA4, most people dont want any more of it till GTA5

 

[BuckRobotron]

I would also tend to agree that they were basically late to attending to the guests at their own party. Should have released the dl content sooner.

But then there are many who stick with the pure "fool around" nature of the GTA games and ignore story progression, so paying for extra story/episodes ranks very low on their list of things to do.

 

[NullPointer]

Fix the combat dammit

This. If the core gameplay mechanics arent up to snuff, its hard to justify spending money on premium DLC.

 

[Foliorum Viridum]

Both expansions improved most of the faults that 4 had. Shame that it hasn't been as popular as they deserve.

Shove 'em out on PS3.

 

[MightyHedgehog]

Certainly would've done better had they indeed released closer to the original game, but the relatively high price point and the need to have the original disc to play them (until Episodes was recently released) really, IMO, has had a greater effect on the sales than anything else. They are worth the price they're offered at, IMO, but I think most people are still unwilling to plunk down that sort of cash for a separate, but still connected expansion. Had GTA IV been more like an RPG, like Fallout 3 or Oblivion, where player advancement was persistent and enhanced in the game via expansion possibilities, then the expansions could have offered more value inherently to the base. As it was, the expansions really needed to stand alone or be priced lower than they were and are.

 

[Fox Mulder]

Worst game I ever bought on GAF advice.

saints row was pretty shitty, while the 2nd was more refined and executed better. It's also more in the classic GTA 3 though San Andreas vein than GTA 4 was.

 

[Net_Wrecker]

Well I loved the expansions, and felt they came out at a perfect time. How close to launch can you release 20 hour expansion to a 40+ hour game? That would be even worse for them. I just think they overestimated who was willing to pay $20 for a non physical expansion, or they overestimated the amount of people that buy expansions period.

 

[Grecco]

Modern Warfare is the new GTA.

Plus there are better open world game options available now. GTA isn't unique anymore.

GTA franchise is akin to the "WHAT?" Stone Cold Steve Austin. Still a draw, but not quite what he used to be.



.

I said this months ago. :lol Anyways Lost and Damned had alot of hype and sold very well. Releasing a seccond expansion so soon after with little to no hype was a mistake. Gay Tony should have been a 2010 release. Also making radio stations exclusive to the DISK version was moronic.

 

[Goldrusher]

I'm saying GTAs time as the top tier franchise is over. GTA series isn't the cream of the crop anymore.

I pity all those out there, playing games just to play games. And not caring if it's a GTA, COD or even WiiSports.

 

[AniHawk]

Wow. I completely forgot this had been released, and that it didn't chart.

 

[gregor7777]

I pity all those out there, playing games just to play games. And not caring if it's a GTA, COD or even WiiSports.

This is a sales thread, friend. You seem to have some difficulty in grasping this.

 

[Replicant]

Take a pick:
A) It's console exclusive
B) GTA4 backlash
C) GTA is not a franchise people really follow. They see the release, they pick up the main game, they kill a few cops and then they stop caring.

All of the above.

 

[speculawyer]

I know the episodes are awesome, but they were released too late and too expensive, IMO.

Too expensive? You can pick up both DLC packs for $35.99 on a stand alone disk. If you think that is expensive then I don't know how you could afford the original game at $59.99

 

[Goldrusher]

This is a sales thread, friend. You seem to have some difficulty in grasping this.

So you can say "I think xxx is the cause", then nobody else is allowed to respond to that ?

I'm just saying that I don't think COD is responsible for the lower than expected sales of an expansion to an entirely different game.

An FPS, focused on multiplayer deathmatches, on small maps.
vs.
A third-person shooter, heavy on story, in an enormous open world.

So yeah... I don't think that's the reason at all. If you like GTA, you like GTA. You don't suddenly jump on the COD bandwagon. I know I didn't. The games don't compare. At all.

 

[grandjedi6]

And thus Take2 comes to the 'shocking' realization that expansion packs/dlc won't sell as well as a brand new game.

 

[Mrbob]

I pity all those out there, playing games just to play games. And not caring if it's a GTA, COD or even WiiSports.

And I don't play GTA4 or MW2. Not what this thread is about. We are talking about sales.

Edit: I'm arguing the amount of people who like the type of game GTA is offering is lessening as the years go by. The number of people who like what Modern Warfare is doing is growing. At least for this generation, which is the first one where online is a major focus.

I expect something else will supplant Modern Warfare as top dog next generation.

 

[AniHawk]

I expect something else will supplant Modern Warfare as top dog next generation.

*rolls dice*

Game shows are back.

