Support NeoGAF

[RMI]

I'm pretty bent about this new hardware. The idea that developers will somehow now be able to deliver us games as they were promised prior to the release of the PS4 (i.e. 1080p, 60 fps as a standard) is laughable. Games will perform just as badly after PS4 Neo, and even worse on the original hardware.

I think it's about time that console gaming moves to a new lifecycle model. Its significantly better for all involved, especially the consumer. Very happy about this happening.

how is this better for the consumer? Especially the consumers who already bought a PS4?

 

[Glitchesarecool]

I live out in the boonies in a town of a few thousand and still support an almost entirely digital catalog. They can sell cheap USBs or some nonsense for those who have crappy Internet if they must. There's no reason optical is the external media of choice. And regardless, most gaming is going to shift to the wireless space, if it hasn't already.

The best source of internet available to me without having a hard data cap (max available is about 60gb) is a 10gb line that drops to 20kb/s download speed once I break that 10gb limit. Satellite sourced.

 

[nynt9]

if you call it an overreaction then fine, but i'd like to point out just a few things that i think you're overreacting on.

gaming is entertainment, you spend money to have it in your life. this is a decision i'm making for myself, because i'm primarily a console gamer and i'm on the dislike boat for this iterative shit news.

the person i was responding to was essentially saying it is nonsensical of me to give up gaming completely when i could just revert to PC gaming and that is a wrongful assumption because - I don't own a workable PC. my laptop is currently lost in limbo, and the one i am using is having issues of its own. i have the destiny Ps4 that i burned $450 on, and i am not suddenly going to invest in hundreds and potentially thousands of dollars on PC hardware just to get back into gaming.

now, none of this is stuff that you or the guy I originally responded to knew, but you both assumed without knowing anything, that I could just do it. aside from the monetary reason that i just explained to you, i'm also just not a PC gamer, i've been a console gamer since I was 7 years old and i never intended to change that. yes, i have tried PC gaming when I was a kid but i didn't enjoy it. i enjoyed gaming on console and i enjoyed that the hardware I invested in lasted me half a decade and was the entry and singular option throughout that time.

You know you can play most of the same games on PC, right?

 

[Alucrid]

then it's not entirely fair of you to state it is an overreaction.who the fuck are you to judge exactly? you're being borderline condescending now

oh, sorry about that then. i didn't realize your original comment was meant to be posted to the void. never to be commented on by anyone else.

 

[Gipsy Danger]

You know you can play most of the same games on PC, right?

Just wait until he finds out a PC can last you half a decade too!

OT: I dunno how I feel about this. I barely play my PS4 at this point and going to a smartphone like model seems like a terrible idea. I'll probably just add myself to the list of exclusively PC after all this is said and done.

 

[CHC]

then it's not entirely fair of you to state it is an overreaction.who the fuck are you to judge exactly? you're being borderline condescending now

Why are you even posting your opinions publicly if you don't want people to respond to them? Especially when they're so hyperbolic. You get what you give - post an extreme statement, get extreme reactions.

 

[jroc74]

People are losing their minds


This might be the nuttiest E3 ever

Nintendo might be in striking range with NX lol

lol.

Hey it might be a repeat of this generation: 1 console maker capitalizing off the mistakes of the other 2.

Yea the next few years will definitely be interesting.

But yea I think the writing was on the wall when Iwata pitched the NX plans. Even if it wasnt going to be overall at least 1 console maker was gonna say to hell with generations.

But IIRC I think Sony and MS also had talks about this before or right after their consoles launched.

Regardless there was gonna be a shake up with generations coming soon. I think its starting now.

 

[CCIE]

Well, seeing as how I loathe Windows, PC gaming is just not an option for me. I will probably by a PS4K for just the UHD capability unless cheaper player become available, but that will probably be it for me. I'm getting older, and don't really have the time anymore.

Mobile gaming, with retro stuff is probably my near future. Time to move on

 

[ninjablade]

there were a loooooot of gaffers saying they will switch straight to PC gaming if Ps4K is a thing at all, regardless of how much or little of an improvement it is on the original.

I'm on a similar boat, in that I'll give up gaming completely since I don't game on PC.

just quit dude and stop posting while you're at it, you crying about quitting gaming over something so silly is pathetic.

 

[Phanatic8390]

I dunno how I feel about this. I barely play my PS4 at this point and going to a smartphone like model seems like a terrible idea. I'll probably just add myself to the list of exclusively PC after all this is said and done.