 

[Kintaro]

I didn't read through the thread, but here's a big "f you" to Take Two. You left an entire userbase, who bought GVA IV, out of the loop by not releasing the Episodes for PS3. Yes, I know, MS gave you the loan/bought it, but what did you honestly expect? Episodic content isn't a major seller as people thought it would be and you limited yourself to one platform instead of two.

Not to mention, bigger releases over-shadowed expansions that were finally bundled together, way too late in the game.

 

[gregor7777]

So you can say "I think xxx is the cause", then nobody else is allowed to respond to that ?

I'm just saying that I don't think COD is responsible for the lower than expected sales of an expansion to an entirely different game.

An FPS, focused on multiplayer deathmatches, on small maps.
vs.
A third-person shooter, heavy on story, in an enormous open world.

So yeah... I don't think that's the reason at all. If you like GTA, you like GTA. You don't suddenly jump on the COD bandwagon. I know I didn't. The games don't compare. At all.

Ugh, do we need to explain this to you again?

We were talking about how the big franchises compare sales wise against one another. Whether you think so or not, success and failure has a lot to do with expectations within the publisher and those that invest in them.

If CoD sells 4 million for Activision, investors want to know why publisher X's big game isn't selling that well.

It's a battle for mindshare and customers dollars. And there is overlap.

That being said, the original post you responded to didn't say CoD was stealing their sales. Where is that Jim carrey .gif when I need it?

 

[DeadGzuz]

or has Grand Theft Auto lost some allure with consumers?

This. No ones cares about GTA after playing GTA4, there are much better games out there. The two DLC on disc for $40 was a good idea, but bad timing.

 

[pizzaguysrevenge]

This. No ones cares about GTA after playing GTA4

What world do you live in? :lol

 

[AniHawk]

What world do you live in? :lol

Yeah, even though it's a pretty bad game by most accounts, there are lots of people who still like it.

I don't think the episodes selling poorly has much to do with the quality of GTA IV.

 

[Magni]

And I don't play GTA4 or MW2. Not what this thread is about. We are talking about sales.

Edit: I'm arguing the amount of people who like the type of game GTA is offering is lessening as the years go by. The number of people who like what Modern Warfare is doing is growing. At least for this generation, which is the first one where online is a major focus.

I expect something else will supplant Modern Warfare as top dog next generation.

If Bungie's next IP is multiplat, I'd say it has a chance as being "next top dog"

 

[speculawyer]

So if I may summarize many of the thoughts:
-GTA IV backlash
-Expansion packs just don't sell all that well
-GTA IV was already too long as is (many people didn't finish so why buy more?)
-They need to refine the gameplay mechanics
-Came out too long after the original GTA IV
-360 exclusive
-Want new City

Yeah, all of those combined would certainly explain it. The exclusive factor doesn't explain why it did poorly on the 360.

 

[AniHawk]

If Bungie's next IP is multiplat, I'd say it has a chance as being "next top dog"

If Bungie's next IP is multiplat, they're going to need to get major backing from some studio. Otherwise a commercial that says, "from the creators of Halo" isn't going to cut it. I'm looking at you, Stubbs the Zombie.

 

[DeadGzuz]

What world do you live in? :lol

Well how did they sell? I had my fill, GTA4 left a bad taste in my mouth. I'm not going to run out a buy a bunch of DLC when there are good games to buy, ones which innovate.

There will always be people who love game x and buy everything associated with it, but the backlash was huge for GTA4 and well deserved. It is the highest rated game this gen and it's mediocre at best.

I'll wait for GTA5 and buy it when it's $30.

 

[Trick_GSF]

I would've brought them, but I don't have an Xbox.

 

[McLovin]

I bought the ps3 version.. then way later I traded halo 3 for gta4 on the 360 with a friend. But after I started playing gta4 I realized I was tired of the game anyway.. so I didn't even bother getting them. Even though I really wanted them initially. GTA 4 was too long and too boring for me to justify purchasing the content. Even though I knew the content was better.. I couldn't bring myself to buy it.

 

[chaostrophy]

The sandbox game genre is getting more and more crowded, so GTA has more competition. IMO Assassin's Creed II makes GTA4 look like an amateurish joke.

 

[CrunchinJelly]

The sandbox game genre is getting more and more crowded, so GTA has more competition. IMO Assassin's Creed II makes GTA4 look like an amateurish joke.

 

[Opiate]

I honestly think the Houser Brothers have pulled a Wachowski brothers. That is, I suspect they don't understand what made them so popular in the first place. If a game has qualities X+Y+Z, it is often possible that people love X so much that they love the game in spite of Z, not because of it. Developers get the wrong idea, and think the huge sales mean people loved Z, so they put tons of effort in to Z, ignoring or reducing X (and Y).

To be more specific, I think the Housers began to think of themselves as Artistas, or fine Craftsman of a burgeoning medium or art form. They put their emphasis on this.

But in reality, I think most people who enjoyed their games just wanted a giant city they could roam around in and blow stuff up.

 

[WiCkEd_Co]

I bought gta for my ps3 so I never got the add on until the disc came out and I just rented it from gamefly.

I wouldn't buy it because I don't play it online and even the few times I go online it seems not many people playing. Is it dividing the online community?

I mean can retail disc add on players play with download add on players? Also if I look for a game online in the lost and dammed will I only find gamers that are play lost and the damned?

 

[Phantast2k]

GTAIV GOTY (PS360) = problem solved

 

[Unregistered007]

Sorry to be the hater but everything about GTA4 sucked. GTA was succesful when it was about gameplay first and decent story. Great & simple enjoyable gameplay was what GTA3 was about.

GTA 4 only had great graphics going for it, the rest sucks

1. Driving
2. Walking
3. delayed animation awkward walking lame cover system....

I just hated everything about GTA4....

 

[TheSeks]

or did they also lose some money by not releasing the Add-Ons on PS3? Discuss!

A partial reason, but not the hugest one.

 

[Deleted member 30609]

as much as I didn't like GTA4, I'd have really liked this to succeed.

 

[szaromir]

Fallout 3 DLC was hugely successful (according to Todd Howard from Bethesda), so it proves single-player DLC can sell - you just have to make a good game in the first place. Obviously that wasn't a case with GTA4.

 

[Eggo]

What sucks is the two episodes are much much better than the original game. Of couse that may mean the original game sold better than it should have so maybe it all evens out.

What?! I thought the expansions were a big step down quality-wise. L&D was a big disappointment. TBoGT had some really cool missions, but I didn't like the main character and the overall quality of the product seemed to pale in comparison to GTAIV. In terms of gameplay/replay value compared to amount paid, GTAIV is a much better investment than spending $40 for the two expansions.

 

[TheKurgan]

I still haven't finished the main story in GTA4

I will get to all the extra content eventually...

 

[Magni]

If Bungie's next IP is multiplat, they're going to need to get major backing from some studio. Otherwise a commercial that says, "from the creators of Halo" isn't going to cut it. I'm looking at you, Stubbs the Zombie.

Wait, Bungie made Stubbs? Games made by former Bungie devs != games made by Bungie, especially when you're talking about the average gamer's knowledge of the games industry.

 

[cgcg]

LOL wonder why the sales number aren't meeting their expectations. That's a hard one to figure out.

 

[Jay Sosa]

Nobody bought it because GTA 4 was crap, finally they have some proof for it..

 

[Okin]

The story and characters were the worst part of GTAIV. Why would I (or anyone) pay for more of that shit?

Also, if the devs couldn't be bothered to put in something fun like a parachute in the main game, then I'm not going to fucking pay $20 for it two years later.

 

[Okin]

I honestly think the Houser Brothers have pulled a Wachowski brothers. That is, I suspect they don't understand what made them so popular in the first place. If a game has qualities X+Y+Z, it is often possible that people love X so much that they love the game in spite of Z, not because of it. Developers get the wrong idea, and think the huge sales mean people loved Z, so they put tons of effort in to Z, ignoring or reducing X (and Y).

To be more specific, I think the Housers began to think of themselves as Artistas, or fine Craftsman of a burgeoning medium or art form. They put their emphasis on this.

But in reality, I think most people who enjoyed their games just wanted a giant city they could roam around in and blow stuff up.

Exactly!

 

[Zoso]

I bought it. Only $40 & they're better than the original game. I love it.

 

[AniHawk]

I honestly think the Houser Brothers have pulled a Wachowski brothers. That is, I suspect they don't understand what made them so popular in the first place. If a game has qualities X+Y+Z, it is often possible that people love X so much that they love the game in spite of Z, not because of it. Developers get the wrong idea, and think the huge sales mean people loved Z, so they put tons of effort in to Z, ignoring or reducing X (and Y).

To be more specific, I think the Housers began to think of themselves as Artistas, or fine Craftsman of a burgeoning medium or art form. They put their emphasis on this.

But in reality, I think most people who enjoyed their games just wanted a giant city they could roam around in and blow stuff up.

Pretty much. They were so focused on telling the best story ever in the most realistic city ever, they forgot to design a video game.

 

[Mrbob]

Oscar worthy.