This is where I'm at too. My play time is 90/10 in favor of PC these days. Apple upgrade model in console gaming? Yeah, I'm done. That's money that can go to PC upgrades.

 

[The Artisan]

Wow if you think it's takes potentially thousands of dollars to get a solid PC than you're completely misinformed.That's a stupid stupid myth perpetuated by people who don't understand and often don't care to understand the costs of PC gaming. You can literally build a sub $500 PC that's about 25-30% more powerful than a PS4. I had one up the other day I built as an example for $450.

No wonder you see PC gaming as the end of gaming for you. Someone has cleary created a boogie man of misinformation which your PC knowledge rests upon.

PC gaming can literally do everything console gaming can near the same level of simplicity if you like and more. It's a completely tuned experience and nothing close to what it was when you were a kid unless you're like 12.

i didn't claim to be an expert on it but i don't think it's unreasonable to say that it would cost at least $1,000 to have the most optimal hardware possible.

 

[georly]

well, i don't think "punishing" is the only word to describe, ceasing myself from spending money on video game stuff.
i think we established this

Hey, that's fine. I just assumed that since you post on a video game forum that games were important to you and that ceasing to play games was a form of self-punishment. If you don't think so, then all is good.

 

[DrROBschiz]

lol.

Hey it might be a repeat of this generation: 1 console maker capitalizing off the mistakes of the other 2.

Yea the next few years will definitely be interesting.

But yea I think the writing was on the wall when Iwata pitched the NX plans. Even if it wasnt going to be overall at least 1 console maker was gonna say to hell with generations.

But IIRC I think Sony and MS also had talks about this before or right after their consoles launched.

Regardless there was gonna be a shake up with generations coming soon. I think its starting now.

Everything is going to homogenize at a certain point. We are reaching the atomic limit on modern electronics and im not sure what the roadmap for building chips is beyond the current setup

Everyone freaking out about the market changing in the future should probably chill... though it could change even further or stall for a bit

Its crazy times bro

 

[Rockandrollclown]

Seems like a bad idea to me. The entire point of consoles is convenience, and everyone dealing with the same baseline hardware for the duration of the generation. I expect PC to TV streaming will replace consoles for me entirely.

 

[Aztechnology]

i didn't claim to be an expert on it but i don't think it's unreasonable to say that it would cost at least $1,000 to have the most optimal hardware possible.

But how is that a fair comparison? Are you saying the PS4 is suboptimal for you? Then why are you on PS4?

 

[The Artisan]

just quit dude and stop posting while you're at it, you crying about quitting gaming over something so silly is pathetic.

i'll say it again: who are to judge?

But how is that a fair comparison? Are you saying the PS4 is suboptimal for you? Then why are you on PS4?

i'm a console gamer. i bought a Ps4 because i wanted an upgrade from the Ps3, with the mindset that, like the 3 playstations before it, this would last me five years. the recent rumblings of the Ps4K have soured that mindset.

 

[True Fire]

Once the PS4K comes out no one will have a problem with it. At least they're not releasing platform exclusive games like Nintendo; it's just a graphical boost for games just because they're able to do it.

 

[Menitta]

I'm not going to do a hard switch to PC. If a console gets an upgrade 2-3 years after the original and assuming I can get a deal on upgrading, it'll still be cheaper than a yearly upgrade on PC.

Also the exclusives that Sony and Nintendo have are always more appealing to me than almost all of the games that also release on PC. People always talk about what PCs can do but they can't play Yakuza 0.

That being said, I don't like it in the slightest.

 

[Gipsy Danger]

i didn't claim to be an expert on it but i don't think it's unreasonable to say that it would cost at least $1,000 to have the most optimal hardware possible.

What does most optimal mean? Why do you need to have the most optimal? Are you looking for 4k/60fps? Seems a bit ludicrous tbh.

 

[baconcow]

The PS4K/Neo should not affect current PS4 gamers. It provides people will the opportunity of better performance and graphics, something that the PS4 is less capable of as more modern games come out (i.e. The Witcher 3). IMO, this is the right direction for console futures. This is an update that is optional. It hurts no one, except possibly those in very competitive gaming (these games usually incurring graphic hits to achieve 60 fps anyways), and benefits those who want better performance and graphics.

 

[RMI]

i didn't claim to be an expert on it but i don't think it's unreasonable to say that it would cost at least $1,000 to have the most optimal hardware possible.

The most optimal PC hardware is unreasonable for most people. That's not really much of a statement.

For $1000 you can build a PC that far exceeds current consoles. For less than $1000 you can still do much better.

 

[DrROBschiz]

Seems like a bad idea to me. The entire point of consoles is convenience, and everyone dealing with the same baseline hardware for the duration of the generation. I expect PC to TV streaming will replace consoles for me entirely.

Uhh set tops will always have a market

you guys are all bark and no bite

Consumers are ultimately going to buy a product that serves their needs in convenient fashion

Im expecting things to go on as usual this next cycle

 

[The Artisan]

What does most optimal mean? Why do you need to have the most optimal? Are you looking for 4k/60fps? Seems a bit ludicrous tbh.

optimal means the best.

The most optimal PC hardware is unreasonable for most people. That's not really much of a statement.

For $1000 you can build a PC that far exceeds current consoles. For less than $1000 you can still do much better.

i would want nothing but the best, which would be expensive, which is one reason why I'm not about it.

 

[tebunker]

This is where I'm at too. My play time is 90/10 in favor of PC these days. Apple upgrade model in console gaming? Yeah, I'm done. That's money that can go to PC upgrades.

Which is in effect the same thing. You are just more comfortable with the idea of opening your pc up a dropping a $300 video card in there every 4 years or so. This isn't any different in that instead of having you open your ps4 they are just going to keep iterating with fewer large disruptive releases

The real plab here is to keep people in their ecosystem. Much like how steam has some how engendered loyalty to a fault in spite of all of valves short comings. No other competitors come close.


Well this just in, Sony, Ms and Nintendo want that kind of loyalty and ecosystem adherence and retainment. They are all working towards that in some fashion.

Finally, you should keep an eye on MS because they are about to go to war with steam with unified apps etc. they are building an ecosystem to bridge pc and xbox and they have historically shown a propensity to use their os to push competition out

 

[rschauby]

And now we see what happens when next-gen consoles start off with budget specs and hardware.

We all would have been better off we had paid for $500 consoles in the beginning.


Or just stick with PC Gaming...

 

[Alucrid]

What does most optimal mean? Why do you need to have the most optimal? Are you looking for 4k/60fps? Seems a bit ludicrous tbh.

why even play games if i can't sli four titans

 

[Gipsy Danger]

optimal means the best.
i would want nothing but the best, which would be expensive, which is one reason why I'm not about it.

If you want the best then why did you pick a console? This line of thinking is insane. The best would literally be up to $3000.

I'm not going to do a hard switch to PC. If a console gets an upgrade 2-3 years after the original and assuming I can get a deal on upgrading, it'll still be cheaper than a yearly upgrade on PC.

Also the exclusives that Sony and Nintendo have are always more appealing to me than almost all of the games that also release on PC. People always talk about what PCs can do but they can't play Yakuza 0.

That being said, I don't like it in the slightest.

You don't upgrade PCs yearly, though. People always talk about what PS4s can do but they can't play Civ V.

 

[True Fire]

The PS4K/Neo should not affect current PS4 gamers. It provides people will the opportunity of better performance and graphics, something that the PS4 is less capable of as more modern games come out (i.e. The Witcher 3). IMO, this is the right direction for console futures. This is an update that is optional. It hurts no one, except possibly those in very competitive gaming (these games usually incurring graphic hits to achieve 60 fps anyways), and benefits those who want better performance and graphics.

No, the existence of the PS4K makes your PS4 and entire PS4 library wither into dust. We might as well quit gaming altogether, because selling our PS4s to soccer moms and spending an extra 100 dollars on an upgrade is too difficult.

 

[Philippo]

Have no problems with it, just like i have no problems with iPhone 6->6S->7, we are still getting new generations, and everything NEO-related is optional.
Give me a good trade-in deal for my old version and im on board.

 

[Grief.exe]

i'll say it again: who are to judge?i'm a console gamer. i bought a Ps4 because i wanted an upgrade from the Ps3, with the mindset that, like the 3 playstations before it, this would last me five years. the recent rumblings of the Ps4K have soured that mindset.

The PS4K's existence doesn't preclude the games still being playable on the original PS4. Sony or the publishers will never lock out the majority of their market.

You're entire argument is emotionally-based rather than logical.

 

[The Artisan]

If you want the best then why did you pick a console? This line of thinking is insane. The best would literally be up to $3000.

because i'm a console gamer, and i can explain why i choose console gaming over PC gaming but it's not entirely relevant here, we can have a PM convo about it.

The PS4K's existence doesn't preclude the games still being playable on the original PS4. Sony or the publishers will never lock out the majority of their market.

You're entire argument is emotionally-based rather than logical.

for 20 years when I buy a console, it's the best that particular console platform has been because its the only form that hardware has been throughout the generation. the Ps4K changes that. and it's okay that it's not coming off as logical to you, because i'm making the decision for myself only, not you, and not anyone else, and honestly, it's not really place for anyone to make a judgement call for a decision someone makes for themselves that isn't harming anyone else.

 

[Amneisac]

For me, the entire reason I bought the consoles (PS4 and X1 in this case) is because I knew I could buy them and get 5-6 years of gaming out of them and enjoy the exclusives. Now that isn't the case anymore, I'm just going to pass on console exclusives and just play 100% PC instead of 85% PC.

 

[Aztechnology]

optimal means the best.
i would want nothing but the best, which would be expensive, which is one reason why I'm not about it.

By that metric you should have stopped playing console long ago because you wanted the best. I don't get it. Why is your perception of good based around what the most powerful option available is? Why is your decision making suddenly drastically changed when more options become available. Simply choose what is best for you and fits your concept of satisfying or good. Does the existence of a new PS4 really make you feel like yours is now so obsolete you won't be happy with it?

 

[-ImaginaryInsider]

This is a ripple effect of the traditional "sell at a loss" console model dying. Making a $399 profitable-at-launch console the has to last 5-7 years and stay even slightly relevant in the face of things like Steamboxes and VR is basically impossible.

The front half of the traditional console model had already changed, this is just back half reacting to it.

 

[bachikarn]

It feels like it takes people forever for people to upgrade so keeping everything in the same eco system makes some sense. Conversely, this may give people even more reason to never upgrade.

However, I wonder how much this will hold back games. Its not all about graphics. There were aspects of Destiny that were heldback due to them having to support the previous generation.

 

[CHC]

optimal means the best.
i would want nothing but the best, which would be expensive, which is one reason why I'm not about it.

OK so basically you're closed off to the idea of building mid-range PC that is perfectly serviceable, and you would only want "the best" PC, but at the same time you also would refuse to buy a new console iteration, and if it even releases you're going to give up gaming entirely...?

What are you looking for people to tell you here? This is crazy.

 

[tebunker]

Uhh set tops will always have a market

you guys are all bark and no bite

Consumers are ultimately going to buy a product that serves their needs in convenient fashion

Im expecting things to go on as usual this next cycle

Except that console makers are hellbent on it not being as usual anymore. This is the first signs of changes coming.

Not saying we will go full digital or streaming soon but the ultimate goal is to have users living in a controlled ecosystem and build barriers to leaving.

 

[DrROBschiz]

For me, the entire reason I bought the consoles (PS4 and X1 in this case) are because I knew I could buy them and get 5-6 years of gaming out of them and enjoy the exclusives. Now that isn't the case anymore, I'm just going to pass on console exclusives and just play 100% PC instead of 85% PC.

Uhh its still the case

Ps4 games will continue to be made and play as they do now up until the end of its life

 

[Mobius 1]

I'm getting really repulsed by the entitlement around this subject. It's a new product. You don't have to buy it. The one you already have works as advertised and will continue to do so. Support for it will continue.

 

[OhNoDangerItsaPentagonRun]

I honestly think the Xbox won't do it because one, the PS4k thing is getting people upset and two, not one hint of any leakage what so ever on the Xbox side. Which just seems odd to me if they were actually going to do an upgrade. A revision yes, a new upgraded version? Don't know.

 

[eFKac]

I'm not going to do a hard switch to PC. If a console gets an upgrade 2-3 years after the original and assuming I can get a deal on upgrading, it'll still be cheaper than a yearly upgrade on PC.

Also the exclusives that Sony and Nintendo have are always more appealing to me than almost all of the games that also release on PC. People always talk about what PCs can do but they can't play Yakuza 0.

That being said, I don't like it in the slightest.

Depending on your initial investment, you don't really need yearly upgrades to play games close to maxed.

And I wouldn't be surprised if people will be able to play Yakuza 0 on PC along every Yakuza after it, more and more Playstation games are going to PC thanks to x86 architecture and decent steam sales.

 

[Grief.exe]

i would want nothing but the best, which would be expensive, which is one reason why I'm not about it.

because i'm a console gamer, and i can explain why i choose console gaming over PC gaming but it's not entirely relevant here...

Technically, these two view points are mutually exclusive.

 

[Gipsy Danger]

Uhh its still the case

Ps4 games will continue to be made and play as they do now up until the end of its life

In his defense. What if it ends up with a Hyrule Warriors Legends situation. Where it works on the old model but runs like shit? Too many unknowns at the moment to make any decision either way.

 

[UnrealEck]

I am not sure what you are even talking about.

I think he's saying console gaming is becoming more and more like half-arsed PC gaming.

 

[DrROBschiz]

I honestly think the Xbox won't do it because one, the PS4k thing is getting people upset and two, not one hint of any leakage what so ever on the Xbox side. Which just seems odd to me if they were actually going to do an upgrade. A revision yes, a new upgraded version? Don't know.

Xbox is going to do it

They are basically one more bad user experience from being the next WiiU

 

[The Artisan]

By that metric you should have stopped playing console long ago because you wanted the best. I don't get it.

console gaming has always been separate but complementary to PC gaming in this respect because it's always been one set of hardware per generation. i wanted the best and that's why I bought a Ps4 after having a Ps3 for about 7 years, with the mindset that this would the best on the playstation platform for another possible 7 years. that isn't true.

Why is your perception of good based around what the most powerful option available is? That's a dangerous mindset to have in life and leads people to huge debt etc.

...well, you don't really know anything about me aside from the fact that i play video games, so let's stick to that. what exactly is your question here?

OK so basically you're closed off to the idea of building mid-range PC that is perfectly serviceable, and you would only want "the best" PC, but at the same time you also would refuse to buy a new console iteration, and if it even releases you're going to give up gaming entirely...?

What are you looking for people to tell you here? This is crazy.

if people don't like what i'm doing that's fine, but it isn't fair to judge. i could easily say "i think it's stupid that people appreciate that console generations are becoming incremental" - i could say that, but i won't because it's everyone's right to think the way they want, it isn't affecting me. and the way i think shouldn't be affecting others either.

Technically, these two view points are mutually exclusive.

i will explain it to you further if you want, but in a PM.

 

[RMI]

optimal means the best.
i would want nothing but the best, which would be expensive, which is one reason why I'm not about it.

OK, just realize that this is a crazy idea since diminishing returns on dollars spent intensify towards the top end of the hardware spectrum. Very few PC gamers are out there buying the absolute best hardware.

 

[True Fire]

For me, the entire reason I bought the consoles (PS4 and X1 in this case) is because I knew I could buy them and get 5-6 years of gaming out of them and enjoy the exclusives. Now that isn't the case anymore, I'm just going to pass on console exclusives and just play 100% PC instead of 85% PC.

You're forgetting one thing. This is still the PS4. It's not like Apple where every phone is gradually phased out; the PS4 and all of its iterations will coexist and will be supported up until the PS4.8χK is phased out in 202X. This is actually good news for people with the vanilla PS4s because it extends their support as well.

 

[The Artisan]

OK, just realize that this is a crazy idea since diminishing returns on dollars spent intensify towards the top end of the hardware spectrum. Very few PC gamers are out there buying the absolute best hardware.

I'm not a PC gamer to begin with but if I were I would want only the best, which is probably why I don't indulge in PC gaming. it just isn't for me.

 

[Aztechnology]

console gaming has always been separate but complementary to PC gaming in this respect because it's always been one set of hardware per generation. i wanted the best and that's why I bought a Ps4 after having a Ps3 for about 7 years, with the mindset that this would the best on the playstation platform for another possible 7 years. that isn't true.
...well, you don't really know anything about me aside from the fact that i play video games, so let's stick to that. what exactly is your question here?

I must have changed my post right after you quoted it. I realized that didn't convey the question I was trying to ask and seemed more like an adhominem attack than a question. It was changed to.

Why is your decision making suddenly drastically changed when more options become available. Simply choose what is best for you and fits your concept of satisfying or good. Does the existence of a new PS4 really make you feel like yours is now so obsolete you won't be happy with it?

I'm not a PC gamer to begin with but if I were I would want only the best, which is probably why I don't indulge in PC gaming. it just isn't for me.

So to get things straight, PC gaming isn't for you because you essentially don't have the self discipline to not buy way more than you need? I guess I can kind of understand that.